SUGGESTIONS - OFFICIAL ARMORY/PHYSICAL LEVEL THREAD

Good day everyone!


After seeing countless of different threads all discussing the same topics over and over i decided it would be a better idea to have it all in one place. More replies, more views and that will sure get SE's attention.

But that is not all there is to it. After reading all the other posts talking about the armory system and about the removal or keeping of the physical levels... it's hard not to notice that everyone has their own views on how to change these and don't agree with one another.

So i'm not here to suggest a new system that will please all of you but rather ask for all of your help to come up with one that will make 80-90% of us happy.

I want us to work together, take this game's future in our hands and make our voices heard. Forget having SE experiment again with a system that will piss off the majority of us and let's come up with our own. A good, stable and above all fun system that we can all agree upon and that we know we will enjoy having.


So this is how we do it....

You all give suggestion on what to do with these system, do we keep it the way it is? Do we improve it by adding/changing this or that? Do we completely replace it with something else? You get the idea...

Based on all your replies, i will come to edit this post as you make your voices heard and little by little we will all come to something that the majority of us will agree upon. And then what? Well...we will discuss it some more! We will perfect it and hopefully this will become one of the top 5 threads and for sure will get SE's attention.

Physical Levels:

i want your opinion on this, should we keep them or remove them? Don't just say yes or no... be specific about why you chose your answer. If you want to keep it, specify if you want it to remain untouched or modified and if how will it be modified?

If you like someone's idea... reply to his post by quoting his post and say you second that idea.

If you disagree with someone's idea, be constructive about it. Don't just say "your idea is stupid i don't like it". Say why you don't like it and what would be better and why?

Armory system/advanced jobs/talent trees:

There's 3 things in there but they pretty much all work together and depend on each other so lets discuss it as one system.

How would you change the armory system or would you leave it the way it is? How would advanced jobs(Or classic job names as SE call it for now...) fit into it? Are you for class specialization(AKA talent trees)? Or do you have another take on the idea....


Some guidelines:

-Don't post if you don't have anything useful to add to this thread.
-We don't need negative comments, trolling etc... whatever you want to call it.
-If you don't agree with the thread then go look somewhere else.
-Be constructive in your replies if you don't agree with someone else.
-Be specific when you give an idea or when you say that you want a system more then the other.
- try to post in BLUE your support for someone's post/idea and in RED when you disagree. Post with normal black color for when just making a regular post and not just replying to someone's idea.


[SIZE="5"]***EDIT***[/SIZE]

Allright.... the first suggestion is to have a FF Tactics(PS1) type system.

Pretty much it is similar to the current Armory system but cross/class abilities are restricted.

As in the example Kaedan gave:

"You could learn skills from any Job you leveled up. HOWEVER, only certain skills could be equipped on your current class. For example... Cure could be equipped on any Class, but Cure II+ could only be equipped on "Mage" classes or perhaps Gladiator to make a "Paladin-esque" character.

EDIT#2
Physical levels should definitely go. It is the opinion of the majority of players... but should we just remove it and forget it ever existed or should it be replaced with something better?

There is a lot of debate regarding the Armory system. Some like it the way it is... others want it changed. I'd say it is almost split in the middle. Should we then keep the basics/ the essence of the armory system in place but modified to please the others who don't like it? Any idea how we can make happy those who want it to stay the way it is while giving something to those who believes it breaks the game in its current state?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...t-Jobs-dev1033 needs to be required reading.

I just posted this in another thread, but it would probably work well here too:

What if it was changed to something like Tactics?

In Tactics, you could learn skills from any Job you leveled up. HOWEVER, only certain skills could be equipped on your current class (with the exception of Squire maybe?). For example... Cure could be equipped on any Class, but Cure II+ could only be equipped on "Mage" classes or perhaps Gladiator to make a "Paladin-esque" character.

What do you guys think about that?

My personal opinion is keep Physicals levels. It's part of what makes FFXIV unique and interesting. Scrapping it and reverting to a pigeon-holed class system would be taking a step back.

Might wanna tag it with the correct [devxxx] number if you're going to make this the *official* thread.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...t-Jobs-dev1033 needs to be required reading.

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And no, no it doesn't. Which is why it's dropped off the first page already when there are other ideas circulating.

The question I have for everyone is ...

What does Physical Level actually DO in the game? What in-game mechanics does gaining a physical level accomplish?

As far as I can tell the only thing that physical level actually affects is when and how many bonus attribute points you get for your character's stats. And IF character stat allotment is going to go away (like many players want it to), what purpose would physical level serve at that point?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sorel

The question I have for everyone is ...

What does Physical Level actually DO in the game? What in-game mechanics does gaining a physical level accomplish?

As far as I can tell the only thing that physical level actually affects is when and how many bonus attribute points you get for your character's stats. And IF character stat allotment is going to go away (like many players want it to), what purpose would physical level serve at that point?

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I agree with you. Many people do want to get rid of the physical system. I get what they tried to do with by giving you the option to put your stat points where you want to but in a game where you can change jobs on the fly and having each job needing it's own specific points it just doesn't fit well. Also you add the fact that you can only reallocate a certain number of points at one time makes it even worst when changing jobs.

They could let you reallocate all the points whenever changing class... maybe add some kind of restriction too to make sure it is not abused. Like the first time you reallocate for a job it will cost you a certain amount of Gil... then 2nd time the amount doubles and so on.... or have a cooldown or something like it has now but longer as it will let you reallocate all the points.

This could make physical levels better but not that much more useful.... you could have per class stat points allocation and that would eliminate the need for physical levels.

To all those reading this and thinking about starting their own thread about these same subjects,

Remember that it is pointless to have 20 threads discussing the same thing.

I understand that you want people to see/read about your opinion and feel that if you just post on one of these threads that have already started, people will just skip over it as not everyone will read through 20 pages of comments.

That is why i took a different approach in this thread. Every post matters and your opinion will be added to the main/1st post or removed if the majority disagree with it.... I'm reading every single post and will get all your input to edit the main post and then come up with one system that will try to please most of you.... not everyone will be happy with it as it is impossible to please everyone but if the majority (70%+) is happy, then it is a good way to go.

bump this up please

So it looks like before we can discard Physical Levels, we first have to find a method of character stat progression without it.

How do we go about doing that?

How does anyone feel about this...

Let's keep Physical levels,
removing the manual stat points allotment and make it automatic.
Remove Class ranks and replace with Weapon skills/levels. You would level the type of weapon you use(ex. your level/skill with stave, not just one specific staff). Mages would use stave, scepters, wands etc.... each giving you different abilities as you level them. They would also contribute to stats.... example staff would give your class more INT then other weapons etc as you level them...
also you will gain EXP and points to spend in a talent tree like system to will let you chose if your gladiator will go the path of a paladin or a dark knight....

I understand this will restrict cross/class abilities a lot but i believe we need some restriction to make each class more unique.
Sounds interesting to anyone else?

Copied from another thread:
First of all I have to say I love the armory syste, being able to fully customize your own character is a great thing, but honestly I think the current system gives the player too much freedom.

For exemple, all of the DD want all of the buffs of every class and they can have them working perfectly fine. This is wrong in 2 points:
1- I'm forced to play not one, but many classes I don't like just for one skill.
2- Every DD ends up with the same strategy, with the same build and using the same skills.

I guess the main issue is that we can equip almost everything we want. Increasing the amount of action points to equip a skill of another class we won't be able anymore to equip everything we like, we'll have to think wisely and chose what it's worth to get and what is not.

Even better, the amount of action points needed should be different from class to class, in example, Lancers amongst the meele are the ones with more MP and more buffing skills so they should spend less ap then the other DoW when equiping a DoM skill; Marauders are be able to tank like Gladiators, so when equiping Glad's skills they should spend less ap then Archers and Lancers.

About spells, I think the issue can be addressed with a better affinity system too. Right now DoM spells performed by DoW are weaker, but still worth to be done, especially when playing solo. IMHO they should enhance the affinity system making it worthless to cast a spell by a DoW class IF they have not certain requirements (affinity+ traits, affinity+ equips, ect).

This + different affinity based on class, not on disciple, would help a lot in the class uniqueness issue, yet would keep the system open to customization.

Plus I think that the ability to cross class shouldn't be applied to WS. Like how is it possible that I can use Arrow Helix with my lancer? o.O I know this would mean getting rid of the cross class regimen, but honestly they aren't that worth ^^'


Something about Physical Level:

At first I thought it was awesome, PL + Armory made me think about something like Guild Wars, where you can drastically change your character role, but it end up in nothing like that.

I think the main issue is that stats aren't really doing much, for instance you can be a good healer even with 50 mind, they should make stats more effective.

Plus they have to find a way to make it easy to switch your stat build, I guess the converter traits where meant for this purpose, but they fail in 2 points:
1- they don't convert enaugh stats, you still have to reallocate many times.
2- they don't suffer the rank's cap, so they are used to increase a stat power rather then balance them all.

Onidemon, I understand what you are saying. I do not agree with everything you suggested though.

Automatic stat point allotment would make every naked (nothing equipped) Conjurer statistically identical to every other naked Conjurer. It makes things easier for bookkeeping, but characters will lose some the RPG aspect of playing the game.

Removing Class Ranks and replacing it with weaponskill levels, then allowing classes to use more than one weapon essentially eliminates the Armory System. Going down that road would require significantly more development work than keeping the Armory System and building on top of it.

Using a talent tree to specialize Classes into Jobs is one of the things the dev team is considering. However, it does make it much harder for players to come up with unique character builds, as well as mix and match abilities for a particular style of play.

So, unfortunately, I do not believe what you described is the way for SE to proceed. As a result, I do not have anything more positive to say on it. I apologize.

Personally Physical level is fairly easy to obtain and doesnt have a main purpose right now. Most of the traits such as Dex, Str, Int, Pie dont have much of an effect. I would be for either completely fixing the current system and make caps for each class this way there is a little bit more job uniqueness with the addition of being able to set up how you want your points allocated saved automatically for each job class, or completely wipe out that system and bring in more of a system that FFXI used. This way it will still benefit the players that are more dedicated and job classes will get more of a specialized niche.

And to help ease the feeling of losing progress if the current system is scrapped and a new system for example like FFXI was in place. If SE allowed everyone to be capped on all attributes for your rank, would that change your minds. We all know that one day the top rank from 50 to whatever will increase and basically if you have a rank 50 job already most likely you will also have capped out your physical level. So it would be more like a swap from one system to another. Nothing was lost and you only have more to gain in the process.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alcide

Copied from another thread:
First of all I have to say I love the armory syste, being able to fully customize your own character is a great thing, but honestly I think the current system gives the player too much freedom.

For exemple, all of the DD want all of the buffs of every class and they can have them working perfectly fine. This is wrong in 2 points:
1- I'm forced to play not one, but many classes I don't like just for one skill.
2- Every DD ends up with the same strategy, with the same build and using the same skills.

I guess the main issue is that we can equip almost everything we want. Increasing the amount of action points to equip a skill of another class we won't be able anymore to equip everything we like, we'll have to think wisely and chose what it's worth to get and what is not.

Even better, the amount of action points needed should be different from class to class, in example, Lancers amongst the meele are the ones with more MP and more buffing skills so they should spend less ap then the other DoW when equiping a DoM skill; Marauders are be able to tank like Gladiators, so when equiping Glad's skills they should spend less ap then Archers and Lancers.

About spells, I think the issue can be addressed with a better affinity system too. Right now DoM spells performed by DoW are weaker, but still worth to be done, especially when playing solo. IMHO they should enhance the affinity system making it worthless to cast a spell by a DoW class IF they have not certain requirements (affinity+ traits, affinity+ equips, ect).

This + different affinity based on class, not on disciple, would help a lot in the class uniqueness issue, yet would keep the system open to customization.

Plus I think that the ability to cross class shouldn't be applied to WS. Like how is it possible that I can use Arrow Helix with my lancer? o.O I know this would mean getting rid of the cross class regimen, but honestly they aren't that worth ^^'


Something about Physical Level:

At first I thought it was awesome, PL + Armory made me think about something like Guild Wars, where you can drastically change your character role, but it end up in nothing like that.

I think the main issue is that stats aren't really doing much, for instance you can be a good healer even with 50 mind, they should make stats more effective.

Plus they have to find a way to make it easy to switch your stat build, I guess the converter traits where meant for this purpose, but they fail in 2 points:
1- they don't convert enaugh stats, you still have to reallocate many times.
2- they don't suffer the rank's cap, so they are used to increase a stat power rather then balance them all.

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It is an interesting idea and i think it shows that we all agree on one point and it's that the free for all cross/class abilities is broken and needs some restriction.

Restricting the amount of points per class would be one way but that would make other complain as per why their class can't use as many abilities and that it is not fair. It would also still give room for abuse to the system and pushing people to all use the same abilities no matter what class.

But having abilities restricted to your class or class type sounds very good. It is true that it makes no sense for a gladiator to be able to use ranged abilities? Or a Gladiator using ICE/Fire/WIND etc spells? even if useful it makes no sense unless that gladiator is somehow speced to be a dark knight.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sorel

Onidemon, I understand what you are saying. I do not agree with everything you suggested though.

Automatic stat point allotment would make every naked (nothing equipped) Conjurer statistically identical to every other naked Conjurer. It makes things easier for bookkeeping, but characters will lose some the RPG aspect of playing the game.

Removing Class Ranks and replacing it with weaponskill levels, then allowing classes to use more than one weapon essentially eliminates the Armory System. Going down that road would require significantly more development work than keeping the Armory System and building on top of it.

Using a talent tree to specialize Classes into Jobs is one of the things the dev team is considering. However, it does make it much harder for players to come up with unique character builds, as well as mix and match abilities for a particular style of play.

So, unfortunately, I do not believe what you described is the way for SE to proceed. As a result, I do not have anything more positive to say on it. I apologize.

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It all made sens in my head at the moment i was writing it but not so much anymore. Thanks for the feedback! :)

There should be a UI available to choose 1-3 classes to pick abilities from. The combination of classes chosen should alter your class name as well, for example: Gladiator + Conjurer yields Paladin.

Also there should be a dagger/knife-specific class. No thief or rogue-like class seems strange.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AuronYevon

Personally Physical level is fairly easy to obtain and doesnt have a main purpose right now. Most of the traits such as Dex, Str, Int, Pie dont have much of an effect. I would be for either completely fixing the current system and make caps for each class this way there is a little bit more job uniqueness with the addition of being able to set up how you want your points allocated saved automatically for each job class, or completely wipe out that system and bring in more of a system that FFXI used. This way it will still benefit the players that are more dedicated and job classes will get more of a specialized niche.

And to help ease the feeling of losing progress if the current system is scrapped and a new system for example like FFXI was in place. If SE allowed everyone to be capped on all attributes for your rank, would that change your minds. We all know that one day the top rank from 50 to whatever will increase and basically if you have a rank 50 job already most likely you will also have capped out your physical level. So it would be more like a swap from one system to another. Nothing was lost and you only have more to gain in the process.

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While true that stats don't have much of an effect right now, Yoshi-p did state in a recent intreview, with ffxivcore i believe that the calculation for stats are currently being redone from scratch. So when that is done, stat will influence a lot your class.

While true there is some ways to make PL better.... is there any way to make it needed? Not just make it more useful but indispensable. Just the fact that points allocation can only be partially reassigned and then again after some times has passed, it comes in direct conflict with the purpose of this system which is to make leveling multiple classes easier.

I mean if we don't find a way to make the PL needed and become a system that greatly influences our experience with the game, it just become dead weight and should be done away with.


I'm not sure about which FF XI system you are talking... i only played during the first 6 months of it's NA release... But do keep in mind that SE does want FF XIV to stay away from FF XI as they do not want this to turn into FF XI-2. They want to be able to keep both FF XIV and FF XI at the same time and provide 2 different experiences in each of them.. that won't happen if they become too similar.

I think this topic is pointless for the majority has already spoken and most people around the word would like to get rid of the physical level system(Poll Results). Unless the other 3 forums create a similar topic and create massive uproar will the poll results be countered(which i doubt). That will also just show people are clueless about what they want. Your idea also reminds me of FFXI system which was very stupid because i get a bunch of weapons i can use but only one is worth using. Weapon skill levels is a outdated way of going by things.

Physical level :
Scrap it.

Amory System:
Leave it as is, it works great. You can develop your own character with your own play style.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Akumu

I think this topic is pointless for the majority has already spoken and most people around the word would like to get rid of the physical level system(Poll Results). Unless the other 3 forums create a similar topic and create massive uproar will the poll results be countered(which i doubt). That will also just show people are clueless about what they want. Your idea also reminds me of FFXI system which was very stupid because i get a bunch of weapons i can use but only one is worth using. Weapon skill levels is a outdated way of going by things.

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This is exactly the pointless comments i was asking pple from refraining to post. You don't like the idea of this thread? Then please go look at the hundred of threads there is out there and maybe you will find something that interest you. And maybe then you will be able to post comments that are constructive and not just plain negative.

The current system is nice but need a lot of work to make it better. i have thought about it and i came up with an interesting concept. i built it upon the current system and what the devs said they want to do( specifically reverting the class names to "classic FF names").

the first thing is the physical lvl. it serves no point at the moment. to fix this i think adding a PL requirement to weps, this would be the recommended lvl alredy on the wep or 10 lvls below it, the devs have said they are thinking of doing this XD. another thing is making attribute points work proper, And finaly at PL 50 there is an unlock quest, this quest should unlock the other classes "unlock" quests.

Instead of reverting the names of classes to the classic ones i think we should keep the ones we have now as a base class list. At lvl 30 for all the classes there will be a "unlock" quest (this quest unlocks the potential of the class)(lvl 50 PL quest required before you can do these quests) that allow you to progress into a more specialized class.
for example, doing the lvl 30 pug unlock quest will alow you to play as ether a monk or theif, this brings back the classic names without changing everything to do with puglist. another example of more advanced unlocking would be pally. too unlock you need to do the GLA and CONJ unlock quests and then a final you can do the Pally quest to play the pally.

And beyond the specialized classes you can go further. lvl 30 black mage unlock quest and the red mage unlock quest done you could then do a blue mage class quest
or maby White mage + Red mage to do the summoner quest

This adds tons more content to the game in the form of quests, many many quests, and different weapon and armor sets. and allot of story for each class and its development.


here would be a basic breakdown. it could get much much more complex
(spelling is bad sry)
GLA---> Knight
GLA+CONJ---> pally
GLA+THRG---> Dark knight
MRD---> 2handed sword/ax user( dont know the proper name)
Mrd+PUG--->corsair
Pug---->monk
Pug---->theif
Lancer--->Dragoon
Lancer+GLA----> fencer
Ranger--->archer
CONJ--->white mage
CONJ--->Black Mage
Conj---->Red mage
Thrg--->scholar
THRG--->Blood mage(thrg has blood magic seems like a natural transition)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

This is exactly the pointless comments i was asking pple from refraining to post. You don't like the idea of this thread? Then please go look at the hundred of threads there is out there and maybe you will find something that interest you. And maybe then you will be able to post comments that are constructive and not just plain negative.

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Being negative isn't what im trying to do but i understand your point. Why create a thread that will be pointless to help the game? The odds of them saying forget the polls and lets just follow what this one english forum thread is talking about is very...Far fetched... But ok im out of place so with this I leave.

If anyone has ever played FFV, my suggestion is to keep the armoury system and use your current physical level as the "Bare" job level. Bare would still be fully customizable in every way, but jobs would also be implemented that are not customizable. To make the other jobs worth having they will be stronger than Bare is at the beginning, but as with FFV when you master various jobs Bare will actually get hardwired stat bonuses. For instance reaching certain levels in the Paladin job would give Bare permanent defense increases.

In this way you would still have the armory system to use completely with Bare, but with the other jobs you would only be able to equip job specific weapons. That said, once you have ranked up in a weapon class that weapon class would remain ranked up. So the system would look like this:

Jobs Classes that get major bonuses
Bare Any
Warrior Any DoW
Monk Pugilist or a Stave Based Class
Thief A Dagger based class or Gladiator
Red Mage Gladiator, Conjurer, Thaumaturge, a dagger based class
White Mage Thaumaturge, Conjurer
Black Mage Thaumaturge, Conjurer
etc.

While some jobs may have a lesser amount of classes that they receive bonuses for, they would correspondingly be more specialized to those classes. Each job would have it's own skills/spells, and if they same spells were received from the class the job is in then that spell will receive a major potency increase (for instance a whitemage conjurer who is high enough in both job and class to have learned cure will have a much more potent cure.)

This is just an idea I had. While I doubt this is the system that will get implemented, it is still a cool idea. The great part about FFV was that once you mastered all of the jobs you could switch back to the Bare (jobless) job and create a custom character that had higher stats than any other job because of the bonuses. By adding traits like WHM and BLM to Bare and equipping powerful weapons you could essentially be a powerful caster with good gear. The potential for the same is present in this game, and I love it. No longer do warriors have to go without magic and mages have to go without armor. They may not be at full potential in either one, but a mage can still swing a weapon and a warrior can still throw a fireball. Imagine if summoner is added as well... You could go back to normal physical levels, make a balanced character, put some powerful summons in as abilities, add a few buffs and heals, then wear high def/vit armor and equip a bow to do damage from afar... The possibilities are endless.

Quote:

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After seeing countless of different threads all discussing the same topics over and over i decided it would be a better idea to have it all in one place.

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Pardon me, but who are you and why is it that you think you're the one who should decide how things are done here?

Physical Level - Remove It, Get rid of Point Allotments. Give each skill a Stat and Element it enhances if you have it equipped.

Armoury- Keep It As It Is. Rebalance the skills that are causing problems with people cross classing at high levels.

Job System- Implement it as a bit of a Title System. Each Job Title has 10 Levels. Each Odd Level (1,3,5,7,9) Grants a new Job Specific Skill. Each Even Level (2, 4, 6, 8, 10) Grants a Job Trait. Job Levels are granted by a Point System determined by using your Job in Party Based Events like Behest, Dungeons, Etc. A bit like Faction Points from Leve Quests.

Any Weapon, Any Job A bit like the Subjob system from FFXI, No Weapon Class is restricted from a Job. The Weapon instead alters how the player performs the skills of the Job. the Job Defines the Role, the Weapon Defines how its performed. A Paladin/Gladiator uses a sword and shield to bolster defense. A Paladin/Lancer uses damage dealt to maintain hate. A Paladin/Marauder can maintain the hate of multiple targets all at once. etc. Yes some options will be obviously inferior choices but this should be up to the player to decide not the game. Just like we did in XI with the subjobs.


Bonuses From Stats on Skills based on Jobs- Every Skill is granted a "Familiar" Job. "Cure is Familiar to White Mage, Red Mage, Paladin"'. When you have a skill equipped that is Familiar to your Job, you get double the stats and elemental alignment from the skills you have equipped. Some Skills have a Counter Job. Equipping Skills counter to your current Job remove or lower the stat bonuses from that skill. "Cure is countered by Black Mage, Dark Knight."
Some Jobs are Neutral and do not grant or remove bonuses from skills. "Cure is Neutral to Dragoon, Monk, Thief."

Area of Effect Modifier One of the skills learned by most mage jobs is using a Spell it is Familiar with in a AOE Capacity. Even if your Equipped Class is not a Magic User. "White Mage gets Brilliance. Casts Cure as an AOE from target." "Black Mage Gets Corruption. Casts fire as an AOE from Target."

I think physical level was supposed to serve the purpose of specializing your charachter, but they probably gave too much freedom.
rework how stat works, decrease or eliminate diminishing returns from stats, however.
Physical levels should have base stats maybe slightly different for each race, maybe not. for example
lvl 10 highlander

base stats

str 20
vit 22
dex 18
mind 18
int 17
pie 21

at 50

str 90
vit 98
dex 86
mind 82
int 84
pie 90

*the stats here are arbitrary, im just using them for example, they could also be overall lower, once again just an example.
now there would be some status points you could freely alot, so as to customize your charachter, say you have 20 to 30 skill points you could a lot freely. Id say you can completely reset your freely alotted points once per leve reset. the idea is, this is your base charachter growth, this is who you are, I'd make it permanent but i dont think most people would get behind that.

far as the armory system, i dont think anything is wrong with it at all, some skills may need to be exclusive, or have how well they work on sub reduced, but overall thats already in place, buffs buff for less, take longer to recast, cures are about half as effective but still cost the same on DoW, same with magic,
for class uniquness, i think most native weaponskills should have unique animations, by animation i mean how the charachters move, not just the special effect. The job system will further add uniquness with special traits, and skills, the also should continue to have certain discipline specific skills learned via quests, and guild marks.

So i suggest this model that follows to certain extend FF Tactics and FFXI

Tree of Skills, yes this may be seem on several other MMOs and many dont like them but.

We could have Tree Skills for each Job and for each Weapon.
Also make that the physical level and attribute allocations be worth something and share points used to get skills too
Since I pointed the basic idea ill do an somewhat detailed example using classes
Black Mage, Gladiator and Culinarian

So lets start with what kind of allocate system would we use. I say something like FFX
lets call them AP /not ability points Aetherite points/. You would need a certain amount of EXP to earn one or several points

With this lets say that we have access to basic classes/jobs those being the actual armory system and lets say the 6 basic jobs from FFXI

So lets start with the attributes section to maintain the balance of the game we should be allowed to add just a certain amount of points in general.
The actual threshold in the system work nice that after you add certain number you would need more points to increases the attribute

Lets go to a Black Mage now, we have all basic magic fire/water/stone/aero/thunder/blizzard, each magic should have a small attribute requirement for example all these basic magic should have something like 12 INT 5 MND basic requirement to obtain. Now each spell should have tiers like we have right now tier one should have the stat mod like 100% INT+ 100% Elemental attribute the next tier should increase the mod to 120% until certain cap.
Now to continue getting along the path lets say we want to learn Fira again certain requirements should be met on the attribute section but you would need Fire II in order to learn.
This can be done for all spells in all elemental families Blizzard/Blizzara/Blizzaga/Freeze
with the elemental DoT at a somewhat similar degree.
Job Traits should come along the same road but the requirements should be harder since they should add nice bonus. Job abilities too only after learning certain number of spells and some job traits you should be able to learn them and just like merits in FFXI and the tiers in the spells making them stronger or lower the recast in them.

Now lets talk about the actual classes we have.
Gladiator /Sword User or Practitioner/ That should be the actual introduction from the Japanese name but since our localization is odd like always it lead to a lot of mistakes.
So i will call it the Sword Skill Tree, in FFXI we had this and after certain levels of mastery we would get skills, I believe something along that path

Just Like Black Mage each skill should have certain requirements in the attribute area and that we could have certain Weapon Traits to learn in this case if we use a Sword after learning this Trait we should have the bonus only if we use a Sword and not if we use other kind of weapon. This should have some affinity to them too let say certain Weapon Traits Get additional effects or bonuses when you pair them with other Job Traits something similar to the Passive Traits you got mixing spells with Blue Mage.
So what jobs use Swords Warrior/Paladin/Blue Mage you can guess that sort of mix

Now for the crafting area Culinarian in this example.
You should add Ranks lets say this you learn Amateur this should have you learn some basic Class Traits just like those you learn with Guild Marks but on a more varied tone
You wanna learn to cook something from certain family of products you have to learn it and after each rank Amateur/Aprentice/Veteran/Craftman (for example) you get better tier of those Traits witch make you more proficient cooking that

Now many people would complete disagree to me since they would think all the work they done would be for nothing getting those 3-4 classes to 50. Well why not make all that SP into points to allocate how you see fit.

I Think this way they can add the new jobs /even advanced jobs/ without making us stick to a role allowing us to make our character however we want them to be. But Like we know being unique doesn't meant you are useful this could make us decided on certain roles and maybe making them stronger from other classes like how the armory system was intended to work. Also AP should be in a certain way available to obtain but each time you get the next would need more EXP making this something more goal-oriented leveling since we want to get AP to get new skills/abilities/traits to become stronger.

Also if you like the idea here presented but think it can be better please help me so!

or another fix would be to get rid of physical level and make points class based so you can still have the freedom to customize your stats how you want but changing from a DoW to DoM will be less of a pain and either have it so you can reallot all points or keep it as is and put a npc in where you pay a certian amount of gil to reallot all

Can someone translate this?

http://www.gmcg.net/ff14_bin/FF14_job_battle.pdf

I think it's a Japanese player's take on the job system, I found it on the Japanese forums.

[Class] [Effects of various status;
An indicator of whether or not fighting rearguard or avant-garde position
[Action]
What indicators are specialized or dependent on what weapons and skills
The rank and learning abilities of each (abolished or reduced rank error correction)
[Job]
Job action suit
The level of compensation and status of special abilities
Job-level and physical ※, the level set for each job
The base value is automatically allocated the remaining (10) allocated to the players
[weapons]
Amarishisutemu each job to become
- desire for battle
Reduction or elimination of the extreme difference in rank ① correction
Increase the impact of status ②
Reset the intensity of each monster ③
④ PT Status - The more you make a few corrections
(to leave a possible solo) but ※, PT is to add a bonus training.
⑤ PT time to reverse the high level of compensation higher than the low-level training.
Add each weapon ⑥
⑦ status review of the concept of
Elimination of the gauge action abolished or recast ⑧
Based on the implementation of auto attack ⑨, proper spacing attack
Change the main tool of tools Gyazara sub ⑩ (sub only take bait fisherman)
Reviewing the meaning of the various status ⑪


STR: Attack, AP volume
DEX: Accuracy, drop rate
VIT: Defense, HP
INT: Magic Attack, cast speed, magic weakness duration
MND: the amount recovered, enhanced strength, weak magic effects, ability to manipulate
PIE: Magic Accuracy, speed of attack

Oh crap, I didn't realize I could just copy and paste the text. lol