Proper crafted gear?

OK, so I was working under the assumption that the HQ i70 could match Allagan/AF2 with proper melds, but apparently not? (like STR is capped at 12 for tanking gear vs 18 on the i90)


What the hell? I hope the devs are planning on fixing this next patch because that's bogus. Not only is it far more expensive to fully meld your gear, but it's actually still weaker than i90?! That's not what the original intent was with materia & DoH.

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Originally Posted by NefGP

OK, so I was working under the assumption that the HQ i70 could match Allagan/AF2 with proper melds.

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With the exception of accessories for a few jobs, You can slightly outlcass Darklight with proper melds on HQ Ilvl70.

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Originally Posted by NefGP

OK, so I was working under the assumption that the HQ i70 could match Allagan/AF2 with proper melds, but apparently not? (like STR is capped at 12 for tanking gear vs 18 on the i90)


What the hell? I hope the devs are planning on fixing this next patch because that's bogus. Not only is it far more expensive to fully meld your gear, but it's actually still weaker than i90?! That's not what the original intent was with materia & DoH.

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According to yoshi this was done on purpose and that crafted gear should not be better than dungeon gear... Why? Your guess is as good as anyone elses...

Please see my signature for more information.

So they straight up threw out one of the core aspects of the original game - lovely...


Why the hell do we even have materia then? At least in 1.0, melded gear was extremely powerful. Risky and super expensive to make, but in the end far stronger than anything else if you were willing to put in the effort. That completely sucks that they've removed this aspect and IMO is totally inexcusable.

Keep catering to the lowest common denominator guys...

Yeah, the giving of the finger to crafting and gathering classes is one of the primary reasons why my sub has been canceled.

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Originally Posted by NefGP

Why the hell do we even have materia then?

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People complained about the Risk vs Reward of Materia melding, so the droped the largest part of the "Risk" so they also needed to proportionatly scale the "reward" meaning that Ilvl have hard caps on stats (often allready hit them) and so crafted gear will never be better than any dungeon gear of higher ilvl (stat caps wise).

^ that's nonsense. Adding slots was just sensible, and you do realize that even on an item with 2 slots, those 4th and 5th melds have extremely low success rates right?

Assuming you're trying to stock it full of Tier IV (or V which is coming in 2.2) that's going to get very expensive unless you get lucky.

SE should increase the ilevel stat cap and bring back destroyed gear with failed meld.

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Keep in mind that failed melding attempts will cause the materia, target item, and catalyst to be lost.

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this should be back ingame if it is needed to make materia for endgame useful again

Honestly I want to play dungeons to enjoy them, not grind them. I don't want to gear progress a la WoW. A piece or two to compliment my crafted gear, sure, but- Soon enough I'll be forced to grind dungeons and suffer because of minimum iLvls. :/

I thought it was to stop RMT? Like, so people can't just buy the best gear off the MP and buy infinite materia to easily pentameld all of it the moment they hit 50 and be better than everyone who worked to get the best stuff. Same reason why dungeon gear is bind on pickup.

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Originally Posted by BearGrylls

I thought it was to stop RMT? Like, so people can't just buy the best gear off the MP and buy infinite materia to easily pentameld all of it the moment they hit 50 and be better than everyone who worked to get the best stuff. Same reason why dungeon gear is bind on pickup.

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But there's no reason they can't do the same for crafted gear. All they have to do is make one of the mats be a rare dungeon drop, bind on pick-up, and then have the crafted gear be potentially better. That way, you have to successfully run the dungeon instead of bypassing it with crafted gear, and then you're rewarded with potentially better gear without relying on the garbage RNG drop system; and RMT can't abuse it because it's non-tradable.

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Originally Posted by Lyrinn

But there's no reason they can't do the same for crafted gear. All they have to do is make one of the mats be a rare dungeon drop, bind on pick-up, and then have the crafted gear be potentially better. That way, you have to successfully run the dungeon instead of bypassing it with crafted gear, and then you're rewarded with potentially better gear without relying on the garbage RNG drop system; and RMT can't abuse it because it's non-tradable.

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This ^ So easy to fix RMT problems by making key items non tradable and only obtainable trough the winning of challenges , be it dungeons, bosses, or reputation rewards.

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Originally Posted by mmcsky

This ^ So easy to fix RMT problems by making key items non tradable and only obtainable trough the winning of challenges , be it dungeons, bosses, or reputation rewards.

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But then people need to level up a crafting class. Some people already complain if they should level up a second battle class.

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Originally Posted by Felis

But then people need to level up a crafting class. Some people already complain if they should level up a second battle class.

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Then stick to dungeon drops/tome gear? The only people who will really care are the min-maxers and they grind whatever is necessary to achieve that min-max anyways.

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Originally Posted by Lyrinn

Then stick to dungeon drops/tome gear? The only people who will really care are the min-maxers and they grind whatever is necessary to achieve that min-max anyways.

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Not true, I know plenty of people who min/max on say... PLD.. clears turn 5 easily. Force him to level a craft for "best" gear he'd drop the game ASAP.

Being a min/max'r does not necessarily mean they will do a craft. Only means they will maxmimize their gear as a possible. Not that this game needs min/max anyways >.> even non-BiS gear allows you to clear the hardest content with ease.

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Originally Posted by Felis

But then people need to level up a crafting class. Some people already complain if they should level up a second battle class.

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I am not sure what kind of people you refer to, but end game raiders have "at least " 3 classes leveled up to max, and a few DoH/DoL classes maxed.

They are just required if you wanna be an end game raider, everybody else doesnt have to do this if they dont want to and they will do just fine with dungeon rewards and token rewards.

My personal opinion is simply that HQ is to easy to do. My solution is to bring another row oh HQ like HQ2 or exceptional status. Those item could bring the base stats on par with end game gear dungeon but should be REALLY HARD to make. Lets say after you up to 100% HQ progress on synth you slowly gain an HQ2 chance on it. Capping at like 5% atainable only by fully melded crafters. That would bring a sence to crafting, because going 2 stars HQ without HQ mats or food is quite easy.

Well they do got a melding system in place so , They could have a base gear you buy from the market board then go farm the KI from a dungeon to meld it to make it a I80 or something good and maybe not have it as on par as a elitist gear that is out or maybe could have it as a elite style if from a nasty dungeon. Then ask some lv50 crafter to meld it or a friend or a free company person. Would just be another way to add some social aspect to the game.

The crafter making the base gear would need to get a special untradable ingredient to just make the base version that can be sold on the market board.

The "to stop RTM" argument makes no sense cause 1) SE failed to stop them 2) The economy is terrible 3) You cannot stop them anyway

I'm pretty sure the reason crafted gear is only as good as the worst token gear is not to combat RMT. It is so gil doesn't have a reason. This means RMT doesn't have a reason. You have less you feel you need to do as you don't need more gil than dungeons / quests drop. Unfortunately it also follows that Crafting will then have no reason to exist. I find this lazy, others find this the right way to go as they follow that with the idea there is no reason to raid if you can just buy. Crafters have their minigame after all, be happy with that right?

In any case so much would have to change to make crafting worth while.

First there would have to be far less max level crafters. Everyone having multiple capped crafting classes make the entire top end of the economy dysfunctional. So we'll need a level cap raise before that could be fixed. Same idea for gathering, there has to be less raw materials coming in.

There would need to be a big barrier to entry. Tedious and expensive leveling at the top is the normal route. They could do something unique here, but I don't know what and don't really expect that would happen.

You can get 100% HQ without all your gear melded now, which is a big issue. NQ is already trivial in most games. NQ has no reason to exist in XIV. We would need a big reduction in HQ rate.

There would need to be (using current available gear as a comparison) a few pieces per job of HQ + Melded gear that would be equivalent to Myth gear. Otherwise even with less supply there would still be no reason to get it, thus no reason to level to cap and make it. This doesn't destroy raiding, it provides an alternative for some slots and acts as part of your gear progression.

Itemization would need to have a big rework. What drops from where would need reworked. Gear checks would need reworked. Even though SE created massive potential with Crafting and Gathering classes, making them worth while and having a viable economy doesn't fit with the playstyle ARR was designed for. I'm confused as to why DOH/DOL are fully fledged classes without purpose, but here we are.



TL;DR: So much potential wasted. We won't have it changed. Meh.

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Originally Posted by NefGP

OK, so I was working under the assumption that the HQ i70 could match Allagan/AF2 with proper melds, but apparently not? (like STR is capped at 12 for tanking gear vs 18 on the i90)


What the hell? I hope the devs are planning on fixing this next patch because that's bogus. Not only is it far more expensive to fully meld your gear, but it's actually still weaker than i90?! That's not what the original intent was with materia & DoH.

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Not really.

Darklight was still better in 1.23.

And melding was a metric ton more expensive, because it blew up the item if the meld failed, so you'd be going through a TON of HQ Vanya Robes just to get that triple or quad meld.

They wanted this particular style of gear progression where you can use crafted gear temporarily then replace it with gear from tokens, and this is pretty much how it's going to stay.

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Originally Posted by Krokov

Crafting gear has never been better then dungeon gear. WoW dungeon was better then what couldnbe crafted. FF11 drops n djngeons gear was for the most better then what could be crafted especially Abyssea gear. Granted what you could craft was near or in some cases about the same as to the quality of dungeon gear but dungeon items have always been better. Think for a sec if you could craft gear the same as dungeons why do the dungeon at all? other then as has been suggested for rare crafting drops and/or to just see the dungeon as it were. I guess it would give players a choice but when you think about it more would just get the gear crafted instead of running the dungeon. Have patience I'm sure they haven't forgotten about crafters even if some of you think that way.

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Nope, they haven't forgotten about crafters, they designed the game so crafter's wouldn't really matter. See signature for details.

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Originally Posted by TrystWildkey

Nope, they haven't forgotten about crafters, they designed the game so crafter's wouldn't really matter. See signature for details.

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I have seen your sig. just because crafting isn't at the pinnacle if you will at the moment doesn't mean that it won't at some future time be better than what it is now frankly I like crafting myself so reading stuff like this that crafting is terrible just makes me wonder. To clarify I think crafting is fine and fun and in relation to those who don't like it there are alot of those who do like and enjoy it.

Can somebody explain to me what's the point of materia?!

Obviously you don't need good gear until WP but by that point you already have af or higher that don't allow melds.

Soo... am I missing something here? Why did I grind those classes to 50 if I can't benefit from them in any way.
Please don't bring up gil as it's already falling into my lap from dungeons and honestly gil is useless when it comes to gear as only tomes really matter.

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Originally Posted by Ed_N_Ants

According to yoshi this was done on purpose and that crafted gear should not be better than dungeon gear... Why? Your guess is as good as anyone elses...

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My interpretation is that he was trying to strike some kind of balance of relevancy between the 2. Make ppl spend money of crafted gear but if you want the best you have to run dungeons making dungeons not totally obsolete.

With the prices of philo tome mats being so cheap now, there is no reason why a new 50 job shouldn't start out in a full set of crafted ilvl70 gear. Are people really that poor or just don't want to spend their tomes that they probably already have on themselves? Is it really worth selling tome mats anymore? They go for dirt cheap on my server, if you want to make money, you do something else on Leviathan. :x

I know darklight would require less effort and you'd just replace the gear anyway. But really, it's going to take weeks to replace all of it. Might as well have something that is just as good as darklight, or better if you actually materia it. At the very least, someone just starting the game should get crafted ilvl70 jewelery instead of darklight so they can put vitality materia in it, so they can increase their health. This is particularly good for healers who have lower health. I rarely see this though. :/

But definitely, crafters aren't used for much, except maybe to make raid food. It's kind of sad. It's these kinds of things that I mentioned, that aren't taken advantage of that makes me wonder why people level crafting at all.

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Originally Posted by Yashnaheen

I'm pretty sure the reason crafted gear is only as good as the worst token gear is not to combat RMT.

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So much hyperbole.

Take a look at this....

1. DL Bracelet of Fending.

Vit :10
Parry: 9
Accuracy: 12

2. Gryphonskin Wristbands.

Vit: 10
Parry: 12
Accuracy: 12
Str: 9
Dex: 9
Det: 6
Crit Rate: 9

So, please tell me again how crafted gear is only as good as the worst token gear?

Maybe it's not the same for everyone but for me in most instances/raids there's little or no reason to take anything more than crafted gear.

Hmm how about this idea:
normal materia meld don't increase the ilevel. If you put in a materia with a higher stat than the cap during a normal meld the materia lose stat points. But the moment you put in the first forbidden meld the ilevel increase by 5 level. For the first forbidden meld the previous stat cap still count, but for the second forbidden meld the new stat cap count.

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Originally Posted by Krokov

Crafting gear has never been better then dungeon gear.

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you never played 1.19 - 1.23 I guess
Crafting gear with 2 or more materia in it (overmelded with the risk to lose the whole gear if the melding fail) were better than darklight gear (best dungeon gear at 1.21 - 1.23) for some gear slots. Because with crafting gear you can choose the stats while in dungeon gear the stats are fix.

I used this materia table to see which materia can be melded in which gear slot
http://www.mystina.ffxivmaps.com/Mat...%281.22%29.png

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Originally Posted by Grembo

Maybe it's not the same for everyone but for me in most instances/raids there's little or no reason to take anything more than crafted gear.

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This, actually, exactly fits the definition of Hyperbole. Whereas you decided to take a single sentence literally. It was meant to be and thus is not from both our points of view. In any case I can't help it if you have problems with abstractions and skipped the rest of the post.

xivdb is available to all for stats, the next token gear up is called Hero's. If there was more to your post I missed the point entirely.