Best DPS class in the game?

Too bad your monk has to be in melee range and behind the mob the entire fight or you're not doing anything. Too bad the fights aren't all WoW styled tank and spanks, amirite?

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Originally Posted by Schitzen

Too bad your monk has to be in melee range and behind the mob the entire fight or you're not doing anything. Too bad the fights aren't all WoW styled tank and spanks, amirite?

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You do realize we don't need to be behind for all but two attacks right?

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Originally Posted by Subucnimorning

You do realize we don't need to be behind for all but two attacks right?

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Melee range is still preferable?

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Originally Posted by Schitzen

Too bad your monk has to be in melee range and behind the mob the entire fight or you're not doing anything. Too bad the fights aren't all WoW styled tank and spanks, amirite?

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You have never actually raided in WoW if you think that last statement about tank and spanks is at all true.

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Originally Posted by Aicasia

You have never actually raided in WoW if you think that last statement about tank and spanks is at all true.

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or raided at all if he thinks that high dmg every 2.5 (really 3 seconds due to latency) seconds is > 2 to 3x as many hits for greater than half of that on each hit while being 100% mobile at all times.

Honestly from doing a bunch of endgame dungeons, I feel like (in comparable gear) every dps class is pretty dang close to every other dps class. Nailing your rotation and playing your class well are going to be much bigger factors than which class you happen to be, that's how tight everything seems to be. Sure some fights will favor certain classes over others, but a skilled player will make up that difference every time.

Basically, give me a talented player playing a "lesser" class any day over a "best" class played by a mediocre player. You do zero dps when you're dead.

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Originally Posted by Zeckz

Honestly from doing a bunch of endgame dungeons, I feel like (in comparable gear) every dps class is pretty dang close to every other dps class. Nailing your rotation and playing your class well are going to be much bigger factors than which class you happen to be, that's how tight everything seems to be. Sure some fights will favor certain classes over others, but a skilled player will make up that difference every time.

Basically, give me a talented player playing a "lesser" class any day over a "best" class played by a mediocre player. You do zero dps when you're dead.

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it feels this way because there is no accurate way to gauge the performance of the classes right now. anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

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Originally Posted by Dixa

it feels this way because there is no accurate way to gauge the performance of the classes right now. anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

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Hence why I said "feel like". That's a qualitative statement. See how that works. :)

Different fights will call for different DDs as they each have their pros and cons. That said, when it comes to highest single target DPS, that goes to MNK hands down. By quite a margin, too. The difference in DPS is more comparable when a fight has mechanics that force MNKs to lose GL3 a few times, but given a fight where GL3 can be kept up fully, MNK is ahead by a significant measure.

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Originally Posted by Dixa

it feels this way because there is no accurate way to gauge the performance of the classes right now. anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

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actually there are parsers giving empirical evidence showing bards ahead.

Granted no matter what class is doing the most everyone else will call it "easy mode" because of their inability to do the same damage.

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Originally Posted by GreenMagus

I occasionally see people saying Summoners are bad DPS, and some dont even allow one in their party.

They're not that bad, are they?

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Unless parsers are broken, Summoners does barely more damage than a warrior tanking.

Good morning all.
Sorry for my bad engrish (have learned it in Fallout1-2) but i need to ask somebody about dps parser. A friend of mine:) is using LogRep2 and can't figure how to check total dmg during all encounter (counting all mobs not just "Total boss"). It's possible to use calculator in that case and summarize all the positions but it's bs (brahmin sh*t) =\. Will be very glad for any tips!

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Originally Posted by Thotor

Unless parsers are broken, Summoners does barely more damage than a warrior tanking.

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I would not rely too much on parser data. Some say that the parsers do not account properly for DoT damage, which happens to be the main source of damage for the summoner.

As far as i heard, one dot gets tracked and the other (that does no initial damage) does not get tracked. As long as parser aren't really fleshed out, the parses aren't more than good guesses.

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Originally Posted by Usotsuki

As far as i heard, one dot gets tracked and the other (that does no initial damage) does not get tracked.

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Makes senses

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Originally Posted by Schitzen

Too bad your monk has to be in melee range and behind the mob the entire fight or you're not doing anything. Too bad the fights aren't all WoW styled tank and spanks, amirite?

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Lol monk has only to be behind for bootshine and true strike.

In fact Amdapor keep last boss monk keeps ahead of parsers by sitting as side and never losing a stack of greased lighting whole fight.

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Originally Posted by ilJumperMT

Lol monk has only to be behind for bootshine and true strike.

In fact Amdapor keep last boss monk keeps ahead of parsers by sitting as side and never losing a stack of greased lighting whole fight.

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Originally Posted by Usotsuki

As far as i heard, one dot gets tracked and the other (that does no initial damage) does not get tracked. As long as parser aren't really fleshed out, the parses aren't more than good guesses.

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WTF so keeping Touch of Death and Fracture all time does not increase my e-penis!?

the ffxiv-app parser doesnt even register bio bio2 and shadow flare dmg, i did 60k without them in irfrit hard same dmg as a dragoon

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Originally Posted by asyra

the ffxiv-app parser doesnt even register bio bio2 and shadow flare dmg, i did 60k without them in irfrit hard same dmg as a dragoon

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Parse? Because the last person to claim that much DPS turned out to have done 35k in Limit Break.

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Originally Posted by Usotsuki

As far as i heard, one dot gets tracked and the other (that does no initial damage) does not get tracked.

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I think that's a result of the poor combat log in FFXIV. There's a lot of stuff that isn't tracked the way you would expect. DoT damage, f.ex., never shows. The way the App parser tracks normal DoTs is that it sees the initial damage hit (and so knows the attack landed), and then just manually adds in the DoT damage based on the ratio of the initial hit compared to the DoT. I know it works that way because it will show the full damage even if you land the DoT right as a mob dies. It also shows the full 6 ticks (18 second duration) for ARC's Venomous Bite, even before you have the trait that makes it 18 seconds.

For DoTs that don't have an initial hit, the parser can't really know the damage it will do since it's never shown. I'm also not 100% sure that applying a non-hit DoT shows in the combat log.

As an aside, 1000 character limit? Really? Whoever designed that needs a time-out.

Also, you might be able to cheese the App parser by just spamming your highest DPCT DoT and nothing else. Your true damage would be terrible because you'd just be constantly overwriting it, but given the way the parser handles DoTs it probably calculates them all at full damage.

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Originally Posted by PessimiStick

I think that's a result of the poor combat log in FFXIV. There's a lot of stuff that isn't tracked the way you would expect. DoT damage, f.ex., never shows. The way the App parser tracks normal DoTs is that it sees the initial damage hit (and so knows the attack landed), and then just manually adds in the DoT damage based on the ratio of the initial hit compared to the DoT. I know it works that way because it will show the full damage even if you land the DoT right as a mob dies. It also shows the full 6 ticks (18 second duration) for ARC's Venomous Bite, even before you have the trait that makes it 18 seconds.

For DoTs that don't have an initial hit, the parser can't really know the damage it will do since it's never shown. I'm also not 100% sure that applying a non-hit DoT shows in the combat log.

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So, it doesn't count critical on dots ? That means BRD dps is even higher than shown

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Originally Posted by Thotor

So, it doesn't count critical on dots ? That means BRD dps is even higher than shown

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Possibly, but if DoTs are being calculated as theorized here, there are some other items to take into account. If the DoT damage is just being added as an assumed amount, their DPS #'s in the parser may not be getting penalized for clipping DoTs before they've hit full duration.

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Originally Posted by Narcariel

Possibly, but if DoTs are being calculated as theorized here, there are some other items to take into account. If the DoT damage is just being added as an assumed amount, their DPS #'s in the parser may not be getting penalized for clipping DoTs before they've hit full duration.

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The FF14 App parser does not stack DoTs if you overlap them, but it does not seem to count crits. I'll test some more to make sure.

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It definitely doesn't count crits. And it does use some sort of prediction to determine the damage a DoT does. Over a long enough fight, it seems to be pretty accurate aside from crits. Would love to know how much damage I am actually doing <_<.

DoT tick damage is not present in the logs at all, and thus a parser cannot read DoT damage. The parser out there currently attempt to solve this by simulating the DoT damage - which leads to results that are more accurate than completely ignoring them, but overall still very much inaccurate. The more a job's damage is based on DoT damage, the more inaccurate they parse.

SMNs, BRDs, and BLMs have seemingly lackluster DPS values on parses for this reason.

We won't see reliably accurate DPS parses until we have add-on support.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

DoT tick damage is not present in the logs at all, and thus a parser cannot read DoT damage. The parser out there currently attempt to solve this by simulating the DoT damage - which leads to results that are more accurate than completely ignoring them, but overall still very much inaccurate. The more a job's damage is based on DoT damage, the more inaccurate they parse.

SMNs, BRDs, and BLMs have seemingly lackluster DPS values on parses for this reason.

We won't see reliably accurate DPS parses until we have add-on support.

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I agree with this. I noticed the same thing =/ Too much speculation in this threat without dead on dps information. DOTS play a huge role with some of the classes. wtb addons plz

Hello guys,
I'm playing my lv50 BLM, from my experience throughout 2 or 3 weeks farming at dungeons and primals, i think BLM need extra 5 sec to do optimal damage output (cast 2.5 sec Fire 3 then cast 2.5 Fire 1), while consider the RIGHT time to cast'em especially on bosses fight with so much movement (Titan HM, or Demon Wall, 2nd boss of Amdapor Keep).
Sometimes I envy DRG/MNK/BRD/SMN who can insta-cast skills on adds very quickly xD.

While i can do damage 600-ish on Fire 1 and 800ish on Fire 3 with Astral Fire 3 up(without Raging strikes or crits).

IMO,
BLM : great for focusing on mobs or boss with large HP,and AOE
BRD : great for small HP mobs and AOE, while supporting party
MNK/DRG : AMAZING single target LB xD, and fast-kill adds.
SMN : dunno much, really seldom meeting them at dungeon or primal runs ;P

any thoughts?

The answer is in the skill cap:

Bard is "easy mode" and can achieve near maximum potential with a simple rotation while on the run. Dodge and proper movement during any fight in the game has little effect on BRD's dmg.

where as

Black Mage, Monk and Dragoon have a much higher skill cap... Proper rotations are much more difficult to master, positioning to dodge and move properly can interrupt your rotations and throw them off.

Bard was always meant to be a utility job... why do you think they were given songs and a healer limit break?

As the other DPS jobs become more practiced you will quickly find them taking over the DPS king positions.

Really find it incredibly hard to see why people try to sell Summoners short.

I have a lvl50 MNK/DRG and i think on a tank and spank fight it looks like this:

MNK>DRG>BLM>BRD

I cant comment on SMN because my experience with that one is too low and the parsers are messed up when it comes to DoTs but they seem very solid too to me.
Now when complicated mechanics get thrown into the fight that cause downtime on melees or a lot of cast-cancelling to the BLM, all of that may change and for example favor a BRD.

I like this thread. People have been all over Bards for dealing damage, but it's more likely due to never having to stop attacking for movement/casting that is burning folks.

BRD has the worst dps out of all 5... If people know how to actually play their class.

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Originally Posted by Thotor

Unless parsers are broken, Summoners does barely more damage than a warrior tanking.

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parsers dosnt take into account dot properly plusyou have to take into account summons, as well into that

Did someone cast Revive on this thread O_o

All I can say is bards are the lowest DPS and black mage or monks or summoners are the highest.

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Originally Posted by MisakiSatomi

BRD has the worst dps out of all 5... If people know how to actually play their class.

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Yeah, on a training dummy.
In actual combat, where other classes lose DPS due to constant movement (melee friendly fights, anyone?) BRD comes out on top - mobility is too large of a factor still.

I think the fact that noone can agree on which class is the best and which is the worst speaks volumes about how well balanced and different the classes are.

Or it speaks volumes about how terrible the combat log is for parsing =P

Either way, I'm happy that noone's going home crying because their class is just far and away unviable or bad.

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Originally Posted by pandabearcat

I think the fact that noone can agree on which class is the best and which is the worst speaks volumes about how well balanced and different the classes are.

Or it speaks volumes about how terrible the combat log is for parsing =P

Either way, I'm happy that noone's going home crying because their class is just far and away unviable or bad.

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It's more the latter, IMO. Shitty combat log means everyone is just fumbling in the dark with a lighter.

SUMMONER BEST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111

your wrong, oh so wrong. SMN still tops BRD hands down... no question

It's like Black Mage > Summoner > Bard > Monk/Dragoon, though; a skilled/geared monk stacking skill speed can hit 300 DPS in Coil.

Dragoons can hit high numbers as well, though; they have to put a butt load of work into it, where as other classes don't have 20 button rotations to hit their high numbers.