occult crescent tips and eureka comparison

i wanted to start a thread where others could give tips for the content/discuss how it is to eureka for people looking for information/ wanting to have a bit of forsight into the content. ( i know we got the expectation thread but i feel its more of a what do you want/think of the content thread and less informational)

one big tip i wanted to give is for anyone who didnt get to have eureka day 1/current eureka this content will be quite a bit different than current eureka because having multiple active instances and full instances really does change the dynamics of the content. even if you have been to a full active bozja it too was pretty different from eureka because of the way it worked compared to eureka with the way knowledge/elemental levels work and monster levels to monster ranks work spawning a NM that could one shot the whole raid simply because its was higher level is pretty hilarious.

my second tip is if your not sure the content is casual enough for you or you are afraid to step your toes into the content just pick up a tank or red mage they by far make the content more manageable (espcially with our level 100 kits compared to level 70/80)

i will also say feel free to ask questions if there is something you would like to know but havent heard in here!

A very minor tip that I consider highly valuable for this type of content: If you aren't playing a Healer, SMN or RDM, pick up a Phoenix Down and keep it in your inventory, it's normally a very useless item, the fact there is a penalty for to Return in these areas means that being able to rez people is valuable, sometimes you are the last one standing after a rough NM/Critical Engagement, like say Ceto or Red Choctober, and that Phoenix Down will save you the time to go back to base, swap Jobs, and then return to rez people, you might never use it, hopefully you will never use it, but it's like 1k gil off MB at most and 1 inventory slot, very minimal cost for the benefit.

"Not sure if the content is casual enough" - just to clarify this, both Eureka and Bozja were extremely casual on release.

I did Eureka for about 3 hours at a time, about once or twice a week I think? That's an amount a busy working person could fit in at the weekend and still have time for lots of other things... and I got my whole weapon done pretty quick and met lots of cool people and made lots of memories. Yes, I include Pagos in this - it was also casual early on, despite being one of the most difficult and punishing areas.

Bozja was notoriously a joke to get through. You were looking at 1 day to get through the first zone. Likewise for the second one. The progression was so fast that some people thought it was a joke.

There's actually no excuse to claim the content isn't casual. It's those sort of claims that caused the changes between Eureka and Bozja. You can literally logout if you need to go with virtually no consequence, usually, in this sort of content.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

"Not sure if the content is casual enough" - just to clarify this, both Eureka and Bozja were extremely casual on release.

I did Eureka for about 3 hours at a time, about once or twice a week I think? That's an amount a busy working person could fit in at the weekend and still have time for lots of other things... and I got my whole weapon done pretty quick and met lots of cool people and made lots of memories. Yes, I include Pagos in this - it was also casual early on, despite being one of the most difficult and punishing areas.

Bozja was notoriously a joke to get through. You were looking at 1 day to get through the first zone. Likewise for the second one. The progression was so fast that some people thought it was a joke.

There's actually no excuse to claim the content isn't casual. It's those sort of claims that caused the changes between Eureka and Bozja. You can literally logout if you need to go with virtually no consequence, usually, in this sort of content.

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I would also say it's fairly casual as well, but honestly, you do need to consider that for most people, the only real basis for comparison to Eureka was effectively our standard overworld, and when you do compare them they are leagues apart, in that it's almost impossible to die in the overworld. versus Eureka, where understanding basic traversal, especially enmity types is a lot more critical in a place like Eureka, especially pre-echo, and can prevent a lot of deaths, something that is just completely meaningless in overworld, and really any content with the exception of deep dungeon.

So whilst I don't really agree with people when they say it isn't casual, I can at least understand where the comments or issues stem from.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

There's actually no excuse to claim the content isn't casual. It's those sort of claims that caused the changes between Eureka and Bozja. You can literally logout if you need to go with virtually no consequence, usually, in this sort of content.

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casual and hardcore has tiers some people need paper enemies to participate in the content while others can handle enemies with a bit of bite so yes someones version of casual could be anothers version of hardcore in the end of the day everything is an opinion.

at the end of the day there is as many excuses to call content whatever anyone wants you don't rule over how others feel about content.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

casual and hardcore has tiers some people need paper enemies to participate in the content while others can handle enemies with a bit of bite so yes someones version of casual could be anothers version of hardcore in the end of the day everything is an opinion.

at the end of the day there is as many excuses to call content whatever anyone wants you don't rule over how others feel about content.

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Then if the point is “I want it to be MORE casual than Bozja” my answer to that would definitely be no. Bozja was so casual compared to eureka that it barely functioned in terms of it actively encouraged people to do the absolute bare minimum and dump extra work on other people

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Originally Posted by Aidorouge

[[...]It's also bizarre to see people argue that Field Operations are casual content when I'm a casual player and I didn't get the impression at all that it was content meant for me, and I was literally in the wrong instance.

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Plainly speaking, I think it's pointless to argue what's casual and what's not in the forums because it's such an arbitrary term that gets warped depending on who you're talking to.

Field content in general are 'casual (subjective)' to me because they have all the bread & butter from what I'd expect whenever I step into any MMO gaming (this game is not an exception), and my approaches were always similar to:

(1)interact with people to learn more/look for available online resources while seeing if they're up to date. Experimenting is also viable but usually only when contents are pretty new;
(2)assume the worst whenever stepping into newer area (lethal/threatening elements such as mobs, environment, etc) and;
(3)expect punishments for my mistakes, then learn what can be done to reduce the probability of that happening again (I prefer to stumble due to my own mistakes rather than random f-ups that I have no control over).

You'll notice all those approaches are usually either not needed as much, unincentivized, or a combination of those two when it comes to the rest of mainline contents like MSQs. It's to no wonder the devs are fostering a playerbase with radically different PoV of what's casual and what's not.

Here's a tip for talking about basically any content in the game: don't use words like "casual", "midcore", "hardcore" and the like - or your thread will be derailed in 0 time :D

BTT: No idea what your first tip meant, as I have 0 experience with Field Operations - but I'm definitely going to follow your second one.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

my second tip is ... pick up a tank or red mage they by far make the content more manageable (espcially with our level 100 kits compared to level 70/80)

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I'm already sharpening my axe, and have one finger parked on Bloodwhetting :D

Only hardcore thing in this game is doing PotD solo, maybe can make a case for HoH as well but it’s not really up there. The rest is just mainstream trash.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

Here's a tip for talking about basically any content in the game: don't use words like "casual", "midcore", "hardcore" and the like - or your thread will be derailed in 0 time :D

BTT: No idea what your first tip meant, as I have 0 experience with Field Operations - but I'm definitely going to follow your second one.
I'm already sharpening my axe, and have one finger parked on Bloodwhetting :D

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derailment is just part of the forums just something to get use to plus i can't force people to give their advice so if people dont have much to add it wasn't of much use anyways.

i will say dont worry about my first tip too much it was more for players who only know the current eureka state who might be apprehensive to go into occult crescent thinking it will be the same.

i will add another tip!

monsters have agro types besides just passive and aggressive there is sight/sound/blood/true/magic there maybe another but i can't currently think of any others.

sight: is simple they see infront of them in a cone.
sound: is also simple they dont see they hear and will agro if you are running near them
blood: is a little less simple and its they agro when you have taken a certain threshold of damage this also means if you die and are ressed close to one it will immediately attack you when you get it so becareful!
true: is also pretty simple its sight but it also means skills like hide dont work and it will see you still.
magic: this is if you cast a spell the monster will agro you.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

monsters have agro types besides just passive and aggressive there is sight/sound/blood/true/magic there maybe another but i can't currently think of any others.

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Didn't know they changed the game world rules on such a basic level. This might explain some of the frustrations I had when I once set my foot into Eureka ;)

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

Didn't know they changed the game world rules on such a basic level. This might explain some of the frustrations I had when I once set my foot into Eureka ;)

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Yeah if you know the rules you can sneak by the enemies
I think the elemental sprites for instant aggro to you if you cast magic near them
There are sleeping dragons in the second map that you can slow walk by otherwise they wake up and one shot you

Another thing you can do to make your time easier there is if you right click an enemy's HP bar you can have it automatically set your magia board to be offensive or defensive so you can do more damage / take less damage from those certain enemies

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

Didn't know they changed the game world rules on such a basic level. This might explain some of the frustrations I had when I once set my foot into Eureka ;)

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Yes, you used to have to walk when near sleeping dragons. Of course, you also wanted to avoid line of sight and keep as far away as possible given the level difference. Due to this, people could not pass the dragons in Eureka Pagos, and struggled to get to NMs until max level (which allowed them to use the Aethernet). The aethernet level was nerfed eventually, trivializing the entire area along with all the other nerfs and buffs.

So it was fun when you were one of the few that could get past the dragons alive and reach the NM successfully.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Yes, you used to have to walk when near sleeping dragons.

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I am 99% sure this is still a thing unless they changed within the last year, it's especially notable in Pagos where there is a dragon right at the cliff on the way to the forge, so you can get got in a very awkward moment. Though it is also possible to fight off dragons and kill them outright now, which is a big difference, especially at max level+elemental bonus, I often have done so to save people, or just out of catharsis.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

Didn't know they changed the game world rules on such a basic level. This might explain some of the frustrations I had when I once set my foot into Eureka ;)

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This is actually a thing in the normal game as well, but used sparsely, a notable example are the bats at the very start of Sastasha, which are sound aggro, and if you turn on RP walk, you can just, well, walk past them, and they will leave you alone, it's just walking takes so much longer that running up and killing them is faster, but you can easily test it yourself.

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Originally Posted by VeyaAkemi

I am 99% sure this is still a thing unless they changed within the last year

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The reason it's not a thing really is because they nerfed the level you can attune to the NW and NE aethernets. That means you get beyond the dragons once, and that's it - you don't have to do it again. That one time could be a rez through or someone journey you in a multi-person mount. That nerfs a whole lot of the fun of Pagos in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

Didn't know they changed the game world rules on such a basic level. This might explain some of the frustrations I had when I once set my foot into Eureka ;)

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yea eureka's biggest obstacle is understanding how it works and knowing little things like what to do or not to do.

another tip is in pagos up you have bunny fates that are always up that throw new people off and ask what they are or why noone is doing them and its because they are pretty bad exp and other benefits wise they are really only good for gil/items you will mostly see people waiting for big bosses doing them or people gil farming constantly running those fates, this will most likely be the same for the new version that is the magic pots.

a secondary tip is bunnys have a set number of treasures to find and so that is the max amount of people who can get the npc to find one its like 16 chests meaning after a total of 16 people participate its rng if you get a chance to look for a treasure and the treasures can be in dangerous places if done at a low lvl area or (for pagos and pyros) done at the higher lvl area hydatos only have 1 version of the fate and it sends you anywhere to a completely safe area to an very end game area so always think twice about risking going for treasures!

i bring this up because it seems with magic pots in occult crescent they will most likely work the same way (at least thats speculation for now) there will be a limited number of chests for players and it can send you anywhere on the map so in this new content once again think about it carefully as it will also most likely provide minimal rewards exp wise and be very dangerous. they could have always given this a update in this version and fixed limited chests but i feel its more done purposely to artificially deflat the amount of rewards that can be obtained since its very limited.

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Originally Posted by Aidorouge

Can't say I ever noticed any indicator of the enemy's aggro type, so I just never bothered to try and sneak around at all, even though I primarily leveled on NIN, because it seemed like everything was jumping me all the time no matter what I did.

I'm not even sure what level you have to be over the enemy to make them stop instant-attacking you, I just know at some point ones below a certain level "eventually" started leaving me alone, but then the mobs right around the corner would be aggressive so traversing the zone was a constantly slow crawl because it never seemed like it was safe to mount up anywhere.

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the answer is 2 lvls below you! anything 1 level below you or higher will agro you so basically at lvl 20 anemos (lvl cap for it) only lvl 19 monsters or higher will agro you.

eureka has is a low lvl is super dangerous while high lvl makes the overall area much easier and safer due to less agroing and how you will be much stronger than anything that you will normally come across especially since all the max lvl or higher monsters are way out of the way and you kinda have to go find them. the only time this not the case is for sleeping dragons and hydatos which you can easily hit the high lvl area one accident.

basically once you hit lvl cap eureka is a pretty much different experience.

i will also ask have you tried eureka after the moving and mounting update? i feel its also does a number on the difficulty of the content since you dont have to stand around to mount anymore. i wonder how you feel about it with the change if you have tried it.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

the answer is 2 lvls below you! anything 1 level below you or higher will agro you so basically at lvl 20 anemos (lvl cap for it) only lvl 19 monsters or higher will agro you.

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Wait how do you know this? Did they announce this somewhere or are you guessing? Idk how we can have any tips per say until seeing the content. The only thing we can probably infer is that fates will be meta since that seems to be all that FFXIV knows when it comes to this content. Although it would be wild if we needed party members to take out higher level mobs for better xp. I would be happily shocked.

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Originally Posted by Ephremjlm

Wait how do you know this? Did they announce this somewhere or are you guessing? Idk how we can have any tips per say until seeing the content. The only thing we can probably infer is that fates will be meta since that seems to be all that FFXIV knows when it comes to this content. Although it would be wild if we needed party members to take out higher level mobs for better xp. I would be happily shocked.

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i am slightly confused. i am not talking about enemy deagro for occult crescent in that comment i was specifically talking about eureka in that one! as you say they could have changed the deagro level or even removed it completely (but i doubt it).

the reason we can have tips is because occult crescent is just eureka 2.0 it will be the same just with some enhancements/changes SE has a tendency to stick to the same formula so our knowledge from eureka will be good for when entering into occult crescent.

you are right though that without stepping into the content we dont know what has changed/is different but we do know that chain parties from eureka are back it is stated, this also means you will want to kill the highest lvl monsters possible while in full party groups just like eureka i mean unless with our lvl 100 skills kit it will be better to mass agro more mid lvl monsters and mass wipe them out but either way we it will be working like eureka in that aspect.

if i havent cleared up why i made this or you have more questions just let me know!

i will also say we have job exp and knowledge exp we dont know if you get both from fates or if it will have to be a mix of both to get them leveled up!

i will also say fates will never be meta they are super slow and bad exp people did it because it was easy and no effort chain parties are the better exp especially if we consider all the downtime of waiting for NM to be spawned which if you are with a mass of players = basically no to little exp.

fates were meta in bozja just because they were the only thing that actually gave rank exp!

once again i hope i cleared this up!

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Originally Posted by VeyaAkemi

This is actually a thing in the normal game as well, but used sparsely, a notable example are the bats at the very start of Sastasha, which are sound aggro, and if you turn on RP walk, you can just, well, walk past them, and they will leave you alone, it's just walking takes so much longer that running up and killing them is faster, but you can easily test it yourself.

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So after playing FF14 for years, today I learned something new... about the very first dungeon in the game :D