Objectively, The Royal Managerie Will Be Nerfed

No shade mate you're saying what everyone is thinking. I'm not expecting everyone to be a brilliant player but not willing to learn anything remotely challenging? Pathetic.

It's been how long learn your class stop asking to make our game easier when you can't be bothered to put in the effort yourself
Get your dungeons drops, buy vendor food, use your materia hand outs and spend some time learning the dam fight.
It's the same instant gratification BS all over again from AAR, SE literally hands you guys everything and puts it in your nice new expanded inventory, holds your hands all the way through and you all can't be bothered to learn the dam fight.
I know I'm gonna get a bunch of shade thrown at me and negative reactions but it needs to be said...LBR nailed it 110% if you support this fight getting nerfed Your all a bunch of pussies!

I should hope not, pushing people to actually think is never a bad thing.

So, wat you're saying is that people would rather unsub than try to push through the fight?

That's preposterous and ridiculous. I've yet to meet or read anywhere about a single person who did or say they'd do anything like it. Casual or otherwise.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

So, wat you're saying is that people would rather unsub than try to push through the fight?

That's preposterous and ridiculous. I've yet to meet or read anywhere about a single person who did or say they'd do anything like it. Casual or otherwise.

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Never heard of it happening here. But in XI a guy I knew quit for 6 months because he could not beat Maat on red mage, tried like 20 times. I knew him on xbox live and told him to level samurai for easier fight. He returned, switched to Samurai, and won second try.

Of course on there the risk was greater. If you failed you had to go farm a testimony in the depths of an open world dungeon for another shot at it.

Here you can die, you don't even lose experience points, and can try over and over assuming no one else quits or time don't run out. I don't get the rage here sometimes. You don't lose anything but time, it's not like the old school mmos, where you had to grind levels or items to get another shot at something.

Bunch of damn babies. This is se telling you that you can't completely suck shit at lvl 70. It's unnaceptable. The skill floor of the community HAS to be raised. If you are having trouble with this as easy as it is you don't deserve to get to endgame and become a burdcon on the poor souls that may be stuck playing with you. Get better or stay locked out those are your options. Although you you could clear this with 3 ppl dead on the floor the entire time so I'm sure at some point you will get carried through.

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Originally Posted by Dizzy_Derp

Bunch of damn babies.

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From FF14 Reddit:

People who cleared TRM demanding that it be removed from Trial Roulette: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme..._removed_from/

Talk about dodging TRM in Roulette: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/6lndbf/discussion_its_time_we_stop_complaining_about_msq/

Hakul 41 points 6 days ago
It's worse, I bet most of these people campaigning against nerf are the same people who remove accessories to lower their ilvl so they don't get it.
People did the same crap with step of faith, a loud group crying that it shouldn't be nerfed, meanwhile every time they got it in trial roulette they would abandon it or would try to circumvent it with lowered ilvl.

DRKmidgetsnowman 31 points 6 days ago*
You want to prevent nerfs?
then don't friggin abandon the second you dont get ifrit normal as your trial roulette
soo many abandons on high end roulettes

HyperionMonsieurSM 9 points 14 days ago
Queue it with a sub lv 70 friend. You're welcome.

LoftySailor 27 points 7 days ago
If you don't want to get it in trials, just unequip stuff to tank your item level, then put them back on after you queue.

DRKCaptain_Lonk 6 points 7 days ago
Never thought of this, thanks!

[Khovel] [Ryuho] on [Diabolos]khovel 19 points 7 days ago
and now you are tanking sastasha normal.

ngelrugal 1 point 7 days ago
have never heard a complain except "lower your ilvl if you want to avoid shinryu", and even i took it as a ways to avoid the most difficult trial, not a whine

Wonder how much of these tough guys "lower your ilvl [] to avoid shinryu."

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

So, wat you're saying is that people would rather unsub than try to push through the fight?

That's preposterous and ridiculous. I've yet to meet or read anywhere about a single person who did or say they'd do anything like it. Casual or otherwise.

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Based on what I read here, compared to what I see in-game, I'm almost sure it's an exaggeration to strenght their argument. Like the people claiming there are polls that show how players are getting blocked to complete the MSQ because of this trial. Worse than Raubahn EX. Made up arguments.

I read that Reddit link and it's pretty much everyone saying it's not that hard and stuff just like here. Maybe I didn't scroll far enough but I didn't see anyone except maybe the OP demanding it be removed from the trial roulette. Everyone else was pretty much calling him a selfish idiot for demanding such.


Shinryu is pathetically easy if people just do mechanics. The dps check is practically non existent. All you have to do is dodge. If people can't even do that they don't deserve to play any of the content unlocked by clearing this trial.

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Originally Posted by Powercow

Once more people become better geared as time goes on, the fight will become more trivial. Even if only a handful of people know the fight well enough to not die repeatedly, people can be carried.

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The dungeons and trials nowadays have become harder hitting in general. I personally like the change, it's refreshing after all the massive tank pulls in Heavensward.

You might be right OP, you might be wrong. They didn't change Leviathan EX or Titan EX from falling off the edges. I don't see why they would change the Royal Menagerie.

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Originally Posted by Auteur

Wonder how much of these tough guys "lower your ilvl [] to avoid shinryu."

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You got it twisted, these guys arent trying to avoid shinryu, they're trying to avoid the shit players who can't clear it it's one imof the funnest fights in the game. Personally I love getting it in roulette it's fun af.
And the entirety of that thread was people saying the fight was in a good place cause it is. It's perfectly balanced especially for being the last quest in an and by far the best fight in the expac so far. Ppl like you crying need are the core problem in this community. You just want everything handed to you and don't want to work for it so now you want we to bail your no skill lazy asses out. Screw that, don't ruin the fight for everyone in the game just because a few people suck. It will ruin everyone else's enjoyment. We don't need players at endgame who can't do the simple as he'll mechs of shinryu anyways.

I shall share my First Time impression of this dungeon.

It sucked.

Before I even que'd, I watched a few videos, because everyone was arguing about it being too hard and needing a nerf, or needing to remain where it is. When we get in, I found, as usual, the video helped lots. I didn't make many mistakes. Most of them were more a result of not being about to zoom out my camera enough to see enough of the field to know exactly where to go when a big AOE was dropping (that second phase, after the adds one with the new platform and that first AOE that takes up all of it except tiny pieces of the corners). Almost all of the mechanics were recycled stuff from other primals and fights. Tidal Wave? Ahk Morn? Judgment Bolt? All very familiar, and I knew what to do for each.

No, what sucked, was how the TINIEST bit of Lag (and the servers have been getting hit with DDOS attacks since Stormblood launched) on even a SINGLE player, results in virtually a guaranteed wipe. People waste time raising a lagging player. Tanks don't get healed. DPS checks don't pass, heal checks don't pass, a tank gets swept off the edge of the platform and the other gets battered by the wings, etc...

It's terrible. Its not the mechanics that make this fight impossible, its the LAG.

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No, what sucked, was how the TINIEST bit of Lag (and the servers have been getting hit with DDOS attacks since Stormblood launched) on even a SINGLE player, results in virtually a guaranteed wipe. People waste time raising a lagging player. Tanks don't get healed. DPS checks don't pass, heal checks don't pass, a tank gets swept off the edge of the platform and the other gets battered by the wings, etc...

It's terrible. Its not the mechanics that make this fight impossible, its the LAG.

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Sorry but that's a load of rubbish. We did this fight two days ago and nearly wiped, twice having to use 2 full limit breaks to raise the party and we STILL cleared it. Done many runs where more than one person has died including both healers at the same time. I can't comment on a dps check as I haven't seen it enrage.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

DPS check is a bit early on into the fight. Gotta kill the adds fast, or else the AOE Shinryu does can wipe the raid.

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Ok sorry forgot about this one, although I still wouldn't say this is a harsh dps check.

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Originally Posted by Masekase_Hurricane

Sorry but that's a load of rubbish. We did this fight two days ago and nearly wiped, twice having to use 2 full limit breaks to raise the party. We STILL cleared it. Done many runs where more than one person has died including both healers at the same time. I can't comment on a dps check as I haven't seen it enrage.

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DPS check is a bit early on into the fight. Gotta kill the adds fast, or else the AOE Shinryu does can wipe the raid.

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Originally Posted by Masekase_Hurricane

Ok sorry forgot about this one, although I still wouldn't say this is a harsh dps check.

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Harsh enough when half the DPS lagged into death and keep lagging into death.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

Harsh enough when half the DPS lagged into death and keep lagging into death.

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Maybe it's different on your server, as I'm not seeing this on Ragnarok. I have done this loads of times with randoms and with my FC. Yes I have seen it wipe but not due to lag or even low dps.

The reason I see the wipe is people not going to the safe spots and ultimately dying that is not a harsh dps check. To me a dps check is people not being able to clear it due to low gear etc.

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Originally Posted by Masekase_Hurricane

Maybe it's different on your server, as I'm not seeing this on Ragnarok. I have done this loads of times with randoms and with my FC. Yes I have seen it wipe but not due to lag or even low dps.

The reason I see the wipe is people not going to the safe spots and ultimately dying that is not a harsh dps check. To me a dps check is people not being able to clear it due to low gear etc.

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Fair enough, but I tend to see Lag as the issue. People aren't in the safety spots soon enough and all. By the time a group is getting close to finishing the fight by memory after several wipes, the timer has pretty much run out, or a healer/tank leaves which prompts an avalanche of people leaving. Again, I'd expect this of an EX version of the fight. Story Mode content should be much more straight forward than this, though to be honest, I don't see a way or nerfing Shinryu to Story Mode levels without really taking away the essence/immersion the fight brings...

I mean, what do you do? Remove the knock back effect of Tidal Wave? Nerf Shinryu's AOE damage? The size of the AOEs? Downsizing the fight doesn't feel like the right move, but it is certainly unforgiving.

it's an easy fight that you can clear with no problem with a ton of mistakes, the only thing this fight does is keeps bads out of my expert roulette, omega runs, and ex primal pf groups XD

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Originally Posted by Vexander

Fair enough, but I tend to see Lag as the issue. People aren't in the safety spots soon enough and all. By the time a group is getting close to finishing the fight by memory after several wipes, the timer has pretty much run out, or a healer/tank leaves which prompts an avalanche of people leaving. Again, I'd expect this of an EX version of the fight. Story Mode content should be much more straight forward than this, though to be honest, I don't see a way or nerfing Shinryu to Story Mode levels without really taking away the essence/immersion the fight brings...

I mean, what do you do? Remove the knock back effect of Tidal Wave? Nerf Shinryu's AOE damage? The size of the AOEs? Downsizing the fight doesn't feel like the right move, but it is certainly unforgiving.

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If lag is an issue, Why are others on your server/datacentre not complaining about lag in the fight? Only going by others players in the thread.

No wonder cars don't exist in this game..way too many barely understand simple mechanics..

Ppl who bitch about ex primals now and to come obviously never did thordan ex when it was relevant. Fucking grow a pair geeze not all of us like playimg a game on the easiest difficulty setting ffs. If this was ff11 in its prime you ppl crying would probably be the ones still stuck in the fucking dunes. My point being. Learn your job amd the foghts mechanics and you'll quickly realize nothing in this game is difficult except for having to shit players. Go ahead call me an ass but i know im right lol.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

No, what sucked, was how the TINIEST bit of Lag (and the servers have been getting hit with DDOS attacks since Stormblood launched) on even a SINGLE player, results in virtually a guaranteed wipe.

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Incorrect.

Please stop.

i finish my first try but i went with 2 guildy healers that i trust and first thing i see when i start it 2 dps leave and 1 tank leaves still got it done though with only 1 tank but was rough

I'm mean honestly, shinryu is child's play. Not one mechanic is new or has not been seen already, and really if you made it this far in level AND story then this shouldn't even be an issue for anyone.

It's almost August. There are still people struggling to clear this...?

• Fully blind barely geared pug groups for sure might have had a battle with this fight (and a blast! if you leave the salt at the door).
• Fully geared guild and close friend groups which know each other and share hints, tips and tricks on voice chat will call it easy.

This means the fight will be near perfect for about 80 percent of the player-base… and a near perfect result if you consider the above statements as expected outcomes by the devs!

An awesome and outstanding performance from the dev team. Honestly as the ending MSQ fight this was near perfect. Well done. Well done. :)

Shinryu doesn't need to be nerfed. It'll get easier as people gear up, sadly.

Solo tanked it the other day. Went in with 5 dps.
One healer was passing every mechanic, so I'm going to say I only had 1.5 healers on me lol
Many of the DPS also got hit with this and that.

It's still very easy, we one-shot it.

Helped a friend with a clear last week while on my white mage. First try no problem. If 4 people can clear this, why would anyone want to nerf it for 8? Please, just stop. It's the right balance of mechanics and is the most fun I've had since Titan.

it is harder than any other story trial yes, but considering how gear scaling is coming there won't be need for any nerf, actually I think they'll nerf it with echo

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Originally Posted by Croweyes

I'm mean honestly, shinryu is child's play. Not one mechanic is new or has not been seen already, and really if you made it this far in level AND story then this shouldn't even be an issue for anyone.

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I blame Class to 60 buying, i had a Heal in Sephirot, random Primae DF, and he complained how unforgiveable the game is to new players.

THIS is the problem, i curse this Class buyable thing, people should atleast play once to 50 then able to buy another class, not from zero.

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Originally Posted by Saix027

I blame Class to 60 buying, i had a Heal in Sephirot, random Primae DF, and he complained how unforgiveable the game is to new players.

THIS is the problem, i curse this Class buyable thing, people should atleast play once to 50 then able to buy another class, not from zero.

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You honesty blame 60 class buying? Did u know 90% of the players who entered shinryu within a month after release of SB had more than 1 lvl 60+? Those players are those who keep saying its elitist to try, it's sickness blabla to even try. You see it everywhere. Players who say this needs a nerf are those who often complains they cant do it = nerf, which means they put almost no effort into it.

It's a fun but long fight. Perhaps reducing his overall hp to shorten the fight would help a bit.

I stayed away from this topic, but I'll throw in my 2cents.

It's a mechanic heavy fight and a little bit of an endurance fight. As PUG tanks and healers gear up the fight becomes easier for them and that might ease the overall difficulty for groups as a whole. But of course, the total lack of incentive to return to this fight doesn't help bring well geared players back.

From the point of view of players encountering this with level 68 gear with a few lvl 69 pieces, this is a rough fight. But it is doable. So, I don't really think that the fight overall needs to be nerfed.

However, For players who lack fast reflexes or muscle memory, it could be a problem and could easily become a blocker to progress beyond. I don't think that we need to have trails in the story that are blockers in that way. Frustrating your customers as they reach the pinnacle of the story in your game is bad business. So I do think that what would be a good overall solution would be;

Allow Echo to be applied after 15 minutes, increasing with each successive wipe in 5% increments to a max of 20 %.

Secondly, increase the time between the mechanics that Shinryu throws out very close together. Give players an extra half second to respond appropriately. Don't alter the mechanics themselves, just the tightness of the timing. with the changes in the NA data center and people moving around some players have more ping time than they did before, and the timing of the mechanics could be too tight for them. This shouldn't affect more than a couple of mechanics in reality, but it should help players react.

Again though these changes should only happen after the group has been working on the fight for 15 minutes, and the additional time for the mechanics shouldn't be added until echo hits 15%.

IMHO that would fix the issue without nerfing the actual fight.

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Originally Posted by Nikolas

It's a fun but long fight. Perhaps reducing his overall hp to shorten the fight would help a bit.

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In all fairnes it's only long if people don't hit and kill his tail. It does a large # of the HP. I honestly think the fight is tuned fine, just people tend to think it's hard.

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Originally Posted by Dizzy_Derp

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Right, because players wipe a few times trying to do mechanics means that they automatically wouldn't be able to do it at all.

Give me a break