Fluid aura, just why.

So any guess of what they plan on doing in 6.0 with these? Seems like every expansion gets a change, because I believe its in the class quest so they wont remove it. Someone correct me if im wrong. Why cant whm just get a useful ability or spell out of it. Binds that break on hit are pretty bad and nearly useless.

I wish this spell would go the way of Ruin II and be an ability that can be used to weave or use while running out of AoE - differentiate it by giving it a cooldown longer than the GCD (similar to Air Anchor/Drill) and maybe have it generate a blue lily or part of the blood lily (think of it like watering a plant to make it grow).

It has the animation of the regular Water spell that NPCs get so it should deal damage and just be renamed to Water. Get regular upgrades to Water IV. Then, if SE is still adamant on the level 72 removal of elements and going pure holy/light/astral visuals, upgrade it to Banish.

It’s not just white mage. We all have spells that need to be changed or better they need to add depth to the encounters. How can an mmo not need any cc? Cc is a cornerstone. Sleep bind charm these could add depth to the game. How about one fair is able to charm one of the enemies not a boss but like an add type enemy and have it fight for the group? The fairy wouldn’t be able to heal while charming the mob.

Or how about ast undraw does something useful like tosses all cards at an enemy for a stun?

The depth in the gameplay is removed bit by bit in each further expansion.
I don't understand how the game designers can allow this to happen.

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Originally Posted by glamazon

It’s not just white mage. We all have spells that need to be changed or better they need to add depth to the encounters. How can an mmo not need any cc? Cc is a cornerstone. Sleep bind charm these could add depth to the game. How about one fair is able to charm one of the enemies not a boss but like an add type enemy and have it fight for the group? The fairy wouldn’t be able to heal while charming the mob.

Or how about ast undraw does something useful like tosses all cards at an enemy for a stun?

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The problem is that cc works only if the enemies are hitting hard enough too make cc a necessary thing or let them have them abilities that need to be cc and more then 1 or 2 mobs. Like even I hate that phase really bad , the shiva add phase made you use cc and silence on the adds too get the dmg up buff that whas necessary for the week 1 dps check

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Originally Posted by glamazon

Sleep bind charm these could add depth to the game.

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It's called 'Repose', and every healer gets it at level 8. Unfortunately, your target wakes up if somebody attacks the sleeper. In this modern age of "Tank everything to the gate", that means it is fairly useless.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

It's called 'Repose', and every healer gets it at level 8. Unfortunately, your target wakes up if somebody attacks the sleeper. In this modern age of "Tank everything to the gate", that means it is fairly useless.

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Just like Fluid Aura, Repose and Sleep are intended to be low level survival skills. For solo play.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Just like Fluid Aura, Repose and Sleep are intended to be low level survival skills. For solo play.

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They actually have some good uses in party play pre 50 dungeons, and in bozja

The only good use a Sleep has had is the second boss of Brayflox, where you can sleep the main target while murdering the add.

Personally, I would like to see a trait upgrade Fluid Aura to just a pure DPS ability. That would give WHM something to weave in-between Glares, Dias, and Holies when Assize is on cooldown and no one needs heals or Benison. It would fit with how they seem to want WHM's DPS to focus on personal-burst damage vs AST's focus on boosting other's DPS and timing Earthly Star and/or SCH's using Ruin II against clipping, using Energy Drain on extra Aetherflow, and Chain Stratagem (RIP DoTs).

Real CC would go a long way to make this game great again. I don’t really touch anything other than BLU anymore, and it’s really made me realize that one BIG reason our jobs lack flavor these days is the lack of CC mechanics. Tank and spank at the gate while AoE down mobs is really what we have grown accustomed to and it feels awful. How about new dungeon mechanics that make you have to defend an objective, and enemies have to be slowed down with binds, heavy, sleep, or freeze? Dare I say it- maybe Black Mage’s freeze should actually freeze. Or having incredibly dangerous enemies that will wipe your party if you pull them on top of trash- some that say, will relentlessly target the healer? Fluid Aura has NEVER been useful and I’m honestly impressed it’s made it this far. Oh well. I won’t hold my breath.

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Originally Posted by glamazon

It’s not just white mage. We all have spells that need to be changed or better they need to add depth to the encounters. How can an mmo not need any cc? Cc is a cornerstone. Sleep bind charm these could add depth to the game.

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CC skills do exist with Head Graze, Foot Graze, leg Graze, sleep, Low Sweep ect but besides very select times there is no need for it disregarding PVP

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Originally Posted by glamazon

It’s not just white mage. We all have spells that need to be changed or better they need to add depth to the encounters. How can an mmo not need any cc? Cc is a cornerstone. Sleep bind charm these could add depth to the game. How about one fair is able to charm one of the enemies not a boss but like an add type enemy and have it fight for the group? The fairy wouldn’t be able to heal while charming the mob.

Or how about ast undraw does something useful like tosses all cards at an enemy for a stun?

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We had lots of CC in ARR. Yoshi-P has continuously said they are working towards simplifying the game.
Sadly, this seems to be working as it's drawing many players in.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

Real CC would go a long way to make this game great again. I don’t really touch anything other than BLU anymore, and it’s really made me realize that one BIG reason our jobs lack flavor these days is the lack of CC mechanics. Tank and spank at the gate while AoE down mobs is really what we have grown accustomed to and it feels awful. How about new dungeon mechanics that make you have to defend an objective, and enemies have to be slowed down with binds, heavy, sleep, or freeze? Dare I say it- maybe Black Mage’s freeze should actually freeze. Or having incredibly dangerous enemies that will wipe your party if you pull them on top of trash- some that say, will relentlessly target the healer? Fluid Aura has NEVER been useful and I’m honestly impressed it’s made it this far. Oh well. I won’t hold my breath.

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Fluid Aura was very useful in its first iteration when it dealt damage. The second iteration kept the knock back andnaas good for repositioning adds (and the A4S boss, lol). Then they removed that, too, and made it completely useless as most things are immune to the bind.

Id love for it to Stun since casters dont get stuns normally or just remove the dam thing

Give it its knockback effect back so we can knock ranged enemies into the mosh pit when the tank can't be bothered to notice nobody's AoEs are hitting the one out of range mob.

I always thought it would be interesting if Fluid Aura became a lower level version of Assize, that eventually upgrades to it. It would fit the aesthetic and free up a button space for a brand new skill. And it would allow for WHM to get a feel for using such a skill at a lower level.

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Originally Posted by MartaDemireux

I wish this spell would go the way of Ruin II and be an ability that can be used to weave or use while running out of AoE - differentiate it by giving it a cooldown longer than the GCD (similar to Air Anchor/Drill) and maybe have it generate a blue lily or part of the blood lily (think of it like watering a plant to make it grow).

It has the animation of the regular Water spell that NPCs get so it should deal damage and just be renamed to Water. Get regular upgrades to Water IV. Then, if SE is still adamant on the level 72 removal of elements and going pure holy/light/astral visuals, upgrade it to Banish.

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Seriously. WHM doesn't have an on the move DPS button and Fluid Aura ( upgraded to Flood) would be perfect for that.

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Originally Posted by Rongway

Give it its knockback effect back so we can knock ranged enemies into the mosh pit when the tank can't be bothered to notice nobody's AoEs are hitting the one out of range mob.

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Please no, not until tanks get a role action called "get out of the way!"

Hell, give 8% MP back on Fluid Aura because low level mana regen sucks. Found this out as well by doing some mentor roulette on my SCH and not having Atherflow until lvl 45 leads to some major MP issues.

AST: Gets 8% MP back on Draw (30s CD)
WHM: Gets 8% MP back on Fluid Aura (Also is a 30s CD)
SCH: Give them Aetherflow at lvl 30 or sooner

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Hell, give 8% MP back on Fluid Aura because low level mana regen sucks. Found this out as well by doing some mentor roulette on my SCH and not having Atherflow until lvl 45 leads to some major MP issues.

AST: Gets 8% MP back on Draw (30s CD)
WHM: Gets 8% MP back on Fluid Aura (Also is a 30s CD)
SCH: Give them Aetherflow at lvl 30 or sooner

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Considering how good WHM's MP economy is with Assize, Lucid Dreaming, and Thin Air, I rather they just make Fluid Aura be a weaker version of Assize and then upgrade into Assize.

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Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

Considering how good WHM's MP economy is with Assize, Lucid Dreaming, and Thin Air, I rather they just make Fluid Aura be a weaker version of Assize and then upgrade into Assize.

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Possible, but they don't get those until much later. Low level mana regen sucks pretty bad if you're always casting like you should be.

It really is insane how much easier it is on AST if you're drawing every 30s and getting back 16% mana per minute essentially for playing your job right.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Possible, but they don't get those until much later. Low level mana regen sucks pretty bad if you're always casting like you should be.

It really is insane how much easier it is on AST if you're drawing every 30s and getting back 16% mana per minute essentially for playing your job right.

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If you're struggling to manage mana at level 15 with only cure at your disposal (because that's when Conjurers get Fluid Aura), you may be running into bigger gameplay issues that isn't related to MP. Try checking to see if you're using lucid dreaming on cooldown and to see if the WHM gear / tank gear is good. Level 30-32 Brayfox is notorious for being more difficult for WHM in leveling gear because they don't have access to regen, but that's the only instance where they have to rely on freecure procs to help manage mana. After that, Regen is enough to alleviate any issues with WHM's MP from level 35-44 provided they use lucid dreaming on cooldown. Holy removes a lot of healing during pulls because it stops tanks from taking damage entirely for a couple of seconds from lv 45 onwards, and Medica II fixes the need to AoE heal spam at level 50 - 54 provided you let the Heal over Time do their job.

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Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

If you're struggling to manage mana at level 15 with only cure at your disposal (because that's when Conjurers get Fluid Aura), you may be running into bigger gameplay issues that isn't related to MP. Try checking to see if you're using lucid dreaming on cooldown and to see if the WHM gear / tank gear is good. Level 30-32 Brayfox is notorious for being more difficult for WHM in leveling gear because they don't have access to regen, but that's the only instance where they have to rely on freecure procs to help manage mana. After that, Regen is enough to alleviate any issues with WHM's MP from level 35-44 provided they use lucid dreaming on cooldown. Holy removes a lot of healing during pulls because it stops tanks from taking damage entirely for a couple of seconds from lv 45 onwards, and Medica II fixes the need to AoE heal spam at level 50 - 54 provided you let the Heal over Time do their job.

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Aurum vale can occasionally be spicy.

Y'shtola literally has water spells in her pre-5.0 and 5.0 toolkit. And she is a Black Mage in Shadowbringers. Why can't WHM have that? For the love of God, please turn Fluid Aura into a DPS skill!

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Originally Posted by currentlemon

Y'shtola literally has water spells in her pre-5.0 and 5.0 toolkit. And she is a Black Mage in Shadowbringers. Why can't WHM have that? For the love of God, please turn Fluid Aura into a DPS skill!

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not just her, but throughout the game EVERY OTHER CONJURER gets access to them. Whm has never had them.

Latest example, is the bozjan front garlean healers, casting Tactical Tornado and Tactical Water plus Stone 3.

We should get Tornado, Quake and Flood by now. Give us our elements back, and give us water magic at last!

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Originally Posted by Recon1o6

not just her, but throughout the game EVERY OTHER CONJURER gets access to them. Whm has never had them.

Latest example, is the bozjan front garlean healers, casting Tactical Tornado and Tactical Water plus Stone 3.

We should get Tornado, Quake and Flood by now. Give us our elements back, and give us water magic at last!

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Dear God, it's even worse than I thought. WHM seriously needs to have elemental spells return to them in 6.0. It made sense for them to have pure light spells because of the situation in Norvrandt, but now that our character is back in the Source, elemental spells need to return.

We need to go back to our roots (pun intended), I liked the WHM aesthetic of being a mix of cleric and druid, now it's just a generic 'holy priest' healer.

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Originally Posted by currentlemon

please turn Fluid Aura into a DPS skill!

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I think the last thing the combat needs is yet another boring DPS skill. Pretty much every class has one or two, you press the button when they're ready and... that's it. That is not good design. /shrug

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

I think the last thing the combat needs is yet another boring DPS skill. Pretty much every class has one or two, you press the button when they're ready and... that's it. That is not good design. /shrug

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every class except healers

healers have nothing except 1 dot, 1 aoe and 1 standard attack spell. Sch has ruin 2, but its a spell that replaces broil for movement or ogcd rather than works with it.

so yes, healers need more dps buttons, because thats what we spend 3/4 of our time doing.

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Originally Posted by Recon1o6

every class except healers

healers have nothing except 1 dot, 1 aoe and 1 standard attack spell. Sch has ruin 2, but its a spell that replaces broil for movement or ogcd rather than works with it.

so yes, healers need more dps buttons, because thats what we spend 3/4 of our time doing.

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Eh. Fair enough. AST main here.
But what's the difference between pressing Malefic every 2.5 secs or another DPS spell every 30 secs or so. Nothing. I'm not saying I'm against it but it should be more engaging than that.

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

Eh. Fair enough. AST main here.
But what's the difference between pressing Malefic every 2.5 secs or another DPS spell every 30 secs or so. Nothing. I'm not saying I'm against it but it should be more engaging than that.

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Sure, we should have that, call it idk Stella. It did damage, instant cast and had some nice CC on it back in HW. I loved that spell back when I played Ast, it had a niche outside of raids.

I was a long time AST main too, until shb destroyed the job and turned it into balancebot mclightshow the 3rd of the curebot line

HW we also had combust 2 and 3 as separate. One of them required a cast time, the other was instant.

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Originally Posted by Recon1o6

Sure, we should have that, call it idk Stella. It did damage, instant cast and had some nice CC on it back in HW. I loved that spell back when I played Ast, it had a niche outside of raids.

I was a long time AST main too, until shb destroyed the job and turned it into balancebot mclightshow the 3rd of the curebot line

HW we also had combust 2 and 3 as separate. One of them required a cast time, the other was instant.

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Which is all the more reason why WHM needs Fluid Aura to turn into a proper DPS skill. I've mention this a lot in my posts. Heck, I made two dedicated WHM threads with suggested reworks of the job. Fluid Aura was a topic for both of my posts. The easiest way to solve this is to make it work similar to SCH's Ruin II. An instant oGCD DPS skill that does a certain amount of potency, including traits you earn later levels that boosts the potency (Scholar doesn't have this, but I'm making a point here).

For Example:

1. At level 38: Receive a trait that upgrades Fluid Aura to Water II

1. At level 62: Receive a trait that upgrades Water II to Water III

This is the easiest solution though. Nothing flashy. Maybe somewhat boring. But at least it's better than what we have now.

I was going to make a new thread about this, but I decided against it since this one exists. Like I mentioned in my previous post, making Fluid Aura into a oGCD DPS skill is the easiest way to solve this issue. But it's also the most boring. There are a lot of things SE can do here if they put their minds to it.

Another method I've been thinking about is by syncing Stone/Glare and Fluid Aura into a 1-2 spell combo. You cast Stone/Glare first, then you can cast your next Fluid Aura/Water spell with a potency that's higher than Stone/Glare (at least at end game). Fluid Aura would have to be a GCD in order for this to balance this out, but at least it'll solve the button bloating issue somewhat.

Fluid Aura can also be tied to the lily mechanic, but not in the way we're familiar with. Just like how a blood lily blooms after using 3 Afflatus spells, this new lily blooms after casting Cure II or Medica II three times. This new lily will allow the WHM player to cast three Fluid Aura/Water spells as an Instant GCD skill. The skill itself will share it's GCD cooldown time with Aero/Dia and our Afflatus spells to balance it out.

If you don't like having DPS skills locked with healing skills, then replace the three Cure II spells with three Stone/Glare spells.

Something that isn't talked about much, which imo is actually a big part of the game, specially in the leveling/level sync department is....healers exist outside high content raiding too -- leveling roulettes, alliance raids, hunts, dailies, all that can be done as a healer, and the "I literally only have 2 buttons" complex is much more noticeable.