Raise Animation Lock

Does anyone else feel that the animation lock after being raised is a little severe?

I mean after your body floats and stands, its like 1.5 seconds of not being able to move.

Am I the only one who thinks its a little too punishing?

Punishment for dying

=D

This to me is actually a big hindrance to the fight itself. I find no form of challenge finding the right time to raise based off animation lock. Especially in primal fights where most of the time you don't even know where the WHM came from when they raised you, most likely taking damage and going right back down. This is also an issue when using LB3. This is suppose to be the life saver of the party and almost every time I see half the raised people go right back down. Most MMO's I have played, after you have raise cast on you, you go through no locks and already up and able to run again.

I am completely fine with risks of getting up, but at least let me have control of the situation and not keep me in a lock where I am helpless. Or at least let us be invulnerable until we do actually have control of our character. I feel something like this is a major oversight, or maybe it is working as intended by them, who knows. All I know is, that I don't believe it adds any form of gameplay challenge beyond pure frustration.

The animation lock isn't the problem. The problem is that the animation itself has no invincibility frames, so.. say you're raising someone during ifrit and they get hit by an unfair dash in the middle of the raise animation. They die before they even get up.

The player in the middle of the Raise animation REALLY needs to be invulnerable until they can actually move again.

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Originally Posted by Yucie

The animation lock isn't the problem. The problem is that the animation itself has no invincibility frames, so.. say you're raising someone during ifrit and they get hit by an unfair dash in the middle of the raise animation. They die before they even get up.

The player in the middle of the Raise animation REALLY needs to be invulnerable until they can actually move again.

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Learn to accept raise at the appropriate time.

With random AoE and weakness effect, should be bubbled for like 5 sec...Can't take damage and can't deal damage. This should cover animation time and hopefully enough time to be healed to full or out of the AoE. It's frustrating enough casting raise with random AoE's let alone being raised and seeing a read line or circle apear beneath you Kinda feel like Icarus getting to close to the sun.

If a person dies after raise it shouldn't be cause they are locked in an animation.

Raise.

Can't be healed.

Can't move.

Can be killed.

Hmmm...

I kind of find it annoying that I can't target the person being raised with heals for a full 3 seconds after the animation finishes. Trying to spam cure to top them up only results in curing myself...

I don't care so much about the animation lock. Requires people to stop and think for a moment to decide, "Hmm, should I res right into Weight of the Land?"

The bigger issue is how you can't heal people for about 7-8 seconds after they accept the raise. Any heals you cast at them just affect yourself instead. There's also no visual indication of this (since it persists a few seconds after the "stand up" animation has finished) so you just have to guess and hope for the best.

As a result of this, people who've been raised have to sit at ~300hp for 8 seconds before they can be brought back up to a safe level (unless I spam Succor, but that's hardly efficient...). It's way more of an issue than the animation lock. I'd be fine with one or the other, but having both of these is just extremely annoying and makes battle ressing a huge pain.

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Originally Posted by MitArgento

Punishment for dying

=D

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hahaha.. that's a good one, but yeah... it sux... sure the animation looks sexy and all, but please give the player the option to break it if they want to ...

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Originally Posted by ilJumperMT

Learn to accept raise at the appropriate time.

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And if you have no idea where the WHM was when they cast raise on you? Especially in 8 man runs. Expecially when people need to keep moving to not get hit by 'circle' attacks.

Oh. Lets not forget something like Longstop boss. You get a raise and when things are ok, you hit the accept button, dragon barfs on raise spot. Being unable to move you start taking damage you can not avoid.

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Originally Posted by necrosis

And if you have no idea where the WHM was when they cast raise on you? Especially in 8 man runs. Expecially when people need to keep moving to not get hit by 'circle' attacks.

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I have idea when Titan will use stomps or puddles for example, so I wait for safe time to raise no matter the place the WHM was when he raised me

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Originally Posted by ilJumperMT

I have idea when Titan will use stomps or puddles for example, so I wait for safe time to raise no matter the place the WHM was when he raised me

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Being able to work around it is irrelevant to the conversation of whether or not it should be the way it is. I can raise up during Titan and survive also (as BLM no less, which has crazy low HP/defense compared to most everyone else). I can work around when Demon Wall bugs out and Repels late because you pushed its HP down too fast if I know it's bugged out, but does that mean it should bug out? Bottom line, it's pretty annoying to be locked and totally vulnerable, with no way to move, get heals, or anything. Regardless of whether or not you can choose when to Raise safely.

If you want to call it a feature, because you think that added difficulty needs to be there, go for it, but don't use "it doesn't stop you from playing the game" as a way to legitimize it. You could also work around it by not dying. Crazy, right?

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Originally Posted by MitArgento

Punishment for dying

=D

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There's already a punishment for dying. It's called weakness.

Having no invincibility frames during the raise animation is bad design because you can't always know when it's safe or where you will be raised to.

It's yet another example of something ruining the game, its really annoying as a healer to raise someone and not be able to heal them immediately because the game won't allow it, so dumb.

No other MMO I know of does this.

There should be no animation lock at all, its things like this that people complained about in 1.0 and low and behold they're still here.

Definitely agree.

I made a post about this in the Feedback section.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...vement-Please?

Yea you can guarantee they will say "working as intended"

Punishment of death. is execution!

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Yea you can guarantee they will say "working as intended"

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Thats so stupid >_< they really need to fix this...

Nope. In the last mmo I played there was a small lock too. You wouldn't be able to do anything until the animation was over.

It's normal.

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Originally Posted by AzuraWinters

Nope. In the last mmo I played there was a small lock too. You wouldn't be able to do anything until the animation was over.

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And was it also impossible to heal the person you just raised while said person was still capable of taking damage that they could not move out of because of the animation lock?

This is not okay.

I don't want to see any kind of invincibility added to being raised. Last thing we need is to dumb down the MMO genre any further.

I do think being able to heal a player during this animation would help the issue while still forcing players to process some thoughts on when to raise. I know, I know. The last thing us MMO players want to have to do is be challenged or god forbid think while we play our games.

Also, (my mind may not work properly) but isn't there a slight loading screen in addition to all this when being raised? Do not approve D:

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Originally Posted by Hiruke

Being able to work around it is irrelevant to the conversation of whether or not it should be the way it is. I can raise up during Titan and survive also (as BLM no less, which has crazy low HP/defense compared to most everyone else).

If you want to call it a feature, because you think that added difficulty needs to be there, go for it, but don't use "it doesn't stop you from playing the game" as a way to legitimize it. You could also work around it by not dying. Crazy, right?

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You have to work around it because it's a penalty, the penalty for dying in a fight and being revived is that it's not so easy to get back into the fight. This is by design.

Given how easy it is to press swiftcast and raise there has to be drawbacks.

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Originally Posted by Valsh

You have to work around it because it's a penalty, the penalty for dying in a fight and being revived is that it's not so easy to get back into the fight. This is by design.

Given how easy it is to press swiftcast and raise there has to be drawbacks.

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^^ This. Doesnt matter if you dont know where the healer is. Your healer should be telling you when to get up..

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Originally Posted by Becian

Was in ff11 too... nothing new

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Originally Posted by AzuraWinters

Nope. In the last mmo I played there was a small lock too. You wouldn't be able to do anything until the animation was over.

It's normal.

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Normal =/= acceptable.

Change =/= bad.

It's okay to question authority. In fact, a community should encourage it.

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Originally Posted by ilJumperMT

Learn to accept raise at the appropriate time.

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Which add on are you using that gives you an "Accept Raise" option during a LB3? That's when I see most insta-deaths occur anyway.

Was in ff11 too... nothing new

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Originally Posted by Shikoba

I don't want to see any kind of invincibility added to being raised. Last thing we need is to dumb down the MMO genre any further.

I do think being able to heal a player during this animation would help the issue while still forcing players to process some thoughts on when to raise. I know, I know. The last thing us MMO players want to have to do is be challenged or god forbid think while we play our games.

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When is not normally the issue... It's WHERE. Things go wrong sometimes and if you accept a Raise/Resurrection only to then get up on top of/inside of some move you're instantly dead again. Then there's always the possibility that it was totally safe and then a random move goes off or someone turns a move towards where your healer WAS and *BAM* you're dead again. You can't always see where you're gonna go when you get Raised/Resurrected either. You really expect everyone using DF to be using a voice chat service or even trying to type while they're probably running all over the place trying to avoid stuff themselves?

This is something that should change but won't and people will white knight it because they're super elite players that never die.

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Originally Posted by Becian

Was in ff11 too... nothing new

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Wasn't in 1.0 and FFXI didn't have a plethora of ginormous radial AoE moves that could kill you.

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Originally Posted by Sub-Xero

Wasn't in 1.0 and FFXI didn't have a plethora of ginormous radial AoE moves that could kill you.

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lol

on topic mode:
When did you stop playing FFXI :O ? I ask because they did go crazy on the AoE moves from hell but it was after a certain point. XD

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Originally Posted by Inq

Which add on are you using that gives you an "Accept Raise" option during a LB3? That's when I see most insta-deaths occur anyway.

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If that is the case on LB3 raises, healer didn't use it at a good time then.

I have not had any issues with being raised mid combat yet, though that is not too hard to do if pay attention and know the safe times to revive.

People often say that the solution for positioning lag for aoe avoidance is to learn the patterns and move in advance. Same solution applies to when to raise. The positioning lag needs fixing before they tweak raise. As most times if raise up in an aoe going to die again anyways unless the aoe goes off during the the start of the animation anyway if there was an invincibility window.

What really amuses me about the heal-lockout.. is when I raise someone, my Fairy goes spastic trying to cast cure on them.. but has the same problem I do - and ends up healing herself by accident. This is actually kind of bad though more than it is amusing, because she's just wasting time and taking healing priority on a target she can't do anything about, rather than heal someone alive nearby her that could potentially use it.

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Originally Posted by samst

Also, (my mind may not work properly) but isn't there a slight loading screen in addition to all this when being raised? Do not approve D:

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Yes, there is. It's an extremely clunky mechanic.

If OP thinks this is bad, every single spell/ability used to put you in animation lock in 1.0. Can you imagine doing the hardest fights when this happened? It was a nightmare. You needed to plan everything ahead of time, especially as a healer.

What I dislike most about the 'animation lock' of being raised is that if I target someone after they have been raised and cure them, it won't go on them right away. It will instead cure me. There are a good few seconds where the newly-raised person is vulnerable to taking damage but unable to take heals. This is silly to me.

Yes -- there should be a penalty to dying... and there is (weakness). In some fights, dying makes it nearly impossible to raise again anyway... but please, please, please make us capable of curing someone the second they can take damage.

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Originally Posted by Alpheus

lol

on topic mode:
When did you stop playing FFXI :O ? I ask because they did go crazy on the AoE moves from hell but it was after a certain point. XD

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Well I know there were/are a lot of big AoE moves in FFXI but in most encounters they aren't/weren't a one hit kill. I meant more like FFXI as a whole wasn't designed around these big ol' AoE moves all over the place.

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Originally Posted by Varok899

Raise.

Can't be healed.

Can't move.

Can be killed.

Hmmm...

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This, nothing is more annoying as whm then to raise someone and you try to quickly heal them only to just heal your self and they die again...enemeis have no issues smacking you in the face and killing you as soon as you even in the raise animation, but healing? GOTTA WAIT BRO!

What makes this even more bad is the fact once a person dies again they took a much bigger hit with weakness losing 30% of their stats and HP, so they are likely to just die again..

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Originally Posted by Krisan

What really amuses me about the heal-lockout.. is when I raise someone, my Fairy goes spastic trying to cast cure on them.. but has the same problem I do - and ends up healing herself by accident. This is actually kind of bad though more than it is amusing, because she's just wasting time and taking healing priority on a target she can't do anything about, rather than heal someone alive nearby her that could potentially use it.

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This is also proof that the way it's functioning is NOT by design at all. If they didn't code pet script to recognize a player currently in the raise animation CANNOT be healed/cured/etc, it's because this is unintended, one way or another.

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Originally Posted by Nanga

This is also proof that the way it's functioning is NOT by design at all. If they didn't code pet script to recognize a player currently in the raise animation CANNOT be healed/cured/etc, it's because this is unintended, one way or another.

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Oh come off it, the pet AI is sketchy at best. They run into mobs, forget to heal stuff, autocast things are terrible times.