SE! Change the HW fate drop rates to the same as Bozja!!

Title. No one want to farm memories in Bozja because HW fates are 100%. It should be the same everywhere to be fair to ppl.

I see lots of farm groups both in the heavensward area's and in bozja. So i politely disagree with your statement.

Why not make skirmishes/CE a 100% drop as well? Seems like the better deal.

But yeah, at this rate Bozja will die rather quickly because it's easier to just do the Relic outside.

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Originally Posted by Caitlinzulu

I see lots of farm groups both in the heavensward area's and in bozja. So i politely disagree with your statement.

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Because Bozja has story, which at least was a greater motivation for the content for me. But once story is done and you maybe get your needed Bozja coins, people will just stay outside because the Relics are more efficient that way.

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

Why not make skirmishes/CE a 100% drop as well? Seems like the better deal.

But yeah, at this rate Bozja will die rather quickly because it's easier to just do the Relic outside.





Because Bozja has story, which at least was a greater motivation for the content for me. But once story is done and you maybe get your needed Bozja coins, people will just stay outside because the Relics are more efficient that way.

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Despite people insisting on this is not true. Fates offer no other reward, while Bozja gives much more. Thing is, Skhrimish/CE is for lockbox and mettle mostly, if you want memories you need to AoE farm.

https://i.imgur.com/iV2ZsCQ.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/x3jol1f.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/MvWS4Av.png

This kind of drop is not uncommon at all.

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Originally Posted by Shahi

Title. No one want to farm memories in Bozja because HW fates are 100%. It should be the same everywhere to be fair to ppl.

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Or, now I know this might be a CRAZY idea, how about they buff the Bozja rates to match the HW Fate rates instead of nerfing the efficiency of the HW fates?

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

Because Bozja has story, which at least was a greater motivation for the content for me. But once story is done and you maybe get your needed Bozja coins, people will just stay outside because the Relics are more efficient that way.

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I keep hearing about this mythical, supposedly good "Bozja Story". When it looks to me like it's 3 quests. Maybe 4.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

i keep hearing about this mythical, supposedly good "Bozja Story". When it looks to me like it's 3 quests. Maybe 4.

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Yeah and in the last two shit hits the fan with a cliffhanger for next section. Was actually interesting.
Regardless, I do agree with buffing the rates in Bozja, cluster farming I get a few but definitely slower.

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

Why not make skirmishes/CE a 100% drop as well? Seems like the better deal.

But yeah, at this rate Bozja will die rather quickly because it's easier to just do the Relic outside.

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It's so easy to level characters in Bozran though. Went from level 71 to 78 in a few days just from running around doing skirmishes and CEs. So I think it will stay relevant that way :)

Then you have the issue of people being rammed into Eureka again (Bozja is just Eureka 2.0), just for relic. All they have to do is make gold rank skirmishes give a memory 100% of the time.

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Originally Posted by Conando

Then you have the issue of people being rammed into Eureka again (Bozja is just Eureka 2.0), just for relic. All they have to do is make gold rank skirmishes give a memory 100% of the time.

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Gold 100% of the time, silver 50% of the time, and bronze 25% of the time.

Though, the fact you can get them from just killing anything in there makes it not so bad if you are just farming clusters...

Bozja rates 100%. Make it happen SE.

Just making it so skirmishes and CEs have 100% drop rate while retaining the chance for mobs to drop the memories would make things much better.

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Originally Posted by Shahi

No one want to farm memories in Bozja because HW fates are 100%

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Using an alt character with a max level of 50 to complain about this? When you technically get more rewards at a time when farming in Bozja?

Please don't use blanket statements/your own personal assumptions to try to make a point. We have enough false information going around with Bozja right now, we don't need more assumptions just further clouding things.

It is a bit bizarre that the relevant, new content is far, far, far more time consuming to get said Relic items than old, very easy, solo'able FATEs dense in old zones.

if you think about it you can farm more in bozja than you can in the hw fates


you can have both the first stage (memories) and second stage (bitters) active at the same time provided you've progressed that far on a weapon already

memories drop from specific parts of each bozja zone. the first zone drops yellows, second blues, and third reds. bitters can drop in any zone.

so in theory you could have a farm going where you have 2 in each zone farming mobs, with 2 floaters and you would be able to acquire all 4 types of memory at once.

as opposed to manually doing fates in the hw zones and getting 1 at a time.

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Originally Posted by Shahi

Title. No one want to farm memories in Bozja because HW fates are 100%. It should be the same everywhere to be fair to ppl.

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Well, in fact I was able to get 2 extra weapons farming in Bozja, and I'm glad I did that because I could understand that while doing that there you will also get something else, let it be going through the rank levels, or farming clusters.

In fact, if you specifically go for farming clusters, you'll get a lot of memories regardless.

"Change the HW fate drop rates to the same as Bozja"

https://media0.giphy.com/media/5xtDa...5eDK/giphy.gif

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Originally Posted by Driavna

Despite people insisting on this is not true. Fates offer no other reward, while Bozja gives much more. Thing is, Skhrimish/CE is for lockbox and mettle mostly, if you want memories you need to AoE farm.

https://i.imgur.com/iV2ZsCQ.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/x3jol1f.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/MvWS4Av.png

This kind of drop is not uncommon at all.

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I mean I was in Bozja for 2-ish house last night, getting from like level 2 to 6... participated in a bunch of skirmishes, and as many CEs as the RNG would let me I got a single memory and 2 clusters... so... I dunno... it doesnt seem to be worth the time investment.

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Originally Posted by Avalon304

I mean I was in Bozja for 2-ish house last night, getting from like level 2 to 6... participated in a bunch of skirmishes, and as many CEs as the RNG would let me I got a single memory and 2 clusters... so... I dunno... it doesnt seem to be worth the time investment.

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Because SK and CE are for lockboxes, mettle, XP and pages (some also drop exclusive fragments). If you really want to farm memories and clusters/fragments you need to AoE pull in a group (and thanks to how the loot work you can be extremely efficient doing this). I know, the ideal will be "I just need to follow the fate train and get everything" for a lot of people however I still think this design is better.

I already completed 2 relics, have materials for 2 more and for the final one will only need to farm 2 types of memories. All this by just farming while waiting for Castrum to pop.

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Originally Posted by Infindox

Yeah and in the last two shit hits the fan with a cliffhanger for next section. Was actually interesting.
Regardless, I do agree with buffing the rates in Bozja, cluster farming I get a few but definitely slower.

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I think it's a safe bet they'll nerf the drops. They seem to do that in relic content and certainly did in Eureka pretty frequently. Cluster farming seems to be a lot faster by killing certain mobs and staying away from the fates and critical encounters. No idea what the upgrade equipment drop rate is in Castrum but on the face of it those drops need improvement, 999 coins is ridiculous.

I dont think hw fates should be lowered at all. Bozja could use a buff on drop rates. Maybe after its relevancy ends buffing it again, but never to 100% and certainly never enough to beat out hw fates.

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Originally Posted by Avalon304

I mean I was in Bozja for 2-ish house last night, getting from like level 2 to 6... participated in a bunch of skirmishes, and as many CEs as the RNG would let me I got a single memory and 2 clusters... so... I dunno... it doesnt seem to be worth the time investment.

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An entire Skirmish or CE counts as one single drop, with the same rate as any regular mob.

So you could spend 5 minutes doing a Skirmish, where you kill 100 Skirmish tagged mobs and get one single drop chance.
Or you could pull 100 regular mobs and AoE them down with your party, and get 100 drop chances.
Not only will you get a ton of memories this way, but you'll also get Bosjan clusters and fragments for actions. Yet all people ever want to do is AFK until a Skirmish pops up...



I do think CE's should give you a guaranteed Memory drop for that zone, and Castrum should guarantee you one of each type. but apart for that, I think the drop rate in Bozja is fine.
And HW FATEs shouldn't be 100%, but about 50% would be absolutely fine, because both methods need to be viable.

Bozja is actually fine.

I admit my first reaction was being baffled that HW FATEs seemed so much easier to farm a relic, but it turns out regular mobs in Bozja have a decent droprate. We were just farming our relic the wrong way starting out. FATEs and CE's are for leveling, Mettle, qualifying for 1v1's and obtaining lockboxes. Regular mobs are for Clusters, Fragments and Memories.

Bozja skirmish farming wouldn't be so bad if mobs didn't have a bazillion hp. I know fates scale with player participation numbers, but something seems broken in Bozja. Some fates have way less hp enemies even at the top side of the map compared to the starter zone, or middle, with about the same amount of players participating and zerging the fates. And in some cases, after joining a fresh new instance, when the first fates start spawning, they still have bazillions of hp, even if you're alone in them and no one else participated before or currently (because the fate just spawned for the first time in that instance). Time spent doing skirmishes isn't rewarded enough, even if you do it for exp/lockboxes. CE are great though, they're fun and reasonably well scaled.

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Originally Posted by M0rrigan

Bozja skirmish farming wouldn't be so bad if mobs didn't have a bazillion hp.

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Made worse due to SE making artificial difficulty by sycning down to 430.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

Despite people insisting on this is not true. Fates offer no other reward, while Bozja gives much more. Thing is, Skhrimish/CE is for lockbox and mettle mostly, if you want memories you need to AoE farm.

https://i.imgur.com/iV2ZsCQ.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/x3jol1f.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/MvWS4Av.png

This kind of drop is not uncommon at all.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

Because SK and CE are for lockboxes, mettle, XP and pages (some also drop exclusive fragments). If you really want to farm memories and clusters/fragments you need to AoE pull in a group (and thanks to how the loot work you can be extremely efficient doing this). I know, the ideal will be "I just need to follow the fate train and get everything" for a lot of people however I still think this design is better.

I already completed 2 relics, have materials for 2 more and for the final one will only need to farm 2 types of memories. All this by just farming while waiting for Castrum to pop.

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That really is worse than Eureka then... because now its not even FATE farming... its just mob grinding... atleast the FATE grinding is faster, and can be done solo. (Even in Eureka every FATE you were at level for dropped mats toward the Relic). Outside of one mount, I havent seen a single reason to do Bozja over just getting my relics done in HW FATEs and dungeons. Its like they took the worst parts of Eureka, focused on them, added some more RNG (in the form of the absolutely awful Critical Engagement queue), and then slashed the drop rates on the actual content (aforementioned FATEs and CEs)... for a big company SE makes terrible gameplay design decisions pretty often.

How you think this design is better, when its the same, but implemented far worse is a mystery to me.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Made worse due to SE making artificial difficulty by sycning down to 430.

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How does it make it worse when everything is synced to 430 as well?

You're not fighting ilvl 500 monsters.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

How does it make it worse when everything is synced to 430 as well?

You're not fighting ilvl 500 monsters.

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I don't have the HP values in front of me currently (would be a good thing to check out) but I would wager we are fighting above 430 levels of HP. Whenever you come across "HP sponges" that's just an easy, lazy way to have artificial difficulty where it simply becomes a battle of attrition.

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Originally Posted by Avalon304

That really is worse than Eureka then... because now its not even FATE farming... its just mob grinding... atleast the FATE grinding is faster, and can be done solo. (Even in Eureka every FATE you were at level for dropped mats toward the Relic). Outside of one mount, I havent seen a single reason to do Bozja over just getting my relics done in HW FATEs and dungeons. Its like they took the worst parts of Eureka, focused on them, added some more RNG (in the form of the absolutely awful Critical Engagement queue), and then slashed the drop rates on the actual content (aforementioned FATEs and CEs)... for a big company SE makes terrible gameplay design decisions pretty often.

How you think this design is better, when its the same, but implemented far worse is a mystery to me.

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This is way better. Eureka was forced mob grinding. You HAD to grind mobs to force an NM pop. And then you still had to complete the NM.

Here, the mob grinding is optional. Both methods give drops. And both methods give different things other than those drops. Want to level your jobs while working on relic? Focus on skirmishes and CE. Want clusters? Warmachina. Want fragments? Beasts.

Target what you want , and they all progress the relic.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

I don't have the HP values in front of me currently (would be a good thing to check out) but I would wager we are fighting above 430 levels of HP. Whenever you come across "HP sponges" that's just an easy, lazy way to have artificial difficulty where it simply becomes a battle of attrition.

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Enemy HP scales by player count.
More people in an instance/CE, the more HP Skirmishes/CEs have.

This can result in HP sponges if you're unlucky, but I find Skirmishes tend to have far too little HP, and they die in seconds.

It all depends om how many people are in an instance when the system calculates the next Skirmish, how many people join a CE, and how many people actually stick around to engage in them.

If you've got a full instance, but you're tackling a Skirmish on your own, you'll be there forever.
But if the instance in still growing and you're part of the 'FATE train', then you might not even get a hit in before it's dead.

Claiming it's 'a lazy way to have artificial difficulty' is just ignorant cynicism.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Enemy HP scales by player count.
More people in an instance/CE, the more HP Skirmishes/CEs have.

This can result in HP sponges if you're unlucky, but I find Skirmishes tend to have far too little HP, and they die in seconds.

It all depends om how many people are in an instance when the system calculates the next Skirmish, how many people join a CE, and how many people actually stick around to engage in them.

If you've got a full instance, but you're tackling a Skirmish on your own, you'll be there forever.
But if the instance in still growing and you're part of the 'FATE train', then you might not even get a hit in before it's dead.

Claiming it's 'a lazy way to have artificial difficulty' is just ignorant cynicism.

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Skirmishes and CEs scaling is iffy right now I have to say. A few days ago we queue as a duo for math CE (in an instance with less than 10 players, since it was close) and the boss HP was absurd (we both were using DPS essences, DPS lost actions, speelforge and bravery buff) to the point of not having enough time to kill it. Then you have a skirmish that takes forever even with a full party, but the next one is clear super quickly by resistance NPCs.

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Originally Posted by Avalon304

How you think this design is better, when its the same, but implemented far worse is a mystery to me.

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Once you figure out how everything works none of the problems mentioned in your reply are a real thing. Furthermore, Eureka has a big problem with how NM spawned. If I happened to end in a good instance with active people progress was fast and efficient, however, if I ended in an instance with almost everyone AFK but a few was a miserable experience. With this new area, that problem is no longer there and everyone will be rewarded accordingly for the "effort" they want to put.

Was Clusterfarming for the Mount yesterday and got enough Memories for another weapon, just by killing mobs. And it didn't even took me longer than grinding HW-fates.
Don't forget that Fates/CEs aren't the only way to earn Memories in Bozja.

I was killing mobs in bozja for 8 hours at least but still didn't get enough memories for one weapon. I don't know how it goes with a party because couldn't find one the whole time. Ppl just said "do HW fates". Oh well, i'm not in a hurry but it is just bothering me that doing easier, old and boring content gives better rewards. Yeah i know we get clusters and whatever else from bozja mobs but that doesn't help with relics.

I prefer fate grinding in HW. Had my RDM relic weapon in about a total of 2-2.5 hours over 2 days. Very fast que times when the comes to the lvl 60 dungeons. Working on my Summoner relic now. Just taking my time & going into 1 HW a day to obtain 10 memories & the end of the week, will have my Relic.

I'm using bojza to level my PLD. I believe in a couple of hours & obtain 4 memories. 15 lockboxes that end up in 10 of them rewarding me with sparklers. the rewards were garbage.

I wonder if the reason they made HW zones so important for Fates/memories is because it has something to do with the next expansion. Meaning, Yoshi said we should brush up on some HW stuff, so maybe this is their way of encouraging us to do that? I dunno.

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Originally Posted by Lium

I wonder if the reason they made HW zones so important for Fates/memories is because it has something to do with the next expansion. Meaning, Yoshi said we should brush up on some HW stuff, so maybe this is their way of encouraging us to do that? I dunno.

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I believe its due to the free trial including HW to make those areas more lively for new players.

They’ve also just always made Relic steps involve older content. It’s definitely an effort to get people to help out newcomers.

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Originally Posted by Conando

They’ve also just always made Relic steps involve older content. It’s definitely an effort to get people to help out newcomers.

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Yeah, but the problem is that the "First to 70" Buff is for new accounts, including Free Trial ones. Even if we can help newcomers, people are going to be advancing story more than doing FATEs. If anything, I feel like Bozja has been shoved to the side in favor of relic, since it's literally the easiest relic to get more than any other. It feels very disorienting compared to the other relics, which required quite a grind to get. Eureka in particular had a large grind just to get the weapon to max(plus BA runs). In general, I'm more worried Bozja is going to die out rather quickly compared to the likes of Anemos(which kept on due to its ties to Relic).

I think that changing the rates will bring people back to Bozja to do things even if there are people already in there, but it'd be mainly for Relic. If anything, I think this Relic should at least have a bit more effort outside of Bozja so as to not kill Bozja just a little bit after release happened.

The FATE's have the advantage that you can do them on a pre 71 job. It is odd that they chose HW though, SB would have made more lore sense, and I would have prefered ShadowBringers so I can work Shared FATE as well.

I reckon that SB content will be involved in the 5.45 step of the relic somehow as an alternative to farming the new raid instance.

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Originally Posted by HyperiusUltima

Eureka in particular had a large grind just to get the weapon to max(plus BA runs). In general, I'm more worried Bozja is going to die out rather quickly compared to the likes of Anemos(which kept on due to its ties to Relic).

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And that was the issue. The dev team got NEVERENDING backlash for Eureka, and now it’s dead so those that, for whatever reason want those ugly things, can’t get the Eureka relics. Older relics are perfectly doable because they’re tied to leveling and more scalable things (as well as unsync’d content). They may have pulled back the grind just a bit much, but Eureka was so hated that of course this happened.