Concept: I was noticing that several of Archer's abilities aren't used very often and thought that would be a good place to start thinking about Ranger. Primarily Repelling Shot, Shadowbind and Swiftsong. The new ability Sten Needle will work with Repelling Shot to result in a quick burst of damage every 20s but must be used with care with monster mechanics and the increased backstep. With the addition of Camouflage we see new uses for Shadowbind as a damage source and crowd control. The new stance Take Aim grants the Ranger potential for great damage but at the cost of their mobility. As Archers and Bards are highly mobile and quick with their attacks I felt this would be a good contrast. Under Take Aim Bloodletter will turn into Animals, a classic ability from FFV. Using the same system that was put in place in FFV using the Draw Meter instead of a job level we can see the addition of some added damage or support depending on how the invisible dice roll. It will put the "RNG" in Ranger so to speak! I decided to keep Unicorn in the mix as well in order to help facilitate a bit of MP recovery in order to help maintain Swiftsong. Speaking of which, Swiftsong now becomes usable in battle for the RNG but only for personal use. I feel this is important to keep with this revised version of my idea in order to facilitate moving out of danger while having to be motionless for large amounts of time. With Musketeer and the new dagger class right around the corner I'm waiting on what abilities RNG will get from other classes.Quote:
Ranger: A ranged DPS which sacrifices its mobility for increased damage and calls upon animals for aid.
Abilities:
30: Take Aim: Bestows the Aim status effect. Increases accuracy by 10%, critical hit damage by 5% and auto-attack potency by 10. Use of certain Weapon Skills will activate the Draw Meter. As the Draw Meter fills your Weapon Skills will become more powerful. Using the Weapon Skill a second time or filling the Draw Meter to maximum strength will follow through with its attack. Ends upon re-use. (More information below)
35: Sten Needle: Rushes into the target to place a trap beneath them. Deals damage over time with a potency of 40 for 9s. After 9s the trap explodes to deal 120 potency damage. Recast: 20s.
40: Camouflage: Conceals the user (10s). Prevents auto-attacks and detection. Wears off if a damaging skill is used. Cannot be used if you have red or flashing enmity. While concealed Shadowbind will gain 180 potency. Its bind effect will be reduced to 5 seconds but it cannot be removed. MP drains while active. Recast: 90s.
45: Sonic Boom: Delivers an attack with a potency of 120 to target and enemies in a cone behind it. 25% chance Wide Volley will receive a 15 potency bonus. TP Cost: 200.
50: Rapid Fire: Your Draw Meter will charge 20% faster and will not drain while moving (15s). Recast: 300s.
Changes to Archer:
Repelling Shot: Will combo with Sten Needle. Combo bonus: Potency of 160 and backstep increased to 12y.
Quick Nock: Gives a 25% chance that Sonic Boom will stun targets (2s).
Swiftsong: While Take Aim is active it cannot effect others and is usable in battle but drains MP.
Bloodletter: With Take Aim active this changes into Animals: Your next attack which uses the Draw Meter will call upon a random animal for aid. The animal called will depend on the Draw Meter. Duration: 10s. Recast: 30s. (more information below)
Animals:
A number will be rolled from 0 to where your Draw Meter is filled to upon execution of your attack. For example if you fill your bar up to 35 and then attack a number will be rolled from 0-35. Windbite and Venomous Bite will continue to use the same mechanic. The Draw Meter will not enhance the potency of animal attacks. Only abilities which activate the Draw Meter will gain the aid of an animal.
0: Mysidian Rabbit: Rabbit in a Black Mage hat appears beside you but does not aid.
1: Squirrel: A Squirrel will attack your target with a potency of 100.
2-5: Bee Swarm: Bees will attack your target with a potency of 100. If Weapon Skill used is AoE this will hit all targets your attack hits.
6-10: Nightingale: A Bluebird will come and heal your HP for 10% of the damage inflicted by your attack. If Weapon Skill used is AoE this will heal party members within 5y of you as well.
11-20: Tree Squirrel: A Tree Squirrel will attack your target from the air and paralyze it for 5s.
21-30: Falcon : A Vulture will attack your target with a potency of 120.
31-40: Skunk: A skunk will attack your target inflicting Blind and Poison with a potency of 20 for 9s.
41-50: Wild Boar: A Wild Hog will attack your target with a potency of 150.
51-100: Unicorn: A Unicorn will heal your MP for 30% of the damage inflicted by your attack (respectively). If Weapon Skill used is AoE this will affect party members within 5y of you as well.
Take Aim:
The Draw Meter will fill from 0-100. Each point will increase the potency of your current skill by 3.5%. Damage over time potency is unaffected. The bar fills up in 5 seconds time. Any movement will drain the meter at twice its charge rate until movement has stopped (approximately. 2.5 seconds to drain a full meter). It is still possible to finish your attack before and during your running out of an AoE in the same manner that ARC/BRD can but keep in mind the animation for your attack will begin the moment you press it the 2nd time.
The following abilities will activate the Draw Meter:
Heavy Shot
Straight Shot
Venomous Bite
Misery's End
Quick Nock
Windbite
Wide Volley
Sonic Boom
It's been said that any new DPS coming from ARC would end up playing too similar to ARC/BRD so I'm hoping that this will give it enough of its own identity. The loss of Bloodletter as a direct attack should greatly help with this as well as its base recast time increased to 30s. Bloodletter, as Animals, now primarily focuses as a mechanic to keep the RNG's MP strong for Swiftsong with the chance of adding other support in lieu of replenishing MP (as it's not a mandatory resource).
Ranger Proposal
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06-04-2014, 09:16 PMMartaDemireuxRanger Proposal
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06-04-2014, 09:38 PMAeora
I like it! but Camo - I think that should be left to the Nin class (if it's coming at any point). Though the additional affects to shadow bind would give it much more of an active role in the ARC based rotation. Well thought out!
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06-05-2014, 12:14 AMKitruIt is not that it will play "just like" ARC. It's that it will be too similar to ARC/BRD in playstyle to really make it mean anything. Adding in positioning doesn't change the fundamental nature of ARC/BRD: you're still throwing up your 2 DoTs, maintaining Straight Shot, and spamming Heavy Shot in between (the only change you're adding is that you're replacing a couple Heavy Shots with a Sidewinder; in fact, because of the increase in potency, as long as it's not a fight where you're likely to run out of TP, Sidewinder would simply replace it).Quote:
Originally Posted by MartaDemireux
Also, you're ignoring the fact that BRD is explicitly balanced against the other DPS as a DPS. BRD does not have lower DPS because it has support capabilities (the balancing factor for the support is built into the support abilities themselves as well as the recognition that all classes/jobs are supposed to have some form of support/utility); it has lower DPS because it can run around while attacking at range. BRD suffers absolutely no movement penalties in any fights whatsoever because movement doesn't mean shit to them, and all you're doing to restrict their movement as your justification for dramatically increasing their DPS (Sidewinder itself is a 10% increase to damage; even if you ignored every other "positional", you're increasing the DPS of the class/job by a crapload) telling them to stand at a target's side at a distance that almost every BRD already stands in or around anyways.
Also, increasing accuracy on attacks means absolutely nothing. There's a reason that the acc bonus on Hawk's Eye is ignored by anyone and everyone: conditional changes to accuracy are worthless because everyone already builds themselves around getting enough accuracy to always hit (and, since a vast majority of a BRD/ARC's damage is derived from abilities that you are not having them increase the damage of, people would still be capping out accuracy).
In short, you're not really giving them their own identity. You're just cranking the living shit out of their damage to justify their presence in the face of the BRD (completely ignoring the fact that you'd be turning them into the de facto best DPS since they'd have better damage than BRD while simultaneously having virtually identical mobility) with incredibly lax "restrictions" on that increased DPS while having them maintain an effectively identical playstyle.
What you're suggesting is akin to making a new job for LNC that gets better damage than DRG and justifies it by giving Full Thrust an extra 50% potency when used from the flank. It would still play just like DRG. All you're doing is giving them a massive increase to DPS for doing something that they were already likely doing in the first place (and, if they weren't, it's so simple that it would take all of 5 minutes to never notice the requirement again). -
06-05-2014, 04:08 AMOmegaNovaios
Kitru is right, your concept is pretty balanced when compared to BRD itself but that is because BRD itself is already fairly OP. That's why they get less WD (Weapon Damage) and have their DPS lowered when singing most of their support actions. In the future when level cap is raised this may work due to the continuation of lower WD compared to other DPS jobs and BRD becoming more supportive and less DPSish due to the nature of how its jobs actions will flow.
Positional requirements for ranged attacks is a cool concept but it needs to effect something other than ACC because that is the first thing any DPS stats for which is going to be aimed for 100% ACC on EVERY attack. -
06-05-2014, 04:14 AMOmegaNovaiosWell the issue currently is BRD is a job highly focused on support when compared to everything ARC has to offer. How else will they add another job for ARC if they can't even consider a non DPS/Support hybrid?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitru
Ranger should be a DPS job when compared to BRD. BRD should be more supportive and less DPSish than it currently is. Hopefully this will resolve when level cap is raised, otherwise ARC/BRD shouldn't have much hope for RNG nor any other job for ARC to exist.
This is but 1 of many holes SE dug themselves into when deciding to put a bandage over the armoury system of 1.0, it either needed to be scrapped or balanced to work, SE did neither and now we have a mess. -
06-05-2014, 06:49 AMMartaDemireux
Yeah that's true on the ACC but I really didn't know what incentive to give without having to weaken the abilities significantly. I'll think on something else. I had another idea floating around to incorporate Animals (FFV) in some way. The random nature of it is displeasing to me, though. Perhaps through a stance and a combo could there be specification on the animals.
You're right Kitru, it really would still have the ARC/BRD bread and butter. I was hoping that between Camouflage+Shadowbind, Sten Needle+Repelling Shot, Sidwinder and requiring moving to the flank and back behind would be enough to distinguish itself and also put it in enough potential danger that some abilities wouldn't always get used when/where they should. While those do further specialize the mechanic already in place it does still function essentially the same with added flare. And in reading your response I realized I ignored my own thought process to that mechanic. I went in thinking "Hey these abilities don't get used much" and forgot to put in a reason to pass up some of ARC/BRD's frequently used abilities (in the same vein that SMN doesn't make frequent use of Physick, Energy drain and Virus and SCH doesn't generally make frequent use Miasma II, Ruin, Ruin II). So I'll look into a way to do that. -
06-06-2014, 03:27 AMOmegaNovaiosBasically any class can have a 2nd job added with lowered DPS and a pet added similar to SMN. SMN pet is pretty weak compared to the job and LNC really stands out as option to match something previously done in FFXI via a pet wyvern for its 2nd job especially now that lore can't deem a LNC not to have a wyvern (not that lore should deem anything in that sense as having EVERY job under the title of "Lawful Good" is bland) as the new Dragon race will completely blow out the Ishgard view or else there will be a war, which at that point it would probably be the Scions (those protecting the race of the Dragon) v. Ishgard, in which I doubt a LNC would care to befriend such a creature merely to appease Ishgard.Quote:
Originally Posted by MartaDemireux
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06-06-2014, 08:44 AMMartaDemireux
I didn't really mean for them to have a pet with Animal. In FFV Animal functioned by taking your a random number between 0 and your job level and animals would go in tiers. So if you were job level 99 and the game rolled a 0 you wouldn't get anything, 1 would get you Mysidian Rabbit, I think 30 would get you a Raven that paralyzed (probably not I'd have to look it up) and then the highest one was a 60 so if you rolled a 60-99 you'd get Unicorn which was a major heal or something. It was a really interesting system that I'd like to see in this game. Random enough so every animal sent out will still be beneficial but still have a high chance at being something nice. Preferably not healing even though in both FFIII and FFV RNG was able to and I think Fran functioned well as a healer due to her stat layout in FFXII.
So what I'm trying to think up is a system using combos or another type of process that it will work in tandem with. -
06-06-2014, 11:46 AMShurrikhan
I don't think there ought to be any positional requirements on a ranged class like this, especially when one would expect that a Ranger would likely move farther from the heat of battle compared to a Bard. When using as little accuracy as possible, and likely taking on more crit or det in the gear choice exchange, we already have to stay behind enemies (and there is no benefit for flanking when you could be entirely behind). In that sense dodging around positionally is already (a small) part of dps maximization. I wouldn't mind seeing abilities taking on some auxiliary effects depending on the position, but to actually turn them into necessary rotations sounds more akin to a fighter with a pistol in one hand and a sword in the other -- dodge, slip behind an enemy, shoot him in the back of the head.
The only major changes to how an archer would move between the jobs of Bard and Ranger is the allowance of a deeper, more steady, and powerful stance being available to the ranger, which would greatly limit his mobility when doing maximum dps (which, while Bard would remain a bit below most dps classes in sheer dps, would move it up just short of melee w/o a DRG (assuming good melee fight conditions), and about on par with DRG's longterm damage when a DRG is present and increasing piercing vulnerability). In this stance most shots would likely carry a cast time or effect tied to the course of the animation, during which movement is allowed but slowed. Perhaps it can come with a stack mechanic which further increases the potency bonus at cost of further increased cast time and slow percentage, quickly reaching a complete stop during the animation. This need not turn Ranger into a true turret dps. The lighter stance, or simply when the toggle is off, could also come with a bonus that would in turn of situation or long-term rotation, cause wildly moving, positional play, similar to a shortbow (or Miqo'te, in lore) style as compared to the more distant and steadily powerful longbow (or Elezen) style.
In either case, the DoTs and Bloodletter procs must behave differently. Unlike with ACN, we can't simply tack on 5 healing/shield and 2 mitigation abilities and call the waste of the other abilities (except as handy, but auxiliary extra dps) well and fine for its role. I haven't anything to recommend yet, however; I can only say that it seems crucial. I'll edit as ideas come to me. -
06-06-2014, 11:50 AMOmegaNovaios
Hmm, that would be fairly difficult to work into ARC and to balance it out. Maybe that style would be better off a Class that evolves into RNG and BST where the difference between RNG and BST would be BST also gets a pet Animal in addition to Animal calling and RNG gets stuff that makes the attacks ranged and the job more agile, stealthy, and tactical.
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06-06-2014, 01:08 PMMartaDemireuxHaha, you read my mind on the note of adding a cast time. A few hours ago I was like, "Hmm, what if they had a stance that added cast time or more of a 'draw bow' time." But then, like you said, the Bloodletter mechanic would need altering because even with less mobility but higher damage it'd play just like BRD. If a stance was used that did this though it would have to be attractive enough to maintain it else people just wouldn't use it and would again just be playing like BRD but with new mechanics. My exact idea on adding cast times was to create a system where you would press the button once and it would start filling up a bar. You can press the button again to shoot the arrow at any time with no animation locking but the more you let it fill up (ie draw your bow tighter) it would deal more damage. You could still move while it filled up to dodge fight mechanics but it would drain the bar the longer you moved. I'm planning on changing Aim into the stance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shurrikhan
The idea for positional requirements stemmed from hunting. Gaining certain vantage points and getting benefits from them. But perhaps overall it's not that good of idea. Probably better suited for a Ninja type class to teleport in and out of melee range whatnot to make use of positional requirements.
I forgot the lore differences in Elezen and ancient Miqo'te archery. Would be neat to do something with this but I don't think I could make it work well. BRD's relic weapon is essentially a longbow but focuses on fast movements and all that. So then Ranger would have to focus on slow/tactical movements but with a shortbow. Just doesn't sound right to me. -
06-06-2014, 03:35 PMShurrikhanTo <snip>: Yeah, the 'draw' prep or channel on a Ranger-specific stance was pretty much the first thing I thought of when I heard that we might eventually get more second jobs from our original classes. I'm still not sure what form of this I'd favor, and tend to overcomplicate things horribly (of course, I don't see why one would take the time to master a class without the will to read fine print), but that's always been there in the job's idealization for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by MartaDemireux
To the latter part: I wasn't saying that the necessarily need to use the shortbow. I was just pointing out that a Bard could at certain times (especially when the Primal bow was new) inch out a bit more dps by only getting enough accuracy to cap for back attacks, so in some ways the mad jumping and diving of keeping a position on an enemy was already part of Archer gameplay).
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By the way, I have some ideas written out finally, but it's long. I mean terribly long. And not quite complete. If you're interested in a read, I'll post it. Otherwise I'll refrain, for others' sanity.
I'll just post the basic ideas for now.
[Fore-changes: The direct damage of Venomous Bite and Windbite now benefit from both Disembowel and Foe, the DoT portion only from Foe, and Bloodletter only from Foe. This is a minor attempt to make us slightly less dependent on Dragoons, and slightly more able to buff ourselves or each other. I would like to see base damage increased slightly as necessary to bring the Disembowel-affected dps back up to where it was, and for the Foe bonus to be taken as gratis or buff.]
[Background: I'm rather still rather fond of the idea of each job embracing two stats potentially, though I will admit that the specialization (usually towards either burst or longevity) is hard to balance. Originally I planned for Ranger to use mana whenever it used magical attacks, either in proc-combination with Venom and Windbite or including the original application of the ability. This refers back to the use of Piety by Archers in version 1.x. ...Well, no more piety for anyone but healers, but I still wish to in some way make use of mana as a Ranger, since I would like Ballad to contribute something to the job when used by its counterpart, but I've yet to figure out how I would most like to see that play out.
I also originally intended for Ranger to also carry two traits: Grouping of Shots, which increases accuracy against a particular target (where excess accuracy is converted into critical strike chance, critical strike bonus, or determination, depending on concurrent effects or stance), and Repetition, which increases attack speed slightly and mana regeneration significantly, each increasing effect with recent shots made [in this sense determination growth causes the effect of Grouping of Shots to slowly ramp up indefinitely, while a single auto-crit to an enemy can quickly open it up to improved attacks].However, there are no job traits in this game. Instead, we must fumble over tooltips to give even the slightest class depth with the "now does this in job C!" or the inclusion of trait-like qualities within long-winded toggleable abilities like Defiance.]Scratch that. I will attach an oversized tooltip to a stance ability. One stance gets one mechanic, other gets the other. They can be active simultaneously, but will drain with time due to that recency effect, and stacks gained in one will replace an equal number in the other.
Basic Idea: The Ranger plays in two different styles, basically 'Shortbow' and 'Longbow' (or 'Woodsman' / 'Hunter' and 'Marksman'), and a large part of mastering the job is in making use of the opportunities the two provide, especially unto the other. In the 'Longbow' style, Ranger faces many of the vulnerabilities of caster dps, some of its abilities becoming casted and others having an uncancellable movement slow for the duration of the (increasingly long) animation of its primary abilities, these effects increasing with stacks alongside the stance's beneficial effects. The 'Shortbow' stance inversely makes the Ranger increasingly mobile, sacrificing base damage for movement and attack speed. Both are useful and often necessary for maximizing dps, though the 'Shortbow' stance will only tend to increase dps when used opportunistically (putting aside situations where the job itself is capable of dodging while in 'Longbow' but the player is not, and therefore should not be sacrificing dps potential for mobility). Ranger adds a few support moves to the Archer repertoire, making it faintly supportive, but is generally a full dps, with damage approximately equable to that of casters.
The Ranger acts in a style between a proc- or charge-based class and a combo class. Whereas physical shots stand primarily as 'filler' for Bards, between DoTs, they make up the majority of the Ranger's concerns, primarily by building up chances or stats on a per-shot basis (varying with damage dealt, including critical damage) towards critical junctures. Venomous Bite and Windbite are here used less as a 'matter of course' and more as the openers for specific tactics or in capitalizing upon them. They also have auxiliary use, such as in debuffing enemies or in AoEs. (One combined use of Venomous Bite includes a disease debuff, while a combined use of Windbite includes the purging of a buff on the enemy; Venomous allows the ranger to deal the last tick of all DoTs' damage that were on the enemy to nearby enemies when it is killed by Mercy's End, and Windbite allows various attacks to gain different AoE effects when centered on the enemy affected with Windbite). Ranger has one auto-crit ability, Foeseeker (though it is not the most powerful of Ranger's abilities; due to its low potency, 125, raising the critical strike chance of a Heavy Shot following a Puncture or Bloodletter to cause it to critically strike is actually your largest nuke).
Generally the Ranger focuses on either breaking through defenses with built-up damage, where each proc helps ramp up damage further for a short time in longbow (Marksman) form, leading to very bursty play, or else preparing numerous high-crit-chance, low-damage abilities in the shortbow (Hunter) form that can be capitalized on with opportunistic strikes thereafter. Ranger uses Accuracy and the conversion of excess Accuracy a lot; but in Marksman aspect excess accuracy is considered from a threshold between front and flank in spite of position, and in Hunter aspect it is considered from your actual position.
P.S. Abilities I'm using: <Aspect/Stance>, Puncture (a linear AoE that pierces armor), Multi-nock (nock another arrow, spread the effect), Gloom Arrow (support-ish, combos for additional effects, causes Shroud (a debuff that blinds and reduced your enmity against the target), and Foeseeker (30 or 40-second CD auto-crit 125 potency ability with some comboing).
The change to Bloodletter, within Marksman:
while Marksman is active, River of Blood procs reduce Bloodletter's current remaining cooldown time by 5 seconds, produce a stack which increases Bloodletter's damage by 30% (stacking compoundingly) each stack, and allow Bloodletter to be used instantly at damage cost proportional to the time remaining until cooldown refresh. As stacks increase, Bloodletter gains a potential cast time. Each .75 seconds for which Bloodletter is cast / channeled consumes a stack, causing it to release at increased damage [animation will scale to match]. The maximum cast time is equal to .75 seconds x # of stacks. [It tends to look like the 1.x's Bloodletter's laser cannon.] it is the only channeled ability I have right now where increased time increases damage, the rest must meet a minimum time to fire at all, and therefore come to more risk with movement, which I honestly prefer. -
06-06-2014, 05:41 PMMartaDemireux
Changes Made to OP:
Directional and distance positioning removed.
Aim: Changed from a special attack to Take Aim - a new stance which applies the Aim status and introduces a new mechanic: the Draw Meter. Upon use of certain attacks the Draw Meter will begin to increase. The more it increases the more powerful the attack will become. Moving will deplete the meter very quickly.
Sidewinder: Removed.
Rapid Fire: New buff which allows your Draw Meter to charge faster and prevents it from draining while moving.
Bloodletter: Changes into Animals which works with the Draw Meter to bring in a random animal to deal damage, inflict status effects or heal the user.
That's a neat idea! I like the idea of using VB/WB to combo with other things. If what you mean by channel is what I think it means then I think that might be a not very good thing. In my signature I have a link to my Geomancer idea. I originally had a channeled mechanic for GEO but after some talks in the thread the conclusion was that in a very dodge-heavy game like FFXIV a channeled ability is generally more of a hindrance than a boon. Yours sounds like a potentially quick channel depending on the amount of stacks you plan to be the average use and then of course the capped amount of stacks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shurrikhan
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06-06-2014, 06:46 PMShurrikhanBy 'channel' I basically just meant that the ability has dynamics that affect the total damage based on a variable cast time. You can choose to hold it down as much as you like, and break whenever you want in order to dodge, simply using fewer stacks. If anything, I might try to make it more punishing by wasting the remaining stacks, but as it stands, by only 'channel' ability listed is pretty movement-friendly. Heavy Shot and Puncture however, mechanics not listed above, will not be. They will either complete the cast or waste the progress, and maybe even a stack or whatnot with the attempt. In short, I want Ranger to feel that it needs its turret dps (at least a good portion of the time, while using 'Marksman' aspect), and should time things out to deal with the issue (rather than Bard 'non-issue') of movement.Quote:
Originally Posted by MartaDemireux
I've reworked Bloodletter a bit, by the way, in order to make it less of a dps loss. (4 'stacks' for Hunter aspect would mean 4 more instances of 150 potency each, or 600 potency total plus the original Bloodletter, 750.) To keep potency from getting so high without further nerfing Bloodletter in Marksman aspect, I'll need to reduce the maximum stacks. I'll just be using 3 stacks as maximum, each stack reducing the CD by 6 seconds (two-fifths), increasing cast speed by 1 second, and increasing damage by 50 potency and 20% of new combined potency. 240, 348, 478. (Compared to Hunter's 300, 450, 600) This still runs the issue of potentially critting for some damn much though... About as much as a Flare crit when using every possible CD. (Under full CDs, a Heavy Shot can already hit for over 600, and this would be over 3 times that.) And it's still behind in dps, if the bonuses of the two aspects were to run the same. To try to round that out, I think I'll have Marksman provide no aspectual damage bonuses to Bloodletter, but Bloodletter can help with damage dealt on itself and other abilities through the <Grouping of Shots> mechanic. I'm still looking for Heavy Shot to actually be the general potential nuke of the Marksman aspect, with Bloodletter as an aside that fills in where Puncture's armor penetration fails and the Ranger would otherwise lose its roll / chaining spree / killing spree.