Pld Emnity/hate distribution chages?

[Aeonk]

That idea fails to address what Cream_Soda has been saying all this time. I'll reiterate it in a different way so maybe people will get the point.

We do NOT need help holding hate. We never did.

What we need is a reason to have a PLD in the party instead of a DD tank. Justification.


Holding hate 100% of the time might make you feel like you're tanking... but really, what's the point? If a DD, even a sub par DD can survive the mob's damage and deal more damage than you, they speed up the fight. And as we all know in abyssea, time is money. The playerbase doesn't want a safer fight, they want a faster fight. So how can PLD speed things up?

Damage.
It not only speeds the fight up, it is easily the best hate tool in the game. I'm not saying that we have to upset the job balance and become the #1 DD's as well as tanks (although elitist mentallity will take nothing less than #1... but there's no satisfying them anyway.)
Any type of dmg buff would be a step in the right direction, no matter how big/small it is. If you're dealing significant dmg to help speed things up (and tank), that's all anyone can ask for.


And as the icing on the cake, how about a little perspective?
Even RDM has Composure (it's used for buff duration, but it does give them accuracy.)

[Arcon]

That idea fails to address what Cream_Soda has been saying all this time. I'll reiterate it in a different way so maybe people will get the point.

We do NOT need help holding hate. We never did.

What we need is a reason to have a PLD in the party instead of a DD tank. Justification.


Holding hate 100% of the time might make you feel like you're tanking... but really, what's the point? If a DD, even a sub par DD can survive the mob's damage and deal more damage than you, they speed up the fight. And as we all know in abyssea, time is money. The playerbase doesn't want a safer fight, they want a faster fight. So how can PLD speed things up?

Damage.
It not only speeds the fight up, it is easily the best hate tool in the game. I'm not saying that we have to upset the job balance and become the #1 DD's as well as tanks (although elitist mentallity will take nothing less than #1... but there's no satisfying them anyway.)
Any type of dmg buff would be a step in the right direction, no matter how big/small it is. If you're dealing significant dmg to help speed things up (and tank), that's all anyone can ask for.

People need to stop using that argument. PLD does not need to deal more damage. Right now PLDs aren't used, because right now the game is unbalanced, not the job. Old content is, well, old, and not much of a challenge either way. New content is Abyssea, and thus not a challenge at all. Talking about balance in these times is pointless, there's nothing SE will do, because there's no point. All they need to do is wait, or rather, that's all we need to do. Once there's new content coming out, WHM won't be able to tank anymore, and the demand for PLDs will rise again.

Old content is easy because of the low level, so anything can be blink or even blood tanked by pretty much any job. It's why no one set up a 6-man party at 75 to kill Leaping Lizzy, there was simply no need for it. Current content is high level, but easy because of ridiculously overpowered buffs. All we have to do now, is hope that SE introduces new content, that is a combination of both: high level, but no crazy buffs. Then damage mitigation will be an issue again, or more precisely MP conservation. That will be the justification you're looking for.

Abyssea is just a temporary thing, it was nothing but that from day one. Something to hold us over until final end game content is introduced. Getting so worked up over it is pointless, just use this time to pimp out your PLD for when it gets to shine again.

On topic though, I realized I didn't even post it here, enmity is still broken as it is now (even outside of Abyssea, and it will be on higher-level content as well). I made a new suggestion to modify the current enmity system here. Uncapped enmity is the only real way to go in my opinion, it would fix a lot of the problems the current enmity system holds.

And as the icing on the cake, how about a little perspective?
Even RDM has Composure (it's used for buff duration, but it does give them accuracy.)

That helps their damage about as much as Shield Bash and Reprisal do to our own, even if those don't count for enmity. Just saying, a little Accuracy boost can't be called a DD ability. RDM was just always an odd job at that.

[Greatguardian]

For some reason you really do seem to think Paladin takes less damage than other jobs.

It doesn't. Not without an Ochain. But, that said, Ochain is just brokenly awesome to begin with.

[Aeonk]

Tell me something Arcon... do you really think this DD tank mentallity is going to go away?

It wasn't just abyssea that created this imbalance. It was also the cap increase. Your WHM's have convert, your RDM's have Refresh 2, BRDs with Ballad 3, etc.

With a little support in the MP department, the MNK tank will live on post abyssea.

That's why this problem needs to be addressed now. Not wait for SE to offer it up on a silver plater. And considering we just got skipped over in favor of buffing DRK (and a potential nerf in crit WS's, which hurts us further).... I wouldn't hold your breathe waiting for an answer.

[Charismatic]

(and a potential nerf in crit WS's, which hurts us further)

No, it's already been addressed here on the forums... that's going to apply to enemies only.
Otherwise I agree with your post.

Let's also not forget that our white mages have up to +7MP per tic (without using stuff like poison taster's cape, etc) in idle gear nowadays.

[Cursed]

SE will only fix PLD when their are enough "PLD is dead" cries.
Problem is, every time we get a rally started, someone comes onto these forums and starts the "NO PLD IS NOT DEAD I HAVE THE SOLUTION" derail.
I've been tanking since 2003. PLD is not ok the way it is now. The current reality makes Earth Staffed Byakko and Seiryu days look like the golden age.
PLD IS DEAD.

[Greatguardian]

SE will only fix PLD when their are enough "PLD is dead" cries.
Problem is, every time we get a rally started, someone comes onto these forums and starts the "NO PLD IS NOT DEAD I HAVE THE SOLUTION" derail.
I've been tanking since 2003. PLD is not ok the way it is now. The current reality makes Earth Staffed Byakko and Seiryu days look like the golden age.
PLD IS DEAD.

Pld is not dead. I have the solution.

Dead horse. Beaten. I promise the "Krystal method" of "Scream loud enough and make enough threads and eventually they'll fix it" doesn't work. It's just obnoxious.

[Mirage]

To fix PLD, the game needs bosses where PLDs are required for a safe victory. Which means we'd need a mob that has enough accuracy to cap evasion against a lv90 thief with 100+ evasion in gear and capped, merited evasion skill. Along with that, it would have to hit so fast that 5 shadows would be eaten long before before either utsusemis could be recast. It would also have to hit so hard against jobs that weren't purely geared for defence that the mages wouldn't be able to keep their HP at safe levels.

Or something like that. I don't have either pld or nin above 50.

Btw i don't know how much evasion you can stack on thf, 100 sounded like a lot but i'm not sure!

[Greatguardian]

To fix PLD, the game needs bosses where PLDs are required for a safe victory. Which means we'd need a mob that has enough accuracy to cap evasion against a lv90 thief with 100+ evasion in gear and capped, merited evasion skill. Along with that, it would have to hit so fast that 5 shadows would be eaten long before before either utsusemis could be recast. It would also have to hit so hard against jobs that weren't purely geared for defence that the mages wouldn't be able to keep their HP at safe levels.

Or something like that. I don't have either pld or nin above 50.

Btw i don't know how much evasion you can stack on thf, 100 sounded like a lot but i'm not sure!

A mob like that would be better tanked by a DRK, MNK, or RDM long, long, long before a Paladin. Defense is worthless. Bloodtanking on PLD is worthless. Any "PLD tanking" that involves PLD/WAR is going to be worthless. It's harsh, and I apologize for that, but it's the truth and there's no need to reiterate in detail why bloodtanking is bad every time someone posts about bloodtanking/defense.

[Mirage]

Then maybe they should change the defense to actually do something.