Thank you for the new relic quest

I dont remember exactly which interview it was, but I remember Yoshi saying he appreciates constructive criticism, but wished there would also be more on what people actually liked about the game.

Well, 2.2 has finally delivered something interesting with actual goals to work toward, in the form of the new relic quest. I love that this quest brought variety, specifically, it gave a big reason for lots of players to go out into open world areas, gave lots of players the rare drop design they wanted, and gave something important to do along with endgame dungeons, which the game lacked pre 2.2.

This single addition in 2.2 made me resub, and now gave me new hope for the game that I had previously lost. Idk whether the devs listened to the requests for some of the above I mentioned; but either way I appreciate what they brought us in this patch. Keep up the good work!

Don't get your hope up so fast.

The RNG now is only low because it is new content and will most likely be buffed to have a higher chance to drop each Major Update with it eventually dropping at a 100% Rate later.

However, that is only the first step to get your relic into ilvl 100 Relic.

Once you're in Atma your Relic's stats is still ilvl 90 Stats and will not be ilvl 100 stats until Animus. This is where the real work to upgrade your Relic begins being that each Book have 4 catagories to complete being in battle leves, FATES, Dungeon, and Monster kills. You will also need to pay 1500 myth per book which is a total of 13,500 myth for all 9 books.

Of course once the next tome tier is released it will be easier to get those books.

(Example: Radz-at-han Oil use to cost 900 phil tome but now only cost 225 Myth tome since Phil is now replaced by Myth)

Yea, some of that is probably true. Either way though, this patch was a big step in the right direction, for me that is.

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Originally Posted by Otoha

Yea, some of that is probably true. Either way though, this patch was a big step in the right direction, for me that is.

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Well the RNG system as the first part of the upgrade process still feels out of place for me. I still think they could have done something a bit more interesting with those Atma souls like fighting special solo instanced bossed unique to the Relic Upgrade side-story that would cover more lore and detail about our relics.

or at least skipped it all together since we don't actually begin the upgrade process our relics until we get it to Atma and start working on those books which will take weeks to get them all done through the solo and group content each book will require us to do.

As of now the RNG isn't anything special or a throw back to when things are determined by RNG if you can get the best weapon or not but just to hold as many people back until the next set of Relic is released.

Relic in this game is not the best weapons after all but the Starter Endgame weapons to allow people to get into Endgame and get the real Strongest Weapons in the game.

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

(Example: Radz-at-han Oil use to cost 900 phil tome but now only cost 225 Myth tome since Phil is now replaced by Myth)

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Considering that the philo:myth trading ratio ended up at 4:1, the oil costs the same today as it did before 2.2. Just using a different currency.
Might be easier to come by the myths now, but the price is the same...

I agree completely; for a while I was only logging on during the weekends with maybe like a few hours put in each day. When 2.2 was launched I did literally nothing but play trying to collect all my atmas. I've only gotten 10 so far, and I'm actually looking forward to coming back and playing during the weekdays to try and get the other 2, and than work towards the rest of the upgrade.

I don't understand how people can be complaining over it, literally whining that they haven't instantly gotten the new gear, as opposed to having to put a little work into it. Completing it, one by one, gives me a feeling of accomplishment, something which has sorely been missing from the game for a while now.

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Originally Posted by Rakashu

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It the part that the first part of Upgrading relic isn't about actual work but about luck. Collecting the 12 souls is simple a measure of being Fortunate enough to have them actually drop for you and even once you get Atma your relic has not been upgraded yet since the stats of Atma is still ilvl 90 stats. Yes once you get Atma your Relic is still a ilvl 90 relic. It may say ilvl 100 but the stats still remains ilvl 90 Relic until you complete the Animus books and complete all 9 book to get it into ilvl 100 stats.

The real work begins once you get Atma (ilvl 90 stats) and start getting Animus (ilvl 100 stats) with the 9 books.

I still think they should of just skipped the Atma part in the first place because the relic is not ilvl 100 once you get Atma but ilvl 90 and only gradually become ilvl 100 for each book you complete with each book cost 1500 myth (13,500 myth for all books) and each book having tasks cover FATES, Dungeons, Monster kills, and Battle Leves.

The process of actually upgrading the relic from ilvl 90 into ilvl 100 (Atma into Animus) is a worth total of 3 to 4 days per book by average ( 2 days to gather 1500 myth and 1 or 2 days to complete 1 book tasks) which is between a total of 27 days to 36 days to actually obtain the ilvl 100 Relic once you get Atma.

This is mostly where I see the flaw being that getting Atma is not the actual process to obtain ilvl 100 Relic but to obtain a Re-skin version of the ilvl 90 relic so you start working on getting the real ilvl 100 weapon being Animus. This setup they have now isn't about rewarding people who can spend time to farm something over and over again, since the RNG only favors those fortunate enough to get their item not by skill but by luck with how a few people already obtained their Atma on day one of 2.2 release, but is simple a Gate designed to slow people down from performing the actual task to obtain the ilvl 100 relic which will take weeks to complete because SE needs a gate to prevent too many players from starting their Relic ilvl 100 Quest this early in the game.

Of course this RNG will gradually be lefted over time and will most likely be completely removed and placed on to the next set of Relic upgrades are released.

I don't understand people who think "to work for" is "to have luck"

They want to have it right now, and the only way to do that is increase drop rates. Then we go back to having a one day per week game. (For some people)

Then again, there are a lot of other things to do. Even when I couldn't progress in gear, I still enjoyed playing.

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Originally Posted by Cid_Grim

They want to have it right now, and the only way to do that is increase drop rates. Then we go back to having a one day per week game. (For some people)

Then again, there are a lot of other things to do. Even when I couldn't progress in gear, I still enjoyed playing.

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You do know you will need about 1 month to actually obtain the real ilvl 100 Relic right?

As I said before by average a person will need 3 to 4 days to complete 1 book with 9 books total. It is impossible to obtain the Ilvl 100 Relic within a Week because obtaining Atma is not obtaining the ilvl 100 Relic itself but a reskin version of the ilvl 90 relic and the ability to perform the actual Relic Quests to obtaining the actual Ilvl 100 Relic Animus being all 9 books for Animus.

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

You do know you will need about 1 month to actually obtain the real ilvl 100 Relic right?

As I said before by average a person will need 3 to 4 days to complete 1 book with 9 books total. It is impossible to obtain the Ilvl 100 Relic within a Week because obtaining Atma is not obtaining the ilvl 100 Relic itself but a reskin version of the ilvl 90 relic and the ability to perform the actual Relic Quests to obtaining the actual Ilvl 100 Relic Animus being all 9 books for Animus.

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Yes, and i am absolutely fine with that. I am sorry you are disappointed with the hoops we have to jump through to acquire the weapon, but you could choose to not do it at all. (We both know you are going to complete it either way.)

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Originally Posted by Cid_Grim

Yes, and i am absolutely fine with that. I am sorry you are disappointed with the hoops we have to jump through to acquire the weapon, but you could choose to not do it at all. (We both know you are going to complete it either way.)

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That won't happen until i find the right class/Job worth putting into since there is no class/job currently that interests me.

This relic upgrade chain is not made simply for players to have a long term goal but to serve as a goal for players who have a Main class/job. As of now the design of this Book Quests is expecting players to only focus on giving their Main Job their Animus.

Without a Main class/job that interests me there really no purpose to waste away time and effort and 13,500 myth tomes now.

However, that was not my point being that the real purpose of this whole RNG thing is not to provide a challenge for players at all nor a throw back to the old days when RNG determines if you are the have or have nots but to prevent too many players from starting the actual ilvl 100 Relic Quests.

Yet we all know how this will end anyways being that the RNG we have now will start to be gradually removed over time and eventually Atma and Animus will become easier to obtain anyways while a new set of Upgrades are released with the current rate of Atma and Animus Quests.

I can already predict the qq a few weeks from now:

Newer players shouldnt be allowed to get their animus that easily. We had to grind through weeks, why did se remove the rng and make the grind easier? QQ.

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Originally Posted by OPneedNerfs

I can already predict the qq a few weeks from now:

Newer players shouldnt be allowed to get their animus that easily. We had to grind through weeks, why did se remove the rng and make the grind easier? QQ.

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It was quite despairing to see it take hours for some of the atmas to drop... And seeing others join the party and leave within a few fates because they got it...
Waiting for Giant Seps fate to spawn afterwards (part of Book of Skyfire I) was almost as despairing...

Also hearing people have problems getting enough people to help with some of the fates from other books...

If you sit back and think about it, the reason they did this is very simple.

Just like the duty roulette was designed to give some inventive to higher lvl players to help low lvl players complete their duty or dungeon, this gives higher lvl players inventive to help low lvl players complete their fates.

I chose not to use duty roulette, because I would rather pick the instances I would like to play, but there are plenty of people who choose to use the duty roulette system.

We all have options.

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Originally Posted by Bellybell

I don't understand people who think "to work for" is "to have luck"

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This. I don't mind the grind but grind where you have no end in sight is a painful design choice.

I'll say it. I did it and the first half was painful at times. Did it take a long time? Yes. Did I almost go insane? Yes, but so would you after spending 7 hours hours in Outer La Noscea one day then eleven straight hours in Western La Noscea the next.

But now as much a pain in the ass as it was I get tangible progression now. Now when people are losing their minds because they can't get a mirror to even drop I'll be able to sit there and think to myself "I'm glad I did the relic right away."

Yeah, the FATE part was crap, but now it's smooth, if long sailing. Farm myth and do a glorified hunting log. Stuff you do in this game on a regular basis anyway. It's all on me now, working under my own power. I paid my dues to the RNG gods. How much you want to bet most people will be fighting the RNG gods a lot longer in Leviathan Extreme for their mirror?

I say the relic was the easy way out for most and that the rest of the player base just doesn't realize it yet.

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Originally Posted by Delnoir

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Actually the Design for Relic now is the Starter Endgame Weapon. So Relic is the weapon for people to get first before they start getting the new shiny endgame Content Weapons of Power.

As of now the RNG and High Tome cost are just gates to prevent enough players from entering their Animus stage and Coil 2 higher turns until the next Upgrade appear in FF14 which will either be in 2.3 or 2.4

by 2.3 we will either see the drop rate increase up from the 10% drop rate now into 50% drop rate or the RNG is completely removed so people can start working on Animus while People with Animus can start dealing with the new RNG on ilvl 110 Relic Quest

By 2.4 the RNG will most likely be removed by then since Coil 3 will be out and the next set of Relic weapons for Coil 3 will be released which is most likely the ilvl 120 version with the RNG being moved to ilvl 120 quest or a new type of quests is invinted for ilvl 120 Relic.

Yoshi-P did state each Patch will add a new Upgrade for Relic so expect ilvl 110 Relic on 2.3 and Ilvl 120 on 2.4 with each buffing the chance for Atma or removing the RNG entirely to be moved to the new Relic quest so people don't fall too behind but either way the RNG for ATMA is going to be removed either way over time and then moved to the ivl 110 relic quest and then the ilvl 120 Relic Quest with the Book cost being lower in 2.4 because of a new Tome Tier switching myth for Soldiery being that the 1500 myth tomes will most likely become 325 Soldiery tomes in 2.4. In the end the current set up is designed to slow people down until the next set of relic is released and to provide people who already got their ilvl 90 gear set something to do and spend their Myth tomes on they have no more use for.

As of the ilvl 110 and ilvl 120 relics it will most likely be the same anyways with first part is farming for those souls while the 2nd part are those books. Only benefit the players who already obtained Animus by 2.3 and/or 2.4 time is that they are given a head start to start working on ilvl 110 and ilvl 120 but by then Atma drop rate would have been increased or completely removed.

The atma gathering only took me a little more than a day of off & on farming inbetween capping new tomes and other distractions. It offered a real reason to continue progress towards my 3k fate achievement as well. It also worked well for getting my chocobo companion the kill count it needed for the weekly challenge log bonus xp. I also spirt bound a full set of random pinks I had accumulated from treasure maps. I actually ran into a handful of FATEs that I had not encountered before, so that was nice as well.

The 1500 myth per book is a little bit daunting, but it does give me something to do everyday, even after capping out soldiery for the week. I've completed the 1st book, and the only real snag I ran into at all was the leve page. One of the leves was not a normal leve, but a GC leve so I ended up wasting time/allowances doing about 6 regular leves thinking the one I needed would appear. Then I googled it and figured out the issue.

Honestly the new relic quests are VERY similar to how magian trial weapon stuff worked in FFXI, so I'm already a little numb to silly requirements for minimal gains.

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Originally Posted by Doki

The atma gathering only took me a little more than a day of off & on farming inbetween capping new tomes and other distractions. It offered a real reason to continue progress towards my 3k fate achievement as well. It also worked well for getting my chocobo companion the kill count it needed for the weekly challenge log bonus xp. I also spirt bound a full set of random pinks I had accumulated from treasure maps. I actually ran into a handful of FATEs that I had not encountered before, so that was nice as well.

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I'm going on 13+ hours in one zone for one atma. Please tell me what you sacrificed to enable the RNG gods to grant mercy. Was it a full lala?

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

I'm going on 13+ hours in one zone for one atma. Please tell me what you sacrificed to enable the RNG gods to grant mercy. Was it a full lala?

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He probably sacrificed 666 lalafells to the RNG God. :p

I'm fine with the RNG value of the atma pieces, but people don't realize that pure RNG yields the chance of never seeing a drop, even if you did 250,000 FATEs in a zone. What SE needs to do is simply alter the system a bit so that RNG becomes more of a reward function rather than a necessity. I don't know what the drop rate is on atma pieces, but from what people are saying, based on numbers I've accumulated by friends it's around 5%.

My suggestion? Every fate you complete in zone X and fail to get the atma piece, your odds of getting it in the next FATE increases by 1%. This way, if you are indeed lucky with RNG, you can obtain it after 20 minutes of grinding. But if you are not so lucky, you're not spending 3 weeks in Western Thanalan with no guarantee it will ever show up. If you have to do 100+ FATEs for a single atma piece, you earned it.

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

I'm going on 13+ hours in one zone for one atma. Please tell me what you sacrificed to enable the RNG gods to grant mercy. Was it a full lala?

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All my friends told me I was lucky. I think it took me about 20hrs of FATE grinding over my long weekend (I took Friday off so I started on Thursday) to get all 12. The bad part about that time frame is I literally spent 5hrs in Outer La Noscea, 6hrs in Central Thanalan and like 2hrs in North Shroud. There were 6-7 of them that I got within 30mins-1hr and 2 of them I got on the first FATE I did in the area. Spending that much time fate farming didn't seem lucky at the time, but with your story and another guy I encountered in C. Thanalan who said he did over 250 fates in just that area and hadn't seen one drop, I guess I was pretty lucky...

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Originally Posted by Velox

My suggestion? Every fate you complete in zone X and fail to get the atma piece, your odds of getting it in the next FATE increases by 1%. This way, if you are indeed lucky with RNG, you can obtain it after 20 minutes of grinding. But if you are not so lucky, you're not spending 3 weeks in Western Thanalan with no guarantee it will ever show up. If you have to do 100+ FATEs for a single atma piece, you earned it.

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This ^. This is what I would hope for out of a 2014 MMO. The grind is still there, but at least you know there is some light at the end of the tunnel.

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Originally Posted by Velox

I'm fine with the RNG value of the atma pieces, but people don't realize that pure RNG yields the chance of never seeing a drop, even if you did 250,000 FATEs in a zone. What SE needs to do is simply alter the system a bit so that RNG becomes more of a reward function rather than a necessity. I don't know what the drop rate is on atma pieces, but from what people are saying, based on numbers I've accumulated by friends it's around 5%.

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All MMOs need to stop with RNG NAOW!1!! I really hate this crap. It's more like playing the lottery, than work. I actually think it should be RNG at first, with increasing odds of success, and finally some max number of attempts...

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

I'm going on 13+ hours in one zone for one atma. Please tell me what you sacrificed to enable the RNG gods to grant mercy. Was it a full lala?

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Call it confirmation bias or what have you, but I found that if I wasn't getting the drop after 30 minutes or so, I just moved to another zone. This *might* have helped, might not. Either way it kept me from getting too bored. The worst zone for me was Central Thanalan which I did last. Too many very low level fates with far too many blms spamming AoEs. That zone took me around 3 or 4 hours. East La Noscea was horrid because of the long run up & down the zone, but I usually ran to the top and just warped down to Moraby if it was in the lower half. There's no way in hell I'd spend 13 hours in one zone without trying to change something... maybe unequip/reequip relic weapon, change zone, job change, something, relog even.