4.1 - The emptiest patch yet.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Why is that surprising? The Sims is a franchise literally built on people's desire to play virtual Barbie's Dream House. I guarantee you those who care more about glamour and housing outnumber people who do Savage or even 24-man raids.

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Show me an mmo that's not focused on combat. That stuff works for games like the sims but every popular mmo focuses on combat before everything else.

Guys, take it from someone who tried, and just ended up wasting their time.

Dont engage the people who're just comming here to complain and moan. They get off on complaining, and the sun is more likely to turn into a black hole, then these people are to stop complaining and whining over things that are more often then not incredibly premature

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Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

1.0 had nothing to do with FFXI.

FFXIV 1.0 and ARR only take monster names and character models and such, being inspired from FFXI, there is things that FFXI even handles better then FFXIV, like transmission of data coding. Game play and such is more based on wow then anything else.

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He's referring to the FFXIV documentary that was released this summer in which Koji-fox, Yoshida and other SE members discuss how 1.0 was made and Koji says that the team tried to follow on the steps of FFXI because it succeded before and in their mind it would succed again (FFXIV part 1 19:30 mins for reference)

The update has a lot of improvement than things to do, which is okay for me tbh. I love new content, don't get me wrong and I do wish it was more to do for me (things thats interesting for me) the things that isn't might have value for others, so no complaints here. A game that needs to last longer over few more years needs updates like this, to make the game more fluid and better for all of us. I thinkt he updates are great and I honestly been missing a lot of the things they adding.

I mean, at this point, if you really have a problem with the amount of content right now, then you could always NOT log in on patch day; doubly so if you're on a high pop server, so that everyone who DOES want to partake in Housing Savage can get online in time to do so. There's no need to try bringing things down for everyone else.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Show me an mmo that's not focused on combat. That stuff works for games like the sims but every popular mmo focuses on combat before everything else.

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Why does it matter the genre? You don't think people who play The Sims also like combat focused games? I've played The Sims, I've also played Halo, Mass Effect, Final Fantasy, The Three Kingdoms and a slew of other games spanning numerous genres. One of my favourite games of all time is Life is Strange, a game where this isn't any combat. You do not determine what everyone enjoys. A good number of people are looking forward to 4.1 exclusively because of Shirogane.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Why does it matter the genre? You don't think people who play The Sims also like .

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I love Sims, this thread has lasted this long not based on what someone likes or dislike. It keeps going because people disagree on the definition of what content is. If a furniture piece is content then so is a level one axe for warrior. Meaning anything and everything can be considered content to some in this thread. My opinion just differs those are just gaming features to me but to each their own. Like I've said throughout this thread the original post said this patch is empty and I agree.

Isn't this just a typical patch, minus one dungeon, plus some other content we don't usually get? Also, PvP is actually being balanced regularly, alongside PvE now. I'm more concerned about the quality of what we're getting more than the quantity at this point. Return to Ivalice looks a lot more interesting than any of the 24 man raids in 3x, imo. It seems more production value went into it as well, seeing as how square hired guest creators specifically to contribute to this raid.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Show me an mmo that's not focused on combat. That stuff works for games like the sims but every popular mmo focuses on combat before everything else.

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Mabinogi
Second Life

Runescape, though has a lot of combat, also has a very large "skiller" presence (people that do not raise any combat skills).

That's just games I've been exposed to. They are games that have combat, but are not centered around it. They are played with countless of other strangers online, ringing true to the qualification of being an MMO. They are games focused on the social aspect of MMOs more than anything. You could argue Facebook games are MMOs (require help from other players) to progress, like in Farmville, however I'm sure you'll tell me those aren't MMOs.

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Originally Posted by JunseiKei

Mabinogi
Second Life

Runescape, though has a lot of combat, also has a very large "skiller" presence (people that do not raise any combat skills).

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Mabinogi is a bit of a special case, as Nexon pioneered the freemium, fueled-by-gachapon model, so they have to keep making new gear to feed that model. Sometimes they recycle things, just like Square-Enix.

Second Life however is not a MMORPG. It's essentially an empty sandbox. Most of the content in SL is centered on trying to simulate something, and that includes all things naughty.

All other MMORPG's focus on combat because that is the easiest way to create non-stop content by changing some levers. Just drop some slimes, wolves, and zombies, and you got a game. When your players get bored of that content, you change their colors and give them a new area with the same monsters again that have new skills, or are tougher, or faster, or whatever.

Like where FFXIV fails, on it's face, sometimes is how puzzles are handled. To put it bluntly, there are no puzzles in FFXIV. Most MMORPG's have no puzzles because they don't want to frustrate their players with puzzles, they want to frustrate their players with choreography that they can just learn. Playing with randoms is like herding cats, especially when there are language barriers. Hence I'm almost certain that the purpose of the squadrons was always to give new and experienced players a way to play content that is more puzzle-oriented.

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Originally Posted by Lazaruz

Guys, take it from someone who tried, and just ended up wasting their time.

Dont engage the people who're just comming here to complain and moan. They get off on complaining, and the sun is more likely to turn into a black hole, then these people are to stop complaining and whining over things that are more often then not incredibly premature

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I didn't even bother this time. Not the first time a thread like this has appeared. It has appeared multiple times already, with the release of each content patch. People just can't seem to differentiate between "no new content" and "there are new content but they are just not what I am interested in". I avoided this thread so far but with the release of the preliminary patch notes and people still complaining, it just confirms that they will never be satisfied.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

I love Sims, this thread has lasted this long not based on what someone likes or dislike. It keeps going because people disagree on the definition of what content is. If a furniture piece is content then so is a level one axe for warrior. Meaning anything and everything can be considered content to some in this thread. My opinion just differs those are just gaming features to me but to each their own. Like I've said throughout this thread the original post said this patch is empty and I agree.

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That's your opinion and your allowed to have it.

However my opinion is that there is content. it might not be what OP or YOU expected, but there's content, like the 24man for instance.

Is this nonsense of a thread still going? Preliminary patch notes come out yesterday and there's enough to keep you busy enough.

Lock this thread as it is going no where.

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Originally Posted by Mature

Is this nonsense of a thread still going? Preliminary patch notes come out yesterday and there's enough to keep you busy enough.

Lock this thread as it is going no where.

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You realize more threads will just be made for this patch alone, and more will keep BEING made with each and every patch, right? Let the doomsayers and naysayers try to shout over one another until their faces turn every shade of purple and blue. Come on, the rest of us have a game to enjoy.

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Originally Posted by Mature

Is this nonsense of a thread still going? Preliminary patch notes come out yesterday and there's enough to keep you busy enough.

Lock this thread as it is going no where.

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Stop reading the thread if it bothers you so much. There's no actual rule breaking, so the best way to kill this thread is to be the change you want to see and stop posting here.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

Stop reading the thread if it bothers you so much. There's no actual rule breaking, so the best way to kill this thread is to be the change you want to see and stop posting here.

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It's not about if I like it or not. It's about that it doesn't contribute to ANYTHING positive to the community. Hence no use for it.

Wow how mature to personal attack people because they are not happy with content..completely ignoring that even Yoshida once pointed out that criticism is way more valuable than compliments..I also visit threads that are about interesting ideas and if I like something in the game I will point that out too..yet I will also post about something that I dislike.

Also if you go into a thread and complain about the complainers you are just doing the same thing as us and at the same time you keep the thread alive too.

You know its completely fine if you like the game how it is right now. There is nothing wrong with that..but people are allowed to dislike something too and should not be attacked for that opinion..Both sides can sometimes be a bit too much but in this thread alone most of the aggressive and insulting comments comes from the side that like the patch..why is that necessary? Yes the OP might have overdid it with his title but there is still no reason to attack someone over it. Just write your arguments about the subject itself and not about the people posting it..

Also if you have more and more such threads with quite the amount of likes then maybe there is a reason for that? Yes there will be never enough content to make everyone happy but other than the new PVP mode what content of the new patch will stay for a long time? The one dungeon and the raid will be done in one or two days and after that they are just there to get loot and as soon as people have that they will probably barely run it anymore. Ultimate is only for a very specific kind of people thus the majority will never truly see that one in this expansion. Housing is for only a small amount of people too and things like glamour and hair is truly no long living content. Its nice to have but nothing that will keep most people logged in for months. (Other than horrible RNG numbers to get them x)) Really the only cosmetic stuff that might make people play for a longer time are the pets and mounts, depending where to get them.

So what content is in this patch that will keep people playing it for months which on top of that is also new? Well the only one is probably PVP and that is only more popular right now thanks to the exp it gives and seeing all the problems with bots in the old ones, one could argue how long people will truly play it and how many. I would be fine if they introduced more ways to challenge oneself with older content. Like having certain achievements for running certain dungeons with kind of "rules". This would keep people playing even older content. Yes even those things are probably not for everyone but really what is there in this patch for the casual crowd that wants to play more PvE in a PvE focused game?

@Mature: You do kinda know that you yourself also once started a thread where you disliked something that SE did? Yet that was fine but if someone starts a thread about something you enjoy its bad? Really if this was that bad for the community the mods would have already closed it after some pages. (And posting those lines in it does keep it on page one and thus alive, so you are kinda doing the exact opposite of what you want to happen x))

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Originally Posted by Mature

It's not about if I like it or not. It's about that it doesn't contribute to ANYTHING positive to the community. Hence no use for it.

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And yet here you are...contributing even less by not only complaining about something that contributes nothing, but adding to the problem by refreshing the thread and popping it back up to the front page.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

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Tbh I don't give a toss what you think about me as it goes over my head. so don't waste your time dedicating a post about myself. Thanks

You do know that there is CONSTRUCTIVE criticism and there is moaning right? I can give you a very clear example here of the difference between this pointless thread and this one below.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/forum.php#threads/342315

And again like I mentioned before there is ENOUGH content in this game to keep everyone busy but yet again we keep getting:

"There's nothing to do cause there is nothing I WANT to do"

Sorry the game is not carter for one but for the whole community and DOESN'T give you the right to MOAN but provide a constructive solutions... something that doesn't happen here.

I do think this is the patch I've been least excited about since starting FF. I'll definitely try Rival Wings, but I can give or take the rest now, I am at such a disconnect with the Story of SB (mostly because I don't care about Lyse and they constantly shove her down our throats)

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

I do think this is the patch I've been least excited about since starting FF. I'll definitely try Rival Wings, but I can give or take the rest now, I am at such a disconnect with the Story of SB (mostly because I don't care about Lyse and they constantly shove her down our throats)

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If only they would shove Hien down our throats instead, eh? ;)

B...but....but...

Grand Company Depot updates!
Quality of Life improvements!
DRAGOONS AND SUMMONERS GETTING BUFFED AGAIN!
Shirogane!
24 man raid!
New dungeon!
New story!
Super Mega tough raid!

I... don't... does not compute!! DOES NOT COMPUTE!!!

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻)

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Originally Posted by Pondera

B...but....but...

Grand Company Depot updates!
Quality of Life improvements!
DRAGOONS AND SUMMONERS GETTING BUFFED AGAIN!
Shirogane!
24 man raid!
New dungeon!
New story!
Super Mega tough raid!

I... don't... does not compute!! DOES NOT COMPUTE!!!

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻)

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And none of that content will last more than 24 hours (harder raid is the only lasting thing, but only less than 1% will bother), whereas a patch should last months.
Easier now?

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Originally Posted by Alleo

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accusing ppl of white knightning something is not better, as is trying to pass for a victim, both sides have been firing shots at each other so there's no better one in this discussion.

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Originally Posted by Pondera

B...but....but...

Grand Company Depot updates!
Quality of Life improvements!
DRAGOONS AND SUMMONERS GETTING BUFFED AGAIN!
Shirogane!
24 man raid!
New dungeon!
New story!
Super Mega tough raid!

I... don't... does not compute!! DOES NOT COMPUTE!!!

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻)

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Denial is one heck of a wall to overcome. Case in point:

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Originally Posted by Voltyblast

And none of that content will last more than 24 hours (harder raid is the only lasting thing, but only less than 1% will bother), whereas a patch should last months.
Easier now?

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

I do think this is the patch I've been least excited about since starting FF. I'll definitely try Rival Wings, but I can give or take the rest now, I am at such a disconnect with the Story of SB (mostly because I don't care about Lyse and they constantly shove her down our throats)

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She's awful. I liked Yda. I hate Lyse. She's an even blander version of an action girl Minfilia.

BTW: what Theodric said.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

Wow how mature to personal attack people because they are not happy with content..completely ignoring that even Yoshida once pointed out that criticism is way more valuable than compliments..I also visit threads that are about interesting ideas and if I like something in the game I will point that out too..yet I will also post about something that I dislike.

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Yes, but I don't think he meant "criticism" like:

"And none of that content will last more than 24 hours (harder raid is the only lasting thing, but only less than 1% will bother), whereas a patch should last months.
Easier now?"

from people totally fed up with pretty everything in the game itself. In terms of that, they rely on the numbers they get (nobody needs to tell them, that nobody plays the game.. if that's the case they will notice first).

Yoshi-P also said to exactly those people (not knowing how to be motivated to play the game and be bored after few days of an expansion): "Take a break".

They want suggestions, yes... but telling them "Change the whole concept" and they show you the door. Especially if you word your criticism like you hate most of their work.
It's like the difference of telling a band "Why don't you try to do something with a Didgeridoo?" and "Play something else, your style is boring after 6 albums."

It all depends on whether this content is worth an entire new game's price.
FFXIV costs roughly $15/month. 3 month cycles per patch means $45 per update to the game. If you are a patient gamer and don't need to buy every game at launch, you can get decent "new" games for $45.

So in essence, when people are complaining that the patch is empty, they are making a comparison of opportunity costs: do I spend $45 playing three months worth of a clearly-gutted patch? Or can I get another game (or two... steam sales/humble bundle) that will last me roughly the same time frame?
What makes this decision even more blaring is the fact that SE has stripped the game of a dungeon for the promise of more content.

Once my subscription is up, I think I'll do what I essentially did the entire 3.X patch series: ride the coat tails of the free log in campaigns. They always seem to occur around the release of new patches, and since I really only care for the MSQ I can log in without needing to pay a sub. And I don't have to partake in the quarterly tome grind, since the second-best/easy-to-get gear fulfills ilvl requirements.

Anyone else who feels there is a lack of content, just remember the opportunity cost above. Is this patch really worth your $45? If not, there's nothing wrong with voting with your wallet.

Uhmmm. So people are upset because SE isn't giving us our fate grinding fix in this patch, correct? Because that's the only thing I can think about when I read people complaning about how the new content in the 4.1x patch series will only last for 2 days. Of course all these people have every job/crafter/gatherer at lvl 70, omega savage on farm, got tired of pvp because they spent too much doing it...

Honestly, I'll take the new ultimate raid over the senseless grind for relic weapons we had to go through in arr and hw, thanks. And only one dungeon, thank god, they are clearly out of ideas for those.

There will never be another 2.1 or 2.4. Take a break if you think there's not enough content for you, and do a few patches at once later.

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Originally Posted by Voltyblast

And none of that content will last more than 24 hours (harder raid is the only lasting thing, but only less than 1% will bother), whereas a patch should last months.
Easier now?

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I can guarantee you that the QOL changes, job buffs, grand company grinding ,housing and 24 man raid will last longer than 24 hours.

Those are staying in action a long time due to mechanics and obvious reasons.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Yes, but I don't think he meant "criticism" like:

"And none of that content will last more than 24 hours (harder raid is the only lasting thing, but onls."

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You know what happens when u take a break I can lose ur house if u have one. You missed the upgrade items to upgrade ur gear and weapons. You lose the chance to learn fights whenever one else does. Taking breaks have consequences in this game

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

You missed the upgrade items to upgrade ur gear and weapons. You lose the chance to learn fights whenever one else does. Taking breaks have consequences in this game

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Not when unsynced is a thing. You dont need to know mechanics for just about any fight anymore, and can burn each of them. And those items will be unlocked by the time the person comes back, along with new gear sets to replace the current. So the argument is at a stand still :/

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

You know what happens when u take a break I can lose ur house if u have one. You missed the upgrade items to upgrade ur gear and weapons. You lose the chance to learn fights whenever one else does. Taking breaks have consequences in this game

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You are correct on the houses. Learning parties? Sorta but not really. Learning parties DO happen months later. The rush just isn't there. If there's no parties forming just make one yourself. I've done that before and people will join if you're patient. Upgrade items? Yeah, not so much. They're always there. Sometimes they change the source, but there's seriously no missing out on those.

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Originally Posted by Voldemort

So in essence, when people are complaining that the patch is empty, they are making a comparison of opportunity costs: do I spend $45 playing three months worth of a clearly-gutted patch? Or can I get another game (or two... steam sales/humble bundle) that will last me roughly the same time frame?
What makes this decision even more blaring is the fact that SE has stripped the game of a dungeon for the promise of more content.

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If those 2 games are great then you probably made a good choice.

But, remember while those two games may give better value over the course of three months. Their expansions end immediately or a year or two after. Investing in this game has more replay value over the long haul unless you prefer playing the same thing over and over with little changes.

I play the heck out of old Bioware and Squaresoft games to this day, but that experience does not change anymore for the most part.

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Originally Posted by Elkanah

Not when unsynced is a thing. You dont need to know mechanics for just about any fight anymore, and can burn each of them. And those items will be unlocked by the time the person comes back, along with new gear sets to replace the current. So the argument is at a stand still :/

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Running stuff unsync only might as well cancel sub that's more boring then a guildhiest

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Running stuff unsync only might as well cancel sub that's more boring then a guildhiest

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Maybe in your opinion. unsyncing things can be a lot of fun

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Maybe in your opinion. unsyncing things can be a lot of fun

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Or, at the very least, speed things up on the DPS side when you're running mount farms. I say that when a friend of mine had a full lv 70 party that still couldn't skip Soar in Zurvan Ex. <_<;

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Running stuff unsync only might as well cancel sub that's more boring then a guildhiest

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Well if you're going in at max players and just faceroll everything I can see how that can be boring. Some players try to solo/duo old content which is another use for unsync. Might be more fun for them.

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Originally Posted by Vaer

Well if you're going in at max players and just faceroll everything I can see how that can be boring. Some players try to solo/duo old content which is another use for unsync. Might be more fun for them.

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Was replying to someone saying if u miss them to just go back and unsync. Just seems like a lame option to me but to each their own soloing old primal can be fun tho