The Feast: It's rewards from the past and going forward.

So with the end of season 5 The Feast now has a token system based on rank for participating in the seasonal ranked Feast. As of currently the tokens can only be used to buy a weapon if a player manages to achieve a ranking of at least gold or higher for at least 2 seasons.

I was talking with a lot of folks who had recently been getting into PvP more lately. A lot of them expressed being disappointed and not wanting to try as much because most felt they had no chance at the rewards or the ones that were active just missed the items that they wanted completely due to poor luck. Many have stated that the weapons did not appeal to them but they would spend their tokens in a heartbeat if the tokens could be used towards the past rewards. Take the Lone Wolf Coat or Hellhound mount for example.

Seeing as the rewards are purely cosmetics I became curious and wanted to see the communities opinion on making these items purchasable via tokens every other season seemed like a good idea or not?

The way I see it is nothing but good results could come from them doing this and here is why:

1: It allows people who missed out or who couldn't reach top 100 in a previous season get the item they desire but at the cost of having to make a choice and lots of time investment. (Example having to achieve gold/platinum/diamond etc.)

2: The top 100 would still get their seasonal rewards but they would get them for free along with having a full season to show these items off. This would allow them to amass a store of collars incase that in a season they do perform poorly that they could be able pick up the slack and get the item they missed at the end of the next.

3: Having something that can be obtained overtime gives more players an incentive to participate in The Feast thus adding more players to help keep the content alive and thriving.

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But anyways, I'm curious to hear what players would think if S/E started doing this with new Wolf Collar tokens that they are giving out each season. Do you think this would be a good or bad idea? If so! State why!

Sounds good to me. I'm a late-comer to the PVP scene and would like to get my hands on these if I can actually earn it. I also wish they could revamp the prizes and spread them out more to all PVP fights, like the Field Commander's set which is exclusive to Seal Rock, a dead PVP activity. I would like this set, but no one does Seal Rock anymore.

I'm in favor of a way to make previous season rewards attainable. I see no reason in a modern mmo why gear should remain exclusive an unattainable, especially this one where previous raid gear becomes much easier to attain as levels and ilvls increase.

There are constant farms of old raid content for the purpose of glamour collecting and making old PvP season gear available would doubtless increase activity there as well. Seasonal rewards that are "gone forever" are a relic of older games that should be left in the past imo

Either that or make crafted versions, like there are crafted versions of Coil gear.

See I'm in favour of more unique and exclusive content, rather than reused old content.
I don't have all the fancy PvP rewards. I have a few, but that's nothing to really write home about. I was only ever top 100 once. It doesn't bother me that I won't have everything.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

See I'm in favour of more unique and exclusive content, rather than reused old content.
I don't have all the fancy PvP rewards. I have a few, but that's nothing to really write home about. I was only ever top 100 once. It doesn't bother me that I won't have everything.

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Sadly most people don't appreciate uniqueness anymore and hate that they don't have something others have. Im with you though, it doesn't bother me and I enjoy seeing others with certain exclusive items. This game though doesn't take exclusive or one time items seriously so I'm sure SE will give in to the masses eventually like they always do.

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Originally Posted by bass9020

This game though doesn't take exclusive or one time items seriously so I'm sure SE will give in to the masses eventually like they always do.

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I'm currently not up to speed, does this mean I can get those sweet PVP mounts that are locked behind those large amounts of wins? Like the air ship, and that floating ball.

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Originally Posted by Nora_of_Mira

I'm currently not up to speed, does this mean I can get those sweet PVP mounts that are locked behind those large amounts of wins? Like the air ship, and that floating ball.

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Those are acheivement based rewards and wouldn't/shouldn't be available with collars. I want all mounts but I know i'll never get them so that's fine. Exclusive rewards should stay exclusive but there will always be people that whine and say I want it too =p

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

Those are acheivement based rewards and wouldn't/shouldn't be available with collars. I want all mounts but I know i'll never get them so that's fine. Exclusive rewards should stay exclusive but there will always be people that whine and say I want it too =p

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so, to the point of bass9020, square DOES keep some stuff behind exclusivity. I don't think anyone loses out here with the new rewards.

I've wanted to earn a hellhound since the moment I first saw them in Void Ark. I even made threads requesting them. On the Japanese forum and on the English forum.

Then they got made into a PVP mount, so I did Feast for the very first season then to try and win one. I didn't realize how crazy competitive it was -- I made Gold that time and Platinum this past season. Then they completely turned PVP on its head to give every role the same skills and few differences. That's a completely different subject. But I think it did bring more people to PVP (that and GARO) so that, to me, is a good thing.

I know the devs said previously that old rewards would be recycled (but I don't know if that means only two seasons and then no more), so maybe we'll see those hellhounds and the original armor again. If we do, I hope it's purchaseable with Wolf Collars. Nothing in this game should be seasonal AND exclusive.

Collecting Wolf Collars gives me something to work toward over time. I may not have stayed in the top 100 at season's end, but I still worked toward a goal and would like to see those efforts pay off eventually. Plus, with win-trading and the use of callout programs so rampant in Feast, some of those top 100 players really shouldn't be there.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

Nothing in this game should be seasonal AND exclusive.
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then what is the point of having anything special if everyone can have it?

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Originally Posted by dracklor

Either that or make crafted versions, like there are crafted versions of Coil gear.

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This will literally kill ranked PvP.

I have no problem with exclusivity, in fact it is great for encouraging PVP. However, when many if us saw the mount being paraded by a renowned cheater/hacker/botter in game & on Twitch we realised that it was a prize of shame, rather than accomplishment, in many cases. They & their 'crew' even openly boasted about it & continue to be high in the rankings.

When cheating devalues something then there's no point in keeping it exclusive. If, come next Season, they sort out the cheating issue then exclusive prizes from that point forward would have real meaning. Until cheating is sorted, then why bother?

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Originally Posted by Gospel

But anyways, I'm curious to hear what players would think if S/E started doing this with new Wolf Collar tokens that they are giving out each season. Do you think this would be a good or bad idea? If so! State why!

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NO! Dear God leave MY Coat alone! I worked hard for it! You just want it because only a maximum of 100 people per Datacenter have it but if SE gives them to everyone its not special anymore and so you will loose interest.

Besides: it would take away ANY Reason to participate in Rated Game modes if the Everyone gets every Of those Items after a While. Given the horrible State of The Feast less and less people would participate cause they can get the Rewards later for less effort. (Not that there is a lot of effort needed after 4.0 changes). Leave Valuable Items Valuable. Especially the Coats since Season 1+2 Were much less infested by Cheaters or Wintraders. The Hellhounds might have no Value, but the Coats have!

Why create this thread in general forum instead of PvP forum, maybe because here is a bigger pool of players who have no firsthand information about PvP and will agree with you?
This exact topic was heavily discussed several months ago and players wanted to keep their exclusive items.

Bots will not climb the ladder. Hackers are atleast in EU datacenter very, very rare. Wintrading is an issue, it was more prevalent in Feast Party Mode, which was abolished. Maybe there is 1 or 2 wintrader in the solo queue, but you cant be a complete newbie to pull that off as tier matchmaking system is closer together now, you will need platinum or diamond in the first place to make it in top100.

To be able to grind those rewards with low tier bronze or silver rankings over several seasons would devalue them, no reason to try hard anymore for a spot in 1-100 when you can stop at diamond.

If everyone insists a lot, they will put them in Mog Station probably...

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Originally Posted by Yasmina

If everyone insists a lot, they will put them in Mog Station probably...

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Why pvp if I can just buy my cool rewards?

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

I've wanted to earn a hellhound since the moment I first saw them in Void Ark. I even made threads requesting them. On the Japanese forum and on the English forum.

Then they got made into a PVP mount, so I did Feast for the very first season then to try and win one. I didn't realize how crazy competitive it was -- I made Gold that time and Platinum this past season. Then they completely turned PVP on its head to give every role the same skills and few differences. That's a completely different subject. But I think it did bring more people to PVP (that and GARO) so that, to me, is a good thing.

I know the devs said previously that old rewards would be recycled (but I don't know if that means only two seasons and then no more), so maybe we'll see those hellhounds and the original armor again. If we do, I hope it's purchaseable with Wolf Collars. Nothing in this game should be seasonal AND exclusive.

Collecting Wolf Collars gives me something to work toward over time. I may not have stayed in the top 100 at season's end, but I still worked toward a goal and would like to see those efforts pay off eventually. Plus, with win-trading and the use of callout programs so rampant in Feast, some of those top 100 players really shouldn't be there.

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I know they said old rewards would be recycled but what happens if someone who already has the rewards makes top 100 again? Does that mean the reward is wasted and that's one less person that could have gotten it? You do see a lot of the same faces in the top 100 each season...

No.

If you want to take away my exclusive items I worked hard (And even stressed) for, then let me get legacy items. I want the tattoo and the mounts. Perhaps some other 1.0 items.

If you want to remove exclusivity, remove it all. If you want to claim legacy is different, it's not. PvP wasn't that great at the start, but we stuck with it and supported it. Some of us (like myself) only subbed to play PvP. It got a whole revamp now, so the same argument for legacy can be made that it's a different game mode now, and not the same as it was.

But people will so vehemently defend keeping legacy exclusive, but shout to remove pvp ranking rewards, which was a measure of skill, dedication, and work.

Before someone writes a long post as to why you think legacy is different, don't bother, it's not going to convince me that it's any different than season rewards.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Why pvp if I can just buy my cool rewards?

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I know haha, but this type of post has become something recurrent, and when they can not get something, they almost always ask to put it simply in the Mog shop :/

Personally, I would prefer that they only put the past rewards and that they were with PvP achievements (Seal Rock, Fields of Glory and Astragalos), since some people do not have so much time to go continuously to The Feast.

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Originally Posted by bass9020

Sadly most people don't appreciate uniqueness anymore and hate that they don't have something others have.

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It generally has little to do with what other people have and more to do with a player being motivated by collecting items for themselves.

The uniqueness is kind of pointless. The rewards are so rare as to be invisible; ten people can get them on a data center, but there are more than ten data centers, and they probably all cluster on the highest pop server anyways. They don't act as an incentive, since the number is so low and alts are unrestricted that you have no real chance of obtaining it. So they fail as any real draw for maybe a handful of the same people who dominate the charts season after season. IDC that they are unique, but if SE thinks they get people to do Feast its pretty obvious they have failed.

Right. Pointless. So seeing as contest rewards are normally just U N I Q U E bardings and accessories, we should all be able to obtain in through simple and effortless means regardless of the fact that the entries worked hard for those rewards because I want them too right?

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Originally Posted by Titor

No.

If you want to take away my exclusive items I worked hard (And even stressed) for, then let me get legacy items. I want the tattoo and the mounts. Perhaps some other 1.0 items.

If you want to remove exclusivity, remove it all. If you want to claim legacy is different, it's not. PvP wasn't that great at the start, but we stuck with it and supported it. Some of us (like myself) only subbed to play PvP. It got a whole revamp now, so the same argument for legacy can be made that it's a different game mode now, and not the same as it was.

But people will so vehemently defend keeping legacy exclusive, but shout to remove pvp ranking rewards, which was a measure of skill, dedication, and work.

Before someone writes a long post as to why you think legacy is different, don't bother, it's not going to convince me that it's any different than season rewards.

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Okay, I'm a legacy player and this wouldn't bother me at all.

Here's my honest perspective on the situation. Other people having the same stuff as me doesn't lessen the personal value of the items that I have. My memory isn't wiped, so I remember the experience I had getting those items. That's the things that's valuable to me, the memories. I can reminisce about playing 1.0. I even have old coil weapons and armors tucked away in my retainer inventories, and they're trivial to attain now, heck there are better dyeable versions of them, but I'll always remember the experience of obtaining them. Seeing other people with them doesn't bother me at all.

I guess I just don't really understand people getting attached to the actual items themselves, that's just bizarre to me.

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

The uniqueness is kind of pointless. The rewards are so rare as to be invisible; ten people can get them on a data center, but there are more than ten data centers, and they probably all cluster on the highest pop server anyways. They don't act as an incentive, since the number is so low and alts are unrestricted that you have no real chance of obtaining it.

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The reasons you state are actually the dream incentive to get it. And it's quite obtainable, I got top 100 and a Hellhound mount, it's pretty awesome! I don't have them all, but that's just how it is. You can't have everything.

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Originally Posted by Velthice

Okay, I'm a legacy player and this wouldn't bother me at all.

Here's my honest perspective on the situation. Other people having the same stuff as me doesn't lessen the personal value of the items that I have. My memory isn't wiped, so I remember the experience I had getting those items. That's the things that's valuable to me, the memories. ... Seeing other people with them doesn't bother me at all.

I guess I just don't really understand people getting attached to the actual items themselves, that's just bizarre to me.

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I understand them. People like to feel special and different. The only real way to do that in a game like this is to have an item others cannot attain or that is very difficult to attain. Everyone else can make a character with the same stats/face/colors as you but if you have the coat that people had to be playing 3 years back for (I honestly don't know the reqs) and is no longer available AND it looks fancy and cool? Oh heck yes! You are a special guy/gal/attackhelicopter!

I used to think like that. Check me and my Legacy tattoo! None of you can have this! neeners! I'd give my smug little "Only if you played in 1.0" when people asked how to get it. But now? ... I'm kinda mellowed on that whole mess. People enjoy this game in so many ways , sometimes they want their little potato or lizard person to be dressed just right or stare at themselves riding that weird ball thing across the (crazy beautiful) landscape. When they flattened veteran rewards I didn't even twitch. That's cool everyone, dress like squall if you want to, I'm glad it makes you happy. I don't feel cheated out of anything, I have it too if I wanna use it. It doesn't look any different just because someone else has it.

I think they should make the Visible part of the rewards available somehow. Heck, make it super hard to do. BUT! make it available so that new people can try for it if they want it. Nothing sucks more than joining a game with cosmetic elements late and finding out that "oh, that really cool thing that would have made you feel awesome about your avatar is just not available anymore".

How? Make it so the top 20 people in the whole data center can pick from a pool of old rewards every season. Make it so you have to maintain a certain win ratio for a given amount of time. It'll still be a rare thing, but if you REALLY REALLY want it, it will be there for you to work towards.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

How? Make it so the top 20 people in the whole data center can pick from a pool of old rewards every season. Make it so you have to maintain a certain win ratio for a given amount of time. It'll still be a rare thing, but if you REALLY REALLY want it, it will be there for you to work towards.

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The arbitrary "top X# people" cut offs by definition aren't something you can really work toward. Did #21 work less hard than #20? Most likely not. You could work your butt off and still end up below the cut off because there were many other people also working their butts off. Kinda like the axiom of someone always has to come in last in a competition - doesn't necessarily mean they're bad or that they didn't work.

Uniqueness is so needed in this game. I missed out too, but honestly it's great there are still rare items in the game.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

The arbitrary "top X# people" cut offs by definition aren't something you can really work toward. Did #21 work less hard than #20? Most likely not. You could work your butt off and still end up below the cut off because there were many other people also working their butts off. Kinda like the axiom of someone always has to come in last in a competition - doesn't necessarily mean they're bad or that they didn't work.

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Well yes. For someone to win, someone else has to lose. Very true. BUT.. at least you could try again? It would give you incentive to keep playing.... or possibly crush your dreams and make you never want to play again.. but .. maybe not?

It's highly unlikely my personal ideas are the best solution, but in the end my suggestion is : Make the rewards available but make them difficult to attain.

I think the token system is a great system to reward PvP players with exclusive rare skins. I really hope they continue with the system and that they improve upon and add at least 1 cool new thing each season. I think it really affords for new players to get involved which will only help the PvP community as a whole.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

The reasons you state are actually the dream incentive to get it. And it's quite obtainable, I got top 100 and a Hellhound mount, it's pretty awesome! I don't have them all, but that's just how it is. You can't have everything.

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Great, the other 2000 or so who played Feast that season would disagree on how obtainable it is. Skill follows a bell curve; the majority of people who do Feast will not have a chance at it. That's why they introduced the weapons, because even they realized you can't have a pvp scene where all of 111 people per data center get anything more than a title or a piece of jewelry.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

but in the end my suggestion is : Make the rewards available but make them difficult to attain.

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In that case, I think something like "x# of wins" or "x# of matches" would be a better metric to distribute rewards by. That way it's not arbitrarily cut off and anyone can get it if they spend enough time on it.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

In that case, I think something like "x# of wins" or "x# of matches" would be a better metric to distribute rewards by. That way it's not arbitrarily cut off and anyone can get it if they spend enough time on it.

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Then you fall into the territory of "well.. then you just need to throw time at it and anyone can do that".
It's not an easy fix... =[
if you did wins or matches it'd have to be an astronomical amount..

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

Then you fall into the territory of "well.. then you just need to throw time at it and anyone can do that".

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Time is work and effort. The whole point of it is that "anyone" can obtain them - so long as they work hard. "Top 10/20/100" is arbitrary and does not actually distinguish between those who put in work and those who didn't.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Time is work and effort. The whole point of it is that "anyone" can obtain them - so long as they work hard. "Top 10/20/100" is arbitrary and does not actually distinguish between those who put in work and those who didn't.

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I will counter that time is only that...time. It requires very minimal effort or work to login, queue and move just enough to not be kicked for idleness. Time is however the ONLY real resource any of us can manage completely so I'd be fine with that. I'm speculating you'd get a lot of people complaining about bot's or AFK'ing for the prizes though.
I'm not saying it's not a good solution, I'm simply bringing up what the opposition will likely say for discussions sake.

I don't really care about people who afk, to be honest. For one, afking and bots are punishable with vote kicks or bans respectively. For another, I don't see a few people's lack of courtesy as a reason to punish other players with a system that by design makes it so they will never be able to actually work and obtain those rewards.