I'd love this game, but it's not for me due to the "issue" with AOEs

Just ran Darkhold and died like like 7/8 times (lost count) to AOEs in boss fights. Every time I could die, I died. Healer called me "bad" and sincerely I couldn't argue against that, after all the times s/he raised me.
Just stating the facts making me unsubscribe:
1) Being a MMO veteran brings negative consequences, too. Maybe my reflexes aren't what they used to be.
2) I play in Europe. Latency runs strong in this game, and SE made this decision of evaluating player position SERVER side. Only game I know doing that. Bah.
3) Don't know whether 1 or 2 is the reason I get killed, and don't care: either way can't do anything about that. Can't get younger nor instil some sense into the devs.
4) Can't play a game where people say: "Oh noes, Goodberry again. We aren't going to make it with her." Usually mantra is like: "Oh, we have 'Berry. This is going to be fast." So, returning to games where I am not a liability for groups. My subscription here ends in a couple weeks. Have fun. :P

They are supposed to address the issue with the server detecting your position better in the update, but I do feel your pain. Wanderer's Palace for one. I have run it many times but sometimes on the first boss I just can't seem to get out of his circles. I would suggest watching the forums and see if things really do change for the better and maybe give it another month try out if you decide they have made some positive changes. :)

im playing from Thailand with a ping that is often above 500
the only place i had big issues was titan HM
although i would get hit by AE in most dungeons it rarely killed me
i now subscribe to WTfast and it is REALLY helping me, i went from being hit by AE 5 times in one WP run, to being hit once in 5 runs
WTfast has a 30 day free trial, try it out, i am definitely going to subscribe once my free trial runs out

I understand your pain. There were a couple of very large threads dedicated to just the issue you are describing (like 160+ pages) a bit earlier. Then Yoshi made a statement in the live letter and most of us are just waiting to see how things pan out. Basically what is happening is the server is deciding when the AOE ended, and using whatever information it currently has on your position to dictate whether you got hit by the AOE or not (from my understanding in other MMOs, the client can make the decision for whether you got hit or not, which is why the problem isn't seen in other MMOs). Whether the AOE has casted on your screen, when it ended on your screen, and your position on your screen when it ended don't really come into play unless all that stuff has made it back to the server by the time it does it's calculations. In cases of mid-high latency, updated positioning doesn't get there in time and players end up hit when they did actually move out of effects.

To address the issue, SE is going to be increasing the amount of times per second the client sends positional information to the server. It's going from .3 to .1 seconds. They did say that the fix is going to be applied to end game instances, including PvP, and that they can't extend it to all areas without putting their servers under extreme load. I'm not sure how far that stretches. To fix the underlying problem (the way in which the game was coded), they would need to invest a few million dollars according to a few of the seemingly more knowledgeable folk that supposedly worked in the industry, and that kind of fix would take a great deal of time.

Some things people have had success with (as far as being able to move out of AOEs) are upgrading their computer/modem/routers, switching ISPs, and/or using a VPN (requires an extra subscription). Some people also report that tuning your game options so that your FPS is set to unlimited can help, or lowering your graphics settings.

All in all though, it's a crap problem to have. Extremely frustrating, not just cause you see yourself out of the AOE, but because of the way people treat you when you inevitably get hit. If you do like the game otherwise, and do end up leaving, you may want to check back in a few months to see how things are faring. At least SE recognizes it as a problem. If you just don't like the game enough to do that, no hard feelings. It happens.

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Originally Posted by Wobble

They are supposed to address the issue with the server detecting your position better in the update, but I do feel your pain. Wanderer's Palace for one. I have run it many times but sometimes on the first boss I just can't seem to get out of his circles. I would suggest watching the forums and see if things really do change for the better and maybe give it another month try out if you decide they have made some positive changes. :)

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The problem is this shouldn't have even been a factor to begin with. Other games, even F2P games do this absolutely fine. It's obvious that this game is running on the janky 1.0 technology.

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Originally Posted by Arale

The problem is this shouldn't have even been a factor to begin with. Other games, even F2P games do this absolutely fine. It's obvious that this game is running on the janky 1.0 technology.

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I agree but there is nothing we can really do as players except hope for the best or quit. :)

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Originally Posted by Arale

The problem is this shouldn't have even been a factor to begin with. Other games, even F2P games do this absolutely fine. It's obvious that this game is running on the janky 1.0 technology.

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It's a specific type of server-client paradigm that they've chosen here. When connections are working well it is technically the best method to use, and theoretically prevents many forms of cheating by default. No other MMO to my knowledge uses it to my knowledge though, that is why you never see it anywhere else. It's not Janky or even 1.0 technology.

If ur too old and slow, then there's nothing they or you can do to change your slow reaction. If ur getting latency from EU, you could try battleping or wtfast. I heard greats things about them from a lot of people. They eliminate any lag u get from being too far away from the servers. The game is meant to be played with little to zero lag. Dodging AOEs require quick reaction. If they made the game too easy by making the AOE really easy to dodge, then there's really no point for me and many of us to play.

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Originally Posted by Wobble

Wanderer's Palace for one. I have run it many times but sometimes on the first boss I just can't seem to get out of his circles.

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The problem with this one in particular is that the casting bar is actually really fast and tricky to avoid without a decent latency, however the animation is so unbelievably slow and delayed it just looks awful.

Transfer over to Lamia and play with us, we don't care if you're bad!

But seriously, come on over and look me up. In an FC full of great folks - I'm sure we could get you back into the game. Nothing to lose, right?

If you really like the game, I'd give a try to a VPN service before giving up on it. I have several friends who use one and they say it helped improve their connection tremendously.

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2) I play in Europe. Latency runs strong in this game, and SE made this decision of evaluating player position SERVER side. Only game I know doing that. Bah.

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Actually... most games do that, as it prevents cheating. This isn't the heart of the issue either. It is a combination of the current response time setting and issues on your end, as I have played with many EU players who have no problem dodging attacks. Hell one person in my FC is from New Zealand playing on the NA servers and is able to dodge attacks.

The game isn't "not for you" because of an "issue" with AoEs, it's because of people who weren't nice to you (I doubt you'd be here posting if not for the jerks in your party). It's a shame you're quitting one week before they're making adjustments to improve the issue at hand.

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The problem is this shouldn't have even been a factor to begin with. Other games, even F2P games do this absolutely fine. It's obvious that this game is running on the janky 1.0 technology.

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Nope, sever and client were both redeveloped, it is not running on "janky 1.0 technology." Even with the issues some people are experiencing, the difference between 1.0 and ARR is night and day.

(If problem 1 is really your problem, then you should be a liability in any game you play, no offense. FFXIV is not really a hard game.)

Can I has your stuff?

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

It's a specific type of server-client paradigm that they've chosen here. When connections are working well it is technically the best method to use, and theoretically prevents many forms of cheating by default. No other MMO to my knowledge uses it to my knowledge though, that is why you never see it anywhere else. It's not Janky or even 1.0 technology.

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I literally remember this same problem in 1.0, although it was worse. Hence my reasoning.

However that doesn't make it Janky or even the exact same netcode. Two different implementations using the same paradigm will have the same paradigm weaknesses. In this case the paradigm requires the user to have a pretty excellent connection to their server or you'll run into more problems than most other players. Combined with a .3 second positional update (soon to be increased to .1/s in 2.1 for some zones) you can easily run into the problems you are seeing. Many users use VPN's since it helps them A) make a more direct connection somewhere near the server and B) bypass and traffic routing that the ISP's and backbones use between you and the server. This helps you get a more optimum connection to their server.

As others have mentioned, there will be a reduction in the standard response time from 300ms to 100ms for endgame content and PvP. They may apply it to more of / the rest of the game after evaluating its impact. Obviously checks 3 times as often will put more of a strain on the servers. The game should feel a fair bit more snappy when playing affected content after the patch. (note, your ping + response time = total latency; so under current conditions, some players with high ping might be experiencing a half second or more or of lag)

Never been a liability in any game I played or I am playing, except this one. Quite the contrary, I'd say. No, my groups have always been nice enough. As I said, I understood that (excellent, btw) healer's reaction. What really irked is that if I had managed to stay alive for a bit more on last boss we'd have completed the dungeon in time. I have some lag in other games but nothing game-breaking, as you CAN play them with some lag without getting killed once a minute. And I am not going to pay for a VPN just to play one game. :P

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Originally Posted by Mayin

Can I has your stuff?

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Nothing to see here, get along. :P

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Originally Posted by OmegaFlare

If ur too old and slow, then there's nothing they or you can do to change your slow reaction. If ur getting latency from EU, you could try battleping or wtfast. I heard greats things about them from a lot of people. They eliminate any lag u get from being too far away from the servers. The game is meant to be played with little to zero lag. Dodging AOEs require quick reaction. If they made the game too easy by making the AOE really easy to dodge, then there's really no point for me and many of us to play.

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As I said, have fun. I'll try to have mine in games even "old and slow" people can play with success... i.e. practically every other MMO.

It does get quite annoying.

Level 50 Whm with full health and a stone skin.
Garga-one-shot-I-Win in North Than, single hit and I am dead, insta porting back to Uldah. I was the last of about 50 people who had it happen. He rest when I died.

If I did that with AI, they would ban me for cheating.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

It does get quite annoying.

Level 50 Whm with full health and a stone skin.
Garga-one-shot-I-Win in North Than, single hit and I am dead, insta porting back to Uldah. I was the last of about 50 people who had it happen. He rest when I died.

If I did that with AI, they would ban me for cheating.

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Like most Chimera bosses in this game, they do Dragon Voice or Ram Voice. For Dragon Voice, either stay extremely far away or extremely close. For Ram Voice, stay extremely far away. There is no red circle indicators on the ground. He also does a frontal swipe that also has no red indicators that can 1 shot non-tanks. I'm pretty sure if you paid attention to what the boss is casting and knew what each of his skills/spells did, you'd be able to avoid getting 1 shotted.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

-snip-

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I'm sure you are trying to be helpful but the fact is, it's a cheat when 50 people get wiped because the mob spams one shot wonders. It's also pretty pointless. Can he be beat? I'm sure he can. Have a squad of Whm stand outside the FATE and raise people. Seems cheesy though when you need to sneak a win in.

Too many of the main boss fights rely on blap.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

I'm sure you are trying to be helpful...

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I dodge all of his attacks as a Dragoon because I know what his skills are going to do. Most of the time, I'm lucky and people don't use stuns and doesn't put it on diminishing returns so I can stun the Dragon Voices or Ram Voices. As a Bard, since silence does not have Diminishing returns, I can silence every single one of his voices because they tend to not happen twice within 30 seconds. As a Monk, I can permanently silence him so that he doesn't use any Voices at all. I mean.... if you can't stay away from his front or your teammates can't use silence or stuns... you guys will have a very hard time in Coil.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

I'm sure you are trying to be helpful but the fact is, it's a cheat when 50 people get wiped because the mob spams one shot wonders. It's also pretty pointless. Can he be beat? I'm sure he can. Have a squad of Whm stand outside the FATE and raise people. Seems cheesy though when you need to sneak a win in.

Too many of the main boss fights rely on blap.

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OR use the correct tactics to defeat the encounter. If you're dying, you're clearly doing something wrong. As Tenku posted above, learn to Silence.

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Originally Posted by Goodberry

As I said, have fun. I'll try to have mine in games even "old and slow" people can play with success... i.e. practically every other MMO.

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Practically every other MMO is just as hard as this one and most of them made in the last few years have dodge mechanics where if you can't do it in XIV, you probably can't do it in any other game. If you actually liked the game, you wouldn't be making this thread.

As it is, the trigger for this thread seems to me a few jerk players you met in a dungeon one time. If something like that can drive you to quit a game, then I can't imagine many other online games you'd last very long in. Sometimes people are just jerks. They will only ruin your experience if you let them. You say you've never been a liability in any other game. So that means you were a perfect player in every game you hever played and never made a mistake that compromised the success of whatever you were doing? If that's the case, then I only wish I was you- but maybe this experience should serve to remind you that you aren't perfect and you can make mistakes. You went 47 levels in PUG/MNK before being a liability one time if your story is to be believed. That's a pretty good record, so why are you so upset about it?

And again... The response issue is being given some attention in this upcoming patch. So before stamping your foot and running out the door, why not check it out before writing it off?

(that was quite a ramble on my part lol... perhaps I spent too much time thinking on that whilst writing at the same time)

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Originally Posted by EmSix

OR use the correct tactics to defeat the encounter. If you're dying, you're clearly doing something wrong. As Tenku posted above, learn to Silence.

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I know the tactics. It's called run in a circle pulling adds for the duration of the fight and if you are a stand still caster class, you either die or never apply heals or dps.
Oh and none of this has anything to do with the over use of AoE I-Win attacks from not a few mobs? But EVERY MOB IN THE GAME.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

I know the tactics. It's called run in a circle pulling adds for the duration of the fight and if you are a stand still caster class, you either die or never apply heals or dps.
Oh and none of this has anything to do with the over use of AoE I-Win attacks from not a few mobs? But EVERY MOB IN THE GAME.

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Those encounters are meant for a large group of people to work together. You have 7 other people in your party. Simply telling an off tank or even a dps "can you guys get these adds off me please so I can heal?" would suffice. You're basically having issues because you don't communicate with your team and you are trying to solo an encounter that requires a team.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Practically every other MMO is just as hard as this one and most of them made in the last few years have dodge mechanics where if you can't do it in XIV, you probably can't do it in any other game. If you actually liked the game, you wouldn't be making this thread.

As it is, the trigger for this thread seems to me a few jerk players you met in a dungeon one time. If something like that can drive you to quit a game, then I can't imagine many other online games you'd last very long in. Sometimes people are just jerks. They will only ruin your experience if you let them. You say you've never been a liability in any other game. So that means you were a perfect player in every game you hever played and never made a mistake that compromised the success of whatever you were doing? If that's the case, then I only wish I was you- but maybe this experience should serve to remind you that you aren't perfect and you can make mistakes. You went 47 levels in PUG/MNK before being a liability one time if your story is to be believed. That's a pretty good record, so why are you so upset about it?

And again... The response issue is being given some attention in this upcoming patch. So before stamping your foot and running out the door, why not check it out before writing it off?

(that was quite a ramble on my part lol... perhaps I spent too much time thinking on that whilst writing at the same time)

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I call BS on all of this. XIV is by far the most unresponsive game I've played in all my years playing MMOs. And this is counting games from China, Korea and Japan (and a few F2P) with pings well above the 300ms mark.

You may want to make it sound like only bad players can't avoid AoEs in this game or that they must be really touchy to not enjoy playing in such unresponsive conditions, but that is precisely what should not be required in a game like this. Also BS is the implication that not being able to play this game due to this issue means you can't play any other game, specially considering even the worst F2P game I've played is more responsive than XIV.

As for waiting to see if this issue is resolved in the update one can do that perfectly well without having to give SE more money while they work on it. Once the patch is out and people report it's been fixed players who quit for this reason can resub if they feel confident enough it's been resolved, instead of paying to be frustrated while they fix it, if they actually manage to do it.

As for me I'm just refraining from tanking in a group while this issue is fixed, and leveling my GLA through FATEs. If SE fixes the issue then I'll start doing higher level dungeons to practice my tanking, otherwise I'm going DD next. Specifically lolWyvernlessDRG. d(^^d)

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Originally Posted by Tenku

Those encounters are meant for a large group of people to work together. You have 7 other people in your party. Simply telling an off tank or even a dps "can you guys get these adds off me please so I can heal?" would suffice. You're basically having issues because you don't communicate with your team and you are trying to solo an encounter that requires a team.

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LMAO. Lets add typing to the to do list here.
So now I am running out of a Boss I-Win attack, dodging adds, healing party, communicating aggro to dps.

Got anything else you might want me to do while I'm at it? I should be getting paid to do this stuff. I could blind fold a special Ops in Nigeria with this kind of mutli tasking skills.

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I call BS on all of this. XIV is by far the most unresponsive game I've played in all my years playing MMOs. And this is counting games from China, Korea and Japan (and a few F2P) with pings well above the 300ms mark.

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I call BS on your BS. At a bare minimum, FFXI is definitely less responsive. If you don't think so, then you haven't played it. Also it's pretty much impossible for a game you're getting 300ms+ pings on to be more responsive. ~100 ping + 300ms response = 400ms...I've never experienced a half second difference when trying to escape from an AoE. Now, this isn't to say that *certain people / certain ISP*s are having difficulties, and there is a genuine issue there, but I'm not experiencing it. It doesn't affect everyone and there's only so much SE can do about it. Many of the korean games I've played have crap response times but you don't notice at much simply because the client is given much more liberty to say things like "ok I hit the monster" etc and the server doesn't have as strong of a role. However, these games require rootkit-like anti-hack programs like Hackshield to reduce cheating because the client has all the power. In a game like FFXIV where the server dictates more things, you are more limited in what you can do with clientside hacks (and what things are accessible by the client have been exploited to hack and cheat, so that should tell you how easy it is to manipulate information that the server gives the client free access to).

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You may want to make it sound like only bad players can't avoid AoEs in this game

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No, I know some people are experiencing issues they have little capacity to control, but most people I know aren't having these issues (the people not having these issues are not complaining and thus you won't see them posting here). The fact that VPNs can mostly erase this issue shows that its not really a response time issue that the people having problems are experiencing.

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As for waiting to see if this issue is resolved in the update one can do that perfectly well without having to give SE more money while they work on it.

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The OP said his sub was ending in a few weeks. He doesn't have to give SE more money before finding out if the patch addresses his complaints.

All I'm seeing here is somebody having one bad experience in a party (He never cited any other examples of him dying lots / playing bad / etc and getting raged at for it, which is really more of a community problem than a game problem) and having a knee-jerk reaction to it.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I call BS on your BS. At a bare minimum, FFXI is definitely less responsive. If you don't think so, then you haven't played it. Also it's pretty much impossible for a game you're getting 300ms+ pings on to be more responsive. ~100 ping + 300ms response = 400ms...I've never experienced a half second difference when trying to escape from an AoE. Now, this isn't to say that *certain people / certain ISP*s are having difficulties, and there is a genuine issue there, but I'm not experiencing it. It doesn't affect everyone and there's only so much SE can do about it.


No, I know some people are experiencing issues they have little capacity to control, but most people I know aren't having these issues (the people not having these issues are not complaining and thus you won't see them posting here). The fact that VPNs can mostly erase this issue shows that its not really a response time issue that the people having problems are experiencing.

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I played XI for 10 years, so I can say without doubt XIV is far less responsive than XI, not to mention even if they were about the same XI's system handles it better because it's less spam action focused and positional detection works properly. Not to mention XI is an 11 year old game, so having worse issues with XIV than XI (or any other game for that matter) says a lot about this situation. Also, the only unresponsiveness anyone mentioned came from the UI lag when trying to use macros, rather than latency to/from the server. This was easy to prove if you used something like the windower, where windower macros triggered instantly, while trying to press alt/ctrl to bring up the macro palette usually had a very noticeable delay most of the times. So not the same issue.

(And maybe if SE had bothered to give the XI team some of the money they were throwing away on XIV to fix that issue we'd already have the better UI we were promised more than 8 years ago. But I digress.)

Also, have you ever seen anyone complaining about this position issue in XI? Because I never did in any of the sites I visited. On the other hand with XIV it is mentioned practically everywhere a video or a thread is made about boss fights in general.

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I played XI for 10 years, so I can say without doubt XIV is far less responsive than XI

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officially confirmed, you have no idea what you're talking about.

*activates ability in XI* *waits* *ability takes effect*
*goes to do same in XIV*
XIV was faster by miles.

And yes, I did that just now.

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Also, have you ever seen anyone complaining about this position issue in XI?

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Nope, and that's only because position is almost never important in XI. I'm actually complaining about it right now though, as I actually have to walk in front of a monster that's walking around and swat at the air in order to hit it in XI- If I autofollow behind a monster I can't hit it at all until it comes to a stop. Whereas in XIV, I can chase a monster from behind and hit it as I should be able to.

Beyond that, you don't have range indicators in XI, so it is much harder to judge if you're running out of range of an AoE quickly enough as you can't be sure of exactly where the edge is when you're running.

Perform simple actions in XI, such as equpping or unequipping an item. Observe the time it takes between pressing the button and the swap taking place. Do the same thing in XIV. XIV again is the clear winner. (It takes around 1 full second maybe more in XI- I've never had any kind of action lag by that length of time in XIV)

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Heheh again, even if what you say was true (and it isn't) XI is an 11 year old game.

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It is true no matter how much you want to deny it, and age has nothing to do with it. The poster made an assertion that there is no game with a worse response time, which is completely and blatantly false. He hasn't made an objective fair comparison with statistical data/testing, video evidence, or anything else to support the claim, while I personally do not experience the level of latency/lack of response the poster is claiming to have.

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So how exactly would being "the clear winner" help XIV when it's issues are bad enough to prevent a significant number of players from actually playing the game in a decent manner?

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Not everyone is having the issue, so it's clearly not a simple issue of FFXIV just being horrendous. If VPNs fix the issue for people, then that points to something not directly to do with the game itself as a cause.

It's pretty funny though how when my experience and active testing proves you wrong, you cop out with "but FFXI is 11 years old!"

Heheh again, even if what you say was true (and it isn't) XI is an 11 year old game. So how exactly would being "the clear winner" help XIV when it's issues are bad enough to prevent a significant number of players from actually playing the game in a decent manner? Specially considering said issues had little impact in XI, and they are nowhere near as bad on the real competitors of this game.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

LMAO. Lets add typing to the to do list here.
So now I am running out of a Boss I-Win attack, dodging adds, healing party, communicating aggro to dps.

Got anything else you might want me to do while I'm at it? I should be getting paid to do this stuff. I could blind fold a special Ops in Nigeria with this kind of mutli tasking skills.

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Maybe you should play a DD. Healing is multitasking. I notice that my reactions are slower when healing because I have to watch to many things at once.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

I know the tactics. It's called run in a circle pulling adds for the duration of the fight and if you are a stand still caster class, you either die or never apply heals or dps.
Oh and none of this has anything to do with the over use of AoE I-Win attacks from not a few mobs? But EVERY MOB IN THE GAME.

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You are fighting the encounter wrong. I did this fight the first day of Beta Phase 4 when no one even knew how Chimera fights in 1.0 worked. With a party of 8 people (JUST 8 people, we were the only people who were in the FATE), all in AF/crappy weapons, no deaths, we went out specifically for the achievement.
"Run in circles pulling adds" is not a tactic, it's causing chaos. You or the people around you are causing unnecessary chaos to an already (intentionally) difficult fight. If you do things like this, of course you're all going to die because you're playing the encounter wrong/poorly. As Tenku said again, communicate with your party (heck, even use shout to communicate with everyone) and co-ordinate stuns/silences on the so called "AoE I win" attacks.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

It's pretty funny though how when my experience and active testing proves you wrong, you cop out with "but FFXI is 11 years old!"

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odd, i played Everquest on release and i didn't have half these issues and its old as hell compared to this game. still do not see why most of these issues exist to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Ksenia

LMAO. Lets add typing to the to do list here.
So now I am running out of a Boss I-Win attack, dodging adds, healing party, communicating aggro to dps.

Got anything else you might want me to do while I'm at it? I should be getting paid to do this stuff. I could blind fold a special Ops in Nigeria with this kind of mutli tasking skills.

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How about tell them before you join the fight? You're full of excuses aren't you?

Is someone really in this thread trying to argue that FFXIV is a responsive game? Holy smokes, delusional.

How many MMO's have instant cast abilities that take a couple of seconds to activate because of animations?
How many MMO's have abilities that you have to spam to activate because you were in the middle of some other animation?
How many MMO's have abilities that activate, go on cool down, but don't take affect (Hallowed Ground, Benediction, etc).
How many MMO's let you get up to a second of cast time into an ability while moving before canceling (some people can even actually cast 1 second abilities while running)?
How many MMO's are this sensitive to packet loss and jitter to cause this level of rubber banding?

With all of these issues combined I am captain no response.... just wait til next week and PvP drops on everyone's head.

enjoy
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ealm-of-Aoe%29

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

dodge mechanics where if you can't do it in XIV, you probably can't do it in any other game

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Not even remotely true. Guild Wars 2 is FAR more responsive. The entire game is built with the idea that there is no tank or healer and YOU are personally responsible for keeping yourself alive. The means to do that is very well timed dodging.

Seeing as I leveled most every class to max in GW2, farmed all of the dungeons and climbed the difficulty ladder in Fractals...I can say with absolute certainty that FFXIV makes dodging really, really hard. GW2 has the same 1-hit kill attacks as FFXIV does, yet somehow you don't feel like you got cheated on that game. When you get hit by it there, it's because you timed your dodge wrong or didn't react fast enough.

When you get his by them here, it's because the game told you .1 seconds before the attack lands that it is coming. Or hits you even though you are on the other side of the room before the circle vanishes.