AST's Suggestion: Gravity

How about adding Slow effect on Gravity since, you know the visual effect of Gravity skill is like time stop. The Slow effect and duration might same with LNC Feint's Slow. :p

I think Gravity as a whole really holds AST back for dungeons. Its flaws:

- Level 52 skill. Anyone actively leveling AST who does High Roulette knows that AST is complete garbage compared to WHM/SCH with just no way to compete DPS wise, cards be damned.
- No stun to go with it until Celestial Stasis, which is still quite limited compared to Holy and used once every 2-3 pulls. A big part of why Holy is just crazy good is because it is both defensive and offensively powerful.
- Range sucks on it. 5y is relatively standard for an AoE, but look at Bane and Holy, the core AoE skills of the other 2 healers ... both exceptionally larger.
- The 10% less damage per enemy thing is really not needed. Holy has that effect, yes, but WHM also get Presence of Mind, Assize, and Aero III, and there's just no way you can fight that even with Balance going to a DPS and getting your Gravity spam going (which takes longer to set up than Holy which is basically Divine Seal + Regen + Asylum = G2G for the next 15s).

I think Gravity could use a bit of a face lift, because right now you only use AST for fun in dungeons, or to mix it up. Something like:

8y range, 240 potency with the same scaling as it has, 3s stun attached (can keep the stun or not on Celestial Stasis, doesn't matter, Celestial isn't and shouldn't be about the stun).

Would it be OP for dungeons with these 3 changes? Yes but not any more OP than WHM already is. Kind of crazy to think about how these changes STILL wouldn't even match WHM in all probability for speedy runs.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

I think Gravity as a whole really holds AST back for dungeons. Its flaws:

- Level 52 skill. Anyone actively leveling AST who does High Roulette knows that AST is complete garbage compared to WHM/SCH with just no way to compete DPS wise, cards be damned.
- No stun to go with it until Celestial Stasis, which is still quite limited compared to Holy and used once every 2-3 pulls. A big part of why Holy is just crazy good is because it is both defensive and offensively powerful.
- Range sucks on it. 5y is relatively standard for an AoE, but look at Bane and Holy, the core AoE skills of the other 2 healers ... both exceptionally larger.
- The 10% less damage per enemy thing is really not needed. Holy has that effect, yes, but WHM also get Presence of Mind, Assize, and Aero III, and there's just no way you can fight that even with Balance going to a DPS and getting your Gravity spam going (which takes longer to set up than Holy which is basically Divine Seal + Regen + Asylum = G2G for the next 15s).

I think Gravity could use a bit of a face lift, because right now you only use AST for fun in dungeons, or to mix it up. Something like:

8y range, 240 potency with the same scaling as it has, 3s stun attached (can keep the stun or not on Celestial Stasis, doesn't matter, Celestial isn't and shouldn't be about the stun).

Would it be OP for dungeons with these 3 changes? Yes but not any more OP than WHM already is. Kind of crazy to think about how these changes STILL wouldn't even match WHM in all probability for speedy runs.

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No offense, but you have your little cards or whatever to compensate for your lack of AoE burst. There's no need to out-do Holy considering Holy isn't even that great, especially since WHM offers no other utility to the group, unlike AST.

Edit: Although I do agree that Gravity should be usable at level 50.

I agree it needs something, but its definitely not a potency boost or radius increase in my opinion, It just needs some sort of status effect added.

WHM's have Stun, SCH's have Slow (I prefer Shadow Flare to Holy tbf...)

Are there even any other status effects left to give, if we say No thanks to heavy and bind?

It should do SOMETHING just not to be just to not be ghetto holy, but at the same time it's functional. It's really less about balance and more about fairness. They should give it something, but if they don't it's really more a nitpick then a real issue.

The level 50 thing however really should be addressed. It is a tool you need to have at that level and since you don't have it you are liability to the group. I don't do the 50 roulettes, but if I did I'd feel guilty about bringing ast. And the player should never feel that.

It should give 10 secs slow and heavy imo. AST already is the weakest healer dps-wise, at least give gravity a slow effect so dpsing is a little easier during large pulls. I'd love an AST version of bane for spreading the combusts, maybe as an additional effect of CO so with a very long CD so we're sure it's not too powerful, but ofc it will never happen :/

I dont really think that changes are needed, yes AoE dps skill for AST comes late, but if you look for example at level 40~ what skills AST has access to and for example WHM, you will see that AST in low levels is actually the most powerful healer with their own medica II early at 40, essential dignity at low levels, light speed, lower mana costs, luminous aether appearing at very low levels + buffs from lvl 30.
We might be getting some things late, but we have buffs that can icrease dps that other players do.

It would be nice to have some little effect tied to gravity, even if its heavy, but i dont think it really is needed for the utility that AST provides with cards(or posibility of utility if we talk about rng). i never had problems in dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Akyio

I dont really think that changes are needed, yes AoE dps skill for AST comes late, but if you look for example at level 40~ what skills AST has access to and for example WHM, you will see that AST in low levels is actually the most powerful healer with their own medica II early at 40, essential dignity at low levels, light speed, lower mana costs, luminous aether appearing at very low levels + buffs from lvl 30.
We might be getting some things late, but we have buffs that can icrease dps that other players do.

It would be nice to have some little effect tied to gravity, even if its heavy, but i dont think it really is needed for the utility that AST provides with cards(or posibility of utility if we talk about rng). i never had problems in dungeons.

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I disagree, SCH can dps a lot more often than AST because the fairy will do the bulk of the healing while they can freely DoT up enemies.

Adding the slow effect to it would in essence reduce the damage the party takes. However, as has card buff for this exact purpose. Or in other way, slowing them sets them slower than the party. AST has card buffs to speed up the party against the normal speed of the mobs. AST in essence has tools to affect to the outcome of the battle in similar ways than the Slow would do. They just have it in their unique toolkit which actually sets them apart from the other classes.

It's like I don't have any chance to give DoT each monster because tank's health drops faster... Unlike when using SCH, they got Shadow Flare to slow mobs and faerie that can maintain tank's health...

IMO, Stella is fine with slow, but it should be instant. Seriously, I don't use Stella at all the way it is now. I costs more than malefic, has the same cast time and does less damage. People say it's good for PVP, but if it was instant it would be even better for PVP too.

Since I want Stella to keep the slow, I wish Gravity had heavy, making sense with the name. It would also make it good for PVP AND for dungeons. Also Gravity should be a Lv 46 skill and Combust II should be a Lv 52 skill.

Proposed changes;

Stella: Instant cast ability on 15 sec timer, 100 potency with a 10 sec slow effect

Gravity: Keep everything the same but give it a 10 sec heavy debuff

Stella is useful in A3s, would have been useful in T5 back in the day, is useful in PvP. To be honest I wouldn't be a fan of not having any kind of ST heavy in my kit as a healer, even though it's super situational.

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Originally Posted by Lastelli

It should give 10 secs slow and heavy imo. AST already is the weakest healer dps-wise, at least give gravity a slow effect so dpsing is a little easier during large pulls. I'd love an AST version of bane for spreading the combusts, maybe as an additional effect of CO so with a very long CD so we're sure it's not too powerful, but ofc it will never happen :/

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Celestial Opposition would finally be a good CD if it would spread DoTs/debuffs to targets in range in Diurnal and buffs/A.Benefic's Nocturnal Field to party members in range (similar to Deployment Tactics) in Nocturnal. But yeah, wishful thinking.

While not specifically related to whether Gravity should or shouldn't function differently or have an added effect, I do wish they came up with a more creative idea for a spell called Gravity. Originally I thought it would be cool if the spell behaved like an offensive version of Essential Dignity with damage that scaled in relation to each target's remaining HP. It would pack a punch early on, but gradually drop in power as the enemies lose health.

Gravity inflicting heavy makes a lot of sense since it is GRAVITY afterall.

I'd be happy if it just applied heavy, honestly. Slow would be more useful for dungeon trash, but I don't really care about dungeon trash...

Give gravity the heavy, and stella some other effect, like maybe the slow or something.

I think the devs gave Stella the heavy effect because it's their answer to WHM's "Stone" for, I dunno, solo'ing healers or something. It would be the only healer without a heavy'ing spell early on if it didn't. I doubt they'll change Stella just to buff a spell ASTs can't even use in High Level Roulette... Not without changing the available level of Gravity.

Having said that. Gravity does need something to catch up with how much more potent the other 2 healers are at with AoE (At 50, no less), so I think the "slow" effect on that is a good suggestion.

Would it seem completely broken to give them both heavy?

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Originally Posted by Cidel

Gravity does need something to catch up with how much more potent the other 2 healers are at with AoE (At 50, no less), so I think the "slow" effect on that is a good suggestion.

Would it seem completely broken to give them both heavy?

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Well, considering the fact that both Miasma and Miasma II have Heavy, I guess Stella and Gravity could also have it. But I still wish Stella was instant. AST has no instant damage skill to compare to Ruin II and Fluid Aura.

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Originally Posted by Blueyes

While not specifically related to whether Gravity should or shouldn't function differently or have an added effect, I do wish they came up with a more creative idea for a spell called Gravity. Originally I thought it would be cool if the spell behaved like an offensive version of Essential Dignity with damage that scaled in relation to each target's remaining HP. It would pack a punch early on, but gradually drop in power as the enemies lose health.

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You know that's actually a pretty cool idea. It's pretty in-line with some of the incarnations of gravity in FF.

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Originally Posted by ViDare

Proposed changes;

Stella: Instant cast ability on 15 sec timer, 100 potency with a 10 sec slow effect

Gravity: Keep everything the same but give it a 10 sec heavy debuff

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Prefer to have :

Stella : Instant cast ability on 2,5 sec timer. 80 potency + heavy effect. Can have a 15% chance to make the next Combust II instant. (good dps skill while moving, like Ruin II for SCH but instead of blind you have heavy effect.)

Can't Gravity do something related to the name? Like pulling all the mobs within the range to the position where the AST is? I remember some kind of ability like this from another MMORPG.

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Originally Posted by Seraphyel

Can't Gravity do something related to the name? Like pulling all the mobs within the range to the position where the AST is? I remember some kind of ability like this from another MMORPG.

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Not the best idea to pull enemies towards the healer, lol.
But if Gravity could pull enemies towards the target, it would be awesome.

Oh, I thought Gravity is a PBAOE like Holy, sorry.

The mentioned ability in the other MMORPG does exactly what you say: pull the mobs towards the initial target. And the best thing: you can have the tank as your initial target so that all mobs are pulled towards the tank.

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Originally Posted by Seraphyel

Oh, I thought Gravity is a PBAOE like Holy, sorry.

The mentioned ability in the other MMORPG does exactly what you say: pull the mobs towards the initial target. And the best thing: you can have the tank as your initial target so that all mobs are pulled towards the tank.

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Can you imagine this used in pvp? It would be hilariously overpowered as if Nocturnal AST wasn't already strong enough.

I'd be more happy if Celestial Oppositions stun gave the 'terror' stun so it looks more like we are stopping time. Kinda like it did during the level 60 AST quest.

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Originally Posted by VitalSuit

Can you imagine this used in pve? It would be hilariously overpowered as if Nocturnal AST wasn't already strong enough.

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Why Noct Ast? Diurn Ast gets a cast time redux, Noct gives you nothing for dpsing.. :/ what am I missing?

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Originally Posted by Alu79

Why Noct Ast? Diurn Ast gets a cast time redux, Noct gives you nothing for dpsing.. :/ what am I missing?

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Instant cast "Aldoquium" is broken in PVP. You're excellent at sustaining the group while being unkillable and extremely hard to focus. You don't DPS in PVP because cleric stance is locked out in it (SCHs and WHMs would destroy groups in the old days).

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Originally Posted by MidnightTundra

Instant cast "Aldoquium" is broken in PVP. You're excellent at sustaining the group while being unkillable and extremely hard to focus. You don't DPS in PVP because cleric stance is locked out in it (SCHs and WHMs would destroy groups in the old days).

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Yep, always use Noct Sect in PvP, no exceptions. I've escaped melee LBs, death flares, holmgang happy warriors, and all sorts of damage just because of the excellent instant shield. Combine with some VIT accessories and you'll be a very tanky AST!

I just feel like Gravity's mana cost is unjustified. It only does damage and it's 1414 mana per cast. Aero III is 370 potency per target for 707 MP. Yes, it's a DoT but it begins to pull ahead after about 9s~12s after it's used on a basic trash pull. With 10 mobs, Aero III begins to pull ahead after 6s.

I feel like if they're going to do nothing with Gravity, the mana cost should be 900MP to 1000MP.

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Originally Posted by Alu79

Why Noct Ast? Diurn Ast gets a cast time redux, Noct gives you nothing for dpsing.. :/ what am I missing?

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I meant PvP. Instant cast adlo that's actually stronger than adlo (unless adlo crits).

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Originally Posted by VitalSuit

I meant PvP. Instant cast adlo that's actually stronger than adlo (unless adlo crits).

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Also crit adlo erased by no-crit noct benefit.

Also it would be funny when those people who defend the rock and suddenly you put all of them out lol.

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Originally Posted by VitalSuit

Can you imagine this used in pvp? It would be hilariously overpowered as if Nocturnal AST wasn't already strong enough.

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It's undeniable that it would need a very strict diminishing return. And as I said, it just was an idea. Don't know if those mechanics work for FF XIV.

But Gravity should do something related to the name, shouldn't it?

OP thank you for having a legitimate and well founded idea for making an existing ability more useful/viable. There are far to few of these solid suggestions on these official forums. Kudos! And +1