Please fix marauder

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Peregrine

Just as thief spent all its usefulness points on hate control and didn't have any more left over for what really mattered-damage...marauder is a waste of a DD, stocked with enmity-generators and impotent AoE ability.

---

Which have the potential to work if properly-tweaked. Hence why MRD can be a working AoE tank (where damage done by the tank doesn't matter because the important thing is holding aggro from the DPS) with the ability to single-target tank as well. The idea is to say "GLD and MRD are both tanks" and go from there. Again, MRD seems to be partyl based on bear Druids from WoW due to how their abilities are set up.

Quote:

---

And the game just does not support, and probably can't support, a makebelieve scenario where a marauder would "shine." You feel free to come up with one and I'll give you a more optimal setup that doesn't include marauders.

---

Six mobs that need to be held in place while the AoE'rs do their thing. Mobs that won't die in the first barrage of AoE thrown at them. What those of us who played WoW consider a standard trash pull.

Aside from that, adds during a fight that need to be held in place while burned down by DPS that cannot be CC'd. It's more off-tank than anything else, but its a start. The class needs more work, regardless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duelle

Six mobs that need to be held in place while the AoE'rs do their thing. Mobs that won't die in the first barrage of AoE thrown at them. What those of us who played WoW consider a standard trash pull.

Aside from that, adds during a fight that need to be held in place while burned down by DPS that cannot be CC'd. It's more off-tank than anything else, but its a start. The class needs more work, regardless.

---

Marauder is a waste of a party slot in a fight where 6 mobs are being mowed down awake, because for them to be of any use, all 6 mobs have to be within that pathetic little cone. Good luck. I'll just have a gladiator occupy them all and rotate T2 nukes on them, have archers wide volley across the entire row of them which is the most likely pattern they'll settle on to try to kill your tank, compound dot's on them, and have thaumaturges help out.

In that setting where AoE damage vastly outweighs the importance of tanking, the marauder is simply an inferior AoE'er. Better to get a real tank and real AoE'ers and leave the marauder out.

I already said that marauders who think they used to shine at the multi-mob NM camps were kidding themselves. I'm not kidding. Get a real tank and a real AoE class. Those are the people who shine at those camps, not marauder. Marauder just kindof suffices at both.

Being the best inferior job at both the required roles in a fight does not equal shining in a fight. Gladiato+1st class AoE'ers > Marauder trying to do both while the real AoE'ers spend too much time curing them.

Off-tank=useless role that no one needs you for. Sleep the adds.

Fact remains that there is NO situation where a marauder shines. The only situation that the job thinks its good at, it's not. Marauder tries to combine it's only two remotely pheasible claims into a situation where it shines, and in that situation they're just inferior at everything they do, which is tank and AoE.

Being a 2nd class tank and 2nd class AoE'er is never going to combine to get you something that's worth more than a 1st class tank and 1st class AoE'er working together. It's just not going to happen, guys. 2nd best is gimp.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Peregrine

Marauder is a waste of a party slot in a fight where 6 mobs are being mowed down awake, because for them to be of any use, all 6 mobs have to be within that pathetic little cone. Good luck. I'll just have a gladiator occupy them all and rotate T2 nukes on them, have archers wide volley across the entire row of them which is the most likely pattern they'll settle on to try to kill your tank, compound dot's on them, and have thaumaturges help out.

---

I'm beginning to get the feeling that you don't bother to read any responses to your claims. Either that or you're too locked in whatever mentality it is to see that possibilities exist provided you change certain things about the class in question. Or did you somehow get the impression that I claim this possible with MRD as it currently is? Far from it, to tell you the truth.

Quote:

---

Off-tank=useless role that no one needs you for. Sleep the adds.

---

Adds are immune to sleep and gravity. It is possible to create boss adds that can't be cheesed through CC and instead need to be AoE tanked.

Quote:

---

Being a 2nd class tank and 2nd class AoE'er is never going to combine to get you something that's worth more than a 1st class tank and 1st class AoE'er working together. It's just not going to happen, guys. 2nd best is gimp.

---

So you agree that MRD needs to be buffed in some capacity to serve a tank or DPS role appropriately?

One thing you need to learn about Peregrine is that they can't be reasoned with. They DO NOT listen or read posts made by others that have even the scent of disagreement on them. The immediately resort to Straw Man reasoning or Argumentum ad nauseam (trying to prove a point simply by repeating it OVER and OVER without even considering other points made) or they use their favorite type of argument; Argumentum ad hominem. Which is to skip over the argument entirely and directly and personally attack the person they are debating with. Logical Fallacies are at the very heart of every post this person has made and almost everyone would agree with that, considering the grand total of likes Peregrine has received is a whopping zero, on any post of theirs that I have had the misfortune to have read. They are a forum troll at I strongly suggest blocking them. I find my blood pressure and overall ease of reading has improved ten fold since I no longer have to wade through their psycho babble.

In relation to the original post I will agree that Mrd does need some fixing; however, its more of an issue of the battle system in general and I'm looking forward to the upcoming 1.18 patch too see what it brings. Essentially the main beef i have is that SE gave almost every class (more so Mrd obviously but besides the point) AOE ability yet they punish us for using them. Aggroing more than one mob doesn't result in more SP for managing to kill the extras, you are actually given just the opposite, no sp. Why give us all these AOE powers when you are usually going to be scolded for having used them save for a few specific leves or NM's? I predict Mrd's abilities getting an enmity/dmg over haul to make us more useful for the upcoming dungeon scenarios where (hopefully) serious crowd control and multiple sp mob kills will come into play.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Filtiarne

One thing you need to learn about Peregrine is that they can't be reasoned with. They DO NOT listen or read posts made by others that have even the scent of disagreement on them. The immediately resort to Straw Man reasoning or Argumentum ad nauseam (trying to prove a point simply by repeating it OVER and OVER without even considering other points made) or they use their favorite type of argument; Argumentum ad hominem. Which is to skip over the argument entirely and directly and personally attack the person they are debating with. Logical Fallacies are at the very heart of every post this person has made and almost everyone would agree with that, considering the grand total of likes Peregrine has received is a whopping zero, on any post of theirs that I have had the misfortune to have read. They are a forum troll at I strongly suggest blocking them. I find my blood pressure and overall ease of reading has improved ten fold since I no longer have to wade through their psycho babble.

In relation to the original post I will agree that Mrd does need some fixing; however, its more of an issue of the battle system in general and I'm looking forward to the upcoming 1.18 patch too see what it brings. Essentially the main beef i have is that SE gave almost every class (more so Mrd obviously but besides the point) AOE ability yet they punish us for using them. Aggroing more than one mob doesn't result in more SP for managing to kill the extras, you are actually given just the opposite, no sp. Why give us all these AOE powers when you are usually going to be scolded for having used them save for a few specific leves or NM's? I predict Mrd's abilities getting an enmity/dmg over haul to make us more useful for the upcoming dungeon scenarios where (hopefully) serious crowd control and multiple sp mob kills will come into play.

---

it actually could in the old sp system, and they say they will correct the one mob issue, but he is right, to use the aoe well you tend to have to mob as the mobs adjust, and that kills steadfast, i never got the skill that allows you to move while steadfast, but if it doesnt give you a long time, or has a long recast, its kind of almost pointless. It should really be a switch on off skill.
Also they would have to create content of high level with multi mobs. Not to mention, while before, one might say marauder or pug had better dps while tanking, without stamina, glads DPS is going to sky rocket, guard alone not having stamina is going to throw thier damage way up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duelle

I'm beginning to get the feeling that you don't bother to read any responses to your claims. Either that or you're too locked in whatever mentality it is to see that possibilities exist provided you change certain things about the class in question. Or did you somehow get the impression that I claim this possible with MRD as it currently is? Far from it, to tell you the truth.
Adds are immune to sleep and gravity. It is possible to create boss adds that can't be cheesed through CC and instead need to be AoE tanked.
So you agree that MRD needs to be buffed in some capacity to serve a tank or DPS role appropriately?

---

I read all your comments. You just can't come up with a justification for marauder's effectiveness. It's physically impossible, because the concept of marauder isn't new.

Doesn't matter if you can't sleep the adds or kite them. If that's the case, then you put them on the BEST tank and you get the BEST AoE'ers to kill them. Putting the gimp tank that can gimp AoE into the game is the incorrect decision in that case. He'll either die, or he'll not be able to hit 3 of the 7 enemies.

If you can't sleep the adds, even more reason for your best tank to get your job and the more dependable AoE'ers to get your job too. Marauder would be an undependable liability in such a fight.

Sorry. That's just the reality of marauder. You literally cannot come up with a scenario where it's a better choice than gladiator plus 1st-tier AoE jobs, because it doesn't exist. It never existed. Marauders never shined. Ever. Stick a gladiator where the marauder is and a real AoE job, and the marauder's shining now looks dull.

That's just how it is. Unfortunate. But marauders have to be honest with themselves. They're not good at oldschool dodore.

I'll say it again, because people still aren't getting it. You never shined at oldschool dodore. You were not that great a tank, and not that great an AoE'er.

Gonna have to deal with that reality if MRD is to move on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Physic

it actually could in the old sp system, and they say they will correct the one mob issue, but he is right, to use the aoe well you tend to have to mob as the mobs adjust, and that kills steadfast, i never got the skill that allows you to move while steadfast, but if it doesnt give you a long time, or has a long recast, its kind of almost pointless. It should really be a switch on off skill.
Also they would have to create content of high level with multi mobs. Not to mention, while before, one might say marauder or pug had better dps while tanking, without stamina, glads DPS is going to sky rocket, guard alone not having stamina is going to throw thier damage way up.

---

Correct. Not only is steadfast unreliable, even if you do move in position 2 seconds later a mob decides they don't like that and hop right out of your piddly cone area. You're not hitting 6 eyes at once at Dodore. You're hitting 3. The mages are hitting 6. The archers are hitting more than you are.

To work, marauder would have to have a draw-in ability to that sucks mobs up to its pathetic cone while mass-provoking them, and then binding them in place. That's really the only way they're going to be worth inviting for the things the job claims it can do.

Their tanking is sub-par, and their AoE'ing is both unreliable and sub-par. Those are the facts. They are undeniable. It is *never* going to work as designed. Marauder was simply poorly designed as a heavy DD.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Physic

it actually could in the old sp system,

---

No it didn't. In the old system you still only were able to proc SP on claimed (red name) mobs only, just like now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rentahamster

No it didn't. In the old system you still only were able to proc SP on claimed (red name) mobs only, just like now.

---

hmm might be so, worked on leves, but works on leves now. also you used to get sp even if someone else killed your mob, even if they were out of party, but thats a different issue.

I think they may kill claiming in open world, they asked some question implying that in the polls i think.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Physic

hmm might be so, worked on leves, but works on leves now. also you used to get sp even if someone else killed your mob, even if they were out of party, but thats a different issue.

I think they may kill claiming in open world, they asked some question implying that in the polls i think.

---

That's because on some leves enemies spawn in groups, and when you claim them, you claim the whole group as one and all the mobs' names in that group turn red.


The reason why you might have gotten SP when someone else killed your mob is because of action-based SP that accumulated during the fight, but it doesn't get totaled and applied towards your character until the mob dies.