Why don't they realise yet? Stat-based combat systems aren't fun!

I think the better question is why don't you realize the game isn't going to be how you want it.

I dont like stat based games, I hate a game that decides when I miss or when I hit or when I block, thats why I love TERA.

But I dont mind this system i can live with it.

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Originally Posted by Corrderio

I think the better question is why don't you realize the game isn't going to be how you want it.

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Because im a complainer and people dont know what's good for them.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

Because on the website it says that FFXIV has an active combat system "where position matters" etc. Go look.

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i think you just like to complain about everything. since like I've said before, you basically make a new complaint/QQ thread like every day. i think today is 4 days in a row, just saying........

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Originally Posted by DeadlySwordz

i think you just like to complain about everything. since like I've said before, you basically make a new complaint/QQ thread like every day. i think today is 4 days in a row, just saying........

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I dont make one new complaint-thread every day.

Some days I make two.


And anyway, just because I complain doesnt mean my complaints are invalid.

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Originally Posted by DeadlySwordz

are those both MMO's or what? never heard of them.....

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Originally Posted by Mack

I think they're PS3 exclusives, offline though. Demon's Souls has been out for a long time now and Dark Souls is sort of the sequel to it although not real, its kind of its successor. Good games.

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Originally Posted by Nikita

Demon's Souls

Dark Souls

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lol. allow me. demon's souls IS online. it's basically like an mmo except out of all the massive amounts of people playing the game, you have a max party limit of 3. think of it as a single player game that you play with other people. i HIGHLY recommend anyone that likes MMOs to give it a try. it doesn't have stat-based combat, it has skill-based combat, but it is in fact a deep RPG.

Vesperia, you clearly want an action game.

Why are you even bothering with a Final Fantasy game in the first place? You're pratically asking for a different genre.

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Originally Posted by Firon

I didn't wanna say, but if you don't like these type of systems why are you here?

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Hm, there must be something about the game that he likes other than the copy cat combat. /shock

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Originally Posted by Neptune

lol. allow me. demon's souls IS online. it's basically like an mmo except out of all the massive amounts of people playing the game, you have a max party limit of 3. think of it as a single player game that you play with other people. i HIGHLY recommend anyone that likes MMOs to give it a try. it doesn't have stat-based combat, it has skill-based combat, but it is in fact a deep RPG.

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Yea my bad completely forgot Demon's and Dark Souls have online capabilities.

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Originally Posted by Mack

Yea my bad completely forgot Demon's and Dark Souls have online capabilities.

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You should get Demon's Souls and try it! Especially before dark souls comes out.

Not all rpg need a stat system, in some cases it ties your character down to certain build(s). With games like Elder Scrolls or fall out you want a highly versitile character since not all situations will require you to run in sword/ melee weapon ready for a fight. You may need stealth or to snipe someone. RPG are mostly about playing a role in a story. Like Zelda has no stat system, and it is an rpg. I Then ff games could use some better design and get ride of the path/hallway mantality and get more open world thinbg going with better means of exploration and do away with a stat system since people abuse them in mmo. And force others to get certain gear to max out 1-3 stats. I vote for anything that stop ppl from telling others how to set up their characters. Kinda sick of cookie cutting in mmo.

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Originally Posted by Neptune

You should get Demon's Souls and try it! Especially before dark souls comes out.

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hehe I have the game and played the hell out of it just completely slipped my mind that people can invade your game or help you online.

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Originally Posted by Kilta_Firelotus

Not all rpg need a stat system, in some cases it ties your character down to certain build(s). With games like Elder Scrolls or fall out you want a highly versitile character since not all situations will require you to run in sword/ melee weapon ready for a fight. You may need stealth or to snipe someone. RPG are mostly about playing a role in a story. Like Zelda has no stat system, and it is an rpg. I Then ff games could use some better design and get ride of the path/hallway mantality and get more open world thinbg going with better means of exploration and do away with a stat system since people abuse them in mmo. And force others to get certain gear to max out 1-3 stats. I vote for anything that stop ppl from telling others how to set up their characters. Kinda sick of cookie cutting in mmo.

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But.. But..

My cookies look like a vomit blob, if I don't use a cookie cutter.. T.T Mr Gingerbread, farewell.....

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Originally Posted by Kilta_Firelotus

Not all rpg need a stat system, in some cases it ties your character down to certain build(s). With games like Elder Scrolls or fall out you want a highly versatile character since not all situations will require you to run in sword/ melee weapon ready for a fight. You may need stealth or to snipe someone. RPG are mostly about playing a role in a story. Like Zelda has no stat system, and it is an rpg. I Then ff games could use some better design and get ride of the path/hallway mentality and get more open world thing going with better means of exploration and do away with a stat system since people abuse them in mmo. And force others to get certain gear to max out 1-3 stats. I vote for anything that stop ppl from telling others how to set up their characters. Kinda sick of cookie cutting in mmo.

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Many would argue Zelda is more of an action adventure type of game like Metroid (They're virtually the same thing). But yes, Action RPGs exist like the Elder Scroll, modern Castlevania, Mana, and Tales series in which stats and leveling play a prominent role in how your character develops along with active control on the players part.

RPGs are not as much playing a role in a story, if that where the case piratically every game where you play a character would be an RPG. The term is mostly derived from the games mimicking the classic tabletop RPGs; the only games of the time to utilize playing the role of a character as a main focus of the gameplay. They adopted the name along with the basic game mechanics and the actual term has little literal meaning today.

There are obviously good regular RPGs as well (Dragon Quest series comes to mind) and I think there is room enough for all genres and sub-genres in the industry. It's just important to keep in mind that this game was not designed around an action RPG mentality. If anything it's (very) loosely based around tactical RPG mechanics.

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Originally Posted by Gramul

Vesperia, you clearly want an action game.

Why are you even bothering with a Final Fantasy game in the first place? You're pratically asking for a different genre.

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Id rather have an action game than an inaction game.

Anyway, go to the official ffxiv website.

youre the one asking for a different ffxiv.

Zelda is an "action rpg" , kinda like KH , is an action rpg ......but both of them are played like a "DMC" , some puzzles , some new weapons / skills , dungeons , bosses ....

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Originally Posted by Kilta_Firelotus

Not all rpg need a stat system, in some cases it ties your character down to certain build(s). With games like Elder Scrolls or fall out you want a highly versitile character since not all situations will require you to run in sword/ melee weapon ready for a fight. You may need stealth or to snipe someone. RPG are mostly about playing a role in a story. Like Zelda has no stat system, and it is an rpg. I Then ff games could use some better design and get ride of the path/hallway mantality and get more open world thinbg going with better means of exploration and do away with a stat system since people abuse them in mmo. And force others to get certain gear to max out 1-3 stats. I vote for anything that stop ppl from telling others how to set up their characters. Kinda sick of cookie cutting in mmo.

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Agreed .

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

I'd rather have an action game than an inaction game.

Anyway, go to the official ffxiv website.

you're the one asking for a different ffxiv.

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It just mentions that position and range have an effect on gameplay. Not exactly indicative of a action RPG. More like an SRPG. You just chose the wrong genre and the past 13+ games should have been a strong sign of it.

I think these types of games are fun and that's why I play them now. Many would agree with me as well :)

Someone who says XI battles don't require skill must be really bad at XI or they aren't playing in the harder areas of the game. I play in the easy areas and get my ass handed to me by mobs all the time.

Zelda is an action adventure...it has no RPG elements. KH has stats mixed in with the action making it an action RPG. Oblivion is an action RPG. Mass Effect is an action RPG.

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Originally Posted by Seif

Someone who says XI battles don't require skill must be really bad at XI or they aren't playing in the harder areas of the game. I play in the easy areas and get my ass handed to me by mobs all the time.

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BTW if you still play FFXI is it a good idea to start from scratch at this time if I decided to go back to the game?

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Originally Posted by Mack

BTW if you still play FFXI is it a good idea to start from scratch at this time if I decided to go back to the game?

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Its a Damn site easier to level now it ever has been. Went from nin 17 to 31 in a single night, wasnt even tough, only had 4 people :D Come to Ragnarok server :D Really friendly community!

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Originally Posted by Junpei

Its a Damn site easier to level now it ever has been. Went from nin 17 to 31 in a single night, wasnt even tough, only had 4 people :D Come to Ragnarok server :D Really friendly community!

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Cool I might just do that, thanks :)

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Originally Posted by Mack

Cool I might just do that, thanks :)

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Don't do it. You still can't jump.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

Don't do it. You still can't jump.

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meh don't really care.

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Originally Posted by Mack

meh don't really care.

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Plus all the story NPCs just ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble to the point where it makes Charles Dickens look succinct.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

Plus all the story NPCs just ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble ramble to the point where it makes Charles Dickens look succinct.

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i played FFXI for 3 years, but thanks for the heads up.

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Originally Posted by Mack

i played FFXI for 3 years, but thanks for the heads up.

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And the boat between Selbina and mhaura that takes like ten hours.

I could have SWAM to valkrum in the time I spent waiting for that thing. pfft.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

And the boat between Selbina and mhaura that takes like ten hours.

I could have SWAM to valkrum in the time I spent waiting for that thing. pfft.

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K. (filler text here)

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Originally Posted by Mack

K. (filler text here)

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And having to mine for hours just to afford a potion to do a BCNM and not die.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

And having to mine for hours just to afford a potion to do a BCNM and not die.

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God I miss it.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

Undeniably, the worst aspect of both WoW and FFXI is the "combat". Sure both games are really lame in almost every other respect too, but their combat, gosh! - the combat in particular sucks more than anything. It sucks enough to deserve notable mention all by itself. As you can very well see!

The problem with games like FFXI and WoW is that they both rely on the "stats" approach to combat. Basically instead of fighting, all you're doing is trying to rebalance mathematical equations. For example, if you're not busy trying to manage an invisible enmity calculator, you are trying to manage a visible health bar instead. It's so tedious.

It's no wonder UI add-ons are so prevalent in WoW. After all, the whole game is a UI practically. And i bet if FFXI had allowed it, the game would have ended up exactly the same.

How can you tell me that this is fun?

I'd rather fill, empty, and refill a bucket of water every so often. It's probably just as exhilirating and obviously founded on the exact same principles.

Or perhaps I could read the labels on a shampoo bottle instead. That's the same thing again. "Rinse and Repeat".

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MMo's are the children of pen and paper role playing games. These were also based on stat match ups, and a little luck. I believe the game you want to be playing is called Call of Duty. You can find it in any frat boys passed out vomit pool.

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Originally Posted by Vahzl

MMo's are the children of pen and paper role playing games. These were also based on stat match ups, and a little luck. I believe the game you want to be playing is called Call of Duty. You can find it in any frat boys passed out vomit pool.

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I don't know why you consider stat-based combat to be so high-brow. Maybe because it allows you to AFK while in combat, freeing up time to ruminate on the meaning of life or something.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

I don't know why you consider stat-based combat to be so high-brow. Maybe because it allows you to AFK while in combat, freeing up time to ruminate on the meaning of life or something.

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I don't consider it high brow. I consider it the direct evolution of the genre, and while I don't think mmo gaming is in any way high brow, Call of Duty would be considered low brow.

If you don't like the style, which has been tried and tested in most mmos, then go play something else. You are, as always, a poor troll.

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Originally Posted by Gramul

It just mentions that position and range have an effect on gameplay. Not exactly indicative of a action RPG. More like an SRPG. You just chose the wrong genre and the past 13+ games should have been a strong sign of it.

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THIS. So much. Vesperia, it even shows a picture of the positioning. This includes the archer behind the con&thm because they usually are healing themselves. The position does matter. The arc needs not to get hit by aoe. and emulate is a great thing for thm. So SE spiced it up with some good PR talk. That's your own damn fault for getting hyped up about it, when the rest of us knew exactly what to expect. There were reviews around for months, really, if you hate it so much I know I am not the only one who wish you would nut up or shut up.

Sometimes, i do get tired from playing for hours, but not like i got tired from waiting for a party for hours in 11. Something tells me that Vesperia is just after some badges under their name with all of the posting.

I think that anyone who spends enough time on the forums to get 510 posts since May, is not playing the game enough to enjoy it. So I advise anyone reading Vesperia's posts to take it with a grain of salt. I'm one for looking at both sides of the story, but you've been told multiple times that there are thousands of us who are here for what we came for; the FF name and genre. I loved tabletop gaming, and although I don't enjoy people telling me what equipment i should be wearing, the draw is always the same and strong enough to keep me coming back for years. I don't post very often, but I think there are positive things about this forum, namely, communication through mods getting through to the devs. I think that alone should be a reason to cut down on the complaining, and increasing the thoughtful well detailed posts. I haven't seen one yet from you Vesperia, just a lot of complaining.

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Originally Posted by Vesperia

My point wasnt that stats shouldnt exist. My point was combat shouldnt be soley about refilling HP bars and balancing enmity equations. It's so mathematical. And this is what I mean when I say 'stat-based combat'.

Stats should play a role but they shouldnt mean more than our actions. Players' actions and reactions should mean more than our stats do.

Also, instead of juggling 'Provoke' and 'Taunt' to manage a mob's 'hate', a fighter should have to use more cunning and actions to defeat the opponent. If all you're doing is managing a hate-equation it's hardly combat.

All in all, I dont know why you guys are so thrilled by such a system.

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I'm skipping all posts you made after this one, so don't hate if I missed something essential! But now to the topic.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? All the things we fight in games and/or MMORPGs in which we either succeed or fail is based on our actions and performance. Stats are there to affect the effectiveness of said actions, not do the shit for us <.<
I can't start a fight and say "127 Strength, it's your turn" "Fight this mob and send it back to hell"...
We start a fight and from thereon its either win/lose BASED on what we do. Stats are there to make these actions more effective, which in the end still relies completely on WHAT I do.

Mentioning the fact that you think that juggling Taunt and Provoke is the way to keep hate in XIV only shows that you have no clue btw...Taunt and Provoke do NOTHING for keeping hate. If you're tanking as GLA you're using 10+ skills in a rotation to keep hate...if you don't have those skills its harder for you to keep hate, no matter what you're stats say...

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If you don't like the style, which has been tried and tested in most mmos, then go play something else. You are, as always, a poor troll.

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Ouch ouch. Horse chariots have been tried and tested on most trails. Who needs steam engines anyway?

Definitely, XIV's combat lacks something. Maybe it's action, maybe it's tactics. But having success determined entirely by your stats is so... well... so "mommy-please-wash-my-35-year-old-back-armchair-general" like. For people who love to hide behind their superior stats, accumulated in countless hours of wasted lifetime.

At least give us reaction and tactics elements. Something where you actually have to use your brain. Something that transcedes stroking your virtual Ridil until it becomes +1.

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Originally Posted by Rinsui

Ouch ouch. Horse chariots have been tried and tested on most trails. Who needs steam engines anyway?

Definitely, XIV's combat lacks something. Maybe it's action, maybe it's tactics. But having success determined entirely by your stats is so... well... so "mommy-please-wash-my-35-year-old-back-armchair-general" like. For people who love to hide behind their superior stats, accumulated in countless hours of wasted lifetime.

At least give us reaction and tactics elements. Something where you actually have to use your brain. Something that transcedes stroking your virtual Ridil until it becomes +1.

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The worst part about XIVs combat system pretty much is the fact that stats don't matter at all. The only factor that really does something in the game is your rank...which makes the whole purpose of equipment completely obsolete.
The combat system itself misses a lot of aspects that would make it more fun(especially in reactive and tactic playstyle) but equipment being more or less useless makes it just horrible >.<

A valid objection.