To the devs!

[ManaKing]

We're finally agreeing on something, progress. Rdm is not a pure buff job, and does not, and should not, function like one.

Yeah but that is all RDM is viewed as. We have no real value except to refresh and haste in a party.

Curing isn't even an issue because of how much better a WHM can service an alliance and a BLU can service a single party. We are behind on curing. We will never catch up unless the next curing change affects us very favorably. So the best we are doing as a support is Haste, Refresh, Cure.

We need more, but we don't need to neglect what we already have. I have no problem with curing others, hasting others, or refreshing others. I just don't want that to be all I'm good for every time things get real. It gets boring fast and there is plenty of time to do other things while i sit around.

When you compare the solo experience to the party experience, RDM is disastrously bad with other people. All of it's value gets cut down because it doesn't stack well(enspells/sambas or gain/boost). We need buffs to our functionality to a full alliance (please don't read this as we need AoE buffs, that isn't what I'm saying.) Things need to stack better for us and we need our enfeebling back to throw into the mix.

On melee, It really is go Almace or go home. There is no middle ground, which I guess is ok, but it won't be if they don't keep RDM's gear up to date. They have done a decent job recently(thanks Brego Helm, Rubeus Spats, and Ephemeron), but they still haven't given us an acceptable TP body. The only one that is even close to acceptable is crimson/blood scale mail augmented to +3% haste, get the accuracy for the secondary buff, and get some decent random augments like more acc or atk. I'm not going to pretend that is a reasonable amount of work. You have to get lucky on either Odin or the HQ drop of the Adamantoise....Neither are good drop rates. Good luck on all that random luck.

Please fix our job. It's broken and WE can't do anything about that.

[cidbahamut]

I have no problem with curing others, hasting others, or refreshing others. I just don't want that to be all I'm good for every time things get real.

If you think that's all you are good for then you need to hang up your pimp hat and play a different job.

Red Mage is in a bad place, but perpetuating this myth that Refresh, Haste and Cure are all we have is not helping anyone.

[ManaKing]

If you think that's all you are good for then you need to hang up your pimp hat and play a different job.

Red Mage is in a bad place, but perpetuating this myth that Refresh, Haste and Cure are all we have is not helping anyone.

You certainly didn't counter point anything so it seems that your lack of evidence doesn't lead well to your argument. Please actually participate in a conversation or expect to be ignored. I don't have time to waste on people that make vague, insulting statements. I'm not in high school or under a bridge.

[cidbahamut]

You certainly didn't counter point anything so it seems that your lack of evidence doesn't lead well to your argument. Please actually participate in a conversation or expect to be ignored. I don't have time to waste on people that make vague, insulting statements. I'm not in high school or under a bridge.

You didn't really back your argument either. Hooray for internet arguments.

Seriously though, Red Mage brings more to the table than just three spells.
Are those three spells useful? Yes.
Can you do more to assist in any given fight than cast those three spells? Yes.

Try making use of your subjob. Even without Chainspell Red Mage is still a better suited to stun than anyone other than a BLU rocking all their stun spells. Red Mage can fill in the holes that crop up in mage duties while the specialists are pre-occupied. White Mage is busy keeping tank alive but can't take a break to help raise. Red Mage is operating under the freedom of 'we don't care what you do' so they raise folks and re-apply pro/shell because god knows the White Mage doesn't have time to run into the fray while the NM spams TP attacks and no one else ever remembers to do it. White Mage has everything covered? Get back to nuking and stunning if you're /BLM. Need more -na spells? You can help with that if you're /SCH or /WHM(and then get back to nuking). Stuff goes south and the NM is looking at you? Good news, if it can be kited then Red Mage is probably better suited to kiting it than most(disclaimer: there's plenty of stuff that can't be kited, shut up).

Is it worthwhile to bring a Red Mage when there are specialists available? Probably not, but I think there's too many variables to say the answer is anything but subjective without further details.
Is Red Mage in a bad place as a job? Yes.
Is Red Mage only bringing 3 spells to the table? No, and you are silly for suggesting so.

There, now pick that apart and tell me how I am wrong. I know saevel will.

[saevel]

You certainly didn't counter point anything so it seems that your lack of evidence doesn't lead well to your argument. Please actually participate in a conversation or expect to be ignored. I don't have time to waste on people that make vague, insulting statements. I'm not in high school or under a bridge.

I added that troll to my ignore list a long time ago. I suggest you do the same, thus you no longer have to listen to them.