Why I Decided to Become an Elitist

Post removed.

That's a really long post.

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Originally Posted by Zaft

That's a really long post.

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I wrote it while Titan was in the air. True story. (I was bored)

SE, please allow us to give more than one like on a post. I want to give this person like 20 cookies right now (and watch them eat them in between titans jumps).

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Originally Posted by Purrfectstorm

Then they reject vote abandons as if to hold the experienced players hostage with the penalty timer.

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Oh, I've never rejected a vote abandon to hold anyone hostage. ?_? I've rejected them because it's usually one disgruntled person who wants to leave, while the rest of us are willing to go back in there and try to get it down instead of running away. Don't try to make us all leave (and end up waiting in queue all over again) just because you don't want the penalty. If the majority of people weren't having fun or didn't think it was possible to win, the vote would pass. If it's rejected, it's simply because you're in the minority and should just leave on your own if you want. I'm pretty sure it's almost never about holding anyone hostage...

Edit: Now that I am awake, I can write a better reply lol. I pretty much agree with this. Not -everyone- is that way but personally, I've experienced this. I have been held hostage too..haha. (Although I don't really mind lol..can always just leave, meh)

It was in Garuda Extreme. We tried for a while, and it was exactly as you said..there was 4 of us experienced, and 4 were not. We tried helping them for a good long while, tried to patiently explain mechanics, after like 30 minutes of wiping we just said sorry guys this just is not going to work, we were trying to vote abandon and they refused. They were like "come on just one more" the other tank, try as he may, just could not keep hate for anything. We eventually just had to leave.

I've no problem helping people, but they have to help themselves as well.

I think you're mistaking the elitism we all know and abhor for simply being good. There are a growing number of players who refuse to play with anyone who isn't on their level. These are the ones who have party flags which ridiculously high ilvl requirements (despite the content requiring much lower) and list comments like "screw up, get kicked", This is immediately apparent to anyone who opens up the Party Search box trying to find a group. These types of groups are becoming the norm, rather than the exception.

The issue isn't that only the elite post their parties, it's that those mid-tier and low-tier players who do post their groups have often had high-tier players join only to criticize and judge. They're not interested in helping a player to get better, only to rub their face in the dirt that they are 'superior' in some way. That is the real reason elitism get's such a bad rep.

If you're just good at what you do, that's fine. It's when you grind people beneath your heel in your wake that people get annoyed and call you out. I'm not expecting every good player to go out of their way to help newcomers, but this anti-social extreme is not acceptable and someone was going to mention it sooner or later.

I can mostly agree with you.

However not watching a guide is not the sign of a bad/weak player. To some players the challenge of learning a new fight is more fun then beating it. And often times those players have learned to quickly adapt to new situations and formulate tactics on the fly. This is is skill that is not easily gained and is even harder to obtain if all you ever do is watch/read guides.

I think this post is painting the issue in broad strokes.

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Originally Posted by Purrfectstorm

I'm not here to preach how easy this game is (it's not easy if you don't do those things above). I just want to offer a different way of looking at so-called elitism: as a mindset that is not okay with mediocrity, not just in others, but in one's self as well.

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This x1000

Why should i try my best on something when others dont give a sh*t? - Right, i don't have to. Worst is when people fk up on mechanics that are easy as hell and known since many moons (LotA Final Boss Ancient Flare is the best example when i want to flip my table).

In 16 years of MMORPGs, at some point i just stopped giving advice if people don't ask for it. Ill go into silent mode when i enter instances an pray that i don't have tools that don't care about mechanics because "This is a i## instance, im i125+, so why should i care?"

tl;dr *cough* XD Im with you on that rant, if that makes me an elitist, so be it - gl on your drops o/

When I hear elitism, I think of a person who doesn't want to play with people who aren't at their level of skill.

There is nothing wrong with that. Them not wanting to teach others is NOT an issue. I shouldn't have to teach persons who go into the Duty Finder. They should have the self respect and respect to others by watching videos. When said persons insult lower skilled players, then there is an issue.

I call myself elitist, but I don't insult others lack of ability - I just avoid them.

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Originally Posted by SaintAjora

Oh, I've never rejected a vote abandon to hold anyone hostage.

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True, not all vote abandon rejects are about holding people hostage. I do feel like many are, though.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

I think you're mistaking the elitism we all know and abhor for simply being good.

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I'm not mistaking it. Different groups use the term "elitist" differently. I was just trying to demonstrate the positive side of elitism (the self-improvement angle). I agree elitism where people put others down is bad though.

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

However not watching a guide is not the sign of a bad/weak player.

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I agree. Although in most cases the player who isn't watching a guide and wants to learn on the fly does so in groups where others do know the fight. Some groups are okay with this but many are not. Again, it is because players who don't know what they are doing are complete liabilities. SE shares the blame on this by making fights counter-intuitive and where new players cause auto-losses for groups. In this game, knowledge of fight mechanics IS what separates good and bad players. If you don't watch a guide and you're in a group of others who have, your performance will generally be worse.

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Originally Posted by kyuven

I think this post is painting the issue in broad strokes.

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I won't deny that. But look how long my post was just using broad strokes. Would any of you read a book on elitism if I wrote it? (I would paint a more complete picture, I promise!)

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

The issue isn't that only the elite post their parties, it's that those mid-tier and low-tier players who do post their groups have often had high-tier players join only to criticize and judge. They're not interested in helping a player to get better, only to rub their face in the dirt that they are 'superior' in some way. That is the real reason elitism get's such a bad rep.

If you're just good at what you do, that's fine. It's when you grind people beneath your heel in your wake that people get annoyed and call you out. I'm not expecting every good player to go out of their way to help newcomers, but this anti-social extreme is not acceptable and someone was going to mention it sooner or later.

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Asking someone to not be a liability is not criticism, nor grinding people beneath your heel. And let's not kid ourselves, no one has fun wiping constantly no matter how much they insist. The first time it was fun, the 5th time it was amusing, the 50th time you still can't manage not to wipe to the same mechanic that has killed you 49 times before, it's not fun anymore and you're deluding yourself if you continue to claim it is.

And why are you upset with parties you don't want to be in forming with rules you don't like? They have no obligation to lower their standards for you, and you have no inherent "right" to a spot in a group. The people who have run something 100+ times have every right to want to run with other people with the same experience as they have.

And lastly, helping someone and carrying them are not the same things. No one expects you to be perfect, but if you can't even manage to survive at least 80% of the fight then it's not help anymore.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

Did you even read what you quoted, or just the first line? Because if you read the whole thing, you'd understand your post is completely meaningless.

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Then you go on to preach about belittling people, priceless.

Then let me put this in a way you can comprehend.

You have an obligation as a human being to not be a liability to everyone around you. When you absolutely refuse to take instructions because they're not phrased in a way you like, you are not living up to that obligation. If someone is being outright abusive, why would you even want to be in their group to begin with?

Again, everyone has a right to group with equally experienced players and they have no obligation whatsoever to stroke your ego when you screw up.

I think elitism is more about how people perceive you than what you perceive yourself as in this community. It all goes down to how people interrupt your actions or words. I just find it a little weird that when you do help new inexperienced people in fights and they thank you for it, you should be considered an elitist because you are superior in terms of experience, but most people will tell you that's not true because I think most people link elitism to an egoistic attitude?

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Originally Posted by kyuven

I think this post is painting the issue in broad strokes.

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And using water colors where oils would work better.

@OP - redefining elitism to fit your framework, does not in fact redefine it. I've seen all of this before and what you a re talking about is not elitism, it's veteran player fatigue which brings with it a nasty dose of intolerance for other players, new players and anyone/anything that does not meet the exact specifications of the fatigued veteran player at that time.

The attitude that demands others watch a video before playing is selfish pure and simple. Many players wish to experience content the first time by actually playing it.Shocking I know, imagine that wanting to play this game instead if simply viewing it on You Tube....

Elitism stems from the elitist who believes themself rightly or wrongly, to be superior to others, not player fatigue.

Dressing up the bitter intolerance that comes from the fatigue as elitism doesn't make it elitism, even if rationalizing it that way makes you feel better about your self.

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Originally Posted by Kiroh

Asking someone to not be a liability is not criticism, nor grinding people beneath your heal. And let's not kid ourselves, no one has fun wiping constantly no matter how much they insist. The first time it was fun, the 5th time it was amusing, the 50th time you still can't manage not to wipe to the same mechanic that has killed you 49 times before, it's not fun anymore and you're deluding yourself if you continue to claim it is.

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Did you even read what you quoted, or just the first line? Because if you read the whole thing, you'd understand your post is completely meaningless.

I have absolutely no qualms with people playing alongside whomever they want. They can form their own rules, their own guidelines. However, often times I've seen these same experienced players outright belittling players because 'they're not good enough'. Some to the point where it becomes borderline harassment. This attitude doesn't help anyone and simply puts new players off attempting the content in case they're considered 'not good enough' by the next elite player that comes along.

The problem here is that it's THESE players which are giving the term 'elite' a bad reputation. They're the sole reason people consider elitism 'a bad thing' and 'toxic' for the community. Your post is almost an example of these issues itself, which really isn't helping matters. Being good is fine, being boastful and unpleasant to those you deem less skilled is not.

There's a difference between constructive criticism and telling someone they suck.

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Originally Posted by Purrfectstorm

I won't deny that. But look how long my post was just using broad strokes. Would any of you read a book on elitism if I wrote it? (I would paint a more complete picture, I promise!)

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As an editor, I'd advise against using the term "elitist" as it doesn't contain the right connotations.
Also, you'd need to address arguments: mainly, how do you respond to day 1 content? If you expect people to watch videos, how about people who don't even know they exist? How about people who don't learn except by doing?
Also, you mention that you practice. OK. So I'd assume you use the PF? Or the DF? By your own expectations, since you're practicing, if you ran into yourself, would you leave yourself behind because you don't know the fight? At what point would you leave yourself behind?
Do you expect people who want to practice content to form a PF each time? There's about 2 dozen fights in this game with mechanics. How do you practice for each one?
You mentioned titan...titan is one of the worst fights for newbies not only because of how it punishes failure to respond to mechanics, but also because if you DO fail and end up at the bottom of that chasm, you can't see the rest of the fight. Even Leviathan lets you see the fight if you've fallen off...

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

However not watching a guide is not the sign of a bad/weak player. To some players the challenge of learning a new fight is more fun then beating it. And often times those players have learned to quickly adapt to new situations and formulate tactics on the fly. This is is skill that is not easily gained and is even harder to obtain if all you ever do is watch/read guides.

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I enjoy jumping into a new fight too. The thing is, jumping into a farm run or a clear run with no knowledge of the mechanics is completely disregarding the other seven people in the party. It happens all too often. Seven people are going in there to clear it. One person is going in there to learn it. The ultimate point of learning is a clear, of course, but if you're out for the experience of going in blind, jumping into a party with seven experienced people isn't the way to go anyway. If someone enjoys jumping in without a guide, more power to them - but they'll need to be joining or making learning parties and not disrupting the gameplay of people that are out for quick, painless clears.

I agree that it doesn't make you bad or weak, but it does make you awfully rude in some situations.

Last weekend I try to clear my t9 and ask some of my friends to follow me, everyone give a silence answer because I said I never go there before and this is my first time. I try ask some friends from my ls and one this nice player willing follow me to t9.

We q DF in there I'm just following what she's doing and stand but we still wipe because I screw up and they kick me.
She said it's OK we try again until u know the meteor and Golem mechanic, after 5 DF I ask her to stop and rest because I feel bad to her.

In the next day I DF alone trying to learn step by step, even after I watch more than 5 time MTQ and Mr.Happy video it still did not help me much because the strategy in Jap server is different from the video. But I'm lucky because in Japan after 15 min if our progress look pointless they will vote for abandon, so no drama at all I only do t9 on that saturday.

I'm able to clear t9 at sunday morning after 2nd DF swiftly without a single wipe feel proud about it.
Tonight I'm planning to do t11, I've just clear t10 last monday with 1 try only hahahahaha, compared with t9 t10 was nothing.

I'm totally thankful to her for giving some hope to try.

I'm planning to beat all coil before new expansion and aiming to be the one of the first player clear new expansion raid. I've been playing this game about 3 month already casually.

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Originally Posted by kyuven

As an editor, I'd advise against using the term "elitist" as it doesn't contain the right connotations.
Also, you'd need to address arguments: mainly, how do you respond to day 1 content? If you expect people to watch videos, how about people who don't even know they exist? How about people who don't learn except by doing?
Also, you mention that you practice. OK. So I'd assume you use the PF? Or the DF? By your own expectations, since you're practicing, if you ran into yourself, would you leave yourself behind because you don't know the fight? At what point would you leave yourself behind?
Do you expect people who want to practice content to form a PF each time? There's about 2 dozen fights in this game with mechanics. How do you practice for each one?
You mentioned titan...titan is one of the worst fights for newbies not only because of how it punishes failure to respond to mechanics, but also because if you DO fail and end up at the bottom of that chasm, you can't see the rest of the fight. Even Leviathan lets you see the fight if you've fallen off...

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Elitism does carry negative connotations which is why something like "I've decided to become an elitist" makes such a great hook.

How do I respond to Day 1 content? I usually run it with FC or create a PF "Learning group, expect wipes, please be patient."

I only expect people to watch videos for difficult content (primarily EX primals and Coil). I would not expect them to watch a video in DF (although I'd certainly hope they would); I don't expect much out of DF at all. I can honestly say I've never met anyone who didn't know the community was using Youtube video guides to learn fights. In my FC, we get new players who ask about a fight. "Is Garuda EX much different than Garuda HM?" for example. They are usually advised that it is a lot different and that watching a guide might be helpful. That being said, I wouldn't be rude to someone who didn't know video guides existed or didn't realize right away what a really, really good idea it is to watch them first. As for learning by doing, I myself am that type of player, but I still find it somewhat helpful to know basic things like "Don't kill spiny" and "Don't place meteors too close together"

As for how I practice - generally I make learning groups in PF and/or ask FC members if they'd like to join. Friends are generally more patient of others learning content. It's unrealistic to expect this kind of patience from complete strangers (although I think it would be really, really nice to live in that world). At what point would I leave myself behind? When I see that I'm not up to the task at that moment. I've bowed out of a lot of groups because I was lagging, because I needed to re-watch a video, or I was just overtired. I don't expect people to form PF every time they want to learn something. Hopefully, the player base understands that most people are going to be new immediately following the release of additional content. For content that has both been out a while and is expected to be reasonably difficult (i.e. something with the word "extreme" in the title) I would definitely expect people to practice it the best they can with PF or even with DF. However, in the latter case, the new player should understand that DF is a complete crapshoot and they're likely to meet with some impatience. I'm not suggesting that they not DF it by any means. They'll just have to hang in there through the votekicks and disbanded parties. Hopefully, they'll understand that players don't owe them that learning time.

Titan is a terrible fight for newbies. I agree. It's really fun when you get the hang of it and fun is why we play the game but I hope SE will design fights a little differently in the future (few, if any, mechanics that completely remove people from battle). On the other hand, one shouldn't expect "Extreme" whatever to be newbie friendly.

I can't blame people for getting frustrated with our community at times. I used to abhor the word elitist, but I've seen all types in this game. I've found I just want to enjoy my time on here as much as possible and although I don't care for the elitist attitude I've found in the if u f up, I'll kick u...and no noobiez plz! pf's, I'm really tired of getting in "farms" that are clearly intended carries where one player lays dead the whole time from not knowing mechanics going "wtf?" I don't mind helping and teaching new people, but it's complete bs to not want to learn the fight and wait for people to carry you. Nothing rubs me the wrong way in gameplay more than people wasting my time. Sometimes I dont blame people for wanting to come across the nasty way they do on here. I don't think it's elitist at all to not want your time wasted.

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Originally Posted by nuyu11

Last weekend I try to clear my t9 and ask some of my friends to follow me...

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I love your story. You stuck in there through the frustration and gave yourself the best chance to win. It doesn't sound like you are blaming anyone for not wanting to help you learn. You took responsibility for your own learning. As a result, you had more control over clearing T9 and you did. Congratulations on your clears. Good luck to you in Heavensward!

Well what can I say except for some "obvious" things. The toxic community is there due to players disrespect to each other. And that's basically it.

Now to address it and people who "want to learn by doing" in more detail:
Content can be basically separated into
1. Easy or noob one - that is all Heists and Dungeons up to Brayflox Longstop (normal of course).
2. Normal or mainstream or casual
3. Hardcore - EX and MAYBE a bit of some normal Primals and Coils starting from T5.

Of course every piece of content have basically this progression:
Learning -> Practice -> Farm
Learning is basically only learning your role and base principles of game or learning some harder content "by doing"
Where Practice starts from knowing your role to a decent extent and knowing what to do, meaning - at least watching guide

Here in our imaginary world we sincerely believe that all content in DF in terms of progression should be treated as such:

Easy = Learning+
Brayflox = Awakening
Mainstream = Practice+

Meaning - in all easy content in DF noobs should be expected and treated with understanding, respectful guidance and advises.
In Brayflox they should be awoken to tough reality which is - all further mainstream content must be treated as being in Practice mode UNLESS they form a Learning party in Party Finder. Otherwise they basically "asking for it", because Brayflox must have tough them that by going there in Learning mode with random people (which is DF) is not very nice. You basically say - "I don't care about you guys but dying is fun / I wanna learn it by doing it etc. - get over it. BUT you guys should still treat me nicely".

The only really troublesome area is multi-party raids which is CT / ST / WoD, because making learning party for that is really troublesome.

Unless something like this is not followed people will continue to find community toxic. Because... REASONS!

For me it's all about mindset. With the way players whine about coil in these forums, I'd rather try to down content with someone who has 3 fingers total but genuinely tries his best without whining instead of those people (people claiming "i'm already good! it's the content's fault!" truly disgusts me). I'd rather try to help the 3 fingered player with setting up his control setups that makes sense for him than practicing with the latter while hearing/reading their whining.

Unfortunately, with how rampant these should-be-playing-second-life-instead players are, I end up setting my expectations for anyone that has zero coil gear very low. Like 2/10 low. Seems unfair but they always seem to meet that expectation easily and sometimes surpass it into the minus territory.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

These are the ones who have party flags which ridiculously high ilvl requirements (despite the content requiring much lower) and list comments like "screw up, get kicked",

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Not really. In my expierience, people that open these types of PF recruitements are looking for a carry and screw up their own.

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Originally Posted by Gardes

For me it's all about mindset. With the way players whine about coil in these forums, I'd rather try to down content with someone who has 3 fingers total but genuinely tries his best without whining instead of those people (people claiming "i'm already good! it's the content's fault!" truly disgusts me). I'd rather try to help the 3 fingered player with setting up his control setups that makes sense for him than practicing with the latter while hearing/reading their whining.

Unfortunately, with how rampant these should-be-playing-second-life-instead players are, I end up setting my expectations for anyone that has zero coil gear very low. Like 2/10 low. Seems unfair but they always seem to meet that expectation easily and sometimes surpass it into the minus territory.

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You make a really good point about the whining. Too many players, instead of focusing on learning, try to prove to others and themselves that they are really as good as they think they are. Then it can be really hard to accept that they might have made a mistake because it feels like admitting that they aren't as good as they think they are. So the whole cognitive dissonance thing kicks in where they start assigning blame (at other players, at the content, etc.) because the fact they need to improve is too hard to face. And the thing is, as long as people have this attitude, they don't improve.

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Originally Posted by Purrfectstorm

I love your story. You stuck in there through the frustration and gave yourself the best chance to win. It doesn't sound like you are blaming anyone for not wanting to help you learn. You took responsibility for your own learning. As a result, you had more control over clearing T9 and you did. Congratulations on your clears. Good luck to you in Heavensward!

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Actually I just ignore this coil content honestly, but my friend encourage to do it.
She said go show it to those who picky about their partner(prefer experienced player only) that you can do that content by DF alone.

It may be a long post but it does show an amazing point of view form the other side. I only hope he's not attacked for no reason.

http://33.media.tumblr.com/0aaca9819...s9wso5_400.gif

I agree with OP. RAISE A GLASS WITH ME!

The "elitist" mindset settles in pretty deep late in an expansion's lifespan (or late in the core game's life in this case).

It's part of what made me hesitant to jump into this game after being in WoW for almost a decade. Luckily, I've made some friends who are happy to help a scrubby newb like me learn the game.

To people who might turn new players away from content they are geared for: Give us a chance, you never know when you might be pleasantly surprised. New means inexperienced but inexperienced is not the same as bad.

I understand the feeling, and, I won't lie, I became a bit way too much elitist, perhaps. So much that, roleplaying my previous character (She was kind hearted and noob-lover) was starting to become challenging, perhaps too much, ended making, at least, an elitist lala bastard... A bit exaggerated funny lala, but stills fine.

The thing is, yep, that 'downtime' exists for us, especially when we know the strat too much... My first 4-5 T13 I was just like "OH god, I don't understand it at all" (Side note: I hate to see videos, so I just read the strat people tells me, then analyze situation, then get experience. ). For putting it worse, I think t13 as MNK first timing is not that easy, and if you drive out trying to put positionals at time you'll mess it up...

Yesterday I went with BLM, (Supreme ease in my opinion) and after doing it sooo many times that it becomes bored, It's like I can anticipate to everything, I just need to cast and cast, and when gettng a good proc, preparing my next position and moving at that time. So I addapt... After Earth Shake I just cast and cast, and when having a proc I use that chance for moving away, colocating myself for next megaflare... After megaflare I do the same, colocating again closer to the party...

All the damn t13 with BLM is so easy!... Just cast, colocate yourself, oh, look a lot of adds, quelling strikes, raging strikes, potion, double flare...

I'll have to try DF and go healer first time, want new challenges!...


Now, about my already said boredom in that matter, My character (and, myself too, a little) gets VERY TIRED of pugs and randoms in duty finder and all those who also doesn't learn despite they go infinite times there... And she has her own reasons for that, because she sees how easy it is and can't understand why the rest whine so much saying it's hard.

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Originally Posted by Ayuhra

To people who might turn new players away from content they are geared for: Give us a chance, you never know when you might be pleasantly surprised. New means inexperienced but inexperienced is not the same as bad.

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I think they're not as good as they think, some of them have over a 100 tries to complete it with 24/7 play time.

This is why it's good to have a static clearing endgame content. A sidenote: the noobs can watch Mr. Happy's or MTQCapture's Xeno's Raidguides before engaging into endgame content. Sometimes people lag but how hard can it be to press a button at the right time?

Well, it needs be considered that some people wants experience the game by themselves, not by Mr Happy.

But (and it is a big but, I love them too), what is the difference between go in a duty blind and ask directions there, and read a guide first?

If people want experience a duty firsthand, they needs be honest with themselves. They need really learn a duty with no help.

Even the simpliest question "something I need to know here?" makes you better have read a guide beforehand, because you are asking a guide to the party in stead. Save your and party member's time, reading it before, that guide will be surely more well explained than a few chat lines. Your willing to experience things firsthand will unfortunately crash the very moment you ask for directions. Don't ask them, or read a guide first.

I'm aware of how will be good being able to overcome and understand a duty by yourself, it is something really few players can feel today. But it needs to face the hard reality that your duty is in game months now, and your play style will collide with the majority of players you will meet on DF.

The best thing to really experience the great feel to be able overcome a duty with your head (and not Mr Happy or someone's else one), is you will make a group of people alike your mind. Make it a FC, or a LS, but try to get together. You all will experience so much more fun than trying to make your game on the average PUG you get on DF.

I'm not an elitist, I'm just better than everyone else.

Get on my level.

Lalaru on the side note: you are from Lich - I had an alt there and when I went into Duty finder I met people who were unable to communicate in English and messed up simple mechanics: how do you deal with those types of people? If you wipe a few times and you don't know how to communicate in their language, don't you just have the urge to leave as it's pointless to explain how the mechanics work?

@Jah, um u just know how to press buttons - that accomplishment... LOL

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Originally Posted by Jamein

I'm not an elitist, I'm just better than everyone else.

Get on my level.

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Why bother getting good and equal with other players when you can whine until the others get brought down to your level? Seems to work every time.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

I'm not an elitist, I'm just better than everyone else.

Get on my level.

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Agreed, everybody is bad except me.... real loner...

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

Lalaru on the side note: you are from Lich - I had an alt there and when I went into Duty finder I met people who were unable to communicate in English and messed up simple mechanics: how do you deal with those types of people? If you wipe a few times and you don't know how to communicate in their language, don't you just have the urge to leave as it's pointless to explain how the mechanics work?

@Jah, um u just know how to press buttons - that accomplishment... LOL

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People unable to communicate in English?!... OH NO!... Now I'll have nightmares remembering my worse t11 ever made... It was a premade of 7 Frenchs and... They just seemed to ignore me for not being French or NONE of them understood me... Sigh, they didn't even accept my advise, the simplest one I could give them of "WAR -> Sphere (Weapons node)" PLD -> Cube (Gravity node)"
"Storm's path (Using autotranslate) needs to be applied to sphere, OP damage. PLD needs to use fight or flight for aggroing cube"

No, they just went like they wanted all the time. At the end I was thinking about ragequitting, but they finished kicking me before that, thanks god, the unique good thing they did.

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

Lalaru on the side note: you are from Lich - I had an alt there and when I went into Duty finder I met people who were unable to communicate in English and messed up simple mechanics: how do you deal with those types of people? If you wipe a few times and you don't know how to communicate in their language, don't you just have the urge to leave as it's pointless to explain how the mechanics work?

@Jah, um u just know how to press buttons - that accomplishment... LOL

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That's why in Masamune we vote abandon if no progression after 15 mins. I'm Gaijin among them, how to communicate?