99 Empyrean Trials.

[DrStrangelove]

this is a game, take your real life comparisons and gtfo

Sorry, the analogy was too complex.

Let's try something else then:

Food good, fire bad.

[Nynja]

Food good, fire bad.

actually if you made it through grade 10 history, you'd know without fire, you'd still be drawing stick figures on your cave wall out of coal, or whatever was used back then, and your food wouldnt even be good.

[DrStrangelove]

actually if you made it through grade 10 history, you'd know without fire, you'd still be drawing stick figures on your cave wall out of coal, or whatever was used back then, and your food wouldnt even be good.

Umm....okay, I see a 4-word, single-syllable sentence was too complex. Not surprised!!


And just to be clear, fire was discovered by various pre-human ancestors long before modern humans. The development of complex thought in modern humans occurred 700,000 years afterwards.

Cave drawings were made using coal (from their own cooking) or charcoal that was found on the ground from natural fires, so this had zero to do with the discovery of fire. In fact, development of cave drawing was 740,000 years after fire was discovered.

So cave drawings have nothing to do with fire, but complex thought that occurred in modern humans which did not exist until around 70,000 years ago.

If your point was that without fire (which had been discovered 700,000 years before modern humans existed), that we'd still be living in caves, then I'm dieing to hear the theory.


Now getting back to another complex thought:

Empys are not hard to get to 95, nor 99. What is intended is that they will not ALL get to 95 or 99. This is called planned scarcity. Had SE wanted all of them to be 95 or 99, then you would be able to do a quest (kill mobs, get xp). They use drops to reduce the abundance of completed weapons.

If you want to argue this, you have to convince SE that having 32,000 level 99 empys in 12 months is a good thing.

[Kysaiana]

If you want to argue this, you have to convince SE that having 32,000 level 99 empys in 12 months is a good thing.

I'd love to see the numbers on relics 12 months after the dynamis revamps. Particularly the CoP zones.

You argue SE doesn't want ALL empyreans to be 95, but relics are basically handed their 95 trial. I'm personally okay with 60 riftdross/cinder as long as their are more fights that supply them in the future. Because Rex/Ig aren't going to be fought consistantly for very long and the supply for those items will eventually dry up otherwise. I'm more likely to get 60 dross/cinder than I am to get 1500 plates.

Yes, I can spend all my in-game time converting massive amounts of cruor into gil, adding too the inflation. But it's not a simple matter of taking my money bags down to the heavy metal plate store. The supply for HMP is dwindling. Voidwatch is losing popularity as more people either get the drops they want or simply give up on this crap. And beyond all that, why pay so much gil for such a minor upgrade? Anyone who does is buying a Rolex but getting a Casio.

[DrStrangelove]

I'd love to see the numbers on relics 12 months after the dynamis revamps. Particularly the CoP zones.

You argue SE doesn't want ALL empyreans to be 95, but relics are basically handed their 95 trial. I'm personally okay with 60 riftdross/cinder as long as their are more fights that supply them in the future. Because Rex/Ig aren't going to be fought consistantly for very long and the supply for those items will eventually dry up otherwise. I'm more likely to get 60 dross/cinder than I am to get 1500 plates.

Yes, I can spend all my in-game time converting massive amounts of cruor into gil, adding too the inflation. But it's not a simple matter of taking my money bags down to the heavy metal plate store. The supply for HMP is dwindling. Voidwatch is losing popularity as more people either get the drops they want or simply give up on this crap. And beyond all that, why pay so much gil for such a minor upgrade? Anyone who does is buying a Rolex but getting a Casio.

I think we have points of agreement:

1) they need to make sure there is some reason to do content for HMP, ADL and PW besides just the completion of weapons. That alone will not create a supply.

2) Relics are 4,000 and will never be 32,000, no matter how easy the 95 or 99 content is. The huge hurdle is the start with 120 million gil. Empys are already 16,000 and the hurdle is at the back. That's where the two differ and it's why SE will restrict empys at the back end.

3) It's unfair to look at each upgrade by itself. Empys are great weapons that are easy to solo / duo / lowman if you will all the way to 90. At 90 they are free and basically the best weapons. Mythics and relics do start to become better depending on the weapon, at 95 or 99. If SE sets a high hurdle AFTER 90 it's because the road up to 90 was fast, free, clear and easy. It's on the whole that you have to compare them.

[Kysaiana]

1) We do agree on this.

2) According to the Census it was 6,640 relics at the time of the Census compared to 3.985 the previous year. http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/gui...nsus/10/4.html I'm not sure where you got the 32,000 empyrean number from. It was 27k ish at the time of the Census so that number is probably right or too low. I wouldn't be surprised if there was 10k+ relics at least by now. Still no where near 32k but give it time, relic popularity has gone up recently especially since 90 and 95 trials made many relics equal to if not better than their empyrean counterparts.

As for the gil hurdle on relics, you can solo farm a relic to 75 in a few months time, there's no gil requirement, and you only need help with the attestation/fragment parts and even those are soloable for some people. People only spend gil because it takes less time to make gil than farm the currency. Empyreans are easy to 90. I don't think anyone would argue against that. Relics are also easy. They only take longer because you're limited to 2hrs of dynamis a day while you can spend as much time in abyssea as you have stones for / get TE's. Both weapons are free if you want them to be and saying "I spent 120 mil on a relic, therefore empyreans should spend 150mil on one trial." doesn't add up to me. It makes no sense to have a huge road block in empyrean weapons two trials after you get the weapon skill/aftermath.

Sorry, that was a bit of a rant.

3) I agree. On the whole, relics are easier to get to 95 than empyreans. They also cost less gil if you chose to go that route. So I guess relics are the easier weapons? The 99 trial remains to be seen. Which is the whole point of this thread. I highly doubt SE is going to ease up on any of the trial requirements than they already have no matter how much we gripe.

[newmonkey]

Ok Most people stil buy curreny for relics i should know i sell plenty of it each night however that been said you do know that you can go spam dynamis and sell the currency to fund your plates right ?

So technially the 95 empy trial is free if you want to use that silly excuse, oh and by the way its 30 mil for the last ukon stage and its going to be at least 100 mil for the last relic stage, again what are you trying to prove here ?

[MarkovChain]

Tadaaa 2x level 99 for us tomorrow and yeah it's the easiest trial of the 3 by far, though boooring. The relic one is going to fun at least. Hopefully the plates nerf makes PW trial easy too. Now for a 99 daurdabla.

[Nynja]

are you going to post this alleged video or what?

[macross]

we'll have 2x 99 tomorrow too, today's ADL dropped 2 marrows yay. 1x 99 empy harp, my ukon will still be 95 sadly for long time. Should have 3x mythic done in a few days if people spam their zeni too.

its 60m as dross sell for 1m here, and people won't budge. I guess peeps buy them in the hopes they will finish a 95 someday shrug.