Nyzul Isle Uncharted information and feedback

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Originally Posted by Camate

As a general guideline, the system has been balanced in such a way so that once you have gotten used to it, you should be able to reach floor 60. If you try really hard, you can get to floor 80, and then if luck is on your side you will able to reach floor 100.

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THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE AT ALL!

I'm one of the many unlucky ones. I'm well over 0/300+ on both Pil and Qilin and I'm basically given up hope on ever getting Toci and Qilin's boots (yes I haven't gotten even that one yet) and NQ/HQ dagger.

This is a MAJOR FU from SE to the playerbase where LUCK is involved to just get to 100th floor.

Thanks SE, but no THANKS. You can take this event and just stuff it where the sun dont shine.

Thanks for the update Camate. I'm happy to see the Reward Obtainment consideration. I would just like to request 1 additional thing to consider.

The time limit forces us to rely on luck to get to Floor 100 at all... much less kill the NM there.

As with Old Nyzul, if you were ejected without rewards being distributed yet, you lost the contents of the treasure pool. Is there a way to prevent this from happening? Could we maybe be transported to a "Lobby" room like you're planning with Legion where we have a chance to lot on what dropped instead of losing out on the rewards we just got?

I can just imagine the way I would feel if my group made it to floor 100 with 45 seconds to spare, unloaded on the BOSS and got 2 drops that we all wanted and how infuriating it would be to lost them because we weren't quick enough with lotting/passing.

I really like it.

Incoming changes are really great to. They wont ruin the difficulty which is cool but will lower the cost of being unlucky.
Fast and tough event. Obviously casuals will cry because as always they want top gear w/o being optimal at event.

As for luck being involved. It's good. If luck wouldnt play any role you could constantly get to floor 100 with not even perfect setup.

Ppl always shouting they want something but instead they should stop for a moment and try to think. There is NO WAY to pass the luck being involved w/o completely destroying the event. You would need to balance every type of floor to avg same amount of time to complete and then set a static jump for next floor. In that kind of system you could then set that static jump at number that will allow perfect group to always be at 100 floor if they do everything perfectly. With event like that when some floors (code lamp around the corner) are much faster than others you cant really do anything to exclude the luck.

Luck is also maybe a bad wen you watch it from side but in the actual event it really makes everything more interesting and excitement. At least this kind of luck presented in Nyzul Isle because luck involved at VW with brainless killing stuff to get drop in chest is different story. Here luck boost dynamic of the event and burst emotion making event itself a great fun a drop being only a cheery at the top.

EDIT: oh yeah what Yygdrasil posted about drops is right. Letting ppl lot/pass after event is done would be really cool. something like BCNM when you out of arena but you can still lot/pass.

Sorry Camate, but luck based events are unacceptable.

Any event that rewards luck vs skill is not fun in the slightest, I honestly would have been happier fighting VT mobs every floor but gaining progression.

Why is the Dev team so hell bent on adding content just to artificially inflate the time it takes to gain rewards, honestly, it's a little frustrating.

Ever wonder why people are starting to shy away from Voidwatch? Even this Nyzul Isle is practically dead already on my server, with like 2-3 groups doing it consistantly.

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Originally Posted by Atoreis

I really like it.

Incoming changes are really great to. They wont ruin the difficulty which is cool but will lower the cost of being unlucky.
Fast and tough event. Obviously casuals will cry because as always they want top gear w/o being optimal at event.

As for luck being involved. It's good. If luck wouldnt play any role you could constantly get to floor 100 with not even perfect setup.

Ppl always shouting they want something but instead they should stop for a moment and try to think. There is NO WAY to pass the luck being involved w/o completely destroying the event. You would need to balance every type of floor to avg same amount of time to complete and then set a static jump for next floor. In that kind of system you could then set that static jump at number that will allow perfect group to always be at 100 floor if they do everything perfectly. With event like that when some floors (code lamp around the corner) are much faster than others you can really do anything to exclude the luck.

Luck is also maybe a bad wen you watch it from side but in the actual event it really makes everything more interesting and excitement. At least this kind of luck presented in Nyzul Isle because luck involved at VW with brainless killing stuff to get drop in chest is different story. Here luck boost dynamic of the event and burst emotion making event itself a great fun a drop being only a cheery at the top.

EDIT: oh yeah what Yygdrasil posted about drops is right. Letting ppl lot/pass after event is done would be really cool. something like BCNM when you out of arena but you can still lot/pass.

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If you enjoy luck, here's praying that you see a Flan All Kill floor every single time. Enjoy your LUCK.

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Originally Posted by Atoreis

I really like it.

Incoming changes are really great to. They wont ruin the difficulty which is cool but will lower the cost of being unlucky.
Fast and tough event. Obviously casuals will cry because as always they want top gear w/o being optimal at event.

As for luck being involved. It's good. If luck wouldnt play any role you could constantly get to floor 100 with not even perfect setup.

Ppl always shouting they want something but instead they should stop for a moment and try to think. There is NO WAY to pass the luck being involved w/o completely destroying the event. You would need to balance every type of floor to avg same amount of time to complete and then set a static jump for next floor. In that kind of system you could then set that static jump at number that will allow perfect group to always be at 100 floor if they do everything perfectly. With event like that when some floors (code lamp around the corner) are much faster than others you can really do anything to exclude the luck.

Luck is also maybe a bad wen you watch it from side but in the actual event it really makes everything more interesting and excitement.

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o_O;

...wat?

Luck is always more important than skill.

It's good to see confirmation that there is no gimmick we're missing. Thanks, Camate. Time to start looking for Scholars.

I have a suggestion that might make this concept more Fair. If Nyzul temp items are available to purchase how about adding an item that you can trade to the ??? on the floor jump (1 use) that you can select how high you want to jump floors (1-9). If this item was only available to the party leader or if everyone got one maybe halve the amount of floors you can jump using the item (1-5). It would help a little to take away some of the frustration. If you play your cards right it makes 80 Achievable. 100 would still take luck and skill but with playing the cards right, it would give you a shot at it.

I don't see a problem with the idea of the loot getting better you progress further, but even the low level gear should have some utility to an average player at 99.

All 5 tiers drop level 99 equipment. A majority of which is outclassed by no-effort easily obtainable and incredibly common equipment from either the auction house, other events, or even original nyzul. Look at something like the NQ Euxine Coat. What is the point in this piece of equipment? What player would benefit from this? These rewards don't exist in a bubble.

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Originally Posted by Teraniku

I have a suggestion that might make this concept more Fair. If Nyzul temp items are available to purchase how about adding an item that you can trade to the ??? on the floor jump (1 use) that you can select how high you want to jump floors (1-9). If this item was only available to the party leader or if everyone got one maybe halve the amount of floors you can jump using the item (0-5). That would make floor 60 obtainable by everybody and still make 80 achievable by skill and 100 would still take luck but the players would have some amount of control.

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No. I think I get where the Devs are trying to go with this one, surprisingly.

It's about dynamic decision making. Rather than progressing through a set route or a set plan, the idea is to force players to make decisions and weigh cost/benefit scenarios on the fly. Is it worth it to jump from floor 77 or is it safer to climb to 80 manually? Things like that.

My biggest concern was "Can we do this without hacking the game?", and the answer is yes. It requires some finicky exploitation of cutscene mechanics, but floor 100 is possible. That's all that matters to me.

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Originally Posted by pancakesandsx

I don't see a problem with the idea of the loot getting better you progress further, but even the low level gear should have some utility to an average player at 99.

All 5 tiers drop level 99 equipment. A majority of which is outclassed by no-effort easily obtainable and incredibly common equipment from either the auction house, other events, or even original nyzul. Look at something like the NQ Euxine Coat. What is the point in this piece of equipment? What player would benefit from this? These rewards don't exist in a bubble.

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They could make lvl 60 nq lv 80 +1 and lv 100 +2 but would that really change anything? 20 and 40 are so easy that party of low skilled players can beat that after a week so rewards are rather symbolic too.

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

It requires some finicky exploitation of cutscene mechanics, but floor 100 is possible.

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Elaborate.

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Originally Posted by Atoreis

They could make lvl 60 nq lv 80 +1 and lv 100 +2 but would that really change anything? 20 and 40 are so easy that party of low skilled players can beat that after a week so rewards are rather symbolic too.

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Then why have equipment on that floor at all? If this was upgradable it would sort of make sense. Like the dynamis upgrades, you would need less work to reach the maximum tier if you started at +3. Just ditch NQ through +2 and replace with extra alex or something that might make the event worth doing, rather than gear that would have questionable utility to someone in 5/5 pink.

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Originally Posted by Yygdrasil

Elaborate.

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1) Sch 2hr and Embrava pt
2) Sch freeze timer on lamp
3) Sch reapply Embrava each floor, freeze timer again
4) Rinse and repeat, fulltime Embrava

There have been confirmed reports (with pics) of floor 98 and 99 runs by people using this sort of thing.

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A...R8X3n88yPPzKbQ

Oh that is rich, truely it is. So the developers think that difficulty equals to luck? What does this say to the Unlucky who could perform just as well as the Lucky in boss fights at 60/80/100 and win, but constantly get low floor skips? "Thanks for playing, here is your booby prize of no use. Come again!"

I don't know what game these dev's are playing that makes this practical...but I hardly doubt it is the same game the rest of us play.

So glad I quit with crap like this they are making now, lol.

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

1) Sch 2hr and Embrava pt
2) Sch freeze timer on lamp
3) Sch reapply Embrava each floor, freeze timer again
4) Rinse and repeat, fulltime Embrava

There have been confirmed reports (with pics) of floor 98 and 99 runs by people using this sort of thing.

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SCH going to get Embrava nerfed in the next update if not an emergency update sooner. Or be even funnier if SE consider this no different than NM pinning which is illegal in their eyes and can ban ppl for.

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Originally Posted by Dreamin

SCH going to get Embrava nerfed in the next update if not an emergency update sooner. Or be even funnier if SE consider this no different than NM pinning which is illegal in their eyes and can ban ppl for.

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Watch out, guys. They might nerf Primeval Brew if they hear that people are using chests and martellos to pause those, too.

Oh yeah, and pinning is perfectly acceptable. You don't seem to know what pinning is.

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Watch out, guys. They might nerf Primeval Brew if they hear that people are using chests and martellos to pause those, too.

Oh yeah, and pinning is perfectly acceptable. You don't seem to know what pinning is.

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Nice try, want to agrue with SE on that? Pinning IS NOT acceptable by SE's official post below here:

http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/pol...ews19874.shtml

Correct me if im wrong but they focused on SCH 2hr instead of many small fixes to make Embrava very powerful buff that can actually be enough itself to consider SCH for an event. Working as intended for me.

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

1) Sch 2hr and Embrava pt
2) Sch freeze timer on lamp
3) Sch reapply Embrava each floor, freeze timer again
4) Rinse and repeat, fulltime Embrava

There have been confirmed reports (with pics) of floor 98 and 99 runs by people using this sort of thing.

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Does the rune give you a cutscene? I thought you just click it and it repeats the current objective?

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Originally Posted by Dreamin

Nice try, want to agrue with SE on that? Pinning IS NOT acceptable by SE's official post below here:

http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/pol...ews19874.shtml

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Pretty sure thats about an Iron giant swinging above you and doing 0 damage while you could stand in one place and just kill it.

Camate,

Thank you for your reply. I am happy to see that they will be lowering the cost of temporary items in Nyzul Isle. As someone who has worked long and hard to obtain the necessary points to continue in my quest for a Mythic Weapon, I am happy that I won't have to "fear" going below the 150k mark due to experimenting with this new Neo-Nyzul.

On that note; however, I do have some feedback in regards to the Alexandrite and this new content. As a player base, we are currently unaware of what may come down the road in terms of changes to Salvage; as such, when it was announced that Alexandrite would become available through the new Nyzul Isle content, I must say, I was very excited. I was hopeful that this would increase the supply of Alexandrite on a more than sub-par level server wide. I choose to use the wording "sub-par" because, truthfully, I am not the only one who feels that the drop rate in this new content does indeed still require some investigation.

It is no mystery that the quests and items involved in the initial creation of a Relic, or Empyrean weapon require a much different process than that of the Mythic weapons; as such, I feel the requirements are still quite reasonable with the Mythic Weapons with the exception of a few things, the number one thing of which being Alexandrite.

I have always felt that one of two things needed to be done to help "balance" the difficulty of creating the initial weapon itself (Mythic, vs. Relic/Empyrean):

1. Reduction in the number of Alexandrite required for quest completion (I truly believed that this wasn't something that would change, or that actually needed to be changed; however, I still felt it could have been a solution)

or

2. A more likely solution; to increase the availability of Alexandrite through both Salvage and Nyzul Isle. I feel that much can still be done to increase the drop-rate of both individual pieces of Alexandrite as well as the pouches which yield random amounts of the item.

As you can see, option 2 was clearly more probable from the beginning, and I am happy to see that some effort has been taken to pursue this route; however, I feel the changes *SHOULD* be far from over in regards to the drop rate (in both Salvage and the new Nyzul Isle).

Are you able to comment on the this topic? Perhaps shed some light on what the development team is planning in regards to the Mythic Weapon quests' future (will it see any changes)? Most importantly whether or not more balancing will be done to the drop-rates of Alexandrite in Nyzul Isle, as well as Salvage?

Thanks in advance,

~Bersty

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

1) Sch 2hr and Embrava pt
2) Sch freeze timer on lamp
3) Sch reapply Embrava each floor, freeze timer again
4) Rinse and repeat, fulltime Embrava

There have been confirmed reports (with pics) of floor 98 and 99 runs by people using this sort of thing.

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In light of this, the whole construction of Nyzul Isle Random Edition seems a lot more palatable. If some poor soul ends up on floor 102, though, that will be pretty funny.

Still, I'd prefer it if they had gone the route of harder junk enemies/harder bosses/harder Notorious Monsters/no temporary items/climbing in 10 floor intervals rather than 5/etc. rather than just "RANDOMIZE ALL THE THINGS!"

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Watch out, guys. They might nerf Primeval Brew if they hear that people are using chests and martellos to pause those, too.

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Brew locking is A-OK in SE's book. As a result of that, I would be very surprised if they came out now and said this embrava method isn't ok.

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Originally Posted by Ashvrei

Hello,

Thank you for your post regarding this, Nvr. We are aware of this function and would like to clarify any concerns that you guys may have about this.

Locking the Primeval Brew countdown timer by examining chests (for example) is currently [03/18/2011] a known mechanic and by design.

However, this does not mean that adjustments will not be made in the future. We will be sure to keep the community updated at www.playonline.com / information section if any changes are made to this system.

If you have any additional inquiries, constructive suggestions or feedback about this mechanic, we suggest bringing it to the "General Discussion" section.
As always, we will be monitoring these threads, reviewing feedback for improvements, and providing clarification when necessary.

Thank you,
-SQUARE ENIX Moderator

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Originally Posted by Atoreis

Pretty sure thats about an Iron giant swinging above you and doing 0 damage while you could stand in one place and just kill it.

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That, and things like Amhuluk where you pulled him to the bottom and all the DD's stayed on the floor above him.

SO let me get this straight. You can freeze the timer on a floor by having someone talk to the rune of transfer and lock themselves in the CS?

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Originally Posted by Yygdrasil

SO let me get this straight. You can freeze the timer on a floor by having someone talk to the rune of transfer and lock themselves in the CS?

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No, you pause the timer on SCH's 2 hr which enables them to use Embrava throughout the duration of the run.

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Originally Posted by pancakesandsx

I don't see a problem with the idea of the loot getting better you progress further, but even the low level gear should have some utility to an average player at 99.

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This is the main thing here. I don't care if it is hard, but there has to be some progression - not just an all or nothing reward.

The lower tier gear needs to be changeable into something useful. My initial suggestion was that you should be able to do something like merging the NQ and the +1 gear to get the +2 gear an so on, however this might still be considered easy somehow which apparently would lead to the gear getting nerfed.

But it is simply unacceptable for the lower tier gear to be so useless. Perhaps we should be able to turn gear from lower floors into something useful? For example, lets say that you have the gear from floor 80 from a few weeks or work. You can now turn in your floor 60, 40, and 20 gear for a reward as long as you have the floor 80 gear as proof that you don't need the lower tier gear anymore.

Perhaps this could be a merchant that will give you Alexandrite in small quantities, or large amounts of Imperial Standing, or perhaps even Zeni. Just something.

My issue with this event has mostly been the lack of progression, but if we can't be allowed to use the lower tier gear to upgrade into higher tier gear in a way that is still difficult and time consuming, all I ask is that we are allowed to do something with it other then throw it away.

Ok good. That makes a lot more sense than what I thought I was reading. lol

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Originally Posted by Dreamin

Nice try, want to agrue with SE on that? Pinning IS NOT acceptable by SE's official post below here:

http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/pol...ews19874.shtml

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Right.

You just proved you don't know what Pinning is.

@Fusionx, that was pretty heavy sarcasm.

Btw can you actually froze time at neo nyzul? Dont think clicking on lamp after warp gives you "cutscane"

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

@Fusionx, that was pretty heavy sarcasm.

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Might have been but we have the official stance on pausing timers for anyone who had doubts.

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Originally Posted by Atoreis

Btw can you actually froze time at neo nyzul? Dont think clicking on lamp after warp gives you "cutscane"

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Magian specs should also work.

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Originally Posted by Dreamin

Nice try, want to agrue with SE on that? Pinning IS NOT acceptable by SE's official post below here:

http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/pol...ews19874.shtml

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hey riri, that exploit wasnt considered pinning. it was using a terrainial glitch to park IC in one spot and constantly nuke it while it swings at you but misses.

Pinning is where you exploit pathing to make a mob never really reach you, but this actually involves you moving yourself, I'll diagram it

bla, code tags dont work here :(

The mob wont take the shortest route to you, which would be running right against the object to get to you, and instead it cuts wide. You move from x to x and the game perceives the shortest route to get to you as going backwards effectively running in an arc motion back and forth but never actually getting to you. You generally dont have time to cast more than bio2 and poison2 though.

That's pinning.

The problem with this is people are only going to be bringing certain jobs and the rest of players without those jobs are screwed. Looks like SCH DRK DRK COR THF WHM or gtfo

Nyzul floor 100 is the new AV got it...

My opinion is SE wasted they time on this crap :(

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Originally Posted by Ophannus

The problem with this is people are only going to be bringing certain jobs and the rest of players without those jobs are screwed. Looks like SCH DRK DRK COR THF WHM or gtfo

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Was waiting for post like that lololol.

you know whats cool in FFXI? You can make several jobs on one character. Do it.

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Originally Posted by Rezeak

Nyzul floor 100 is the new AV got it...

My opinion is SE wasted they time on this crap :(

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^ This times a thousand. Guess my post in the Quitting thread wasn't premature at all. Screw this Company rightly. Luck based events... Seriously. There are ways to make rare armor that doesn't rely completely on a R.N.G... These people should have never gotten into game design.

They should be hired as Torture Specialists though, make a killing.

"We designed the event around the idea that, You'll mostly get useless junk the entire time, but if you're really lucky, you may be able to get something thats almost an acceptable substitute to what you can already equip. And if you literally Poo Four Leaf clovers and Horse-Shoes, You'll see floor 100 Long enough to time out".