Remove Reduction of Loot for others in Savage.

This game is pretty alt unfriendly and doesn't let you progress your character past some pretty hard caps every week, so gearing another class on the same character is impossible until you have geared one out and moved on to the next. However that's not my issue here, the point is, just let me have something to do if I can't gear out my character...For those of us who aren't as entertained by things like the gold saucer.

Lift the savage restriction on reducing loot for other players. Sure let me only get 1 chance at loot per week that's fine i can live with that, but don't let me reduce others chests. I love doing savage content and I would happily just join PF's all day long to do it, but me just being there screws over others so I can't. Whether I wan't to go in to improve, or to help someone or just because I am bored, the fact that it reduces their loot is just stupid.

I know it was implemented a while ago due to carries, but I think it caused far more harm than good to the playerbase. Not to mention it would make PF far quicker to fill up in the back end of the week because people who have already cleared but want to re-do it will be able to join, and doesn't solve the issue of people taking the hit to a chest for 1 week to get a carry, then being able to join a farm party after they have the clear regardless of whether they know what they are even doing. Its just a redundant system now and needs removing.

Just a small rant from me I guess.

I agree with You


People still selling content for real money, even if it's locked or restricted - so maybe SE should be after them - because general rules to pin whole player base don't work -

Agreed.

It's not much wonder FC's rarely Savage. You get a clear for 8 players, the other 3 on the bench can't be helped and have to go pug it to keep up. The 1 chance per week should be individual.

Bad idea, people would play it. Go in with seven people loot locked and the eighth gets a full party size amount of loot dropped.

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Originally Posted by Saccharin

Bad idea, people would play it. Go in with seven people loot locked and the eighth gets a full party size amount of loot dropped.

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And? This isn't a competitive game. The competition that community makes it is over in less than 24 hours anyway. This can only benefit the NA/EU pug scene and weaken the grip that statics have on raiding in this part of the community.

All content available in game, including pvp should award us with highest ilvl gear and have different stats so we could customize a little.

Either this or what we have now, 1 day grind in 1 week and 6 days doing nothing.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

And? This isn't a competitive game. The competition that community makes it is over in less than 24 hours anyway. This can only benefit the NA/EU pug scene and weaken the grip that statics have on raiding in this part of the community.

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It's not about competition or anything.
It's about people trying to "cheat" with that system.
Instead of doing your weekly clear like usual with people needing it, they could pretend anything to guanrantee there are 7 "helpers" to get all the loot for themselves and don't need to roll against others.
It would make it unfair for people rolling their loot against 7 others people. They'd automatically gain more gear than others. This isn't what is wanted.
If they lifted restriction, it should come with a rework of the system so that there's no abuse and looks fair for everyone.

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Originally Posted by KDSilver

It's not about competition or anything.
It's about people trying to "cheat" with that system.
Instead of doing your weekly clear like usual with people needing it, they could pretend anything to guanrantee there are 7 "helpers" to get all the loot for themselves and don't need to roll against others.
It would make it unfair for people rolling their loot against 7 others people. They'd automatically gain more gear than others. This isn't what is wanted.
If they lifted restriction, it should come with a rework of the system so that there's no abuse and looks fair for everyone.

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Honestly, I think it's well past time SE implemented a personal loot system. No worries about who has or hasn't cleared in a given week, no pressure to make alts to avoid impacting others' loot if you want to raid more, etc etc.

That said, this isn't exactly a new suggestion - SE doesn't seem to care to go in this direction. So, failing that, I'd rather see them just remove the chest reduction. Yes, there's some potential for abuse - but IMO, the impact of the current system is worse.

But IDK, maybe I just don't think it's the end of the world if people don't get screwed over on loot...

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

And? This isn't a competitive game. The competition that community makes it is over in less than 24 hours anyway. This can only benefit the NA/EU pug scene and weaken the grip that statics have on raiding in this part of the community.

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Savage/Ultimate somewhat competitive.

The loot locks and reduced loot are there for a purpose and allowing that exploit would essentially mean someone have up to 8 tries, or choices, of loot that week.


High end loot is really easy for the 'casual' to get, the savage drops are only a little bit better.
Savage is for organised groups, i.e. free companies and is not for your casual PUG'er, i.e. me.

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Originally Posted by Nedkel

and have different stats so we could customize a little.

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In theory yes but what would happen is that everyone would go for whatever BIS stat is simmed so there's no choice in reality. Also, from a tuning point you'd have to tune it for everyone having BIS stats or it would be easier than intended. In the end an illusion of choice.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

Honestly, I think it's well past time SE implemented a personal loot system. No worries about who has or hasn't cleared in a given week, no pressure to make alts to avoid impacting others' loot if you want to raid more, etc etc.

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I can't see that being popular. WoW did that with their Mythic raiders and it prevented people funnelling loot to their mates. Sorry... 'worthy' participants.

They would definitely have to rework the system, removing the restriction without changing it would not be adequate.

It would be a run selling bonanza since 7 people could just continually sell runs all day on the same 7 characters for the 1 paying person and sell every floor and funnel every single piece of loot to them. Sure, you could do that now but you would need a ton of geared characters to even bother.

Of course, most people would want gear to be easier to get, but really if they actually cared about giving everyone gear at a rapid place they wouldn't give you only 2-3 pieces of gear per floor for 8 people, and it wouldn't take 4 weeks of pages to get a single accessory or 8 to get pants/weapon/chest.

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Originally Posted by testname

People still selling content for real money, even if it's locked or restricted - so maybe SE should be after them - because general rules to pin whole player base don't work -

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They just don’t seem to care. Nearly the entire first page of Party Finder was filled with people selling runs on Chaos about a week ago. Absolutely nothing is done about it. Same names on there, week after week, month after month, year after year.

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Originally Posted by Saccharin

Bad idea, people would play it. Go in with seven people loot locked and the eighth gets a full party size amount of loot dropped.

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Most systems will always have a way for people to abuse it, but do you punish the majority for the minority that do? Same thing with the people who sold carries, yeah it happened and it still does, so do we punish everyone with a system that doesn't let us continue to play with friends or other groups or go into the only content I enjoy more than once a week?

Tuesday resets happen, I get my clears, then do nothing for 6 days. The gearing system needs one hell of an overhaul which I doubt they will do, but at least this way I have SOMETHING to do inbetween resets.

Not to mention people already funnel gear in their static groups to DPS first anyway, the only reason I would see people abusing it the way you mentioned would be if they had alts they wanted to gear out quick, so people would go on cleared chars and let one person switch to alt to get full loot. Again while an abuse of the system I don't really see it as having a massive impact on the overall game itself compared to forcing us all to not be able to play with others once we have clear.

Pro's outweigh the cons still imo.

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Originally Posted by KDSilver

It's not about competition or anything.
It's about people trying to "cheat" with that system.

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Ok, give each chest a chance not to appear, increasing by 12.5% or so for each member who has cleared that week, as well as making members who have cleared ineligible for loot. 7 have the clear? The chance loot appears for the last person is much smaller, but still exists, similar to the chance of getting loot from rolling against 7 others.

There are better solutions than simply deleting half the loot because a single person wants to help a friend out.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Ok, give each chest a chance not to appear, increasing by 12.5% or so for each member who has cleared that week, as well as making members who have cleared ineligible for loot. 7 have the clear? The chance loot appears for the last person is much smaller, but still exists, similar to the chance of getting loot from rolling against 7 others.

There are better solutions than simply deleting half the loot because a single person wants to help a friend out.

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I'm not defending the current system at all, don't get me wrong.
But explaining why you can't remove one thing without reworking the whole system.

It bothered me many times and still does when "helping" precisely.

I generally think that the idea is not radical in the regard that it'd "open up Savage to loot sellers". To be fair, the loot sellers have been at it for YEARS, dating all the way back to 2.0. It's dumb, but people do it anyway because that's the black market economy they want even though it violates ToS on rare occasion. I've technically always been against mercenaries, but in reality opening up the system we have now to not locking you out of gear in the case of not getting one of the three chests would be fairer than waiting weeks and weeks for gear. Some people I know have a lot of frustration when it comes to this because they don't get gear they actually need until the 4th Week.

By opening it up as "Weekly Chest" and not "Weekly Lockout" people will be able to get the rewards they want faster in this regard, leading to faster BiS. I think what the current archaic system is intended to do is force slow gear progression in this way so that they don't have their content blown out by a majority of the raid community in 2-3 months. Though by then, you already have a new patch coming in the same span of time, the idea proposed sounds feasible and helps open it up to Casual and Midcores if they're struggling with gear on a particular fight.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

Tuesday resets happen, I get my clears, then do nothing for 6 days. The gearing system needs one hell of an overhaul which I doubt they will do, but at least this way I have SOMETHING to do inbetween resets.

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Congrats you're very good at playing the game. This is where you take yoshi-p's advice and go play other things then come back later.

the devs absolutely do not want people gearing up quickly.

The current thresholds are strict. They could be relaxed slightly with few consequences.

Instead of

8 fresh people: 2 chests
4-7 fresh people: 1 chest
1-3 fresh people: 0 chests


it should be

6-8 fresh people: 2 chests
3-5 fresh people: 1 chest
1-2 fresh people: 0 chests

still with the restriction that the people who have already cleared can't roll on the loot.

My reasoning here is the benefit to smaller groups, such that two groups of 3+1 could team up and get two chests for the 6 fresh people. Such a change would ease the burden of finding a party at all, without making parties so easy to get that paid loot carries would be a significant concern.

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Originally Posted by Saccharin

Savage/Ultimate somewhat competitive.

The loot locks and reduced loot are there for a purpose and allowing that exploit would essentially mean someone have up to 8 tries, or choices, of loot that week.

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Ultimates aren't released at the same time as savage and no one world first racing is going to redo a fight on an alt to get gear during the world first race. So what?
Savage and even ultimate are for anyone who wants to do them you don't need an organized group like an fc or a static. The bosses do the same thing at the same time every single time.

Also for those going on and on about run selling. 1. its already being done. 2. Who cares? Gear in this game isn't like other mmos. The gear in of itself is useless unless you do the content it comes from. Most people are buying for the glam not to stunt on people in their expert roulettes.

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Originally Posted by Saccharin

In theory yes but what would happen is that everyone would go for whatever BIS stat is simmed so there's no choice in reality. Also, from a tuning point you'd have to tune it for everyone having BIS stats or it would be easier than intended. In the end an illusion of choice.

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Just make all sets giving the same amount of certain stats and just twist the values in between the set pieces.
What it could potentially give us is an ability to choose which stats we like the most and go for it. So in a result a min-maxer would have to do some of pvp, some of dungeons, some of tomestones, raids in order to obtain bis pushing him forward playing all the game content.
This wouldnt be bad at all.

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Originally Posted by MrPresident

They just don’t seem to care. Nearly the entire first page of Party Finder was filled with people selling runs on Chaos about a week ago. Absolutely nothing is done about it. Same names on there, week after week, month after month, year after year.

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That is my point

I would like to replay raids, with no abolishing coffers from people who didn't roll this week

I don't understand, why it cant be like this

And Why SE made this system in first place ( since they do nothing about sellers of content )

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Originally Posted by testname

That is my point

I would like to replay raids, with no abolishing coffers from people who didn't roll this week

I don't understand, why it cant be like this

And Why SE made this system in first place ( since they do nothing about sellers of content )

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Thats because selling clears is not against tos IF its not for real money, while some of it is, you'd be surprised how many clears you can buy with just gil. I will have to clarify that a bit though, piloted runs (when someone uses your account to clear a fight for you) are against the tos, but they are not illegal because selling runs is illegal, but because account sharing is. If thats not happening, and you pay in gil or other in game goodies, its a similar transaction as to giving a crafter items and they will craft an item for you for a fee.

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Originally Posted by Saccharin

I can't see that being popular. WoW did that with their Mythic raiders and it prevented people funnelling loot to their mates. Sorry... 'worthy' participants.

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Many dislike personal loot because it prevents teams from prioritising who gets gear. So if someone is a tad undergeared or you just want to beef out your raid dps more...well you can't funnel the loot to where you feel it would be best used. And if someone is unlucky they can go ages without any loot dropping for them and what can you do about it? Very little.

Personal loot also means getting unwanted gear. Just because you're lucky enough to get loot doesn't mean it's actually something you want or need. Imagine you need a helm upgrade and you keep stuff for other slots instead, while someone else in your team has the helm you want and they don't want it...but you can't trade. The loot is wasted.

Personal loot is great for pugs because that's an environment where loot drama can happen so easily with the current system. It's awful for organised teams who typically try to be somewhat strategic with who gets loot and when.

Sure the old loot system in WoW did get abused a lot by people giving loot to their buddies instead of where it was the most beneficial...but is there any loot system that is both free of abuse and downsides? I don't think so. Also you can leave a raid team that distributes loot poorly, but you can't escape a personal loot system.

I prefer the current system to personal loot. It's very frustrating to watch good gear go to someone who doesn't even want it while someone else who needs it didn't get a drop.

As for the topic OP brought up, I think SE should do away with the chest limitations and let individual players be able to loot only on their first kill of the week. That way they can help their buddies or just do savage for fun as much as they like without their first kill affecting anyone else.

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Originally Posted by Nedkel

All content available in game, including pvp should award us with highest ilvl gear and have different stats so we could customize a little.

Either this or what we have now, 1 day grind in 1 week and 6 days doing nothing.

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Agreed, there should be as many avenues for ilvl farm as possible. PvP, Dungeons, Crafted, Tomes, Raids, and “Raids” (those trials they think are Raids) should all be viable pursuits

Aren't you already not able to roll on anything on your second round? I am 99% that was the case last time I did second kill with character that had gotten it's first weekly kill. It was by Raid Finder back in Deltascape, and I was not planning on robbing those people that one chest but it happened :/
Need/Greed were greyed out, I could only pass. Without changing this it would not make your gearing faster, which is already perfect.

I'd love some kind of to this, from that helper perspective. No better way to encourage people to give savage chance than to help them to their first kill of current tier.

quit trying to bring single player jrpg gearing systems into an mmo. plz no. I don't want to have to hunt my best in slot helmet if it's locked behind PVP.

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

Congrats you're very good at playing the game. This is where you take yoshi-p's advice and go play other things then come back later.

the devs absolutely do not want people gearing up quickly.

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Congratulations on your lack of simple reading comprehension.... that was not the point of this post at all I even said keep the loot lockout to 1 clear per week just don't reduce the chests for the other people if we are going in to help others or just to enjoy the content. Sorry if you were unable to grasp that pretty simple concept.
Also this is an MMO, I should have enough actual progression content or be able to redo content to keep me going for more than a day a week, the weekly caps in this game are insanely restrictive and then we have this system where the weekly cap also prevents you from playing with others because it screws over THEIR weekly cap. That's just stupid.

Telling me to go play another game does not improve this game what-so-ever, and if you have no interest in improving this game (which is seems you don't) feel free to exit this thread.

I should be allowed to re-do the content or help others without screwing them over. I don't need another bit of loot or incentive to do it, I just need for others to not get punished for me enjoying the game, or content that I want to do.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

Congratulations on your lack of simple reading comprehension.... that was not the point of this post at all I even said keep the loot lockout to 1 clear per week just don't reduce the chests for the other people if we are going in to help others or just to enjoy the content. Sorry if you were unable to grasp that pretty simple concept.
Also this is an MMO, I should have enough actual progression content or be able to redo content to keep me going for more than a day a week, the weekly caps in this game are insanely restrictive and then we have this system where the weekly cap also prevents you from playing with others because it screws over THEIR weekly cap. That's just stupid.

Telling me to go play another game does not improve this game what-so-ever, and if you have no interest in improving this game (which is seems you don't) feel free to exit this thread.

I should be allowed to re-do the content or help others without screwing them over. I don't need another bit of loot or incentive to do it, I just need for others to not get punished for me enjoying the game, or content that I want to do.

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well golly gee I had no idea you were so altruistic and magnanimous that you would want to replay things so much after getting your own stuff and carry the mewling newbs through the savage without being a run seller/RMT party clear person.

again relaxing chest rules means people getting gear too quickly. if patches were closer together i could see them relaxing this but they have a schedule for a reason. they have the data to back up their reasoning. farm to your content when savage gets unlocked. that's why they unlock it.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

Congratulations on your lack of simple reading comprehension.... that was not the point of this post at all I even said keep the loot lockout to 1 clear per week just don't reduce the chests for the other people if we are going in to help others or just to enjoy the content. Sorry if you were unable to grasp that pretty simple concept.
Also this is an MMO, I should have enough actual progression content or be able to redo content to keep me going for more than a day a week, the weekly caps in this game are insanely restrictive and then we have this system where the weekly cap also prevents you from playing with others because it screws over THEIR weekly cap. That's just stupid.

Telling me to go play another game does not improve this game what-so-ever, and if you have no interest in improving this game (which is seems you don't) feel free to exit this thread.

I should be allowed to re-do the content or help others without screwing them over. I don't need another bit of loot or incentive to do it, I just need for others to not get punished for me enjoying the game, or content that I want to do.

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I already mentioned this a different thread on this subject, but the system is intentionally designed to slow down and control the rate at which players earn gear. Without lockouts, People could get a full set of Edenchoir Gear in a theoretical day. and then what? They log out, some potentially staying logged out until the next content is released. Not exactly something that a company that wants you to stay subbed so you keep giving them money wants. Without making things insane grinds, there is no way the FF14 team can create content faster than the playerbase can consume it, it's just a simple fact of reality. So this MMO and many others use grinds or weekly/daily lockouts to extend longevity, since it puts more control on the developer's side of things.

The systems are simply to extend content longevity; nothing more, nothing less. It's a necessary evil on the developer's side. Of course, you could enjoy a theoretical alternative where they turn Savage into an ultra grind, quadrupling the prices of all book costs, making chests drop with 1-2% odds to make sure that the gear distribution stays comparatively the same as the previous system on a weekly basis. But I have a feeling there'd be a sizeable chunk of the playerbase that would be crying for a return to a guaranteed system soon after :rolleyes:

Without substituting it for another system or penalty that creates a weekly controlled distribution of gear the devs tune for, they won't ever release the penalty lockout system. And frankly, I enjoy the guaranteed loot too much for them to try something else.

Also, let's do an example to showcase why the devs wouldn't want to remove the penalty for helping others.

In the current system, for every 8 players that clear savage, no more than 2 chests are being given out. In a system where there's a weekly lockout but no penalty for helping, let's see how a team could abuse and exploit it to its limit:
7 players get on alts, 1 gets on main. they clear, the 1 main gets both chests.
that 1 main switches to an alt, one of the other alts switches to main, clear again. that main gets 2 chests.
repeat until you've literally octuple'd the amount of chests being given out in a week. Literally 8x as many chests than the developers tuned for. and given the natural overarching response of players to seek the path of optimization, it would quickly become very popular, and any team not doing it would be putting itself at a gigantic disadvantage.

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

well golly gee I had no idea you were so altruistic and magnanimous that you would want to replay things so much after getting your own stuff and carry the mewling newbs through the savage without being a run seller/RMT party clear person.

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Again, absolutely zero reading comprehension or common sense on your part its like you want to argue for the sake of arguing not because you have a valid point. No one said I was altruistic or carrying newbs, but I have friends in an FC who want to do it, or god forbid I actually enjoy doing the content and want to do it more than once a week without screwing over someones loot boxes.

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again relaxing chest rules means people getting gear too quickly. if patches were closer together i could see them relaxing this but they have a schedule for a reason. they have the data to back up their reasoning. farm to your content when savage gets unlocked. that's why they unlock it.

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See, this could be a valid point, so lets open with this one instead of a sarcastic comment without even reading first.
This is only in the case where you get 7 people with a clear trying to funnel gear onto one person which is going to be the minority of people doing this, so are we saying we punish the majority for the minority that would abuse the system?

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Originally Posted by Jamein

god forbid I actually enjoy doing the content and want to do it more than once a week without screwing over someones loot boxes.

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Masochistic.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

so are we saying we punish the majority for the minority that would abuse the system?

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Yes. anytime you open a system to abuse people can and will abuse the heck out of it. it's the bad apples that ruin the whole bunch. it's why we can't have nice things. it's all the other sayings that are there for situations like this. you cannot let people game the system because they will do so ad nauseum.

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Originally Posted by MariaArvana

I already mentioned this a different thread on this subject, but the system is intentionally designed to slow down and control the rate at which players earn gear. Without lockouts, People could get a full set of Edenchoir Gear in a theoretical day. and then what? They log out, some potentially staying logged out until the next content is released. Not exactly something that a company that wants you to stay subbed so you keep giving them money wants. Without making things insane grinds, there is no way the FF14 team can create content faster than the playerbase can consume it, it's just a simple fact of reality. So this MMO and many others use grinds or weekly/daily lockouts to extend longevity, since it puts more control on the developer's side of things.

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I didn't ask to reduce loot lockouts for the individual player. I'm fine with them keeping this.

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In the current system, for every 8 players that clear savage, no more than 2 chests are being given out. In a system where there's a weekly lockout but no penalty for helping, let's see how a team could abuse and exploit it to its limit:
7 players get on alts, 1 gets on main. they clear, the 1 main gets both chests.
that 1 main switches to an alt, one of the other alts switches to main, clear again. that main gets 2 chests.
repeat until you've literally octuple'd the amount of chests being given out in a week. Literally 8x as many chests than the developers tuned for. and given the natural overarching response of players to seek the path of optimization, it would quickly become very popular.

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I see this point and I still maintain the pro's outweigh the con's because lets look at the situation required for this.

8 players (a static) easily done thats fine
All of them with Alts levelled and geared for savage, still easily doable but not everyone has the time for this only the people who put a lot of hours in want to gear out two chars to clear savage twice.

Now lets look at the reasoning for this.
You are saying they are going to clear each savage raid, 8 times a week to funnel gear for content they already have on farm for something where there is zero competitive market.

I absolutely agree it could be abused, just like people can sell clear runs, but my point is given the above requirements for doing that, and the reasons/benefits for doing it its going to impact far less people than having the restrictions in does.

Will people abuse it? Of course some will, but I would be willing to bet it would be a small minority, so again do we punish 95% of the playerbase for what the 5% are going to do?

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

Yes. anytime you open a system to abuse people can and will abuse the heck out of it. it's the bad apples that ruin the whole bunch. it's why we can't have nice things. it's all the other sayings that are there for situations like this. you cannot let people game the system because they will do so ad nauseum.

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And I concede that fact that SOME will abuse it (as stated in a post above) however their abuse of the system has ZERO impact on the rest of the playerbase, a small minority of players being geared quicker does not screw the game over for the rest of the players, so why punish the rest of the players for something like this.

Again (and yes this is just my opinion) the pro's far outwiegh the cons.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

so again do we punish 95% of the playerbase for what the 5% are going to do?

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To Square, yes. Square is a company first and foremost. Their systems are made on cold, heartless math, statistics and theoretical simulations that they project will keep people subbed longer without being too harsh. They want to keep gear distribution at 2 chests/8 players, and thus have to squash out any possibility of loopholes, as there's just as many players that will abuse them.

(See: any of the previous exploits/loopholes/etc that have been in-game before. Adding queue penalties because some sour apples kept withdrawing to fish for in-prog queues or leaving if they don't get the dungeon they want with zero repercussions, adding in forced log-offs each day during the opening of Stormblood due to people abusing systems to avoid the auto-kick, job-switching to super level BLU solo in less than an hour, literally changing the terrain of boss rooms and forever making boss arenas flat due to people LOS & height abusing bosses (Most notably Twintania), etc.)

Welcome to game development, where impressing your boss with your financials is pretty integral to secure yourself a nice budget for your ongoing game in the future.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

Will people abuse it? Of course some will, but I would be willing to bet it would be a small minority, so again do we punish 95% of the playerbase for what the 5% are going to do?

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Remember why we lost in combat markers, feast chat and all the other stuff that they changed to prevent "abuse/exploits". These changes affect everyone instead of the small percentage of people that were "abusing" it. I mean you could probably lump the dreaded parser in that category, too. Can't have them because some people will abuse it to be mean. So really if given the choice I think they'll go with punishing everyone as it is easier to enforce.

Pretty much the reason it is the way it is is because they have a financial incentive to keep it this way. They are strangling the gear on purpose so their catch up patch actually covers as many people as possible.

I think it would be funny to see people make PFs with "weekly cleared people only" and the leader being the only person without loot so they get all the gear though.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

so are we saying we punish the majority for the minority that would abuse the system?

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I mean, they already did that when they removed the ability to place waymarks midfight.

And the fact that they're never adding in a clientside DPS meter is arguably yet another nail in that particular arguement.

This is SE. I don't know WHY they've been so remarkably out of touch with FFXIV, but it's frustrating, and confusing both at the same time.

But there ain't any other decent MMO available on the markets atm, so I guess all we can really do is grin and bear it.

Running splits to basically fuel the gear to certain people is currently already doable, BUT the reason not many people do this is because you need 2, 3, 4 or however many separate characters depending on how many sets of gear you want to get. If they remove this restriction, you can be damn sure people will start doing it since you need only 2 guys and you can do it over and over and over. So then it would become a problem and then it would be fixed like feast chat or something else like SE usually does.

And yea, all that talk about making the content last longer and such is definetly the reason why it is like it is.

Also to everyone advocating for personal loot system? There is 0 to gain from it, and only to lose. How it would work if it was made similar to what we got now, with similar gear pacing would be like this. You kill the boss. There are 8 people in the raid, 2 coffers worth of loot is distributed randomly to people in the group. 1/8 to get a single piece. Thats 12.5%. Now lets compare that to a pug 2 chest run. Boss is killed, 2 chests worth of items is dropped, and you roll for the things you want. Assuming everyone rolls need its 1/8. So 12.5% per item again. So in summary, personal loot is oddwise the same, but you lose the control you have. Don't want an item? You can't pass or greed with personal loot. You could end up with a bunch of duplicates and not get the one you want. So I've got 2 things to say, personal loot, if implemented would follow the same math as we currently have, but you lose the last slivers of control you have. And secondly, and far more importantly, if you want steady loot join a static! If you can't find one, make one. Don't screw everyone over because you choose to live in the pug world. Living in pug world means you aren't quaranteed steady loot or steady clears etc. It is your choice to do it. Don't make it worse for everyone else because you chose to do that instead.

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Originally Posted by MariaArvana

To Square, yes. Square is a company first and foremost. Their systems are made on cold, heartless math, statistics and theoretical simulations that they project will keep people subbed longer without being too harsh. They want to keep gear distribution at 2 chests/8 players, and thus have to squash out any possibility of loopholes, as there's just as many players that will abuse them.

(See: any of the previous exploits/loopholes/etc that have been in-game before. Adding queue penalties because some sour apples kept withdrawing to fish for in-prog queues or leaving if they don't get the dungeon they want with zero repercussions, adding in forced log-offs each day during the opening of Stormblood due to people abusing systems to avoid the auto-kick, job-switching to super level BLU solo in less than an hour, literally changing the terrain of boss rooms and forever making boss arenas flat due to people LOS & height abusing bosses (Most notably Twintania), etc.)

Welcome to game development, where impressing your boss with your financials is pretty integral to secure yourself a nice budget for your ongoing game in the future.

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You do know this is the same game that director encourages people to unsub if they get done everything they want to do right. You all have a warped view of how money in a company works.
Our subs do not keep this game running.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

You do know this is the same game that director encourages people to unsub if they get done everything they want to do right. You all have a warped view of how money in a company works.
Our subs do not keep this game running.

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Our subs 100% do, trust me everyone unsubs, the game will shut down. It makes them money, alot of money, so development continues. If it stops making them alot of money it gets put on maintenance mode. They are a company if a project is not profitable anymore and has no chance of being profitable it will be shuttered and resources will be invested elsewhere. Even with the FFXIV 1.0 failure.. it was only redone to protect the IP from permanent damage. 3.0+ happened because it the remake was successful and made them money. $$$ is everything in a corporation. We are lucky SE was looking longterm at the franchise and not just ffxiv as a game or this would been shutdown before 2.0 ever launched.

As for Yoshida... his comments on unsubing if you run out of content and wait to a new expansion/patch is one of the underlying problems with this game and why there are such large fluxes in playerbase. A healthy mmo should never run out of content for anyone, this is a resent problem in mmos and due to casual focus with long development time. MMOs have to have longterm content to keep the playerbase engaged for the long haul, ffxiv has none.

The loot lock exists for a very good reason.
But, I'd be for it getting unlocked sooner than it currently is.
The 7 weeks it takes normal players to get the weapon tomestones seems about right.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

As for Yoshida... his comments on unsubing if you run out of content and wait to a new expansion/patch is one of the underlying problems with this game and why there are such large fluxes in playerbase. A healthy mmo should never run out of content for anyone, this is a resent problem in mmos and due to casual focus with long development time. MMOs have to have longterm content to keep the playerbase engaged for the long haul, ffxiv has none.

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Or he realizes that we have many other demands on our time these days like family, friends, other games, other pursuits, netflix, movies, tabletop games, etc. etc. He knows that we shouldn't be putting all our time into this game 24/7. he makes statements like that because he wants people to be able to jump in and out of the game at will and not miss anything.