Request. Please allow trust in abbysea

[Afania]

Lol you must be new to arguing with Afania, Pixela. Most of their arguments when it comes to making the REM weapons is if you are allowed a "stupid easy" amount of time to make one that you and everyone else will quit the game once you have it. To them once you have the item there won't be any reason for you or others to log in anymore because you finished geting that one long term goal done.

This argument is based on the fact that I have plenty of friends/lsmate quit right after they got their mythic/relic nowadays.

In 75 era I rarely see an endgame player quit/come and go as much. They always pop on weekly event every week.

I used to play every single day for 5+ hr when I had a long term goal too, now I just play for 2 weekends after update to cap gear, quit and play other games, then come back after 1~2 more update too. IMO it's wasting my $12 a month if I log on and get nothing to do. The dev is effectively turning FFXI into FFXIV, where you pay a monthly fee but only get to play for a few days due to the lack of longevity.

If you don't agree with the opinion, tell me why, just don't go "lol if you think ppl gonna quit after they get long term goal done". Just because you don't quit without long term goal, doesn't mean that applies to other people.

[Pixela]

This argument is based on the fact that I have plenty of friends/lsmate quit right after they got their mythic/relic nowadays.

In 75 era I rarely see an endgame player quit/come and go as much. They always pop on weekly event every week.

I used to play every single day for 5+ hr when I had a long term goal too, now I just play for 2 weekends after update to cap gear, quit and play other games, then come back after 1~2 more update too. IMO it's wasting my $12 a month if I log on and get nothing to do. The dev is effectively turning FFXI into FFXIV, where you pay a monthly fee but only get to play for a few days due to the lack of longevity.

If you don't agree with the opinion, tell me why, just don't go "lol if you think ppl gonna quit after they get long term goal done". Just because you don't quit without long term goal, doesn't mean that applies to other people.

If you can't tell, the whole design ideal is to make XIV and XI casual. Mainly so that people will play both games, or so they hope.

They know that many of the people that play XIV once played XI, if they make both games just good enough but not too much of a time sink they hope to get twice the subscription fees out of you.

[Afania]

Relics aren't long-term goals though. They used to be, they surely aren't now.

Getting them to Ilevel 119 is, but not just getting one. No soloist is going to get a 119 relic anytime soon.

Also how does allowing trusts in Aby make your friends who you party with to finish that faster and then quit, none of them presumably need trusts anyway. FFXI isn't about finishing long-term goals anymore because the goals are constantly being moved. I-level alone shows you that.

I didn't quit when I finished my king gear set, my homan set, my relic, my af3 etc People that are still playing this game are not the kind of people that get a lolrelic and quit.

When I said having trust will reduce the time it takes to build a relic, I mean trust in Dyna. I care less about having trust in abyssea but just find it unbelievable that ppl complained about Abyssea NM not soloable.

Even if relic isn't long term enough, able to build one even faster just make things worse, not better. So what you just said contradicts your own opinion.

Of course ppl that are still playing isn't kind of ppl that'd quit. Because the ppl that's get bored and quit are already gone ._.

[Pixela]

When I said having trust will reduce the time it takes to build a relic, I mean trust in Dyna. I care less about having trust in abyssea but just find it unbelievable that ppl complained about Abyssea NM not soloable.

Even if relic isn't long term enough, able to build one even faster just make things worse, not better. So what you just said contradicts your own opinion.

Of course ppl that are still playing isn't kind of ppl that'd quit. Because the ppl that's get bored and quit are already gone ._.

I and most of the people I knew that quit didn't quit because they capped out on things, they quit because the dev team we had sucked and the game was going down the drain due to XIV starving it to death.

[Malithar]

This argument is based on the fact that I have plenty of friends/lsmate quit right after they got their mythic/relic nowadays.

2 cents on this, it's pretty much the reality. RMEs are really the only long term goals left for any players who've been a part of the game for a few years or more, and even those are becoming pretty easy. Got Idris just over a week ago, and and after I was done with the testing, I really kinda lost my will to play. Guess it didn't help that I prepped and my only task to complete was to get the HPBs, since the other requirements were far lower than I anticipated. The carrot on the stick was gone so quickly. Just gotta move onto the next mythic I guess.

Content as a whole has lost it's long term appeal. Day to day lives for anyone progressing in current endgame is either A) do merit BCs hoping for your drop or grinding tales to 119 more AF/relic, or B) making gil via Dyna/Salvage/Skirmish/BCs/Delve to put towards RMEs or a few pieces of relevant AH-able gear, like the new +1 rings. It's not so much that that's a terrible state for the game, but the long term "I can't wait until I get that!" goals just aren't there anymore, sans RME, which have largely become less about doing the content and more about amassing gil.

OT: No thanks to Dyna trusts, I'd just mass pull all the mage mobs and spam -gas for the lulz. Congestion etc too. Trusts in Aby, sure why not, give em Atma effects while they're at it too. It's not so much that it's hard content that actually requires them, or that they'd even be all that useful. But for anyone who actually has to progress through Aby (new players) it'd be an annoying paradigm shift to go from soloing up in the outside world with trusts, then suddenly find yourself in Aby progressing further without them. It'd just be a little more seamless, in a sense.

[Lithera]

This argument is based on the fact that I have plenty of friends/lsmate quit right after they got their mythic/relic nowadays.

In 75 era I rarely see an endgame player quit/come and go as much. They always pop on weekly event every week.

I used to play every single day for 5+ hr when I had a long term goal too, now I just play for 2 weekends after update to cap gear, quit and play other games, then come back after 1~2 more update too. IMO it's wasting my $12 a month if I log on and get nothing to do. The dev is effectively turning FFXI into FFXIV, where you pay a monthly fee but only get to play for a few days due to the lack of longevity.

If you don't agree with the opinion, tell me why, just don't go "lol if you think ppl gonna quit after they get long term goal done". Just because you don't quit without long term goal, doesn't mean that applies to other people.

I don't agree with it because there is enough people playing that won't quit just because they finally got a REM done. I would be shocked if there was actually more people that are like you who have all of the best gears and have the REM that they want to have vs the amount of people who are struggling to get this stuff done because they're not well connected, aren't that great at soloing, or heaven forbid one of those dirty casuals. Also I was laughing because I felt bad for the person who responded to you. They probably wouldn't have said some of the things they did if they already knew how you see the game and that you feel that everyone will quit the second they finish making a REM.

[Afania]

I don't agree with it because there is enough people playing that won't quit just because they finally got a REM done. I would be shocked if there was actually more people that are like you who have all of the best gears and have the REM that they want to have vs the amount of people who are struggling to get this stuff done because they're not well connected, aren't that great at soloing, or heaven forbid one of those dirty casuals. Also I was laughing because I felt bad for the person who responded to you. They probably wouldn't have said some of the things they did if they already knew how you see the game and that you feel that everyone will quit the second they finish making a REM.

It doesn't matter if the majority of players are "struggling to get stuff done" unless you seriously want to argue that ppl will quit because they can't use trust in dynamis, which isn't very convincing.

I didn't say "everyone". But the point of MMORPG is to give ppl stuff to do and keep the players staying as long as possible. You want as many people stay sub as possible, not driving them away, even if they're the minority.

So say, if 20% of players can cap gear with current pace, 80% of ppl can't. Not having a long term goal or reducing the time it needs to complete a long term goal will just make 20% of ppl quit faster. But those 80% of ppl will have stuff to do even if you don't do adjustment.

For example, if it needs 2 months for semi-hardcore player to finish a relic, and only 20% of player can finish 1 relic in 2 months. 80% of player needs 3~5 months to finish one. Then SE decided to reduce the time it takes to create a relic to 1 month.

Now 20% of players just quit the game 2x faster, but it won't affect 80% of ppl. It doesn't matter if casual needs 2 months to finish a relic or 3~5 months, they won't run out of stuff to do because they have too much to do, but the top 20% of ppl will. That's the point.

I know many ppl that quit FFXI because they run out of stuff to do, I've yet to encounter ONE casual player quit just because they can't finish a relic in 1 month. Most of the casual players I've met in this game are fairly happy with normal ILV 115~119 JSE gears.

All my argument follows basic MMORPG design philosophy, which is to keep the players as busy as possible and play as long as possible. While your argument are based on what pleases YOU, instead of what benefits the game's life as a whole.

[Pixela]

It doesn't matter if the majority of players are "struggling to get stuff done" unless you seriously want to argue that ppl will quit because they can't use trust in dynamis, which isn't very convincing.

I didn't say "everyone". But the point of MMORPG is to give ppl stuff to do and keep the players staying as long as possible. You want as many people stay sub as possible, not driving them away, even if they're the minority.

So say, if 20% of players can cap gear with current pace, 80% of ppl can't. Not having a long term goal or reducing the time it needs to complete a long term goal will just make 20% of ppl quit faster. But those 80% of ppl will have stuff to do even if you don't do adjustment.

For example, if it needs 2 months for semi-hardcore player to finish a relic, and only 20% of player can finish 1 relic in 2 months. 80% of player needs 3~5 months to finish one. Then SE decided to reduce the time it takes to create a relic to 1 month.

Now 20% of players just quit the game 2x faster, but it won't affect 80% of ppl. It doesn't matter if casual needs 2 months to finish a relic or 3~5 months, they won't run out of stuff to do because they have too much to do, but the top 20% of ppl will. That's the point.

I know many ppl that quit FFXI because they run out of stuff to do, I've yet to encounter ONE casual player quit just because they can't finish a relic in 1 month. Most of the casual players I've met in this game are fairly happy with normal ILV 115~119 JSE gears.

All my argument follows basic MMORPG design philosophy, which is to keep the players as busy as possible and play as long as possible. While your argument are based on what pleases YOU, instead of what benefits the game's life as a whole.

This works, to a point. At that point people say **** this and quit. You need to keep in mind that the majority of people that quit a game do so before they ever get close to capping out.