Please do this SE.

Please make it so that people who get kicked cannot return to the duty they were kicked from.

Tired of insta-queuing griefer tanks joining back in to grief.

Thank you.

No thanks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LordHadi

No thanks.

---

Any reason why you don't support this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adire

Any reason why you don't support this?

---

Obviously he wants to queue up, troll you, get kicked and do it all over again. It's what he lives for.

yes please! some tanks just wanna troll and not put buffs on and let players die over and over. than bad mouth everyone for no reason.. or just dont move form the start. Happened a few times and they got the que back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zaft

Obviously he wants to queue up, troll you, get kicked and do it all over again. It's what he lives for.

---

Probably. Guess I'm too optimistic to expect that he may have a legitimate reason to oppose this suggestion.

Because I got kicked once as a PLD by two members that joined together. Joined in again and they both left and I had no problem at all with the new healer.. So I'm glad I joined again, makes it fair for me.

and no i'm not trolling.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LordHadi

Because I got kicked once as a PLD by two members that joined together. Joined in again and they both left and I had no problem at all with the new healer.. So I'm glad I joined again, makes it fair for me.

and no i'm not trolling.

---

Fair enough. I've been wrongfully kicked myself before.

I still think kicked players should not be allowed to return though. Wrongful kicks are one thing, but one griefer having the ability to hold up 3 people for as long as they like is a much bigger problem.

If you are wrongfully kicked as a tank, you can get a fast queue again, not much harm done to you. If the tank is griefing though? The only option is for the others to leave and eat a wrongful penalty, or abandon.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adire

Fair enough. I've been wrongfully kicked myself before.

I still think kicked players should not be allowed to return though. Wrongful kicks are one thing, but one griefer having the ability to hold up 3 people for as long as they like is a much bigger problem.

If you are wrongfully kicked as a tank, you can get a fast queue again, not much harm done to you. If the tank is griefing though? The only option is for the others to leave and eat a wrongful penalty, or abandon.

---

what about as a dps. how about the community just grows up, does the duty, then leaves and hopes they dont get the same people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adire

Fair enough. I've been wrongfully kicked myself before.

I still think kicked players should not be allowed to return though. Wrongful kicks are one thing, but one griefer having the ability to hold up 3 people for as long as they like is a much bigger problem.

If you are wrongfully kicked as a tank, you can get a fast queue again, not much harm done to you. If the tank is griefing though? The only option is for the others to leave and eat a wrongful penalty, or abandon.

---

I hear you, then I support this thread if they prevent a group of players joined a party together to vote kick (as they think they have the power in the party even tho they might be at fault), otherwise many people will be a victim and have their time wasted..

I find more often than not the dps players are the problem. They attack early, don't use enmity reduction, fight mobs tanks not hitting so they can say look at my deeps! Or in raids like the towers they don't wait for tanks to be ready or to pull, then say why am i tanking X mob. Like you are such a beast you cant be contained. I don't fully blame players though as SE design promotes trolling from withing the group for anyone able to watch enmity meter while playing. it's like crack as they see it rise then they get all sullen when they don't get agro so they try to pull more and run ahead creating more work not for me but for your healer. If you want to tank i'll let you. but don't say i'm bad tank for pulling your card. And don't call us trolls because we rejoin the queue and get your sorry definition of what a group should be and how fast or slow it should move again.

One common theme seems to be players not liking each other or being indifferent to another players plight. It's very off putting. My favorite thing is the no bonus, exp only groups for every pf raid. Then you join and they are just as good/bad as DF. I can't put my finger on it but something about the games design has players hating on one another rather than needing each other desperatly to survive, like in a FF game where potions mattered and anyone could use phoenix down even in combat. Players use others as bait for fates to collect items and such. It's like too much WoW here.

What is it that has us at each others necks so often? it's not as simple as being jerks or kids or desperate for a drop or mad cuz can't raid or win them.. Something within this system has turned us against ourselves, it's fundamentally wrong somewhere at the core where a game is jsut supposed to be fun, but challenging enough that everyone can make a difference, not you got one guy who gets hit he dies so the raid should wipe because of it. Hell Ruby Weapon had to be fought solo. were is that creative thinking at? instead of timers and dps checks how about thought provoking systems like in other older RPG, where you could make a choice and if it was the wrong one it didn't spell doom it jsutu meant you had to work more into the fight after to win it. In some cases im all for one shots but not every friggin thing labeled "hard, or extreme" 1 shots aren't that extreme when 80% of mechanics are one shot mechanics that the entire group cant recover from. That's not extreme it's jsut bullshit. I could only imagine a timer on my Ruby Weapon fight after killing my group before hand i have to win in x amount of time. DPS checks and one shot kill moves on timers ir too much stress when the ilevels are just enough to qualify. Crafting gear and filling it with vit materia overmelds to survive while you have potions that are still useless isn't extreme it's short sighted.
I suggested a long time ago they add materia to the game but give it meaning like adding 200 points to invigorate or 3 seconds to oath. or making regen tick +10. or god forbid adding elemental attacks to weapons as replacement for damage or an added bonus. Crafting would welcome the chance to crack materia to take a +3 to 5. I'm just going to stop before i go too far. if i haven't already.
Good day and sorry to bother you all with my bs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lovescake

what about as a dps. how about the community just grows up, does the duty, then leaves and hopes they dont get the same people.

---

If you're kicked wrongfully as a DPS, then you don't have that benefit of the fast queue obviously. But given that most DPS know this, they are less likely to grief. They have more to lose from being kicked than tanks do.

If you're kicked wrongfully as a DPS, you probably don't want to be put back in with the group anyways. The tank and/or healer has to be involved in the DPS being kicked, and they can prevent you from completing the duty anyways if they want to.

As much as I agree with you and wish people would grow up, sometimes tanks do queue up with the sole intent to cause problems. And when they do, nothing can stop them really because of this system's design. People who do that only do it to get their laughs from causing other people problems, they don't care about completing the run.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LordHadi

I hear you, then I support this thread if they prevent a group of players joined a party together to vote kick (as they think they have the power in the party even tho they might be at fault), otherwise many people will be a victim and have their time wasted..

---

That is one possible solution, though I don't think disenfranchisement is the answer. If a party of three does a duty and gets a random, and that random is griefing and the party's votes are nullified, then the random person can stay in the duty against the wishes of 3 people.

Something needs to be done nonetheless. Tanks have instant queues many times and can harass and ruin dungeon runs single-handedly and evade the vote kick feature. In many cases, the people who vote you out aren't people you want to come back to anyways and aren't people who will get you a successful run either if they choose to stay.

Edit:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amatsuhira

snip

---

If a DPS is intentionally griefing, they are only putting themselves at risk. They can be kicked and replaced immediately. A group who keeps a griefing DPS in the group is one that's very patient.

A tank however is not so easily replaced and is more often than not more crucial for a run's success in DF than an individual DPS is. If someone is only interested in griefing (such as in the run that inspired me to post this thread), queuing as tank or maybe healer is the smart thing to do. You are crucial and are not as easily replaced typically. Trying to grief as a DPS is a good way to get yourself kicked without second thought, as you are more expendable.

I agree that griefing is an issue and kicking can work when all randoms agree but my issues are with it's frequency and the fact that the current enmity system pits players against each other. The dps checks further the problem within the group dynamic because someone/anyone can claim parser numbers or "dps is low". I want to root out the cause of the cancer all together. I have been witness to and a part of greifing and it's a snowball effect. When the dps that are easy to kick turn into tanks or vice versa, what is our true goal and why has it come this?
If only i were smarter...Or better yet had opinions from people that care enough to sift through the bs to find common ground.
Certainly not as simple as good or bad players/community members. Is there fault at the core of something in the game i wonder?

The kickvote system is near useless as long as the same people can keep rejoining the same duty in-progress.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amatsuhira

I find more often than not the dps players are the problem.

---

Coming from a pure dps perspective and having been trolled by tanks for watching cutscenes while leveling and for asking clarifications on mechanics I not only support this but would go even further to say if your kicked you get a 30min time out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tuathaa

Coming from a pure dps perspective and having been trolled by tanks for watching cutscenes while leveling and for asking clarifications on mechanics I not only support this but would go even further to say if your kicked you get a 30min time out.

---

No, this is a horrible idea. Too many wrongful kicks. Just leave it as it is now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tuathaa

Coming from a pure dps perspective and having been trolled by tanks for watching cutscenes while leveling and for asking clarifications on mechanics I not only support this but would go even further to say if your kicked you get a 30min time out.

---

Something is causing players to take out anger/frustration on each other regardless of job. From my years playing this game i have seen tank troll, healer trolls, dps ones and even kicks before looting. Even players kick people after 1 attempt on a boss for afk or offline when clearly they are not.
Has to be a better way to keep more players happy with game and each other.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Riepah

No, this is a horrible idea. Too many wrongful kicks. Just leave it as it is now.

---

I have been wrongfully kicked more than once from watching cut scenes to back flipping of Titans rock (no guide ever mentioned ed that was a possibility) and had to redo a 45+min q. Bad tanks and healers need some form of repercussion for their actions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amatsuhira

Something is causing players to take out anger/frustration on each other regardless of job. From my years playing this game i have seen tank troll, healer trolls, dps ones and even kicks before looting. Even players kick people after 1 attempt on a boss for afk or offline when clearly they are not.
Has to be a better way to keep more players happy with game and each other.

---

how can you kick someone before loot?

when the chests are in the dungeon they cant be kicked.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lovescake

how can you kick someone before loot?

when the chests are in the dungeon they cant be kicked.

---

No, they can be kicked until the chest is opened. I've had the window up ready to kick the moment the fight ends to get rid of... unpleasant party members who tried to not roll on loot so they could stick around. Usually the timer will fall off in the next boss, so a quick / determined person can kick in the window.
Inversely, unless I really want something, I don't roll on it till the last second just in case.

This request has more potential for detrimental outcomes than beneficial. Simply because there are far more incidents of vote abuse.

It's a double edge sword with the unfavorable side with the sharper edge.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KaedrianLiang

snip

---

I'm sure there are numerous ways they could allow this and reduce the amount of vote kick abuse going on.

Actually enforcing the claim that vote kick abuse is punishable would be a start. I'm sure they could come up with some things to change the system for the better too.

Right now, plenty of people get away with vote kick abuse and with abusing the in-progress joining feature as a griefing tool. Fixing one won't necessarily make the other get much worse. It's best that they figure out a way to improve both.

Locking people out from the duty they're kicked from when they're kicked would solve the tanks griefing problem. I can think of many ways that would improve the vote kick abuse problem, namely what I mentioned first: SE enforcing it being a punishable offense.

The fact that both persist shows that the current system is not working.

I actually do not know of any other game that allows someone kicked to rejoin come to think of it. As someone stated earlier, it's against the whole point of vote kicking to allow someone to just rejoin again.

Edit: And as I mentioned before. If you're being kicked and your intentions are not bad, it's probably best that you don't return to the duty you were kicked from anyways. Unless you go in and start a kick and get the other person to support you if there is another non-premade party person in with you, the people kicking you wrongfully will likely not be leaving and it's best to not waste your time with them any further.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adire

I still think kicked players should not be allowed to return though. Wrongful kicks are one thing, but one griefer having the ability to hold up 3 people for as long as they like is a much bigger problem.

---

Step 1.) Kick the griefer
Step 2.) Refresh. Shit it's the same griefer again? Kick.
Step 3.) Wait or progress without one player for a few minutes. Don't start refreshing immediatly. After a min or two, refresh. The griefer will already be in another party, and you got yourself a new, shiny party member. gg.

I do agree that having griefers suck and you shouldn't be able to rejoin an instance you got kicked out from. Just pointing out there is a way to prevent it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ShaneDawn

Step 1.) Kick the griefer
Step 2.) Refresh. Shit it's the same griefer again? Kick.
Step 3.) Wait or progress without one player for a few minutes. Don't start refreshing immediatly. After a min or two, refresh. The griefer will already be in another party, and you got yourself a new, shiny party member. gg.

I do agree that having griefers suck and you shouldn't be able to rejoin an instance you got kicked out from. Just pointing out there is a way to prevent it.

---

Ppl too dumb/ ( party leader too dumb ) too understand that there is an option to refresh missing roles.
Maybe thats y griefers grief them lol its so tempting. If ur not host just ask them to wait on refreshing, its not hard to type that in the chat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LordHadi

Because I got kicked once as a PLD by two members that joined together. Joined in again and they both left and I had no problem at all with the new healer.. So I'm glad I joined again, makes it fair for me.

and no i'm not trolling.

---

From what I've personally seen this example is more the exception than the rule.

I wouldn't like this as queues for low level dungeons are ridiculously long and sometimes I forget to repair my gear, and I appreciate the fact that I can be kicked out and then re-queue into the same dungeon almost 100% of the time. This would mean that the three other people would have to do a whole queue again in order to go into the dungeon because one person has to repair. I'm glad that the other three are not being punished but in your suggestion, they would be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tuathaa

Coming from a pure dps perspective and having been trolled by tanks for watching cutscenes while leveling and for asking clarifications on mechanics I not only support this but would go even further to say if your kicked you get a 30min time out.

---

No. That's an awful idea. Not all kicks are justified. Being kicked from an instance because someone wanted their buddy to join before the last boss isn't grounds for giving the kicked person a 30 minute penalty. I'll agree with the OP, however, that a person that's kicked shouldn't be able to rejoin the same group that they were just dismissed from. I've been trolled a few times by people rejoining just to waste our time and our vote kicks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adire

Please make it so that people who get kicked cannot return to the duty they were kicked from.

Tired of insta-queuing griefer tanks joining back in to grief.

Thank you.

---

I told Yoshida directly about this in April 2014 during FFXIV PS4 Event in Paris. I thought it was fixed...

tell you a funny story:

long time ago, there were a group of people joined in ST. One of them trolling, early pull. one of them always AFK (healer), dying all the time. So, I (healer) did point the AFK person out (at least the trolling person was fighting) in PT chat. Before Amon, the vote kick option poped in my screen. I solo healed all the way, of course I hit yes. The AFK person surprisingly got kicked out. We were 7 pp waiting on 1 more healer. In the meantime, The trolling-early pull person, and the other ppl keeps cursing me with all bad words. When we just got 8th person, my screen went black... I got kicked!
I was shocked and not sure what happened. I just decided to requene after like 1-2 mins. I just happened to join back to the exact team.

Now! they already inside Amon and I was locked out. I have time to screen each players inside the team. It happened to be 4 of them were from the same FC same server. So, that's why they were like fearless and trolling all the time (if you really go dig who you are party with, you can see the pre-grouped ppl tend to troll.) So, I wrote a long support letter to GM with everything in chat who pulled what boss early then run out, did what cause how many ppl died/wipe while 3 of these ppl didn't do anything but just stood there and cursed me in party chat. I just told them, "I didn't initiate the vote kick. Don't worry, I'm reporting to GM, and hopes there will be justice..."

all 3 of them left after Amon.

so... still will be good thing for the rejoin thing.

Legitimate reason. Someone doesnt like you, and like cattle, the vote passes to kick you. right before the WoD boss. Or whatever. Does it matter? They earned their spot, they are participating, why not just finish the duty if they return? Or ask another player to vote the next time because they are harassing.

Just because you don't like people exploiting the reverse doesn't mean that people won't exploit vote kick just as often.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duuude007

snip.

---

Because sometimes they do like what this tank continued to do, stand around and insult people instead of actually tanking. And when they do tank, not taking aggro from the healer, letting the healer die, dying themselves, then spending 10 minutes on the ground telling the healer they're reporting them for not healing them. Then getting kicked and coming back and repeating.

If someone's intent is to grief by not allowing you to finish the duty, "just finishing the duty if they return" is not an option if that person is crucial to the run. In the end, we had to abandon the duty in my run. I've never seen a game that allows someone who is kicked to come back in multiple times.

I've been kicked wrongfully before after contributing, it sucks, but I still think one person having the ability to completely cripple a run by returning over and over is far worse.

If SE would enforce vote kick abuse as a punishable act instead of just claiming it, we could have this "kicked from a run, can't get back into that run" thing. But alas, they do not punish people because of "differences in playstyles" as mentioned by a GM, AKA anything really. Griefing could be someone's playstyle after all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duuude007

Legitimate reason. Someone doesnt like you, and like cattle, the vote passes to kick you. right before the WoD boss.

---

ST run yesterday this is exactly what happened to me, except somehow even more stupid.

There were two healers, a WHM and me (a SCH), the NIN starts complaining about the summoner being AFK from about Scylla onwards. The summoner (only one in the party) is trying to explain the whole time that they're not afk. The NIN keeps asking over and over again why the summoner is afk. Then right before Amon he tells the alliance we have an AFK summoner, and he's going to vote kick. The next thing I know my screen goes black and I'm back in Mor Dhona.

I don't know where he though those Adlos were coming from, or why he kept calling me a Summoner or how he even confused the icons considering they're completely different colors, but that is the story of the dumbest reason I've ever been kicked from a group.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kiroh

snip

---

That's sad. Reminds me of when I've been kicked wrongly and particularly when I saw a new person get kicked from Praetorium one time for being lost for less than a minute. What's more sad than a single person ranting like an idiot and starting an unjustified kick is when the other 6 people (not including you and the person who started the kick of course) go along with it and let the kick go through.

The apathy people have these days when they see wrongdoings is disappointing.

I support this to 100% because:

1: If wrongfully kicked you most likely dont want to go back to said group since they dont want you one way or another, this would allow you to still qeue with in progress selected without having to worry about ending up in same group.

2: Griefers can rejoin till people run out of votes and then its game over.

3: 1 person getting wrongfully kicked and be able to reque for a better group is better then 3 players beeing forced to exit and reque cause of 1 griefer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Devils_Lawyer

I support this to 100% because:

1: If wrongfully kicked you most likely dont want to go back to said group since they dont want you one way or another, this would allow you to still qeue with in progress selected without having to worry about ending up in same group.

---

You are certainly not speaking for many of us. When I just spent 30-40 mins (doing my job) in a dungeon, I feel deserving of the tomes and a chance at end boss loot. Someone deciding to kick me without warning or even comment is going to motivate me to come back for the clear, followed by blisting said player, assuming they are on my server.

Someone griefing others by booting them is just as bad, and just as common, as griefers coming back from a legitimate harassment boot, because they can.

I vote don't fix one without fixing both. because with the demons on both sides, neither argument is superior to the other, and choosing to address only one WILL make the situation worse than it already is.