I miss the old PvP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by aeoncs

That's an extensive way of saying "I sucked too much in 3.X to carry games, so I'm just going to try and ridicule the very concept!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!". Nicely done.
Kinda funny when people who had to wait for the rating AND skill system to change, so that you can reach Top 100/Diamond with a 45% winrate while using single-digit skills, try to mock HW Feast, especially Season 1 and 2.

---

Didn't play back then but it did look and sound 50x more fun than PvP now, but it was unbalanced and promoted the wrong mindset lul

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Didn't play back then but it did look and sound 50x more fun than PvP now, but it was unbalanced and promoted the wrong mindset lul

---

You can't even explain how it was unbalanced and if you say it looks and sounds more than 50x the fun how can you truly tell if it was unbalanced or not without experiencing it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Didn't play back then

---

And with that, your credibility is null and void.

I will however challenge you to back up the latter half of your statement and tell me what wrong mindset did it promote?

This is also an invitation to any veteran 3.x players to please confirm or contest your reply.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

You can't even explain how it was unbalanced and if you say it looks and sounds more than 50x the fun how can you truly tell if it was unbalanced or not without experiencing it?

---

Old videos and stream clips, constant conversations about those days usually mentioning monk and machinist lmao

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

And with that, your credibility is null and void.

I will however challenge you to back up the latter half of your statement and tell me what wrong mindset did it promote?

This is also an invitation to any veteran 3.x players to please confirm or contest your reply.

---

Won't bother anymore since all my credibility is null and void now, why listen to my thoughts

You'll find me a bit amenable to reason, that is, IF you can substantiate what you said despite lack of experience.

Miss old PvP is fine, we all do; for players that played since Frontline installed. Yet, do not over-glorified the old system because it was problematic. In 2.0, Scholar literally slaughter across the frontline until cleric stance is nerfed. In 3.0 warrior becomes king of the hill because of retarded pve mechanisms. If 4.0 is still using old system, the Ninja will the dominate because it has highest burst potentials within shortest time period. In theory, 4.0 Ninja can literally drop someone within 3s with stealth/ambush mechanism if that ever happens.

Keep in mind, no matter how loud you are making, it is nevertheless just an opinion of minority. Only 5% of active players will use gaming forum for discussion. Most of people will not use the forum if they are fine with the new system.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Miss old PvP is fine, we all do; for players that played since Frontline installed. Yet, do not over-glorified the old system because it was problematic. In 2.0, Scholar literally slaughter across the frontline until cleric stance is nerfed. In 3.0 warrior becomes king of the hill because of retarded pve mechanisms. If 4.0 is still using old system, the Ninja will the dominate because it has highest burst potentials within shortest time period. In theory, 4.0 Ninja can literally drop someone within 3s with stealth/ambush mechanism if that ever happens.

Keep in mind, no matter how loud you are making, it is nevertheless just an opinion of minority. Only 5% of active players will use gaming forum for discussion. Most of people will not use the forum if they are fine with the new system.

---

Wait wut, ninjas burst like once a min because bhava and assassinate cds

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Old videos and stream clips, constant conversations about those days usually mentioning monk and machinist lmao

---

Old Videos don't really give a proper perspective. If anything warrior like Divine said were king of the hill. But only if they knew what they were doing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

If anything warrior like Divine said were king of the hill. But only if they knew what they were doing.

---

Not only it was king of the hill it was pure monster and ironically you had to learn stance dance(where in pve you just sat on dps stance most of the time)or you would simply fail as half of your kit was unusable. I mainly played PLD, BRD and NiN in ARR up to early HW but when i got melted by WAR in one match it sparked my interest on that job, when i tested it and noticed all those skill synergies i was blown away how godly it can be. Then i simply started to use it and eventually everything was in muscle memorized and the hell broke loose, when SMN got the all "nerf" heat in HW i actually tried to point out that if anyone should get adjustments it should be WAR but it got literally ignored by most. Even today i can only remember few others who actually were a real threat while using WAR as most simply went "hurrdurr FC!!" and those were 99% of time free kills even when they used "most OP job in game", if that WAR opened with stun and popped berserk you knew you just won that fight. Not to mention PLD before shield swipe "nerf" could literally troll and shutdown whole berserk window with stuns and pacifications, all jobs no matter how "OP" had some counters so in a way all jobs were more or less "OP" thus none of them were truly "OP" in the end.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

Old Videos don't really give a proper perspective. If anything warrior like Divine said were king of the hill. But only if they knew what they were doing.

---

What perspective am I supposed to have?!?!?! Every class had 40 buttons, buffs indicted bursts usually, every class had much more utility than now, machinist could one shot, monk could mongo one shot, dragoon had a meme stun(?!?!?!?!?), monk could one ilm buffs off nyahahahahahah, the skill gap was clear as day and ???perspective???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

machinist could one shot, monk could mongo one shot, dragoon had a meme stun(?!?!?!?!?),

---

Both of the first two of these statements are false. Neither class could One Shot anyone. The only thing that was a one shot was Melee LB and that was if you didn't have any vit accessories or didn't know how to get out of range. Due to the range requirement most Melee would stun then LB due to it but if the person had on a single vit accessory that one shot attempt was wasted. Lastly Dragoon had 2 stuns and even if they did have 3 they target would go immune after the 3rd. If anything PLD was the king of stuns and was great to lock down healers from getting out of control. But that was only effective if the dps were paying attention. The way stuns worked for PLD was 4 seconds, 2 seconds, 1 second, immune. MNK, DRG, NIN, and other classes who had stun abilities were not nearly as effective as they would either be 3 seconds, 2 seconds with the 2nd stun being 1 second.

One Ilm Punch actually had use and those 40 skills not all were used and each class had a unique feel. It was nice with MNK having One Ilm Punch as removing buffs from the enemy was a great way to counteract healers and didn't make the job OP at all as you could only do it once every 3 GCD's and even then at the TP cost it wasn't effective to sustain.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Synestra

All jobs no matter how "OP" had some counters so in a way all jobs were more or less "OP" thus none of them were truly "OP" in the end.

---

This is exactly it. Every Job had a counter. As a healer warriors weren't a threat. As ninja, I just had to wait out Push Back and then there goes part of the warrior burst as any melee dps had greater burst than War itself. They could live in defiance and Inner Beast but that was only so effective for so long.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

Both of the first two of these statements are false. Neither class could One Shot anyone. The only thing that was a one shot was Melee LB and that was if you didn't have any vit accessories or didn't know how to get out of range. Due to the range requirement most Melee would stun then LB due to it but if the person had on a single vit accessory that one shot attempt was wasted.

One Ilm Punch actually had use and those 40 skills not all were used and each class had a unique feel.

---

Somehow I don't feel like you have much high level experience, I've heard otherwise.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

What perspective am I supposed to have?!?!?! Every class had 40 buttons, buffs indicted bursts usually, every class had much more utility than now, machinist could one shot, monk could mongo one shot, dragoon had a meme stun(?!?!?!?!?), monk could one ilm buffs off nyahahahahahah, the skill gap was clear as day and ???perspective???

---

Do you even have a clue on what you are talking about?
You are clearly have not played old system.
Under old system, every job has a form of damage reduction and it is quite impossible for any job to one shot other one.
Maybe redefine your idea of "one shot"? If you need more than 3 GCDs to kill someone it is not really one shot

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Do you even have a clue on what you are talking about?
You are clearly have not played old system.
Under old system, every job has a form of damage reduction and it is quite impossible for any job to one shot other one.
Maybe redefine your idea of "one shot"? If you need more than 3 GCDs to kill someone it is not really one shot

---

You don't know what baiting and/or trading defensive cds is then to open up burst windows

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

You don't know what baiting and/or trading defensive cds is then to open up burst windows

---

Ever heard of distance control and CD management?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Ever heard of distance control and CD management?

---

It's easy to know something, not as easy to simply do it in the heat of battle, but yes hello common sense, carry me to top 10. Oh wait 4.x PvP nvm

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

It's easy to know something, not as easy to simply do it in the heat of battle, but yes hello common sense, carry me to top 10. Oh wait 4.x PvP nvm

---

Oh? Monk, Machinist, and Dragoon one shot people in 3.0 is common sense?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Oh? Monk, Machinist, and Dragoon one shot people in 3.0 is common sense?

---

No common sense in just pvping in general, come on use the brain!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Somehow I don't feel like you have much high level experience, I've heard otherwise.

---

Here you go :). I will let my matches speak for themselves.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...onthly/201704/

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...onthly/201705/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

No common sense in just pvping in general, come on use the brain!

---

Oh, I do use my brain so I wont say brilliant statement such as "any 2 dps can burst down a healer" then backtracked to "2 dps can farm range" when thread is clearly about healer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Oh, I do use my brain so I wont say brilliant statement such as "any 2 dps can burst down a healer" then backtracked to "2 dps can farm range" when thread is clearly about healer.

---

Wowowowowowow my feelings!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

Here you go :). I will let my matches speak for themselves.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...onthly/201704/

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...onthly/201705/

---

Frontlines....it all makes sense now

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Frontlines....it all makes sense now

---

Which means what? I still have more first hand experience in 3.x pvp than you. Show me a video of a Machinist or Monk one shotting someone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

Which means what? I still have more first hand experience in 3.x pvp than you. Show me a video of a Machinist or Monk one shotting someone.

---

Can't be competitive in a hyper casual mode

:wave:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Can't be competitive in a hyper casual mode

---

You have just proven even further you don't know what you are talking about.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

You have just proven even further you don't know what you are talking about.

---

Yup, I can see why you guys don't like new system, once skill gap removed, you do get a lot of this type

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Yup, I can see why you guys don't like new system, once skill gap removed, you do get a lot of this type

---

It's not the skill gap. It is purely that it took all the fun out of it. 9 buttons is just boring... If I wanted to button mash, I could go back to up down up down left right left right BA select start. How would you feel to have PvE to reduced to 9 buttons? Toys are fun and SE stripped all the toys in the new 4.x mode. It is also insulting when people who never played 3.x chime in and say that 4.x is superior "Cuz videos".

This guy is going around necroing threads and picking a bone to get attention. Typical attention whore. Just ignore it lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AriaFairchild

This guy is going around necroing threads and picking a bone to get attention. Typical attention whore. Just ignore it lol.

---

Oh no no, I could use a little workout. Challenge accepted.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

It's not the skill gap. It is purely that it took all the fun out of it. 9 buttons is just boring... If I wanted to button mash, I could go back to up down up down left right left right BA select start. How would you feel to have PvE to reduced to 9 buttons? Toys are fun and SE stripped all the toys in the new 4.x mode. It is also insulting when people who never played 3.x chime in and say that 4.x is superior "Cuz videos".

---

Your opinion on the removal of fun is indisputable but you're also being ignorant and completely biased it's beyond irritating.

4.x is much more team based, more interactive, more thought process because of how much of a small skill ceiling there is. 3.x did indeed encourage the wrong mindset, the stigma of single handedly affecting matches by yourself, not as a team or unit like it's supposed to

Basically Crit is saying it's more enjoyable moving around the map like a herd of pre-engineered cattle all programmed to do the same thing. So then, what's the point of joining? Hope you have less bots and win? To what end? Is it more enjoyable winning a round where you only need to button mash and focus kill targets with the other mindless drones? 111 5 3 111 5 3 111 . Oh that rotation just gets me so excited. :) Can't wait to do that all night match after match with no variation!

Yeah frontlines is ruined and hopeless, welp.

Try out feast, if you don't like it then play another game for PvP

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

Yeah frontlines is ruined and hopeless, welp.

Try out feast, if you don't like it then play another game for PvP

---

No Crit, you're right I don't want to be biased. I'll just 111 5 3 all night long and pretend like it's the best thing ever like you do.

Edit: Also, i'll pretend like i'm the best at it.

That's the spirit champ!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

4.x is much more team based, more interactive, more thought process because of how much of a small skill ceiling there is. 3.x did indeed encourage the wrong mindset, the stigma of single handedly affecting matches by yourself, not as a team or unit like it's supposed to

---

Ye, pressing my buttons as fast as I can is such a complex strategy and so much thought process involved. With these changes they made it again way more casual friendly, which leads that even more of your "interactive, team based" gameplay objectives are just gone. Maybe the skillgap is smaller ye, but for the price that the gameplay is even more boring now.

They most likely won't drop the new map they worked on for a year or so, it has no retreat options, so respawn setting will stay the same.

I won't talk about how they can change the gameplay.
But for starters, they need to work on their PvP HUD as spectator in a custom match(on some resolution its way 2 big, you cant access layout menu in spectator at all) or in duty, the elements need to be resizable more. The jobicon templates have a transparent effect on them if the target is far away and are too small in the first place. They removed the medal icon for a medalcount number, it is not good to see for casuals what they should attack now. They don't know how many medals means they have a decreased dmg taken or increased dmg taken buff, you get that info only if you target the player, which is stupid because you want to know it without targeting and without doing math. Add the light medal/heavy medal buff icon to the name template aswell.

Could someone tell me what's fun in pvp? I'm quite new to the game, pvp especially, and I can't see more than one way of rotating my skills. Also why is the only CC I have a silence that doesn't even seem to do much anything. I have a total of 3 situational spells which all have long cooldowns. Why is it so dull?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

4.x is much more team based, more interactive, more thought process because of how much of a small skill ceiling there is. 3.x did indeed encourage the wrong mindset, the stigma of single handedly affecting matches by yourself, not as a team or unit like it's supposed to

---

You did not play 3.x and therefore you cannot accurately speak to whether it was team based or not.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

You did not play 3.x and therefore you cannot accurately speak to whether it was team based or not.

---

It really wasn't

http://www.twitch.tv/therealcurtyb/v/79126915?sr=a&t=1s

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crit

It really wasn't

http://www.twitch.tv/therealcurtyb/v/79126915?sr=a&t=1s

---

A. The PLD didn't cover the healer or protect them.
B. The MCH didn't One Shot the healer.
C. The PLD placed Full Swing on the MCH and didn't have any support.
D. The MNK didn't follow the PLD and the BRD was off on his own target.
E. The MCH was lucky with his crits.
F. The healer wasn't wearing any Vit accessories and set himself up for it.

So if anything you illustrated how a lack of team play allowed the MCH to burn down the healer. Which illustrates everything ThirdChild and I have been saying that any class was effective against any class.

Guess what. That strategy is all gone now.