Put VIT back in Tank Damage Calculation.

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

So, if I'm understanding this correctly, the issue that tank players are foreseeing is that since so much emnity generation is built on raw damage output, that despite the bonuses built within tank skill combos and exclusive emnity building moves, there is a high probability that DPS will have their damage outputs so far above and beyond tanks that it simply won't be possible for all but the most synergized teams to keep hate on the right person?

Hmmm.... Wouldn't the inclusion role pools, including the new AOE provoke-like skill and everyone who isn't a tank having an enmity dumping skill sort of account for this kind of scenario?

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Provoke only sets your emnity to the current highest+1 so I'm assuming ultimatum does the same (actually just realized I have yet to find a situation for ultimatum), even after the emnity reducer and a whole new set of aoe emnity skills like Abyssal Drain, if a DPS is dealing enough damage they will start catching up and this issue will become worse and worse as ilvl's increase.

Number are not the issue here because if they increase tank dps then the bosses hp has to increase so the change will not fix anything

The only thing they can change is the rotation of the job itself making it fun

But keep their dps in check or else they become 3.0 Warrior where they out dps a bard lolololol!!!!

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

there is a high probability that DPS will have their damage outputs so far above and beyond tanks that it simply won't be possible for all but the most synergized teams to keep hate on the right person??

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It's not only that, if DPS are doing SO much more damage than tanks, like, say, 3-4 times more, it just becomes hugely unbalanced for any solo play regardless of the tanks ability to hold aggro. Tanks will take forever to kill mobs solo and god forbid they have any kind of HP regen. For the sake of balance DPS should never do more than 3 times the tanks dps. Otherwise nobody ever plays tank becuase tanks are painful and slow to solo with and level. Same goes for healers.

DPS should be doing roughly twice the damage of the tank or healer and not much more.

idk about tanks but as a healer I also MUST party for fate credit, I can pull the boss and end up silver even while dpsing/healing the entire time =/

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

Hmmm.... Wouldn't the inclusion role pools, including the new AOE provoke-like skill and everyone who isn't a tank having an enmity dumping skill sort of account for this kind of scenario?

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All it does is give you the highest aggro+1 on all mobs. It wouldn't remedy the issue at all.

Yes, all DPS have an enmity dumping skill now. The question is whether they use it or not.

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Originally Posted by YitharV2

All it does is give you the highest aggro+1 on all mobs. It wouldn't remedy the issue at all.

Yes, all DPS have an enmity dumping skill now. The question is whether they use it or not.

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Another good reason to scream at them!!!!

Okay, so I was on the right track.

And I don't know, I feel like the idea of mobs dying more slowly to the classes that can better self care (like a tank or healer) seems like a logical balance. Yeah, I can't hit that hard, but I can outlast verses outpower my enemy, I mean. DPS need to outpower before they eat too many hits.

At least, that was always my expectation with how each job works solo in the wild since ARR days.

Also, with the enmity dumping skills, we just need to start collectively holding our DPS (and healers) accountable. That's a tall order for some, but that's a method to ease the issue right there.



I'm probably playing devil's advocate here, but I just think that /maybe/ that was the balance and meta SE is working towards here.

Leveled PLD to 70 and now leveling WAR currently at 64, and I am not having any issues with aggro. Killed SusEX earlier today and there were no DPS close on the enmity meters, we were using Shirk too.

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

Well if they want to keep tank damage down, why not have VIT increase enmity generation for all tank jobs?

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I like this.

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Originally Posted by Yahallo

Provoke only sets your emnity to the current highest+1 so I'm assuming ultimatum does the same (actually just realized I have yet to find a situation for ultimatum), even after the emnity reducer and a whole new set of aoe emnity skills like Abyssal Drain, if a DPS is dealing enough damage they will start catching up and this issue will become worse and worse as ilvl's increase.

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I foresee only about a 6-8% increase in mainstat disparity over what is current with fending accessories.

Data to back me up:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

The equations to calculate future stats were derived in Excel and I couldn't figure out how to show them in Google sheets.

"tanks are meant to be tanks" ok. fair enough. However if they want to make them purely focused on tanking then they actually have to design mechanics for each tanking job that make the simple act of holding hate/reducing damage more in depth and rewarding as a result. Typically people don't like playing tanks because they are designed to only hold hate and reduce damage by pressing a cooldown, which is both easy and boring. It's fun when you start out and it's all fresh but once you get used to it what are you supposed to do now? just accept being bored all the time for the sake of the community?