Can something be done about free loaders in the MSQ roulette?

Specifically, people who would follow along, then stand next to mobs to pretend they're doing something, sometimes auto-attacking, sometimes not even auto-attacking, some spamming the same weapon skill throughout the whole instance, e.g. the same AOE regardless on trash or boss.

Solution: revamp those MSQ roulettes and make them solo or light-party duties. Then do away with the MSQ roulette. This is probably the only realistic way.

I've been running the MSQ roulette everyday for the last couple of weeks and practically half of the runs will have 1-2 freeloaders like I described above.

Can something be done about this? Or is freeloading in roulettes an officially sanctioned way to play this game?

Solution: Vote kick them

Doesn't work most of the times because it's hard to determine if the vote kick was initiated by a troll. So most of the time the vote kick fails.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zfz

Doesn't work most of the times because it's hard to determine if the vote kick was initiated by a troll. So most of the time the vote kick fails.

---

Then communicate with your party before you initiate the kick about why you want to kick him or her.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ftail

Solution: Vote kick them

---

In addition to what Zfz responded with, you're in combat most of the time and so it can be tricky to get off a quick vote dismiss. I remember being chuffed with myself when I finally managed to get a dismiss off on a mooch towards the end in Prae, only to have it fail. lol.

But yeah, solo instances would be amazing for the people who actually need the fights would probably have a far better experience. Sadly, I don't see SE managing that any time soon, but maybe they'll surprise us all.

Calling out AFKers and then putting it to a vote is helpful, sometimes they change their behavior, sometimes not. This works in Frontline all the time, people do actively want to win so they kick the people who are purposely not doing anything.

Vote kick in MSQ is the easiest option cause there are no coffers to stall the vote.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ftail

Then communicate with your party before you initiate the kick about why you want to kick him or her.

---

I always call them out first. It's hit and miss at best. Most votes just fail.

For people simply going AFK and not keeping up with the party, the vote kick always passes. But as long as they are moving along, it seems very few people actually realize there are freeloaders. Some people just don't care, and I've been "called out" for being a SJW and I should just mind my own business (probably a friend of the afker) etc.

In any case, the MSQ roulette underwent several revisions and it's always been a band-aid after band-aid. I really don't think there are any good solutions other than simply removing it and revamping those two instances.

Going to probably get worse with moogle tomes coming friday.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Going to probably get worse with moogle tomes coming friday.

---

Actually, the previous one actually improved. Probably because those people normally don't do the MSQ roulette so they can still bear the boredom. :3

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Going to probably get worse with moogle tomes coming friday.

---

I'm not so sure. In the amount of time it takes to do Prae, you could do 3 Rabanastre and come out with 10 more tomestones.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

I'm not so sure. In the amount of time it takes to do Prae, you could do 3 Rabanastre and come out with 10 more tomestones.

---

A lot of people would rather do prae because you don’t really have to look at your screen much to do it. Other content doesn’t let you borderline AFK through it even if it’s better.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

I'm not so sure. In the amount of time it takes to do Prae, you could do 3 Rabanastre and come out with 10 more tomestones.

---

You think people who want others to do the content for them are going to stand around and do the Hashbrown fight properly?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Infindox

You think people who want others to do the content for them are going to stand around and do the Hashbrown fight properly?

---

The afk fight has a higher chance of getting yourself kicked, at which point you've spent 30+ minutes for nothing. They'd be fools for trying to do it...which of course means they will.

Set Max ILvl to 55.

I wish kicking was a good solution to this problem;

However, in my experience, occasionally when an AFK gets called out some people see it as an opportunity to virtue signal and will vehemently defend the person who is AFKing. A couple of interactions like that were what made me stop running that roulette altogether.

SE has built methods of measuring contribution into the game which they use in some encounters. They ought to tie roulette rewards to a minimum contribution check at the end of the instance.

Because of how prae runs your pretty much in combat from the first pull until the second ultima fight. And if they’re quick or cheese the cs and pull you can make it almost impossible to get a vote kick in there. Especially if you talk about it and they know your trying.

This will only get worse starting Friday with the moogle tome event. Tons more people are going to be flooding that roulette to get the larger amount of tomes.

Maybe those Free Loaders should join their own.... Free Company? Eh? Eh? See myself out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LittleImp

I wish kicking was a good solution to this problem;

However, in my experience, occasionally when an AFK gets called out some people see it as an opportunity to virtue signal and will vehemently defend the person who is AFKing. A couple of interactions like that were what made me stop running that roulette altogether.

SE has built methods of measuring contribution into the game which they use in some encounters. They ought to tie roulette rewards to a minimum contribution check at the end of the instance.

---

This, so much. My last few battle classes, I just didn't do MSQ roulette runs. I think I'm unlucky, because I was consistently getting leeches. I highly dislike other people piggybacking off my work, so I'd always call them out. The most common response I got was "dude it's just msq"/"it's easy content". Idgaf how easy it is, people not playing makes it take longer and is complete bs. What if all 8 of us AFK? I can remember 2 times where the kick actually went through. Every other time, it fails because of the aforementioned excuses.

The most I have had AFK was 4 party members in prae, all from the same server. I pointed out how they were leeching and how we should kick them, to which I was threatened with reports for "calling them leeches" and told how "it's easy content anyway". That was my last experience of msq roulette. A big issue of the ffxiv community is coddling/enabling bad play, or even no play at all. I haven't played any other game where people will actively defend leeching for people they don't even know.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zfz

Can something be done about free loaders in the MSQ roulette?

---

Yeah, called vote kick them.

Though, I'd say what is a freeloader in this instance, afk whole dungeon or had to afk 5 minutes cause something came up. I mean we're talking MSQ roulette here and 1 person go afk couple minutes or little bit longer isn't gonna hold back the group, that's including if its a healer or tank.

Praetorium isn't generally an issue since there's very few mob trash and bosses die pretty fast. Any afkers can be kicked as soon as you board the magitek armor into the lower floor or before the Nero, Gaius, Ultima Weapon or Lahabrea fights.

Castrum though is a real pain.

A couple weeks ago I was in a Castrum where both healers apparently were hoping for Praet but instead got Castrum so they decided to pretend to be afk. The tanks not realizing this did the usual wall to wall pull to the first boss with multiple people dieing on the way due to lack of heals. Boss starts and again people dieing due to lack of heals. I point out that both healers are afk, and a SAM gets frustrated and leaves party and immediately after both healers leave too, thus evading the dropout penalty. There was even a new person in the group too.

IMO, MSQ roulettes should apply dropout penalty to everyone that drops regardless if they are first or not to avoid such scenarios where healers can hold the entire raid hostage till someone else does, and also apply dropout debuff to people that get kicked. To avoid people being able to exploit the kick system, MSQ roulette and Praet/Castrum dungeons should only be able to be solo queued.

It's perfectly fine as is, stop being so strict for such easy content.

I don't care if they auto-attack, just so long as they do /something/. When you sign up for those long raids you're agreeing to put up with the same bullshit as everyone else and should expect to at least pull a minimum amount of weight to make it go that much faster. That said if someone isn't pulling their weight the sections before and after Nero are prime time to kick them. Most parties will have picked up on bad behavior at that point, or at least be more welcoming to it being pointed out, and unless other people in the party are in on it, it generally ends with the moocher being removed rather quickly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zfz

I always call them out first. It's hit and miss at best. Most votes just fail.

For people simply going AFK and not keeping up with the party, the vote kick always passes. But as long as they are moving along, it seems very few people actually realize there are freeloaders. Some people just don't care, and I've been "called out" for being a SJW and I should just mind my own business (probably a friend of the afker) etc.

In any case, the MSQ roulette underwent several revisions and it's always been a band-aid after band-aid. I really don't think there are any good solutions other than simply removing it and revamping those two instances.

---

Do you know why? Because it's MSQ roulette. Nine out of ten people don't care in Praetorium or Meridianum.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LittleImp

I wish kicking was a good solution to this problem;

However, in my experience, occasionally when an AFK gets called out some people see it as an opportunity to virtue signal and will vehemently defend the person who is AFKing. A couple of interactions like that were what made me stop running that roulette altogether.

SE has built methods of measuring contribution into the game which they use in some encounters. They ought to tie roulette rewards to a minimum contribution check at the end of the instance.

---

I have actually seen that too. I don't usually kick players unless they are afk, or disconnected, and I have had arguments on occasion when I've wanted to kick them. It's bizarre.

Simple:

Vote Kick.

You just have to make your case. If they're AFK say so before you submit it, and use the AFK option.

If the other party doesn't agree with you, that's the way it goes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deceptus

Simple:

Vote Kick.

You just have to make your case. If they're AFK say so before you submit it, and use the AFK option.

If the other party doesn't agree with you, that's the way it goes.

---

Only many of them won't be satisfied with that and feel the need to come complain about it.

Like.. especially in MSQ roulette a lot of people just won't care. Not even the people AFKing care, most who AFK in MSQ roulette do so because they wanted the other one, they'd love a quick boot from the instance so they can queue up again without penalty.. that's why they do it.

I think this is more a case of how the content is designed over players behaving in a certain way. If you make the MSQ scenes skippable, I highly doubt this would be as much of an issue.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zfz

Specifically, people who would follow along, then stand next to mobs to pretend they're doing something, sometimes auto-attacking, sometimes not even auto-attacking, some spamming the same weapon skill throughout the whole instance, e.g. the same AOE regardless on trash or boss.

Solution: revamp those MSQ roulettes and make them solo or light-party duties. Then do away with the MSQ roulette. This is probably the only realistic way.

I've been running the MSQ roulette everyday for the last couple of weeks and practically half of the runs will have 1-2 freeloaders like I described above.

Can something be done about this? Or is freeloading in roulettes an officially sanctioned way to play this game?

---

Yeah I have had problems with freeloaders with the MSQ but I think a trust option would be great

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lanadra

Only many of them won't be satisfied with that and feel the need to come complain about it.

---

No. This is a request to have the content designed in a way that it doesn't make people go AFK. I don't get satisfaction from punishing anyone. I see a problem and would like that problem to be fixed by taking away the root of the problem. Instead of ignoring it or pretending it isn't a problem and that people who bring it up are complaining.

It's a problem and it's not fine to pretend it isn't. And the best way to fix it is to revamp those parts of the MSQ properly, as should have been done years ago.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Yeah I have had problems with freeloaders with the MSQ but I think a trust option would be great

---

You won't get the xp from a trust. It'll just be for clears then. I think most running it now are doing it to level and certainly now for tokens for moogle. I've run it quite a bit and have had afk'ers but it's not been a chronic issue. I've seem more issues with people leaving Castrum cause they didn't get prae than having people go afk.

AFk is a problem too in alliance raids as well so it's not just main story roulette.

I'll say it again, set the Max iLevel to 50 or 55. Up the EXP rewards somewhat with the added challenge.

> New players will actually have an engaging, somewhat challenging dungeon to do at the end of ARR, and actually have to do boss mechanics. The current "Final Boss of ARR" is a disappointing joke - let's have it actually be a somewhat difficult thing to do.
> People who AFK will literally be obvious dead weight and people will no longer tolerate it.

Better new player engagement and better at weeding out leeches. Win-win.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NolChannel

I'll say it again, set the Max iLevel to 50 or 55. Up the EXP rewards somewhat with the added challenge.

> New players will actually have an engaging, somewhat challenging dungeon to do at the end of ARR, and actually have to do boss mechanics. The current "Final Boss of ARR" is a disappointing joke - let's have it actually be a somewhat difficult thing to do.
> People who AFK will literally be obvious dead weight and people will no longer tolerate it.

Better new player engagement and better at weeding out leeches. Win-win.

---

never going to happen if you like challenge so much may i suggest world of borecraft? they cater to your playstyle more then ff 14

Freeloaders and enablers are the reason I stopped caring about the treasure event and MSQ roulette.
When I got to a run where only me and TWO PEOPLE were actually playing the pre-Nero parts that was the last straw for me.
A better design team would see this as a problem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Haru304

I think this is more a case of how the content is designed over players behaving in a certain way. If you make the MSQ scenes skippable, I highly doubt this would be as much of an issue.

---

They were made unskippable also for a reason. Yes, they were originally skippable. And guess what? If you wanted to enjoy your story finale.. you could kindly go fuck off and watch it in the inn room. SE didn't like that, so they changed it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zfz

No. This is a request to have the content designed in a way that it doesn't make people go AFK. I don't get satisfaction from punishing anyone. I see a problem and would like that problem to be fixed by taking away the root of the problem. Instead of ignoring it or pretending it isn't a problem and that people who bring it up are complaining.

It's a problem and it's not fine to pretend it isn't. And the best way to fix it is to revamp those parts of the MSQ properly, as should have been done years ago.

---

This is another case of: They should. But they won't.

I agree they should, ideally making them into a solo instance, but we both know they won't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by _Koneko_

never going to happen if you like challenge so much may i suggest world of borecraft? they cater to your playstyle more then ff 14

---

... Er, what kind of take is this? Are you saying that doing nothing in content is not only acceptable, its preferable? Gtfo lol.

i'm not saying it is but you seem to think se would make adjustments to the content they will not
the primery reason is that its the most run content in the game and it's also required for the storyline
making it harder would backfire you know how the community react to harder content they avoid it that's why you constantly get crystal tower

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by _Koneko_

i'm not saying it is but you seem to think se would make adjustments to the content they will not

---

The topic is "Can something be done". I answered the question. Never said it was realistic.

To repeat what many said:

Vote Kick. If your group doesn't vote them out, they clearly didn't agree with you. Remember in those cases YOU are the one with the minority opinion, which is why the vote kick didn't succeed. Why should you have your way when clearly most don't agree with you about booting that particular individual?

Now for a solution SE can actually do about this if they agreed with you:

The reward EXP for these MSQ and roulettes would have to be split amongst the mobs/bosses and you only get that exp for participating in the fights. That would obviously eliminate the entire problem.

I don't think they'll ever do that though, nor do I think its needed. That occasional 1 person going semi AFK never really causes much disruptions in these mind numbingly easy levels anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NolChannel

I'll say it again, set the Max iLevel to 50 or 55. Up the EXP rewards somewhat with the added challenge.

> New players will actually have an engaging, somewhat challenging dungeon to do at the end of ARR, and actually have to do boss mechanics. The current "Final Boss of ARR" is a disappointing joke - let's have it actually be a somewhat difficult thing to do.
> People who AFK will literally be obvious dead weight and people will no longer tolerate it.

Better new player engagement and better at weeding out leeches. Win-win.

---

As a MSQ Dungeon, ilvl at 55 will probably kill everyone who are utterly terrible or decent at their job, which goes against the idea that dungeons are meant to be easy. However, it definitely shouldn't be such a breeze that you can have half the party AFK and still be able to clear it with ease. Probably setting the max ilvl to be 90 to 100 would be better.