Gun-blade wielding tank for upcoming job?

So....gun-blade tank based of the designs of nero/gaius/etc. to add some tanking flavor? SE already has the character models,etc. to go with many possible skills. Your thoughts?

If they add any tanks before Ninja I will quit. Im super srsly.

There are already a billion zillion DPS, and only 2 tanks.

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Originally Posted by Sinthetic_Black

If they add any tanks before Ninja I will quit. Im super srsly.

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They announced the dual-wield dagger class which will most likely resemble a ninja. This job/class (probably job) will be implemented at the same time as the gun based job

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Originally Posted by Lucke

There are already a billion zillion DPS, and only 2 tanks.

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I gave up on my PLD out of boredom but if they implemented a gun-blade tank I would give tanking another go

the current balance of 2 tanks 2 melee 2 ranged 2 casters and 2 healers is a ratio yoshida has said countless times that he wants to maintain. so if we see any new classes it will have to be a melee and tank
Gunblade tank is very possible. However, Ninja, will more then likely be a melee dps. Ninja was never really a good tank in XI, just a half ass back up if u had nothing else. It was a waaaay better dps

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Originally Posted by Professor_Ozpin

the current balance of 2 tanks 2 melee 2 ranged 2 casters and 2 healers is a ratio yoshida has said countless times that he wants to maintain

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There are 9 jobs so that would only be 1 ranged dps (bard) that isnt a caster.

Based on it's setting in the story, I kind of imagine we'd have to get to Garlimald before they would give us access to an Empire exclusive weapon style like that.

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Originally Posted by Zophar

Based on it's setting in the story, I kind of imagine we'd have to get to Garlimald before they would give us access to an Empire exclusive weapon style like that.

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Very possible. They could have new job crystals (or something else to fill the spot, since according to lore jobs are ancient specializations, and garlemalds machina style is clearly not ancient) branching of each class with the existing garlemald character models like livia's gun fists for pugilist, i know another garlemald character (can't remember his name) uses a gun axe which a marauder could use, and etc.

The new pistol class could quite possibly get machinist from garlemald as the healer job from there...

I know at least would work for each DoW classes, don't know how it would work on DoM weapons. Would be cool though!

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Originally Posted by Zophar

Based on it's setting in the story, I kind of imagine we'd have to get to Garlimald before they would give us access to an Empire exclusive weapon style like that.

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I'd say that we won't be going to Garlemald for new jobs. We have Cid remember? He'd prolly train us in gun-weapons rather than open up Garlemald, but who knows. Aaaaand, he'd prolly be our in-game contact for an Engineer job and/or airship building.

Engineer would be a fantastic DOH job and I definitely would be interested in crafting equipment such as bombs or other trinkets that could be implemented in an expansion involving Garlemald.

These new roles will definitely be JOBS, not classes. Both the gun and dagger jobs can be created from existing classes. With so many people capping every role, the only way to ensure tanks continue to be in play is offer a new tank class. If neither class is a tank, when the elites abandon their mains to lvl these new jobs, even less people will be tanking.

I'm sure the dagger class will involve pugilist so it will most likely be DPS. Perhaps a support DPS, with smokescreens, etc. to bolster evasion? Who knows - I'm just excited at the possibility of a gun-blade tank.

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Originally Posted by Zophar

Based on it's setting in the story, I kind of imagine we'd have to get to Garlimald before they would give us access to an Empire exclusive weapon style like that.

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Who knows, maybe part of the job's quest will be learning the role from a defecting Centurion in the wake of gaius' defeat?

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Originally Posted by kujowaltz

These new roles will definitely be JOBS, not classes. Both the gun and dagger jobs can be created from existing classes.

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In ARR, your current class is determined by your current weapon. Since we know that there are no existing classes that use 2 daggers (GLA may use a single dagger sub-20) nor is there a class that uses a gun, it can be easily inferred that they will be new classes. Furthermore, it helps that Yoshi has actually said that they're going to be classes.

I seriously doubt we're going to get a gunblade class/job mainly because it's such a specialist weapon (the only gunblade users are extremely high ranked Garleans and we're talking about a sword with a built in gun; I can't imagine many of those lying around) while also being mostly the same as one of the existing weapons (you know, the sword). There are plenty of other weapons we're much more likely to see (like hammers/maces/clubs, flails, whips, and 2h swords) before we get a gunblade *if* we ever get a gunblade class. In fact, there's already a gunblade in game (Blazefire Saber from the Lightning event) so I'm pretty sure that any other gunblades we happen to get will follow a similar model: vanity/glamour options for GLA/PLD that are mechanically identical to any other sword.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

your current class is determined by your current weapon

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Ahhh good point! ....derp

I have to disagree with the gun-blade being used by high ranked Garleans, however. We see gunblades being used as early as the Centurion (and those guys are pretty tanky too). With the defeat of the Garlean outposts, they could easily explain the abundance of these weapons from equipment left over after Gaius' defeat.

If these classes are coming pre-expansion, pre-existing character models (or slight variations) would decrease the patch size; if they are coming in the expansion, then it could be anything. But one would anticipate an expansion to have several new classes/jobs anyways...so I would assume these two new roles are pre-expansion

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Originally Posted by Kitru

while also being mostly the same as one of the existing weapons (you know, the sword). There are plenty of other weapons we're much more likely to see (like hammers/maces/clubs, flails, whips, and 2h swords)

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I fail to see how a hammer/mace/club could provide more of a contrast to existing weapons (you know, swords and axes) in terms of gameplay mechanics than a sword with a gun attached to it. A rapid fire, enmity generating attack would surely be awesome for instance.

A 2 handed sword would be spectacular for a DPS character, or a dark knight style tank

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Originally Posted by kujowaltz

I have to disagree with the gun-blade being used by high ranked Garleans, however. We see gunblades being used as early as the Centurion (and those guys are pretty tanky too). With the defeat of the Garlean outposts, they could easily explain the abundance of these weapons from equipment left over after Gaius' defeat.

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Level is not an indicator of rank. It's an indicator of timeline progression. Centurions *are* high ranking Garlean soldiers; they're only low level because you encounter them earlier on. The lore states that gunblades are the weapons of the Garlean elite. There wouldn't make sense for there to be an abundance of them. It's also important to remember where exactly they would need to drop from: you'd need to have gunblades dropping from the various dungeons (the only dungeons that have anything to do with the Garleans are CM and Prae; everything else is driven by the storyline involving the primals) as well as having GC gunblades as well as gunblades being provided at every vendor elsewhere.

You'd have to explain why, all of the sudden, Garlean magitek weaponry suddenly became as common in Eorzea as axes and spears. Adding a class to use something more realistically "basic" can be easily explained as to why you're adding it: they had been selling them the entire time, but you were never interested in them because there wasn't a class that could use them (e.g. you're not proficient and couldn't become proficient so why would you care?).

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Originally Posted by kujowaltz

I fail to see how a hammer/mace/club could provide more of a contrast to existing weapons (you know, swords and axes) in terms of gameplay mechanics than a sword with a gun attached to it.

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Weapon in no way dictates the playstyle for a class/job beyond a general theme. With minimal effort you could create a gunblade class simply by cloning GLA and tweaking Shield Lob such that it causes you to fire the gun portion instead of throwing your shield. Animations, aesthetics, and gear don't determine playstyle; what determines playstyle is the effects and interactions of the abilities themselves and those are completely independent of weapon choice.

Gunblades are less likely to get a class before any of those weapons I mentioned mainly because gunblades are just extremely specialized swords (even moreso than 2h swords). A hammer is a completely different weapon type than anything currently being used rather than a different take on an existing one. Gunblade is just a fancy subtype of sword. I seriously doubt they're going to add a subtype of an existing weapon before they've started getting to the bottom of the barrel on entirely new weapon types.

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A 2 handed sword would be spectacular for a DPS character, or a dark knight style tank

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I actually think that we're likely to get a 2h sword class at some point (and I'm expecting it to be DRK if only because ), and I'm reasonably confident that it will be a tank rather than a DPS mainly because there aren't that many "tank-y" weapons out there but you can really argue that any weapon is viable for a DPS class/job.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

You'd have to explain why, all of the sudden, Garlean magitek weaponry suddenly became as common in Eorzea as axes and spears. Adding a class to use something more realistically "basic" can be easily explained as to why you're adding it: they had been selling them the entire time, but you were never interested in them because there wasn't a class that could use them (e.g. you're not proficient and couldn't become proficient so why would you care?).

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Only thing i can Think of too Negate this Single Bit is... to never have you Change Weapon, Make the Weapon "Levelable" or Upgradable with bits from other weapons that are compatable from Dungeons or even upgradable with only the Class Quests.. so essentially all your doing is unlocking more Power on the weapon.

There are ways too add them too the Game, But i don't think it would be a Class too itself, More Drops of Weapons from a Garlean Themed Raid/Dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

You'd have to explain why, all of the sudden, Garlean magitek weaponry suddenly became as common in Eorzea as axes and spears

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Los noscea is crawling with pirates and gun wielding, low level enemies. Merlwyb uses a gun. How hard could it be for a black smith to take one of the widely available guns/muskets/etc and attach a blade? Shoot, Garlean gun-blades could just account for a few high level weapons....If Eorzeans can make guns, what's stopping them from attaching a blade?

Your argument about subbing shield lob for a bullet, etc. can just as easily be reversed to say you can just substitute a hammer for an axe, use all the same animations for WAR and boom, new class. What I'm saying is: just as many enemies have skills used by players, there are enemies that have skills and animations players may perhaps use. Combine the gun based animations of limsa pirates, sword based actions of GLD and gun-blade unique skills from garleans and you have a gun-blade class.

Every currently available class has enemy equivalents running around. We know the next two are duel wield dagger based and gun based. So if we look to which enemies (of playable races) currently do not have playable equivalents....using those models saves time, money, and can be done reasonably easy with a patch.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

I actually think that we're likely to get a 2h sword class at some point (and I'm expecting it to be DRK if only because ), and I'm reasonably confident that it will be a tank rather than a DPS mainly because there aren't that many "tank-y" weapons out there but you can really argue that any weapon is viable for a DPS class/job.

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I could see it going either way...

2 handed sword implies damage at the cost of defense. DRK is also known for their sacrificing defense/hp for extra damage. It would also give us the first sword based DPS

But lots of classes can currently risk damage taken by damage given as a DPS. A tank following the darkness system from ffiv would be very interesting....hmmm...

Both roles would be extremely fun and I would main a DRK in a heartbeat

If they add any "gun melee weapon amalgamation" class I'd probably quit. It was bad enough the entire garlean power rangers had gun shields and gun hammers and crap. The last thing we need is players with these failed attempts at weapon engineering.

I can really see DRK and SAM splitting off of the same class honestly. It wouldn't be that far of a stretch really. If done right, they could even end up with split roles of one being a DPS and one being a tank. Or not. And I can't see anything aesthetically wrong with it either. Both wear plate. Both use 2 handed swords. The only thing at all that makes me second guess myself on this is that, I'm sure they would want GS and GK type weapons each having their own animations, but again, maybe not. And if you're worried about GK's crossing over, don't worry, Dark Knights were using Great Katanas in Final Fantasy before Samurai ever made it's first appearance in the series ;)

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Originally Posted by Ferth

If they add any "gun melee weapon amalgamation" class I'd probably quit. It was bad enough the entire garlean power rangers had gun shields and gun hammers and crap. The last thing we need is players with these failed attempts at weapon engineering.

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well if they do, don't let the door hit you on the way out....just kidding lol

In all seriousness though, its a matter of preference and if you don't like the class, don't play it. Saying you'll quit a game because you may find 1 of the many classes stupid is also stupid.

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Originally Posted by kujowaltz

Los noscea is crawling with pirates and gun wielding, low level enemies. Merlwyb uses a gun.

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Where exactly are you seeing this plethora of gun wielding enemies? Virtually all of the low level pirates in LN use axes. I can't think of a single low level enemy that uses a gun. In fact, the only gun using people I can think of are Merlwyb, the thief at the end of the goldsmith quest line, and the first boss of Pharos. Of those, the only "animations" are the 2 gun attacks that the first boss of Pharos uses (the CS animations are ridiculously simply and basically amount to "I stretched my arm out").

Guns are not "common". They're pretty rare, in fact.

Also, the guns that the Eorzeans have are early form blunderbusses and flintlocks. They're the most basic firearms imaginable.

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How hard could it be for a black smith to take one of the widely available guns/muskets/etc and attach a blade? Shoot, Garlean gun-blades could just account for a few high level weapons....If Eorzeans can make guns, what's stopping them from attaching a blade?

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Gunblades are not simply guns with swords attached to them. They are magitek weapons, which is why they don't need to be reloaded and are exclusive to Garleans.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

Where exactly are you seeing this plethora of gun wielding enemies?

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There are those "sniper" enemies in Brayflox HM.. Though, I don't really know if they are using a gun or if it's a crossbow or something. And they aren't exactly "low-level".. Just wanted to throw it out there, not stir the pot (obviously they aren't gunblades) xD

One situation where we might have a gunblade class in the future, similar to Yugiri, deserter from a foreign land. Maybe a Garlean deserter decides to teach Eorzeans the secrets of making magitek gunblades. Kind of a meh idea, since it would be too similar to Yugiri's story, but something to that effect.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

Guns are not "common". They're pretty rare, in fact.

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So then how are they going to justify getting a gun-class in the first place? It's happening. If freaking goblins can get them.... I'm trying to justify how and why, but you disregard every reasonable idea. What's your possible justification for where these guns will be coming from? If not themselves, or the Garleans, then where? My point is if there are going to be guns, attaching a blade is easy.

Will it be DPS? Maybe its a chemist healer using a gun. Maybe its a gun wielding red mage. Maybe its power rangers. Yoshida said it will not be what people are expecting so I'm coming up with non-obvious solutions. The fact so many people disagree with a gun-blade tank make it even more likely based on stances like yours alone.

Ok lets seperate this.
Lore wise - there are many npc's with guns in los nocea, mentions of pirates, canons...
Enemy wise - low level instances (dungeons and class quest), Brayflox, Garleans.

The 'crawling' was a combination of lore and what we see. We may not fight a ton, but its vastly more than whips, clubs, hammers. Nero uses a hammer but essentially identical warrior models for physical attacks.

What is your ideal scenario for where these guns will be coming from?

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

One situation where we might have a gunblade class in the future, similar to Yugiri, deserter from a foreign land. Maybe a Garlean deserter decides to teach Eorzeans the secrets of making magitek gunblades. Kind of a meh idea, since it would be too similar to Yugiri's story, but something to that effect.

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Yeah that's something I suggested, and I think it could work. There are houses in Mor Dhona that currently cannot be entered but a future guild there would be interesting - occupied by Garlean refugees, teaching adventurers how to wield their weapons, etc like you said. It would require players to have progressed quite far in the game to access however....Yugiri's story and possible inclusion in the dagger job quests could just add to an overall theme for the patch that the jobs are included on. A Garlean/Garlemald theme leading up to the expansion

Okay if this were to be the case it would be extremely annoying, if gunblades were to be introduced on a class why would you give them to a tank.

Gunblades have the perfect opportunity of creating a class that can opporate from range and melee which will inturn make an interesting dynamic within the skillset by the weapon alone.

For me they can only be introduced via Hybrid roles, where they have the ability to be used from any range to cater to the role they are helping out... or even as corsairs where they buff the people around them allowing the ability to buff healers and melee by changing there attack methods.

I like to think gunblades will go to a hunter class that will inturn seperate to beastmaster and bluemage, as a nice bit of lore could be created with these two jobs being two sides of the same coin.

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Originally Posted by JakzChurchill

Okay if this were to be the case it would be extremely annoying, if gunblades were to be introduced on a class why would you give them to a tank...

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There is a lot of DPS potential there for sure. Hybrid roles like a DRK that can tank but sacrifices hp/defense for damage output may make an appearance but probably not until the expansion. I think your suggestion of corsair falls too closely with bard IF its concidered a DPS. I could definitely dig a chemist healer, that uses a gun.

As mentioned it could be a kite tank but this would wreak havoc on the DPS of monks/dragoons.

Also remember, as I was reminded, that the type of weapon the class uses stays with that job. A hunter branching into beastmaster and bluemage would require the same weapon. I could see those jobs popping up in the expansion however...would be very cool - another pet based class without the use of summons! job quests could see you fighting and taming various cool monsters.

But as with the Garleans, you can chain close and ranged combos. Swords to push away and guns to chain. It would definitely be easier to pick off an escaping mob! I'm excited to see what crazy gun-wielding class they come up with as if yoshida's comments about it not being what we think

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Originally Posted by Professor_Ozpin

Ninja was never really a good tank in XI, just a half ass back up if u had nothing else. It was a waaaay better dps

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You're kidding right? Although it was never intended to be a tank class in XI, it outshined Paladin in many aspects. Higher evasion, the ability to put out decent damage, and not to mention the shadows that when used properly allowed you to take way less damage than a Paladin so your whm wasn't having to mana dump cure on you. I would have chose a Ninja over a Paladin tank any day in XI.

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Originally Posted by Zophar

Based on it's setting in the story, I kind of imagine we'd have to get to Garlimald before they would give us access to an Empire exclusive weapon style like that.

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Actually, we wouldn't have to wait till Garlemald for a potential gunblade guild.
Ala Mhigo has been under Imperial control for more than a decade. With the way the Garlean Empire works (assimilation) it is very possible they could introduce "Garlean style" combat classes upon the Eorzean Alliance successfully retaking Ala Mhigo- as there would be training facilities present in the city.

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Originally Posted by Alexia89

Actually, we wouldn't have to wait till Garlemald for a potential gunblade guild.
Ala Mhigo has been under Imperial control for more than a decade. With the way the Garlean Empire works (assimilation) it is very possible they could introduce "Garlean style" combat classes upon the Eorzean Alliance successfully retaking Ala Mhigo- as there would be training facilities present in the city.

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Wow I love that idea!! The only negative is most likely having to wait for an expansion....however, that idea opens so many future job possibilities/explanations!

If its a tank they should make it a reward. Gotta tank something hard to get it. Like you quest to find a great gun blade but it's broken then you get a crappy one and work up from lvl one till you repair and get an insta relic