Myth tomb cap should be per job

Given their stance towards speedruns you really shouldn't be surprised. Devs keep doing everything they can to slow the game down. Only reason WP and the primals got an increase to their tomes was to take stress of the servers for AK. Need to stretch out that content as much as possible.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Feel free to do so. But it's a huge hassle switching characters compared to switching jobs, plus you'll have to do the story over again every time. If that's your cup of tea, I think that's totally fine.

The purpose of the armory system is convenience, and it is. If you're crazy enough that you can/want to farm up 2700 myth stones every week on 9 different characters, power to you

costs will be lowered / older gear easier to obtain over time.

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Originally Posted by sasakusaku

So currently, to gear one job is 5+ months each and then 5+ months for every other on a single char....

or...

Make alts and gear up all them in 5+ months at the same time.

So essentially...5+ months to gear up all jobs or 3+ years. Gee, I wonder which is the best way?

I swear, trolls who have blinders on that think only their opinions matters suck.

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The first quote answered your question.

The armory system is great.
I have like 3 full AK sets outside of my main darklight set. Now that I'm full darklight, I can use the philosophy I get from capping myth to buy darklight for alts as well.
The only restriction with the armory system is myth and coil which is currently the highest tier. Alts are kept one tier lower, but there is no wasted loot in this game.

The armory system helps levelling.
The armory system lets you run dungeons as a healer to gear up your dps. Or any role.
The armory system makes for interesting class interactions.
The armory system consolidates your GC rank, your chocobo level, seasonal event rewards and much more.

You people just dismiss the system completely because ONE aspect is limited and it doesn't suit you.
Just "baffling".

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Originally Posted by Amyas

Why would they? So you could run AK 78 times a week and get everything handed to you now now now?

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How is it that people like you can say that running AK 78 times in a week is the same as having everything handed to you, and at the same time argue that running AK 78 times over the course of four months qualifies as working hard and earning it? It's the same amount of work, except one person's got more drive. Newsflash: the one that's taking three months to accomplish something is technically the one who is getting handouts. If you think otherwise, then you're oblivious to the way that the world works, and I'd love to see what your boss says when you tell them, "I could have had that report ready for you within a week, but I wanted to prove my dedication to it by devoting three whole months to it instead." Congratulations will be in order for the hard working intern who's given your job, and you'll be the one given unemployment handouts. That's the way the world works -- the hard working get rewarded, and yet this game is doing everything in its power to turn away those who would like to work hard while rewarding those who make slow progress. That's what we call bad business.

That point aside, there's actually nothing stopping people from running AK 78 times in a week and getting mythology tomes from each run. It's currently possible. It just has to be done across 8 specialized characters. So what you're saying should not be allowed is already alive and well in the game's current model, and the change being proposed by players would not change what content and rewards players can currently participate in working on. It would merely be a quality of life improvement, allowing players to earn certain achievements on a single character instead of spreading them out among eight. Unfortunately people currently have to pay more for the extra characters that are required for maximum rewards, so when you really examine what's happening here, it's clear that this is nothing more than a case of a company placing their own greed over their customers' quality of life. Now do you see why people are upset?

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

As much as I would like to see this too, I think it would get abused.

E.g. Seven players running with one player through Coil who thusly gets all drops and for each successive player run through Coil, would get all the drops.

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As it is now, everyone can have eight characters per server, so people can already accomplish this type of power-gearing by "abusing" alts. People who are willing to put in the excessive amount of time that it takes to run Coil eight times per week are going to do it, regardless of whether or not changes are made here. However if there are people who would rather spend that time on a single character that they most identify themselves with, with no chance of loot for 7/8 of those runs, then where's the harm? What's the difference? The name above a player's head would stay the same when they changed jobs. That's the only difference. It would be a change in the name of fun, and nothing more than that.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Hello,

Currently, the development team does not have any plans to separate the tomestone cap on a class/job basis.

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My reaction:

http://i.imgur.com/oPto34d.gif

The number of AK runs that we're talking about would be equal to a full time job -- 8 hours a day of running AK, and even more if you add in 8 runs of Coil every week. I certainly wouldn't want to put in that kind of time, but that's my choice as a player. If there are people who want to put themselves through that, then they are much more dedicated than I am, and I can respect their choice even though it's different from mine. If I'm allowed to play how I want to play, then why shouldn't other people be allowed the same opportunity? Especially if it is something that would have no impact on how people are already playing, save for how much fun they have with their experiences?

Thank God they finally said it now ppl can stop ther whining

they should rename this forum to General QQ

Want to gear your alts? get full AK, want more? farm philo.

If Crystal tower isnt here because SE fault thats another thread.

Absolutely!

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Originally Posted by Sidious

There shouldn't be a cap at all.

Why am I being told how much I can accomplish in P2P MMO?

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Yeah exactly. It reminds me of the stamina system from 1.0. >.<

Also good to see SE is still telling us to basically "Deal with it" yet again, so much to listening to player feedback. I'll just give up on hoping someday we will have NM...; ;

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Hello,

Currently, the development team does not have any plans to separate the tomestone cap on a class/job basis.

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Thanks Oki, Im happy to see the Dev's arent continuing to cater to the casuals.

Max D.

It would be more awesome if there was no Myth cap in general.

I think if the really hardcore players want to get all their gear so fast, there should not be any restrictions. This cap is obviously there for another reason - to retain players to this game and have them play longer. In doing so, SE earns more subscription money :D

Get coil gear instead of relying exclusively on tomestones like it was intended?

"I'm so sick of grinding AK/WP"
"Please let us get Tomes on every job so I can grind AK/WP 9x as much every week"

I don't even....

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Originally Posted by Silhouette

Thanks Oki, Im happy to see the Dev's arent continuing to cater to the casuals.

Max D.

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Technically it would be catering to the Hardcore.

Haven't they said that myth cap will be adjusted in the future. Costs of Myth armour will be adjusted in future.

Seriously you have to have some barriers in game. There's already people complaining "there's nothing to do" when they refuse to level more than one class, DoL, DoH and still haven't cleared coil.

You need something to aim for, a goal. Caps on tomes at the moment are there to elongate the end game experience. Stop whining already.

If you don't want to play multiple jobs on one character you are only hindering yourself. The game and armoury system is about horizontal progression.

I've yet to spend a day on this game where I've thought "There's absolutely nothing to do!" sure I've grinded gear but I've not burnt myself out.

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Originally Posted by sasakusaku

Well there you have it. Want to play other jobs? Make another character to get around the mythos cap.....

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Or.....

"Want to play other jobs?"

Play other jobs - Tell me, do you have full Allagan gear for your main?

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"I could have had that report ready for you within a week, but I wanted to prove my dedication to it by devoting three whole months to it instead."

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More like: "I could have paid 10 Bangladesh workers to produce this, send it to me, including shipping and overtaxes, and it would have cost me less than your wage - so I suggest you be more like them."

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Originally Posted by Garnatian

Technically it would be catering to the Hardcore.

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Technically it's just an artificial time gate put in place to slow progress down when 'end game' content is extremely limited like we see here.

Flaw is that one can simply make alts and cut the time down drastically so I suggest putting an account wide mythos cap! j/k?

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

costs will be lowered / older gear easier to obtain over time.

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What's the point of playing if they're just going to do things arbitrarily like that?

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Originally Posted by Risae

You really must enjoy doing AK over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

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lol how did you get that out of my post? If they gave us separate tomes like a certain someone wants (because they want their bis gear NOW NOW NOW NOW NOW!), they would run it 70 times a week just to cap myth for all their precious alts.
EDIT: To make it clear...
I'm not for that.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

What's the point of playing if they're just going to do things arbitrarily like that?

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What is the point of playing? I mean, you could choose to wait till they make it easier to get...or you can work toward a goal in an MMO while it's offered to you?

This is the type of MMO people clamored for in 1.0, I certainly didn't but this whole "nerfing old content as you make new content" is the way MMOs are now - people said the way SE did it for XI by keeping all content viable for numerous years was "bad design."

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

lol

That's hilarious.
Your dev team is aware we can just make multiple characters to bypass this artificial barrier, right? All you're doing is making the armory system have NO PURPOSE.

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Plenty of purpose. Class switching, subskills, the ability to trade this stuff disabled. All functioning as intended.

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

this whole "nerfing old content as you make new content" is the way MMOs are now

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And how is that working out for them? Post-WotLK WoW, the paragon of this paradigm, hasn't posted a single net-positive quarter for subscriber growth or retention as a percentage of new gains in years. In fact they've posted nothing but catastrophic losses every quarter since Cataclysm was released. MoP lost ~2 million people in under a year. It can get away with that because it built such a monstrous and loyal subscriber base in earlier years, but games like FFXIV do not have that luxury. This is happening even though Blizzard is releasing the game in new territories such as Brazil. Heck, at one point they were giving Diablo 3 away to people if they agreed to subscribe to WoW-- and they still posted a net-lost in subscribers!

SE needs to build an immersive MMO world in which content is built upon, not made to be disposed by the next patch. Caps and arbitrary changes to it are a step in the wrong direction.

The big issue is if its per job, it would also have to restrict it so those tomes could only effect that job. If not, then I could easily with my current classes grab 1500 Myth in a weak and abuse the system with the 50s I do have now. It can easily be abused and I know I'd take full advantage of it myself to get my gear in two weeks.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

SE needs to build an immersive MMO world in which content is built upon, not made to be disposed by the next patch.

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Some folks (like in the quote) really don't bother to pay attention to reality.

Tell me, do you recall the 3 main dungeon instances being implemented in 2.1?

2 of them undermine your argument.

Just because you can't gear ALL of your jobs with myth gear as quickly as your main class/job you want to stir up a fuss? I was going to say it's kind of childish, but then again that sums up a large portion of the posts in the English section.

So your other classes/jobs are only in Darklight, what's the problem?

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Originally Posted by Sidious

Snip

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So you think WoW subscription decline was entirely due to how they handled their end-game progression gear. Your narrative is misleading. It has more to do with market saturation and, I don't know, WoW being an almost 10 year old game.

Nothing is disposed of in this version of the model either. There is still progression at the end game level through gearing. You'll need the old gear to get the new, it's just easier to get now.
Crystal Tower is not even a tier higher, in fact. The new patch is releasing a raid that's a tier lower than Coil, how is that not building?
The reduction in costs of gear isn't arbitrary. It's just a catch-up mechanism for people who start late.

Square is already catering to people, and they've voiced how they will do it. It's just not in the same time frame they're prepared to wait.

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Originally Posted by Babydoll

Yeah exactly. It reminds me of the stamina system from 1.0. >.<

Also good to see SE is still telling us to basically "Deal with it" yet again, so much to listening to player feedback. I'll just give up on hoping someday we will have NM...; ;

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Too bad they didn't fuse XI's depth with WoW's accessibility. They would've had a true monster on their hands.

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So you think WoW subscription decline was entirely due to how they handled their end-game progression gear. Your narrative is misleading. It has more to do with market saturation and, I don't know, WoW being an almost 10 year old game.

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1.) Yes, because they've removed almost all depth outside of raiding.
2.) Market saturation? From who? Name three serious P2P contenders in the MMO landscape that would be diluting 2 million people annually from WoW.
3.) a.) Blizzard practically reinvents the game every expansion. Today's WoW has almost nothing in common with vanilla WoW.
b.) WoW is brand new in many territories.

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The reduction in costs of gear isn't arbitrary. It's just a catch-up mechanism for people who start late.

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This "mechanism" has been tried and found wanting. Several times. Give it up already. This is an MMO. People don't need to "catch up".

I really don't see why people are so worked up about this whole 300/week cap. Spread out your per week "grinding" or ya know, enjoy other features of the game. Or idk... go outside or something? People can be so impatient these days, gotta "beat" the game in the first month, getting best gear on all your classes and leaving yourself with nowhere to go or nothing to work towards after that. Then we get to hear people complain about how their decked out character has no endgame left to do.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

Too bad they didn't fuse XI's depth with WoW's accessibility. They would've had a true monster on their hands.

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At its start. Xis depth was non existant. The base facts ppl argue on this is blinded by the mass leveling time sink

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Originally Posted by MyMe

I really don't see why people are so worked up about this whole 300/week cap. Spread out your per week "grinding" or ya know, enjoy other features of the game. Or idk... go outside or something? People can be so impatient these days, gotta "beat" the game in the first month, getting best gear on all your classes and leaving yourself with nowhere to go or nothing to work towards after that. Then we get to hear people complain about how their decked out character has no endgame left to do.

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This. I do two to three tome dungeons a day and when thats done I lvl an alt job or craft. My time is spread nicely and im hsving a good time.

It bugs me when people say "tomb" instead of "tome".

I wonder how many illiterate people sit around calling them "tombstones" while they play...

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Originally Posted by MyMe

I really don't see why people are so worked up about this whole 300/week cap. Spread out your per week "grinding" or ya know, enjoy other features of the game. Or idk... go outside or something? People can be so impatient these days, gotta "beat" the game in the first month, getting best gear on all your classes and leaving yourself with nowhere to go or nothing to work towards after that. Then we get to hear people complain about how their decked out character has no endgame left to do.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0cATOGXehc

I think this should be stated ,but those who are rushing endgame are going to get punished for it.

Or rather, speaking more realistically, those who are being patient will be rewarded for it. You do realize myth/philo requirements will likely drop for this armor once more content is released. Which means, leveling multiple characters to bypass the limit just means you worked too much because you were not content to simply do something else to occupy your time.

I keep recommending to the forums that they take a chill pill and enjoy simply spending time with your group and community rather than rush these things and fret over the current limits/pricing. Patience is a virtue that serves as an absolute necessity to your enjoyment of MMOs.

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Originally Posted by Raiz_Cineris

At its start. Xis depth was non existant. The base facts ppl argue on this is blinded by the mass leveling time sink

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This isn't the start of XIV, so my point still stands.

All this whining over Myth gear when all you have to do is get your hiney in Coil and get your gear from drops.

"But I shouldn't have to raid to get gear!!!11! because it's not what I enjoy and should get top tier gear by running an easy instance til my eyes bleed Demon Wall residue."

Tough, you get what you get then when you earn the tomes.

I'll go out on a limb and claim that there are people out there now gearing up their alt classes with Coil gear without having to wait on Myth resets. The gear is there, go get it.

ilvl 90 gear is basically BiS, or second-best at the absolute minimum. Letting people farm BiS gear uncapped/unlimited from herpaderp WP/AK runs sounds like a terrible idea; not to mention that it'd completely eliminate Darklight's purpose for existing, being gear that you can purchase with an infinitely-farmable currency. That is the main distinction between Myth and Philosophy -- one is endlessly farmable, and one is rationed. With one, you have to pick and choose what purchases are most important to you. Myth is not intended to be "Philosophy 2.0" where you can AFK-leech through some Duty Finder runs and get a full set of sweet gearz for all of your jobs.

I fully understand and sympathize that the armory system (which ostensibly encourages players to play multiple jobs) makes it frustrating in that you can't realistically gear up more than one job at a time, but nobody should have that expectation. Does anybody out there really expect you to have multiple pieces of ilvl 90 gear on several jobs? I don't think that having to pick one or two jobs to specialize in (that is, to buy BiS-quality gear for) is that unreasonable of a proposition.

When you add into account that the hardest content in the game for the next several months -- BCoB -- is doable in full Darklight, I don't know what people even think they'd use their "full ilvl 90" sets for, anyway. Standing around in town? The fact that you can't farm up full level 90 on your main, alt, second alt, and even your "for funsies" jobs isn't really the end of the world.

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

Or.....

"Want to play other jobs?"

Play other jobs - Tell me, do you have full Allagan gear for your main?

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I can answer for him. Nope. He doesn't have full allagan gear for his main, or full myth gear for his alt job. But I can tell you one thing with 100% certainty - he has no myth gear for his alt job, if he's a smart player.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

This isn't the start of XIV, so my point still stands.

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This is, in fact, still the start of A Realm Reborn. However.

The fact that this game was recreated in the time that it did, should not be downplayed. You are playing an entirely new game, which is still within it's first financial quarter IE- it's just starting. It was a year before Zilart came out, and even that seemed sparse to the FFXI initial endgame players.

I think it's simply a matter of SE not wanting everyone to be in full ilvl90 gear before CT launches. There will undoubtedly be some people that fit in this category because of the progress they've made in Coil though.

Honestly they should have never even put in Coil until CT was ready. Yeah, it'd turn off some of the hardcores, but they're a minority in the grand scheme of things. I'd be willing to wager the majority of players are still stuck on Titan.

I think it'd be fair to say they'll probably raise the cap a bit sometime during 2.1 when people can get the gear that was intended for them to have after having done some CT and would naturally upgrade into Allagan/i90 AF. With the rep's post, I think it's fair to say that SE intended everyone to be able to play every class, but if you're relying on token items alone you're going to have to limit yourself to a main class.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

This isn't the start of XIV, so my point still stands.

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Abyssea along with adoulin. Your point is non existant.

perhaps your point would remain if xi hadnt jumped on the "no noob gamer" left behind act.