Will there be camps in the new expansion?

Will there will camps similar to pre-Abyssea camps, such as Kings, CoP Wyrms, etc?

you want them to add a HNM that drops 1 item that everyone wants 10% of the time and is a 72 hour repop?

10% is a bit high, don't you think? But otherwise, yes.

No thanks, how about we have actually engaging endgame events instead?

Define: Engaging

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Originally Posted by Takutu

Define: Engaging

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en·gage   [en-geyj] verb, en·gaged, en·gag·ing.
verb (used with object)
1.
to occupy the attention or efforts of (a person or persons): He engaged her in conversation.

They should put these in on one condition. They have no drops. 0 zilch. Absolutely nothing gear or performance related.

Perhaps defeating them gives your character some shiny glow effect, or free warps to different outposts depending which ones that you have killed. Maybe a bunch of cool looking stuff to put on your farm.

No drops though. Absolutely nothing.

If my subscription fees are going to go towards something that most people will never get to experience, then it should be something that most people will not miss.

Saying that everyone can't experience this is complete nonsense. Everyone has the opportunity to go to the camps, and compete. The game needs a sense of competition, and these events were one of the biggest competition driven events that also had the opportunity to yield some of the games best gear. I'm not saying all the best gear came or should come from camps, but quite a bit of it did, and should.

Oh look it's this thread again.

If you want HNM's then just unplug your keyboard infront of a ??? for 72 hours and watch it - then after 72 hours plug it back in and pop the NM. BAM HNM EXPERIENCE.

Why do people want to play a game to sit there doing nothing? Morons.

This game doesn't need competition, if you want competition go play any PvP enabled MMO or FPS or even Ballista here.

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Originally Posted by Takutu

Will there will camps similar to pre-Abyssea camps, such as Kings, CoP Wyrms, etc?

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Sorry Tukutu, you've entered the realm of "If it existed before 2010, you can forget about it, because nobody wants it!"

I beg to differ here: Oh boy check out the 200+ Likes!

Anyhow, I agree with your suggestion. :)

There is a very big difference between 21-24 hour HNMs, 48-72 hour HNMs, and 3-5 Day HNMs.

The 21-24 hour HNMs, a 10 minute (if it pops first window), to a 3 hour (if it pops final window) event. Guess what else was a 10min-3hour event? Every other event in the game. Between windows you can do other stuff. You don't actually have to sit at your screen staring at it.

The longer camps, were mostly camped by mules until the final window. Sure, there was people camping it themselves if they wanted a piece of gear from it, such as Gaiters. Sorry you actually had to spend time to get good pieces of gear.

I'm not saying every event should be Kings, but they were a really fun part of the game that added a lot.

Sorry Takutu, but this is a dead horse thread. Everyone I have polled in game pretty much say the same thing: we do not want this.

And variations of this exact thread crop up every now again because some narcissistic personalities just like you wanting to crow about being better than every one else. And it invariably gets shut down.

So here, I am not even going to argue the point. Instead I say "Just say no to faux PvP! Support real PvP!"

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Originally Posted by Takutu

There is a very big difference between 21-24 hour HNMs, 48-72 hour HNMs, and 3-5 Day HNMs.

The 21-24 hour HNMs, a 10 minute (if it pops first window), to a 3 hour (if it pops final window) event. Guess what else was a 10min-3hour event? Every other event in the game. Between windows you can do other stuff. You don't actually have to sit at your screen staring at it.

The longer camps, were mostly camped by mules until the final window. Sure, there was people camping it themselves if they wanted a piece of gear from it, such as Gaiters. Sorry you actually had to spend time to get good pieces of gear.

I'm not saying every event should be Kings, but they were a really fun part of the game that added a lot.

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Maybe if it were 10 minutes~3hours after its last death, sure. Anything that takes roughly 24 hours to potential pop even if in windows will need you to move things around in your schedule for it, not good, or worth it. If when I am normally sleeping for work it is supposed to pop, I have to sleep weirdly just so I can be up during a time I may be able to get it, does this sound like good content? No.

Popped, Global or Event HNMs onry pls.

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Originally Posted by Eyeballed

Sorry Tukutu, you've entered the realm of "If it existed before 2010, you can forget about it, because nobody wants it!"

I beg to differ here: Oh boy check out the 200+ Likes!

Anyhow, I agree with your suggestion. :)

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Again, you give FFXIV links as if it is something that should effect this game or as if it of some relevance to this game, it is not. Instead lets look at other posts for FFXI on this subject shall we?

This thread asked for HNMs, it was argued with for 29 pages or so, the final votes near the start of the thread seem to be 14 for, 39 against.

This thread even gave the ability to get the items from other content, Legion, or Einherjar, thus eliminating the need to do the content, while providing it still for those who want it. 14 for, 45 against, this was the final numbers for this long gone thread of last month.

This thread gave alot of info on a new idea that would attempt to stop botting and provide a fair chance to everyone, that way they can all get the NM possibly, final votes here were 12 for, 24 against.

In all of these cases the amount for is half or less than the amount of people against it. This means twice as many people say no to this content, than they do say yes. Your post gives a FFXIV thread which has little to no relevance here, sorry, but this shows the exact opposite of what you want to see, more people say no to the very existence of HNMs even if they were not needed to be done for gear, and it was added to other events.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

Again, you give FFXIV links as if it is something that should effect this game or as if it of some relevance to this game, it is not. Instead lets look at other posts for FFXI on this subject shall we?

This thread asked for HNMs, it was argued with for 29 pages or so, the final votes near the start of the thread seem to be 14 for, 39 against.

This thread even gave the ability to get the items from other content, Legion, or Einherjar, thus eliminating the need to do the content, while providing it still for those who want it. 14 for, 45 against, this was the final numbers for this long gone thread of last month.

This thread gave alot of info on a new idea that would attempt to stop botting and provide a fair chance to everyone, that way they can all get the NM possibly, final votes here were 12 for, 24 against.

In all of these cases the amount for is half or less than the amount of people against it. This means twice as many people say no to this content, than they do say yes. Your post gives a FFXIV thread which has little to no relevance here, sorry, but this shows the exact opposite of what you want to see, more people say no to the very existence of HNMs even if they were not needed to be done for gear, and it was added to other events.

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My argument isn't for or against what's going on in FFXIV. It's to show that people outside the game might enjoy it in some capacity. Just as much as people have joined/returned to this game because of the changes it's undergone. If you ask me, I think the developers should stop listening to the community and just make the game they want to make. You can't please everyone and you're a fool if you try to.

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Originally Posted by Eyeballed

My argument isn't for or against what's going on in FFXIV. It's to show that people outside the game might enjoy it in some capacity. Just as much as people have joined/returned to this game because of the changes it's undergone. If you ask me, I think the developers should stop listening to the community and just make the game they want to make. You can't please everyone and you're a fool if you try to.

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True, you can't please everyone, but you can try to please the most people possible... However the majority of people don't want HNM or the like.

You didn't think that all the way through, did you?

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Originally Posted by Trisscar

No thanks, how about we have actually engaging endgame events instead?

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Like VW, where you have a ~1% chance of getting an item you really need, but that guy that doesn't need it just got his 3rd?

At least with HNM gear went to people who could use/needed/wanted the item, rather than the crap shoot that VW is.

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Originally Posted by Reiterpallasch

Like VW, where you have a ~1% chance of getting an item you really need, but that guy that doesn't need it just got his 3rd?

At least with HNM gear went to people who could use/needed/wanted the item, rather than the crap shoot that VW is.

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I'd rather have something like ZNM, personally.

Oh and your argument is rendered invalid by the existence of DKP. Do try again.

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Originally Posted by Eyeballed

My argument isn't for or against what's going on in FFXIV. It's to show that people outside the game might enjoy it in some capacity. Just as much as people have joined/returned to this game because of the changes it's undergone. If you ask me, I think the developers should stop listening to the community and just make the game they want to make. You can't please everyone and you're a fool if you try to.

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http://i1090.photobucket.com/albums/...thCABH8SWO.jpg

Uh... Been camping kings for 4 years almost everyday except when the LS was taking small breaks during summer.
On one hand I miss that kind of world, of feelings, of sensations, of competition between LSs. I miss THAT FFXI which doesn't exist anymore nowadays.

On the other hand GOD PLEASE NO, I wouldn't really want to do Kings or Tiamat or Cerberus or Hydra or Khimaira or Sandworm or anything else anymore. NO NO NO, god please no SE, don't add any mobs like that anymore :(
They wouldn't bring the old FFXI back, just the hassle of it.

A while back one of these threads popped up and someone said these things:

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"Why do you want 24 hour pop HNMs back? So that me and my shell can dominate them with bots and force you to buy the items from us again? Fine, your loss."

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and

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"we used to claim kings even though we didn't need the items and then throw away the drops just to keep the selling prices high"

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That is why I said:

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Perhaps defeating them gives your character some shiny glow effect, or free warps to different outposts depending which ones that you have killed. Maybe a bunch of cool looking stuff to put on your farm.

No drops though. Absolutely nothing.

If my subscription fees are going to go towards something that most people will never get to experience, then it should be something that most people will not miss.

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And to be clear, everyone does not have the opportunity to experience this.

People who have an HNM shell have the opportunity to stop playing the game and sit for 3~ hours a day doing nothing, while their character is in the proximity of others doing the same. At the end, one group gets the opportunity to experience this (18/2000 people currently logged on my server is < 1%) every 1-3 days.

That's just dumb. The insanity of telling your customers that you only have a few people to build content (despite the fact that the monthly bill has remained the same) and then having those few people design content that less than %1 of the players can actually enjoy is off the charts.

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Originally Posted by Takutu

Saying that everyone can't experience this is complete nonsense. Everyone has the opportunity to go to the camps, and compete.

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no, some people cant because pop window doesnt match their playing window.

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Originally Posted by Takutu

There is a very big difference between 21-24 hour HNMs, 48-72 hour HNMs, and 3-5 Day HNMs.

The 21-24 hour HNMs, a 10 minute (if it pops first window), to a 3 hour (if it pops final window) event. Guess what else was a 10min-3hour event? Every other event in the game. Between windows you can do other stuff. You don't actually have to sit at your screen staring at it.

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when i can play 4h a day i dont want to spent up to 3h not playing.
every other event started when we scheduled it to start.

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I'm not saying every event should be Kings, but they were a really fun part of the game that added a lot.

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no it was a boring event that only added the drop people get, and thousand of $ to people who made claimbots.

we cant say X event is fun/boring because what is fun is not universal.

i don't mind if they add HNM, and just hope that they are not on stupiud window


my idea for an world pop HNM: server status on window state
closed(no time min/max)
soon 30min-1h
opened 0-1h

You see a majority of players don't want HNMs. I see a full third of players do want them, more than enough for SE to implement them with desired drops. When your play window closes, it's opening for someone else.

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Originally Posted by Aarahs

You see a majority of players don't want HNMs. I see a full third of players do want them, more than enough for SE to implement them with desired drops. When your play window closes, it's opening for someone else.

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Those people want them back so that they can bot them and keep all the loot from everyone else. That behavior should never be promoted in a game.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Those people want them back so that they can bot them and keep all the loot from everyone else. That behavior should never be promoted in a game's open world areas, but only in instanced ones like Uncharted Nyzul Isle where everybody can hack without the fear of getting caught and then get 15/15 within a few runs, only to complain after that all the other gear added in game sucks compared to Nyzul and they have nothing else to do in-game.

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FTFY!!
(lol)

I guess it doesn't apply to all of the players, but it certainly does to the great majority! :P

It would just be nice if the dev team would answer the people that keep posting on this topic. I mean the train wreck that always ends up happening in these threads are entertain for sure. But really it would be nice to squash this debate and wait for new topic for ppl to flame about.

The right way to do HNM:
Make them respawn at a completely random time. Could be one minute, could be three days, could be 8 months. Makes more sense for the most "elusive" enemies to not show up on a schedule.

Edit 1: Oh, and put it in an abyssea-like area with a time limit so you can't have mules afk-ing at it.
Fake edit 2: Ooh, and let it pop in multiple zones like that ala DI and SW so it's even harder to bot.

It should pop in Port Jeuno so all the AFKers hogging up my screen and lagging me can scurry out of the zone while the pros handle it.

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Originally Posted by Catmato

The right way to do HNM:

Don't do it.

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Fixed that for you.

I think they should make it that you can pop it using key item or pop items purchasable by points once per week. This way everyone who want to pop it can do it, but only once per week. Though they probably will make the drop luck based again and rare/ex otherwise these NMs will be abused in short time and most people will be done with them.

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

I think they should make it that you can pop it using key item or pop items purchasable by points once per week. This way everyone who want to pop it can do it, but only once per week. Though they probably will make the drop luck based again and rare/ex otherwise these NMs will be abused in short time and most people will be done with them.

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I have made a similar suggestion, where you trade trophies from lesser NM for an HNM tribute that allows you to entice them from hiding.

Someone nailed it in another thread and I can't find the post, so I'll just repeat it.

If you want the old HNM experience back, just take your whole shell to any VW Abysea or w/e ??? that you feel like. Have some one /random. If the random number is greater than 990, pop the monster and kill it. If the number is less than 990, wait 30 minutes and then have the person / random again. Repeat this process once every thirty minutes until you have gotten a number over 990, or 3 hours has passed. If after 3 hours you haven't rolled a 990, leave and come back tomorrow.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Someone nailed it in another thread and I can't find the post, so I'll just repeat it.

If you want the old HNM experience back, just take your whole shell to any VW Abysea or w/e ??? that you feel like. Have some one /random. If the random number is greater than 990, pop the monster and kill it. If the number is less than 990, wait 30 minutes and then have the person / random again. Repeat this process once every thirty minutes until you have gotten a number over 990, or 3 hours has passed. If after 3 hours you haven't rolled a 990, leave and come back tomorrow.

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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I believe this is what you were looking for good sir.

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Originally Posted by Takutu

Saying that everyone can't experience this is complete nonsense. Everyone has the opportunity to go to the camps, and compete. The game needs a sense of competition, and these events were one of the biggest competition driven events that also had the opportunity to yield some of the games best gear. I'm not saying all the best gear came or should come from camps, but quite a bit of it did, and should.

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Because we all know how kings worked out riiiiight....
was there... done it for 3 years. no thx I am done with camping forever. Such shity endgame design should never be implemented anymore.

One day, this topic and the "People-be-leeching-experience-yo" topic are going to breed. They're just meant for each other. I shudder to think what the child of that passionate and disgusting union will be.

This topic has been made about a dozen times. It's been locked a half-dozen of those times because there's not that much to discuss and thus both sides just started messing with each other. The Development Bros barely listen to anybody even when they ask for input, so I'm not sure what the point of making this topic again could be, other than just to mess with people.

If you actually want to camp Neo-Arch-Fafnir for hours and have the cleanest house on the block, I recommend appearing naked in whatever field the Development Bros are frolicking to celebrate their summer vacation and communicating your ideas through modern dance. That seems about their speed, and it doesn't involve making this damn topic again.

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Originally Posted by Reiterpallasch

Like VW, where you have a ~1% chance of getting an item you really need, but that guy that doesn't need it just got his 3rd?

At least with HNM gear went to people who could use/needed/wanted the item, rather than the crap shoot that VW is.

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What does that have to do with monster spawn conditions? You can still have a common treasure pool without 21-72+ hour NM spawns. Or are you saying only the people who are willing to sit with their thumbs up their <Rear> for hours on end can use/want/need good gear.

may altana bless spank for all of his posts.

that was a lot of martini

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Originally Posted by Trisscar

I'd rather have something like ZNM, personally.

Oh and your argument is rendered invalid by the existence of DKP. Do try again.

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Oops sorry "goes to people who earned it". Better?

I don't get why people don't understand that they can do both, similar to how some of the past HNM gear also dropped from events like einherjar. Just because the majority doesn't want something doesn't mean they can't please the rest as well. Pretty sure not very many people wanted bell commands/chocobo circuit/pankration/etc but we got it anyways.

Just because you fail at claiming and/or wouldn't know what to do with the mob if you got your hands on it, doesn't mean it shouldn't be in the game.

Don't wanna camp HNM? Don't @#$%ing camp HNM.

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Originally Posted by Reiterpallasch

Oops sorry "goes to people who earned it". Better?

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No. This doesn't reward people who have 'earned' it, any more than any other event. If a person with useful jobs, geared appropriately, caped skills and is very helpful towards the shell but has two jobs, is a full time student and can't attend 100% they're naturally at a disadvantage over some jobless virgin with a huge sense of self entitlement living in their moms basement and can thus attend 100%...

But I suppose that appeals to you. Hmm, I wonder why that can be?

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Originally Posted by Reiterpallasch

Oops sorry "goes to people who earned it". Better?

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"People who earned it" is rather subjective.

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I don't get why people don't understand that they can do both, similar to how some of the past HNM gear also dropped from events like einherjar.

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Einherjar wasn't always there. For YEARS, that gear was exclusive to HNM. If you couldn't or wouldn't do HNM you didn't have a shot at it. And, I've never seen Odin produce a Ridill or a D.ring, have you? Even now, stuff is generally still exclusive to the event it starts out with. Ok, AF3 seals do drop from other events, but I'm not seeing Legion gear in VW or Neo-Nyzul gear in WoE or vice versa.

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Just because the majority doesn't want something doesn't mean they can't please the rest as well. Pretty sure not very many people wanted bell commands/chocobo circuit/pankration/etc but we got it anyways.

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You're really comparing those things to what was once endgame?

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Just because you fail at claiming and/or wouldn't know what to do with the mob if you got your hands on it, doesn't mean it shouldn't be in the game.

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Most of the people who despise HNM participated in it quite often and quite successfully. We don't hate it because we failed at it. We didn't fail at it. We hate it because it really, really sucked. It wasn't fun standing around waiting for something to happen.

Imagine standing around for 30minutes-3hours waiting for Bowser or Dr. Wily to randomly decide to show himself. Now imagine that Luigi or Proto Man are standing there along side you waiting to kill the boss themselves. If they touch it before you, you don't get your chance. The game then locks you out from trying again until 21 hours have passed. If you can't play during that window of time, you're just screwed until the next 21 hours have passed because somewhere in the ether your virtual rival and your main enemy are still going to be doing their thing.

Does that really sound like Game of the Year material to you?