WHM dps VS. SCH dps

So it's simple Who does more damage?

I'm currently on a discussion with my girlfriend of who does more damage WHM or SCH and I can't seem to find a regular threat talking about DPS between the two. So if anyone can clear this up with some parser numbers will be very grateful.

WHM has potential to do more damage. But cons like mana management, total accuracy dependance and that for SCH is easier to heal and hit makes SCH dps more viable on raid content.

WHMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMx100101010100 :o

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Originally Posted by zuzu-bq

WHM has potential to do more damage. But cons like mana management, total accuracy dependance and that for SCH is easier to heal and hit makes SCH dps more viable on raid content.

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We do realize that but the core of the question is "who does more damage" doesn't matte what raid scenario or fight just in parser and generally who does more DMG...

^Yes and also don't care about MP management. I wanna know just a base average of WHM vs SCH, no dependancies or buts, if anyone knows. Can feel free to parse me also on Balmung server~~

From what I've tested is WHM>SCH>AST.

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Originally Posted by Ercapote

So it's simple Who does more damage?

I'm currently on a discussion with my girlfriend of who does more damage WHM or SCH and I can't seem to find a regular threat talking about DPS between the two. So if anyone can clear this up with some parser numbers will be very grateful.

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Single target burst DPS or AoE DPS? Sustained damage versus burst damage? How long is the fight?

WHM can do more single target DPS technically but only for a shorter period of time. In a dungeon environment WHM can do more AoE dps.

SCH can do more sustained multitarget DPS of boss mobs( think A1/A2S).

WHM can do more for a 'short' period but its going to OOM faster so overall damage is going to be less than SCH. It really depends if you are measure damage over 2 minutes or 6 minutes etc.


Edit; You're both right if one is arguing SCH and one is arguing WHM. There's no clear winner each have their niche...

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Originally Posted by Rewind

Single target burst DPS or AoE DPS? Sustained damage versus burst damage? How long is the fight?

WHM can do more single target DPS technically but only for a shorter period of time. In a dungeon environment WHM can do more AoE dps.

SCH can do more sustained multitarget DPS of boss mobs( think A1/A2S).

WHM can do more for a 'short' period but its going to OOM faster so overall damage is going to be less than SCH. It really depends if you are measure damage over 2 minutes or 6 minutes etc.


Edit; You're both right if one is arguing SCH and one is arguing WHM. There's no clear winner each have their niche...

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With regards to 2 vs 6 minutes, as a WHM I dps for much longer than 2 minutes, if that's where you were going with that. I think it also may depend on the healers play style.

AS DPS :

Burst damage --> WHM

Everything else --> SCH


Then, SCH>WHM

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Originally Posted by MyaValentine

With regards to 2 vs 6 minutes, as a WHM I dps for much longer than 2 minutes, if that's where you were going with that. I think it also may depend on the healers play style.

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Yes....it also depends what fight we're talking about.

I can't find the numbers for energy drain for level 60 but -

Shroud of Saints restores a static amount of MP, based on player level. (707 MP / 3 Seconds @ Level 60) (180 Second CD)
You have to time shroud correctly to get all 5 ticks, so in general most WHMs will restore 2828MP

Assize restores 10% of own MP (90 sec CD) (Approximately 1300 @ ilvl195)


Energy Drain restores a static amount of MP, based on player level (I think this is 900 MP per drain, 3 drains every 60 seconds)
Aetherflow restores 20% of your Max MP. (Every 60 seconds) (Approximately 2600 @ ilvl195)

Inherently SCH is going to "last longer" because overall it has short CDs on their MP management than WHM. So with no other external source of MP regen WHM will run out of steam faster than SCH.

I haven't really argued in my previous answer, so here we go.

SCH is better for dps in my opinion. You have a 150 potency dps skill not in gcd that regain some mp and instant, many dots (two without accuracy requirement), Ruin II (instant dps skill) when you have to avoid mechanics/just after broil/etc, and you can stay in cleric stance longer with your fairy, + all the emergency skills allow better cleric stance dance.

I think WHM is better as main healer (even if he can use some dps skills though) and SCH as healer-dps support during progression (in fact, if you play with a good whitemage, all the time).

When I see a WHM that dps and letting me heal everything through a fight, when I play my SCH, I find it weird. But it's just my opinion.

People really aren't answering your question, so I will.

White mage has potential to deal more DPS in both single target, and AoE. Single target is a tiny difference, AoE is a massive difference.

For added info:
Astrologian is on par with WHM on single target, but has the tiny advantage of not requiring accuracy for its DoTs. It's AoE is low. Some people would argue that you can use Lightspeed and spam Gravity, but you will run out of mana within seconds. Even if it could keep full mana, its AoE would still be under that of what WHM can do in AoE. Assize and Aero3 out perform Gravity by a good bit and Gravity is the exact same spell as Holy in terms of damage dealt.

For those keeping score, that puts WHM on top as a healer and a dps, however, in a raid settings, you cannot just stop healing to dps and two healers at full strength is rarely needed. As such, most opt to have the scholar dps since it can do so while it heals thanks to its fairy. During this, the WHM will be full out heals and add little dps.

For A1S, my group has me (the WHM) solo heal the first 40-50% while the scholar does dps; she stars with Selene for added dps and switches to Eos as it gets more intensive. There's no way a scholar can keep up with the heals a WHM can do like they could in 2.0, but they can dps without the worry of running dry on mana.

For A2S, my group has me solo healing the first 5-6 waves. Once again, the scholar does dps; Selene pretty much full time in this fight. By the time I need her help with heals, I'm starting to run dry on mana around wave 6 because of the double prey. At wave 7, our bard uses ballad while we slowly work down the 4 Jagd Dolls not stressing too much about dps since the scholar adds about 1000 dps to the group before hand. From 7, to the end of the fight, she heals with me, each of us focusing on one tank as we destroy the rest of the crap in the instance.

tl;dr
WHM is, by far, more powerful for healing and dps, but mana is a massive concern when doing both.
Scholar can maintain mana well while doing both but it cannot do the heals or the dps of a white mage.

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Originally Posted by Ninimo_Babamo

People really aren't answering your question, so I will.

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You kind of didn't... OP just wanted to know who does more DPS (straight up on a dummy it sounds like)

If you put a WHM and SCH on a dummy for 10 minutes a SCH would do more overall damage because they have better mana regeneration and a WHM would simply run out of juice.

AST isn't onpar with either because it's not its function. At the cost of its own DPS it buffs others (Lightspeed shouldn't really be used for DPS because it reduces DPS potency...). WHM has fluid aura, PoM, Aero III, and Assize which all make a sizeable difference to overall damage done. WHM also has more MP regen than AST inherently though an AST may be lucky with Ewer draws on a dummy.

Read the second line of text in my post. It answers perfectly.

Burst: WHM>SCH
Sustained: SCH>WHM

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Originally Posted by Ninimo_Babamo

Read the second line of text in my post. It answers perfectly.

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Yeah I did but you're missing the key point which is burst versus sustained DPS...WHM has high burst DPS. So if we're measuring the first 2-3 minutes of a fight WHM has it in the bag (no healing, no accuracy issues, straight DPS). After you've used shroud for the first time there is going to be a massive lull in DPS that SCH doesn't experience as severely (even in single target DPS).

OPs question is very surface level anyway, it can be interpreted many ways I guess.

It really can't be.

You are saying sustained dps be 10 minutes but how many of the fights in savage allow for ANY healer to do that? None. And if you want to calculate for 10 minutes, AST will beat both. Why? It can cast Ewer and Balance on itself without the loss of a global cooldown after its instant cast DoT. Nobody calculates burst dps over 2-3 minutes. 30 seconds? Sure, but if you can maintain it for several minutes, I'd say that's pretty sustained even if it does leave you oom.

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Originally Posted by Ninimo_Babamo

Snip

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Originally Posted by Ercapote

We do realize that but the core of the question is "who does more damage" doesn't matte what raid scenario or fight just in parser and generally who does more DMG...

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It sounds like he's just asking for pure DPS and not taking into consideration anything else besides that (the amount of healing has to do/the fight). So my answer is just pure DPS on a dummy. WHM and AST will just oom much faster (you can't bank on balance/ewer at all because RNG).

I also believed sustained DPS in a raid situation shouldn't leave you oom....(though I'm not sure if I'm reading your last comment correctly).

I'm saying sustained DPS is over 2 minutes of straight DPS. WHM is oom after its first shroud pure stone III dpsing (and dotting), so its not really sutained because...you can't sustain it and because the class isn't built that way. SCH can last longer and do overall more damage. OP doesn't quantify what the time limit is and there's no context.

Edit; Is that clear? Idk, I feel like I'm rambling.

white mage actually does more dps than scholar by a decent margin
but
white mage dps spells are far less mana efficient causing them to deplete mana pool quickly and also several scholar spells have 100% accuracy making it more reliable vs high end targets

and astro dps is the worst of the 3

If your choosing which one should do the support dps it's scholar
that's really as simple as it gets

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Originally Posted by Rewind

snip.

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sorry for the confusion if I didn't specify and made it confusing... you all have answered a lot of questions but to make it more specific and help guide this a little bit i will set up a few environment to help the discussion.

1. parser DMG over a 4min limit. pure dps between the 2
.(my girlfriend tried yesterday to go all out on a dummy with a whm and it took her 3.52 sec to ran out of mp)
2. raid DMG (possibly done) meaning, if we are to set aside "who main heal" on the raid environment who will end up with a higher number at the end of the raid.
.(lets say put A1 for single target dmg and A2 for aoe dmg, maybe A3 for more specific single target since A1 does mave more than 1 target)

I try to be as specific as i can think but set yourself on those scenario, who will do more damage there.

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Originally Posted by Ninimo_Babamo

snip.

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Thx you actually answered some of the question of the discussion we where having so you as well as REWIND and everyone here tbh had answered most of our question. thx for the feedback.


ps: thx for all the feedback, is a little struggle not having a parser on ps4 :)

In fact, even on single target, SCH>WHM in my opinion. Burst damage is nice but not really so long as WHM. I can stay around 1200 as SCH during 30seconds with dissipation on a dummy, and then it's 850-900 with pentamelded accessories with accuracy (So, I don't have the maximum Mind I can get).

If you compare HPS instead of DPS, I think it will be more WHM>SCH then.

And AST is and must be the worst of the three in matter of dps, because of cards.

Personnally, when you play Whitemage, I don't think you should worry about your dps but your overheal%/where you can solo heal/mana management and where you need synergy with your co-healer.
I think you can dps a little if you don't need to heal or mechanics need specific damage (Stone I is usefull during A3S fight (add phase) for example). Depend of your co-healer as well. If he wants to heal then you can both heal & dps.
But during raids, whitemage is the main healer, I think it's more a scholar job to maximise dps.

Play as you wish. The synergy with your co-healer is essential though.

I feel like SCH does more damage realistically for most fights due to being able to Ruin II while moving/avoiding mechanics, while WHM needs to cast their nukes (except Aero). Also, SCH has far fewer acc requirements. Holy is nice, but the range sucks(gotta get close)and also puts the WHM in danger of being hit with AoEs.

Just the short encounter period for now. Maths @.@

Im gonna say WHM. Aero is the Ruin II of WHM. 6 seconds and it deals more damage than Ruin II. If you're forced to move. Typically a WHM has 2 Dots to throw up, one that is pretty spammable (Aero II), and a very heavy hitting Stone III. Think about it. Every time you broil, a whm is dealing 40 more potency. 4 broils, 160 potency difference right there.

If you're cutting into your GCD its a DPS loss.
15 Seconds left until boss is invulnerable:
Aero 150 (only 4 ticks)
Fluid Arua 150
swiftcast
Aero II: 250
Assize: 300
Stone 3:210x3
Total:1480

Bio:200
Energy Drain:150
Aero: 125 (only 3 ticks)
Energy Drain: 150
Swiftcast
Broil:170
Energy Drain: 150
Broil x2: 170x2=340
Total:1285

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Originally Posted by Rewind

Shroud of Saints restores a static amount of MP, based on player level. (707 MP / 3 Seconds @ Level 60) (180 Second CD)
You have to time shroud correctly to get all 5 ticks, so in general most WHMs will restore 2828MP

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I must be pretty amazing at timing Shroud, seeing as I've just haphazardly clicked it 20 times since I saw this message and always received 5 ticks of refresh. No more, no less.

Also, it's a 120 second cooldown. Seems someone needs to take their White Mage off of the trophy stand and polish it. :p

Otherwise, I'll admit Scholars are significantly more practical when it comes to doing damage, but assuming in a world of infinite MP and no accuracy requirements, I'd imagine White Mages would edge out over them. Alas, it's a cold and cruel universe, so we'll have to do with accuracy checks and MP issues for the moment. :(

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

If you're cutting into your GCD its a DPS loss.
15 Seconds left until boss is invulnerable:
Aero 150 (only 4 ticks)
Fluid Arua 150
swiftcast
Aero II: 250
Assize: 300
Stone 3:210x3
Total:1480

Bio:200
Energy Drain:150
Aero: 125 (only 3 ticks)
Energy Drain: 150
Swiftcast
Broil:170
Energy Drain: 150
Broil x2: 170x2=340
Total:1285

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If your scholar/whm dps like that as burst damage, it's really bad anyway. Your math is not accurate then.

For the sake of easy math, going to assume the following:

1. A universal GCD of 2.5s (24 GCDs per minute)
2. When a DoT is applied, they'll be given their full duration
3. Infinite MP
4. One Minute Time Frame
5. Training Dummy Target (no accuracy requirement)
6. Assumes you are reapplying DoTs in a manner that has absolutely no overlap (though that's near impossible at times)

=====================

SCH DPS
Bio
Total Duration 18 seconds for 240 Potency
Needs to be applied 4 times in a minute
960 Potency Total

Bio II
Total Duration 30 seconds for 350 Potency
Needs to be applied 2 times in a minute
700 Potency Total

Miasma
Total Duration of 24 Seconds for 300 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 3 times in a minute
900 Potency Total

Shadow Flare
Total Duration of 30 Seconds for 250 Potency
Needs to be applied 2 times in a minute
500 Potency Total

Aero
Total Duration 18 seconds for 200 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 4 times in a minute
800 Potency Total

SCH DoTs account for 15 GCDs in a minute

Broil
170 Potency Total for 9 GCDs
1,530 Potency Total

Energy Drain
150 Potency per Use - 3 Stacks / minute to be used with each application of an instant cast DoT
450 Potency Total

3,860 Potency Total DoTs / Minute
1,530 Potency in Broils / Minute
450 Potency in Energy Drain / Minute

SCH Potency Potential = 5,840 Potency / Minute

Add another 450 Potency if Aetherflow is readily available and SCH is beginning rotation with full stacks. Add another 450 Potency if Dissipation is used as a DPS tool.

Fey Wind does not provide an additional attack in this window.

=====================

WHM DPS
Aero
Total Duration 18 seconds for 200 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 3 times in a minute (to be used in conjunction with Fluid Aura and Assize for maximum effect)
600 Potency Total

Aero II
Total Duration 12 seconds for 250 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 5 times in a minute
1,250 Potency Total

Aero III
Total Duration of 24 Seconds for 370 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 3 times in a minute
1,110 Potency Total

WHM DoTs account for 11 GCDs in a minute

Stone III
210 Potency Total for 13 GCDs
2,730 Potency Total

Fluid Aura
150 Potency per Use - 2 uses / minute to be used with each application of Aero
300 Potency Total

Assize
300 Potency per Use - 1 use / minute to be used with each application of Aero
300 Potency Total

2,960 Potency Total DoTs / Minute
2,730 Potency in Stone III / Minute
300 Potency in Fluid Aura / Minute
300 Potency in Assize / Minute

WHM Potency Potential = 6,290 Potency / Minute

Add another 210 Potency if Presence of Mind is used to allow for an extra GCD within it's buff timer.

Due note that Assize is actually 300 potency / 90 seconds and a total of 600 potency / 3 minutes.

=====================

Above math doesn't account for the fact not all DoTs line up with a 60s timer so there will be some overlap when expanding this timer beyond one minute. Also the math is considering the full duration of the DoT when applied - so it'll do less damage when considered at the end of a minute. However, multiplying the above by however minutes one desires should allow for a decent approximation one can expect. Be sure to allow for buff / ability timers when doing said multiplication as some buffs will not be available on each minute.

Looking at above, and considering infinite MP, WHM wins the race by approximately 7.7% when factoring just sustained damage.

[Edit] Had to readjust specific values as you'll be applying some DoTs more often due to time of application

Quote:

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If you're cutting into your GCD its a DPS loss.
15 Seconds left until boss is invulnerable:
Aero 150 (only 4 ticks)
Fluid Arua 150
swiftcast
Aero II: 250
Assize: 300
Stone 3:210x3
Total:1480

Bio:200
Energy Drain:150
Aero: 125 (only 3 ticks)
Energy Drain: 150
Swiftcast
Broil:170
Energy Drain: 150
Broil x2: 170x2=340
Total:1285

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You guys forgot Shadow Flare.


Also, I would argue that Fey Wind is probably the reason why SCH's DPS wasn't intended to be on par with WHM...the same reason NIN's solo damage is built-in to be lower than MNK or DRG--their Trick Attack debuff adds raid DPS that technically was generated by the NIN, and thus balanced everything out. The 3% haste for the entire raid, likely makes up for or averages out that 300-350 potency discrepancy or comes close to it.

Also with Lustrates, Galvanize, and Fairy heals, the SCH is a bit more mobile DPS-wise than WHM, so I feel they can contribute DPS more easily whereas WHM has to stop and cast more often.

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

You guys forgot Shadow Flare.


Also, I would argue that Fey Wind is probably the reason why SCH's DPS wasn't intended to be on par with WHM...the same reason NIN's solo damage is lower than MNK or DRG--their Trick Attack debuff adds raid DPS that technically was generated by the NIN and thus balanced everything out. The 3% haste for the entire raid, likely makes up for or averages out that 300-350 potency discrepancy or comes close to it.

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Again, the haste buff is arguable. You can see no difference with and without it on a parser during a ~8 minutes fight. The haste buff impact is really minimal.

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Originally Posted by Rewind

You kind of didn't... OP just wanted to know who does more DPS (straight up on a dummy it sounds like)

If you put a WHM and SCH on a dummy for 10 minutes a SCH would do more overall damage because they have better mana regeneration and a WHM would simply run out of juice.

AST isn't onpar with either because it's not its function. At the cost of its own DPS it buffs others (Lightspeed shouldn't really be used for DPS because it reduces DPS potency...). WHM has fluid aura, PoM, Aero III, and Assize which all make a sizeable difference to overall damage done. WHM also has more MP regen than AST inherently though an AST may be lucky with Ewer draws on a dummy.

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I also said ignore mana dependency, disregard all "setbacks" so to speak.

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Originally Posted by Khyan

If your scholar/whm dps like that as burst damage, it's really bad anyway. Your math is not accurate then.

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I said you had a 15 second window to hit as hard as you can. Using 1 OGCD skill during GCD will result in 1 less GCD. Tell me the rotation youd use for both and no, you cannot sneak in a OGCD before the boss disappears.

Edit: Also Johnny I was speaking Short tem, so shadowflare would be bad unless you managed to place it before hand, :O which would give SCH an advantage. (But with Presence of mind precast it might be close again xD)

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

For the sake of easy math, going to assume the following:

=====================

Above math doesn't account for the fact not all DoTs line up with a 60s timer so there will be some overlap when expanding this timer beyond one minute. Also the math is considering the full duration of the DoT when applied - so it'll do less damage when considered at the end of a minute. However, multiplying the above by however minutes one desires should allow for a decent approximation one can expect. Be sure to allow for buff / ability timers when doing said multiplication as some buffs will not be available on each minute.

Looking at above, and considering infinite MP, WHM wins the race by approximately 7.7% when factoring just sustained damage.

[Edit] Had to readjust specific values as you'll be applying some DoTs more often due to time of application

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Thanks sir, appreciate the numbers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

If you're cutting into your GCD its a DPS loss.
15 Seconds left until boss is invulnerable:
Aero 150 (only 4 ticks)
Fluid Arua 150
swiftcast
Aero II: 250
Assize: 300
Stone 3:210x3
Total:1480

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Casting dots when you want burst damage is a dps loss, mainly if you're using PoM. Using PoM reduces stone III cast to 1.92 seconds which allow you to cast 7-8 stones during the whole 15sec period, that's roughly 1600 potency mashing 1 button compared to what you wrote.

Also your rotation is wrong. It's aero III > aero > aero II > fluid aura > PoM > stone III ~ > dots are only refreshed once PoM wears off, swiftcast is better used on either medica II or to refresh aero III. Just because aero III is aoe don't underestimate it's power on single target.

Why did this thread became a thing again?

I said 15 seconds. .-. 15. Again. 15. Also your math was "7-8" Stone IIIs solid math to hit that 1600 huh?

Also yes Aero III is lovely. I was just trying to give each class a chance to use their ogcd skills with swift cast.

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Originally Posted by zuzu-bq

Why did this thread became a thing again?

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I was asking for some information regarding a discussion between me and my girl, if this threat hurts your emotions, I'm sorry but it wasn't what we intended, just basically asking for more experienced people on the matter which we got what we wanted and we are greatly appreciated to everyone, so if this offend you just know that there's no hate intentions on this and + everyone here where pretty nice so I don't understand where are you coming from with your post. Any ways have a good day thanks all...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ercapote

I was asking for some information regarding a discussion between me and my girl, if this threat hurts your emotions, I'm sorry but it wasn't what we intended, just basically asking for more experienced people on the matter which we got what we wanted and we are greatly appreciated to everyone, so if this offend you just know that there's no hate intentions on this and + everyone here where pretty nice so I don't understand where are you coming from with your post any ways have a good day thanks all...

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Don't lie, I hate all these mofo's. Jk jk, chillax. No but foreal @Zuzu, it became a thing because your response was miniscule and didn't clarify much and people were discussing their thoughts. Same reason most posts become a thing :)

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Originally Posted by Raminax

I must be pretty amazing at timing Shroud, seeing as I've just haphazardly clicked it 20 times since I saw this message and always received 5 ticks of refresh. No more, no less.

Also, it's a 120 second cooldown. Seems someone needs to take their White Mage off of the trophy stand and polish it. :p

Otherwise, I'll admit Scholars are significantly more practical when it comes to doing damage, but assuming in a world of infinite MP and no accuracy requirements, I'd imagine White Mages would edge out over them. Alas, it's a cold and cruel universe, so we'll have to do with accuracy checks and MP issues for the moment. :(

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Sorry, I must have been a misread the CD as I was using a website to get the potency calculation, The 5th tick is legitimate in combat. Please see https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...nt_for_whm_in/

No need to be insulting ^_^

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Originally Posted by MyaValentine

I also said ignore mana dependency, disregard all "setbacks" so to speak.

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Then WHM wins both AoE and Single Target (infinite MP pool). Though that will never happen >.<

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MyaValentine

No but foreal @Zuzu, it became a thing because your response was miniscule and didn't clarify much and people were discussing their thoughts. Same reason most posts become a thing :)

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I can see most are just explaining what I've said. I'm just terrible with proof showing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

I said 15 seconds. .-. 15. Again. 15. Also your math was "7-8" Stone IIIs solid math to hit that 1600 huh?

Also yes Aero III is lovely. I was just trying to give each class a chance to use their ogcd skills with swift cast.

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If you want to nitpick, PoM > stone III > fluid > stone III x6. 1620 potency. I just said 7-8 stone IIIs because you can almost hit 8 by 0.2 seconds so the game might and might not register that last one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rewind

Sorry, I must have been a misread the CD as I was using a website to get the potency calculation, The 5th tick is legitimate in combat. Please see https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...nt_for_whm_in/

No need to be insulting ^_^

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Yerr, sorry for the snideness. I just assumed you were going on a drunken rampage. :p (Can't spell assumption without ass, I guess?)

That said, I'm testing both Shroud of Saints and Luminiferous Aether right now with various timings (just after a Regen tick, somewhere inbetween, just before a Regen tick and so on) and I keep getting a consistent 5 ticks of Refresh, even in combat. :/ Perhaps latency might affect it? We all know XIV has lots of silly shenanigans going on with its netcode to begin with, latency might just be making it worse losing random DoT/HoT/SoS ticks. Guess I'll have to test further inside some raid later on, because fighting individual enemies probably isn't straining things that much. :p

Either latency, or the timing isn't as strict as the post is claiming.

And it could've also just been fixed. Two months ago is quite a while, considering the amounts of hotfix patches we've had.