Is our sub fee not enought

you dont need to buy anything from mogstation to have bigger fun in ffxiv. why the word forced ? i dont understand ...

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Originally Posted by ForctyusGold

you dont need to buy anything from mogstation to have bigger fun in ffxiv. why the word forced ? i dont understand ...

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This is kind of stretching it, but try to imagine this; you go to a steak restaurant, order a piece of fine rib-eye steak that is cooked to perfection along with a bottle of red wine, but just as you try to enjoy this delicious meal, you noticed something amiss. So you call for the waiter and ask for the cutlery but was inform that you will need to pay an additional cost for them. Now, nothing is stopping you from picking up the steak with your bare hands and chew on it directly, but it doesn't look elegant and you will probably get that delicious sauce all over your mouth, but can it be done? Sure, why not? Is it ideal, I don't know, you tell me.

TL;DR, people need to learn to see both side of the coin, and just because a piece of content doesn't matter much to you doesn't demerit another player's concern. And no, I don't think $15 sub entitle us to everything but I also agree the pricing on the kupo store is rather ridiculous.

Roleplaying.
Characters need to rest.
Resting includes lying down.
The base game lacks a standard emote in most mmorpgs.
The game is less fun to roleplay in if I cannot express my character in such a basic way.

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Originally Posted by SundayTrash

I can understand putting past events items on mog station, but new emote/glamour/mount that goes straight to mogstation while not giving active sub a chance to obtain them in game is just pure greed, and whats even worst is that most item are solely single character, or if u have alt or future alt u will have to buy it again.

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Until, and unless, users punish SE for this, they'll continue doing it.

Personally, I've sort of just tried to ignore it. It is absolutely greedy, but SE is hardly alone here; every company has realized that many customers don't mind being nickel-and-dimed to death to acquire all the content for a game they've supposedly already paid for. They also know that those who do dislike the feeling, tend not to boycott the game over it, particularly where MMOs are concerned.

Just a sad reality of capitalism. It's the gaming equivalent of a movie theater telling you that you can't bring your own soda into the building, and then turning around and charging you $7.00 for their own fountain drinks. Doesn't make it right, and it doesn't make it fun - but as long as the average person goes with the flow, it's really not worth digging in your heels.

Edit / PS - One thing I do that makes me feel a bit better about the situation is avoid spending anything myself. Additionally, I tend to look down on players using the mounts / emotes / etc. that are purchased on the Mog Station. Not in a 'they're a bad person' type of way, but more in a 'wow, that person actually fell for an utterly transparent money grab; glad I'm not them' type of way. I know it doesn't actually make a whit of objective difference, but it makes me feel better personally.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

[edit] Around 12:40, it's translated he mentions using the profits to add new things such as the EU data centre.

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More housing options ! Wait, do you hear that? ... WOOOSH! That's the sound of all those new lots being purchased under an hour of being open haha. I should make an instanced house billboard or something so I can post it on the fly lol. Hope Yoshida has seen Wildstar, or out of the last 10 posts that I mentioned it that one of our forum gods suggested they check it out (just the housing system, suggest the trailer its short and easy to see~ lol) XD...

Just to add though this link doesn't prove that cash shop was used for adding more inventory space, but that they said that they use cash shop funds for somethings (like EU server). I'm sure some of it is helpful to the game, and other games.

A random aside.. I've always wondered if these fan fests (not just FFXIV, other games too) could find a better way to include everyone (while of course keeping the goodies to those who get the virtual ticket). I feel its a bit funny that A. it's incredibly easy to get around these things (every blizzcon like 50 different options pop up) B. pay or don't be considered a fan (?). Perhaps besides the virtual reward they could add an after party instance in game people could join and give a bunch of fireworks or something lol, then allow a non-premium stream to the public on twitch.

Even though since I've made the comparison it's worth mentioning Blizzcon's opening ceremony is free, you just don't get to watch the panels which tend to have a lot of info in them too.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

This is kind of stretching it, but try to imagine this; you go to a steak restaurant, order a piece of fine rib-eye steak that is cooked to perfection along with a bottle of red wine, but just as you try to enjoy this delicious meal, you noticed something amiss. So you call for the waiter and ask for the cutlery but was inform that you will need to pay an additional cost for them.

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No, it's more like you order your delicous steak, and you eat it with every piece of cutlery included, then you chose a big three-flavored ice-cream with fruits, and the waiter informs you that there is additionnal charge for whipped cream. Restaurants do that.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

No, it's more like you order your delicous steak, and you eat it with every piece of cutlery included, then you chose a big three-flavored ice-cream with fruits, and the waiter informs you that there is additionnal charge for whipped cream. Restaurants do that.

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Depend on which cash item we are talking about. The new emote are more like cutlery while the mounts (especially the fat moogle ones) are more like the ice-cream.

And I just noticed this isn't the /dead thread, but my point still stand.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

Depend on which cash item we are talking about. The new emote are more like cutlery while the mounts (especially the fat moogle ones) are more like the ice-cream.

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Actually, I would say quite the opposite, since mounts makes the whole game much less tedious with faster movement, while the emotes have basically no "useful" purpose.

But since the game gives you plenty of free mounts, then cashshop mounts are more like "I don't want your basic cutlery which are fully functionnal for eating my steak...I want cutelry with diamonds and gold linings". Yeah, you're sure paying extra money for that.

i mean, its called OPTIONAL ITEMS for a reason

does it impact your gameplay in a significant way? no, its just something you OPTIONALLY choose to have for aesthetic.
was it at some time free? yes, you paid for sub for that time period, you get the items that come with it.

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Originally Posted by ForctyusGold

you dont need to buy anything from mogstation to have bigger fun in ffxiv. why the word forced ? i dont understand ...

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We all know glamour is the true fun in this game so.....

I don't get it why are you people so willing to give SE more and more money ? oO

Genuine question. Are the people opposed to the cash shop also opposed to digital collector's editions? For reference the Stormblood CE includes a mount, a glamour piece and a minion and costs 15€ on top of the expansion price. Exactly the same kind of things the cash shop offers. I was prepared to buy the CE but I think I can actually get some things I desire more for less money from the Mog Station.

What about bonus or promotion items that come with other products or services? I recall that buying plushies, magazines, SE games, Amazon purchases, streams, a statue and a soundtrack (and possibly other products) being the only way to obtain certain items or emotes in-game and more often than not they cost far more than anything in the Mog Store. Should these bundles exist or should the physical products be kept separate and all digital items be put in game for everyone to enjoy instead?

The argument I hear from a lot of people is that our sub already pays for all digital items. I'm just so confused why there seems to be an outrage about the Mog Station and not things like 30€ Caith Sith ears. Isn't it just as much of a cash grab? Personally I would like to have that item but I don't think it's that valuable. I think a lot of people had the same feeling when their only way to get the maid outfit was to buy expensive physical crap they have no use for.

So in short, my questions are

1) What separates all these other exclusive digital items from the Mog Station business? I'm looking for moral reasoning derived from the common premise that our sub should pay for all in-game items and emotes.
2) Why there is barely any outrage on exclusive bonus items and literally no outrage on CE items? This question is more about why people feel more strongly about some things than others even though they are very similar. (The link is a thread about wanting to obtain a bonus item separately for money, and no one pointed out it should be in-game for free.)

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Originally Posted by Reinha

Genuine question. Are the people opposed to the cash shop also opposed to digital collector's editions? For reference the Stormblood CE includes a mount, a glamour piece and a minion and costs 15€ on top of the expansion price.

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I'd be more at ease with the mogshop if they stuck to a release schedule of '1 mount, 1 minion, 1 glamour for roughly €4 to €6 each' once every 2 or so years.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

What about bonus or promotion items that come with other products or services?

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Don't worry, these are even more absurd.
People complain that they have to pay a lot of money for a specific emote or minion...totally ignoring the fact that the money was for buying a book, an OST or a figurine...

After all of that, I think the real question is a little bit different : Is your sub not enough to have fun ?
If your answer is "No", then you only have you to blame.

Whether or not the money generated from the mogstation goes directly back into XIV is entirely irrelevant. If XIV is generating more income, SE is going to be more willing to increase it's funding, bottom line. It doesn't get any more simple than that. If something is doing great financially, you're going to invest further to multiply those earnings. Just look at Stormblood - the budget was tripled over Heavensward.

Cash shop purchases directly influence that, as they net a lot of profit for SE. By purchasing from the mogstation, you are directly influencing the game moving forward in a positive way. Keep that in mind.

And of course, as has been mentioned countless times before, you don't have to buy anything from the cash shop. They already add a ton of content to the game in the monthly updates, one or two emotes every half year or so is a drop in the bucket compared to the actual content you get for paying your sub.

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Originally Posted by Endemerrin

If something is doing great financially, you're going to invest further to multiply those earnings.

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Mhm...actually no.
This is the standard for those kinds of things:
https://www.microlinks.org/sites/mic...ges/Boston.jpg .
(Boston Consulting Group Matrix)

FFXIV mooost likely is currently being milked in favor of future stars - the whole triple budget thing still needs a reliable source.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

FFXIV mooost likely is currently being milked in favor of future stars

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You're assuming FFXIV is a cash cow, though. I'd argue against that. XIV's profits have only being growing, and they even made specific note of XIV's success after Heavensward's launch.

It would make far more sense for them to reinvest further into FFXIV until a point where it's deemed that it's growth has plateaued.

Who leads ff 14 in subs and money wow does, Ive never played it Im not interested in it but the fact still remains its a cash cow, what do you expect FF 14 to be ok with just making profit to get by alone. This is a business mmos are competitive they compete with each other be thankful we arent free to play cause we very well could be let them make their money and stop complaining. Look at it as ff 14 is pepsi and it wants some the same profits as coke , thats all it really is them just tryin to have extra ways for them to profit this game cant stay small forever its to much competition out there so no the sub isnt enough because many other games have several other ways to make money so let this one do their thing geez.

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Originally Posted by Roda

Roleplaying.
Characters need to rest.
Resting includes lying down.
The base game lacks a standard emote in most mmorpgs.
The game is less fun to roleplay in if I cannot express my character in such a basic way.

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/sit
/doze

playing death have nothing to do with resting. And you can still lying down on a bed.

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Originally Posted by Celef

We all know glamour is the true fun in this game so.....

I don't get it why are you people so willing to give SE more and more money ? oO

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emote have nothing to do with glamour. Only with roleplay (if you want to roleplay a dead person).

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Originally Posted by Felis

/sit
/doze

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/em is also RP's friend, since the game can't possibly include every idea roleplayers have to express themselves ;)

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Originally Posted by Endemerrin

XIV's profits have only being growing [...]

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XIV's profits or the profits from supporting merchandise (Cash shop, plushies etc)?

I mean, I lack official numbers as much as the next guy, but judging from the unofficial censi, we don't have a substantial growth in subscribers and consequently no growth in subscription revenue. If then profits are growing regardless, chances are they are coming from supporting merchandise and from a business perspective, SE would likely rather invest in that, while keeping the game itself on a maintenance budget solely intended to keep the people buying the extra stuff interested in the game, so they keep buying extra stuff. That's not an uncommon milking strategy. And this is the moment where every conspiracy theorist can let their confirmation bias run free, because now we can speculate whether SE actually has done that of late or not.

I'll leave that to others. To me, SE's strategy regarding FFXIV seems very cashcow-y right now, but hey, we can keep our fingers crossed I'm wrong!

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Originally Posted by Zojha

XIV's profits or the profits from supporting merchandise (Cash shop, plushies etc)?
!

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what is wrong with that tho, as long as t hey are providing a good game, let those whom wana buy the extra stuff do it , seriously we get so much stuff I dont even have time to play other games cause its so much stuff to do in this game and Ive been playing for months. Someone showed me the numbers the other day dont think the are official but they make a few hundred million well wow makes more and thats who we compete wit so lets let the devs make more money so what its a business thats what businesses do. A sub isnt gona make them put everything in the game when they can make side money to , if people get mad over this I wana know what game they think does it better because all of them have similar practices.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

If then profits are growing regardless, chances are they are coming from supporting merchandise

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Not necessarily. We can assume that a month of development cost less than the sum of all subscriptions for that month.
So, with each passing month, the game's profits are only growing more and more.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Not necessarily. We can assume that a month of development cost less than the sum of all subscriptions for that month.
So, with each passing month, the game's profits are only growing more and more.

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The sum of total profits is growing yes. This does not mean that the game is becoming more and more profitable however. I do belive that FFXIV is most likely nothing much more than a cashcow for SE, at least atm, to help fund other endevours.

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Originally Posted by Yonanja

This does not mean that the game is becoming more and more profitable however.

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The ratio might still be the same, but this isn't what's important. FFXI became the most profitable FF of all time way after its prime time, only by the total amount of money it earned. And, if that source is to be believed, FFXIV is already the second most profitable FF game (before inflation).

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

The ratio might still be the same, but this isn't what's important. FFXI became the most profitable FF of all time way after its prime time, only by the total amount of money it earned. And, if that source is to be believed, FFXIV is already the second most profitable FF game (before inflation).

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but who are we to tell the game that enough is enough , like if you are making millions are billions why would you cap yourself and why would you want them to cap themselves. I am of the view point of any way they can earn extra revenue for making us a great game is fine with me wish more people would be on board with that they already gave us what 50 plus emotes the fact that the community would complain about one or two being sold just sounds spoiled to me.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

but who are we to tell the game that enough is enough

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That wasn't my point. I just wanted to say that there is no proof that the "growing profits" come from supporting merchandise.

I don't personally "like" the cash shop, so I simply don't buy anything from it (Except that one time with the Eternal Bond). Complainants are encouraged to do the same, while those willing to pay more are free to continue.

If the game is doing so well, you'd think they'd be giving the players and fans some fanservice, not like bubbies or anything but maybe a bit more references to other games and collabs with games they're currently working on. That'd be awesome. Anyways, Neir plzzzz

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

So, with each passing month, the game's profits are only growing more and more.

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That's not how businesses calculate profits >_>
Though in fairness, that is a clever marketing trick to claim your product is more profitable than it actually is, because semantically you're right: The sum of profits is increasing, therefore the product becomes more and more profitable. Which in turn makes Space Invader the most profitable game out there - Screw WoW and League of Legends!

When an investor/shareholder reads "more and more profitable" however, he expects the yearly/quarterly profits to become higher and higher, not the sum of them. And that means you need to make as much profit as in the last reporting period plus something extra. That's how profit is usually understood in business.

It might be that the person I was replying to meant the more misleading definition - in that case, naturally my arguments hold no water. I simply assumed the more common definition was used.

I can't recall who suggested this earlier in the thread, but I really like the idea of having a way to convert in-game gil to crysta in order to purchase things from the market.

The cash shop is obviously here to stay, and the prices just seem to be getting more and more ridiculous. I think it would appease a lot of the people who are adamantly against the cash shop as there would still be an "in-game" method (of sorts) to purchase the items. Plenty of other MMOs do this. I would imagine the exchange rate would be quite high (knowing SE), but it would be nice to have the option.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

More housing options ! Wait, do you hear that? ... WOOOSH! That's the sound of all those new lots being purchased under an hour of being open haha. I should make an instanced house billboard or something so I can post it on the fly lol. Hope Yoshida has seen Wildstar, or out of the last 10 posts that I mentioned it that one of our forum gods suggested they check it out (just the housing system, suggest the trailer its short and easy to see~ lol) XD...

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Man, don't get me started on the FFXIV housing file, I have a lot of choice words for it and none of them are positive, sadly >>;...

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Just to add though this link doesn't prove that cash shop was used for adding more inventory space, but that they said that they use cash shop funds for somethings (like EU server). I'm sure some of it is helpful to the game, and other games.

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I was just putting that link out there since it was mentioned in a few points throughout the OF that people weren't sure if it was quoted that the Cash Shop helped fun the EU data centre. By some rights it wouldn't be a long hard to extend that thought to say that it would be used to create server infrastructure necessary for the storage increase either. With that being said that video was from 2+ years ago and who knows what may or may not have changed in that time frame. We don't have any information about exactly what S-E spends the FFXIV profits on so any opinion we have is just conjuncture and I for one don't see too much to worry about (yet).

I don't really want to get into the the main thread discussion too much - to me I just see a lot of hyperbolic rhetoric and faulty logic being applied with real world examples that make me roll my eyes. I'm personally impartial towards cash shop as it has no positive or negative effect on me though I do have the opinion that I don't feel $7 is not too much for an emote either - my only complaint to that being it should be account wide and not single character. But it is a one time fee so comparing it to a monthly subscription seems kinda silly to me. If you play your character for a year, your $7 effectively translates into $0.58 / month and just keeps getting better from there.

I care more about game balance and job balance in some regards - oh and making an official parser =D *Prepares flame shield*

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Originally Posted by Shougun

English I no goody goody, try hard - fail harder. Bring dishonor to family- please send help. :P

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Bah, I've seen much worse =p Just put away that great Katana and keep going forward =p

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

what is wrong with that tho, as long as they are providing a good game, let those whom wana buy the extra stuff do it

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With this type of game what people consider good is relative. Some people may be disgusted by lack of housing. Some may dislike the fact that crafting gear is the easiest to use in leveling due to rng drops. Emotes or certain visual components might be more important to others. I don't ever glamour leveling gear. But I know some people every new item has to match the set.

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Originally Posted by Stormrider

With this type of game what people consider good is

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but to be fair tho I cant think of another game that gives new content even if its a little bit every three months and it seems that alot of players over look this , thats so many updates when other games will give you the base game and then an expansion and your left to fiddle your thumbs until something else comes. This game seems to have a very spoiled player base at least on the forums, its things Id love in the game but Im not gona expect everything just cause I pay 15 well really for me 20 bucks a month. Especially coming here from swtor, that before I left milked you for one chapter a month on their expansion, Im just grateful for what they do give even if I dont use everything in the game.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

This game seems to have a very spoiled player base at least on the forums, its things Id love in the game but Im not gona expect everything just cause I pay 15 well really for me 20 bucks a month.

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As a 10+ year MMO veteran, this is nothing. Almost all MMO official forums have a vocal minority complaining about anything and everything from "this player did that thing and I don't like it" to "stop making items for your cash shop and spend that money on things I want." Few here, if anyone, actually understands how FFXIV's development team is structured, how decisions are made (or even by whom they are made), how their budget works, how much oversight Square-Enix corporate has over the game's operation itself, etc.

Everyone on the forums has a Bachelor's in Business and/or Computer Science and knows how easy it is to make the things they want in the game. /s

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

but to be fair tho I cant think of another game that gives new content even if its a little bit every three months and it seems that alot of players over look this , thats so many updates when other games will give you the base game and then an expansion and your left to fiddle your thumbs until something else comes. This game seems to have a very spoiled player base at least on the forums, its things Id love in the game but Im not gona expect everything just cause I pay 15 well really for me 20 bucks a month. Especially coming here from swtor, that before I left milked you for one chapter a month on their expansion, Im just grateful for what they do give even if I dont use everything in the game.

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To bring up everyone's favorite topic, FFXI! For those not aware, this is SE's only other MMO to date. (I can hear the groans!)

But anyway, XI included all* game items in your monthly subscription. You paid your sub, and that was that! So now here comes XIV, which is from the same company, and they've completely done away with their old business model. Now they seem quite content to double-dip their characters whenever they can, constantly raising prices to boot.

You call us spoiled, I call the company greedy. They've done a complete 180 on how they run their MMOs, and that's a shame.




*Because someone always nitpicks this - this is not including expansion packs, fan-fest items, etc.

I guess at the very least they didn't lock /songbird behind a paywall, and I don't know about anyone else, but a lot of people on my server seem to love that one more than /playdead or /backflip, not just because /songbird is free and more people have it, but because of the fact that people have been creating EPop bands and singing till the sun went down for about a day and a half now. It's probably one of the best emotes SE has ever made thus far, I think.

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

As a 10+ year MMO veteran, this is nothing. Almost all MMO official forums have a vocal minority complaining about anything and everything from "this player did that thing and I don't like it" to "stop making items for your cash shop and spend that money on things I want." Few here, if anyone, actually understands how FFXIV's development team is structured, how decisions are made (or even by whom they are made), how their budget works, how much oversight Square-Enix corporate has over the game's operation itself, etc.

Everyone on the forums has a Bachelor's in Business and/or Computer Science and knows how easy it is to make the things they want in the game. /s

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I am also a 10+ year MMO veteran, and this discussion definitely has a place to exist. Don't simply try and write it off as "the vocal minority" complaining again.

For what it is worth, I am 100% OK with cash shops being in F2P and B2P games as all companies need to have a source of income from somewhere. I've spent my more than fair share in these other games, and I have no regrets.

For XIV, you first have to purchase the game itself (which is fine), then pay a subscription (also OK), and then if you want to collect all items (including exclusives), you can pay even more money at their cash shop (this is where the issue begins).

In my opinion, a cash shop on a subscription game should NEVER contain exclusive items. Give the players a chance to obtain all items in game, at least once, then maybe move those items into the cash shop. There will always be players who started late, or missed an event.

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

To bring up everyone's favorite topic, FFXI! For those not aware, this is SE's only other MMO to date. (I can hear the groans!)

But anyway, XI included all* game items in your monthly subscription. You paid your sub, and that was that! So now here comes XIV, which is from the same company, and they've completely done away with their old business model.

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This is a new age and a new market wow is a billion dollar company, league of legions makes so much money its crazy Id never play either of these and I know league isnt an mmo. But my point is , why do you think they put cash shop in to begin with where do you think the jump potions are gona end up, if you look at other mmos they have cash shops. Those other mmos sell gear, already sell jump potions, sell way more mounts, exp boast all kinds of stuff. And swtor even sells gamble boxes and they have subs as well and use the cash shop even more than this game , and Id prob say it profits more than this game does as well. To keep and maintain this game or to make it stay competitive with other games you cant use the same business model from years past.

Mmos are not really growing like they did in years past, you have to do things similar to your competitors and thats what SE is doing, there is hardly anything in the mog station like last time I checked a dress and some dye and now these emotes. Like compared to other places this is nothing , so why are people complaining, if you think that this game is just gona sit idle and not try to capitalize like every other game on the market then you must not no how business works. Ill say it again no subs arent enough subs are never going to be enough in any game period companies will always be looking to make extra money and that goes from burger king, to movie theaters, to here video games, there is no such thing as too much that's called capitalism and its just how things work.


Things come at a price I see your comment above its simply a choice I wanted the hw griffin mount but I wasnt willing to pay for the extra special edition price for that mount. Im not willing to preorder storm blood when I can just buy it on june 20th when its cheaper, the game isnt forcing you to do anything. Unless you buy all the special edition stuff, then some things are just out of ur reach in general. Why is this a problem, you dont have to have everything in the game , nobody said this when you signed up for your sub I know it didnt say that on mine.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

Man, don't get me started on the FFXIV housing file, I have a lot of choice words for it and none of them are positive, sadly >>;...

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:3 Hopefully by informing others who don't know they could see much better, and by reminding SE they have a litany of issues with their current system, maybe some time in the future when they're passing it around in a room they'll say "You know what, Houses! Lets do that again!" lol.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

I was just putting that link out there since it was mentioned in a few points throughout the OF that people weren't sure if it was quoted that the Cash Shop helped fun the EU data centre. By some rights it wouldn't be a long hard to extend that thought to say that it would be used to create server infrastructure necessary for the storage increase either. With that being said that video was from 2+ years ago and who knows what may or may not have changed in that time frame. We don't have any information about exactly what S-E spends the FFXIV profits on so any opinion we have is just conjuncture and I for one don't see too much to worry about (yet).

I don't really want to get into the the main thread discussion too much - to me I just see a lot of hyperbolic rhetoric and faulty logic being applied with real world examples that make me roll my eyes. I'm personally impartial towards cash shop as it has no positive or negative effect on me though I do have the opinion that I don't feel $7 is not too much for an emote either - my only complaint to that being it should be account wide and not single character. But it is a one time fee so comparing it to a monthly subscription seems kinda silly to me. If you play your character for a year, your $7 effectively translates into $0.58 / month and just keeps getting better from there.

I care more about game balance and job balance in some regards - oh and making an official parser =D *Prepares flame shield*

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Ah okay, while I have no doubts the cash shop is valuable to SE both to give Yoshida more power to argue for more money but also for the company as a whole (investors want that sweet money lol) - it's difficult to say what without them telling us what they do with it... So I took the response as a "proof they're using money for inventory" and was like.. well.. maybe not? lol. It is proof they consider the shop helpful however.

IMO, besides that I generally don't like cash shops, SE just needs to tighten their ship and fix their delivery. In a lot of other MMOs that have it together you can't readily lose your purchase as there are commands to get them back (wtf is this lose your $20 wedding bangle thing? lol), stuff is account wide, there are processes to unban your account easily if a bunch of accidental credit card denials happen (like WoW, if your credit card gets silly - in FFXIV you have to hope a thread on reddit explodes, that's not acceptable). "But this MMO lets you throw $100 down without getting anything!" ... -_- yea that's a good system, lets put that everywhere!! lol.

As well for an MMO that likes the cash shop they should consider EQ sort of earn cash shop money via your sub, that'd probably lower tension around it (lower not remove). So say you could buy the moogle mount if you subscribed for 6 months, which would be a very hopefully feature in the defense of unique items in the shop (I'm thinking SE side, "nothing we add cannot be obtained through regular participation in our game~!"). Or consider something more like Wild Star where the last time I looked, nearly every single item in the cash shop can also be obtained by playing and not paying extra (there was an in game cash shop currency or something).

SE could make their cash shop significantly more acceptable if they want, for morale, and perhaps for more income (if you had the choice of getting 4 trees for $12 I bet quite a few more purchases would be made, vs 1 for $5, with the ID tag of LotR added as well). Making it feel less clunky and friendly would shut down forum fights more often and to SE's benefit (as I've seen on other games where the CS isn't so, the forums would usually come to the defense of the company instead against the shop).

Imo, $7 for an emote is too much, it should be like $3 but I think if they had a currency on sub thing more people would not care about the price (within reason, $50 emote? gtfo lol).

A random quip would be that I think their cash shop looks disorganized with a non-AAA tier presentation, a rather pointless issue but yeah haha.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

I care more about game balance and job balance in some regards - oh and making an official parser =D *Prepares flame shield*

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I agree with an official parser option (NOT CASH SHOP), I'm thinking Mods like WoW, maybe an official mod for PS4 players to easily rely on, but I don't agree that parsers would make people's lives harder like commonly suggested on the forums.

I already see and know people get excluded because of and in the name of (false reference to) parsers, the difference here is they pick silly wording strategies to basically say "I saw your parse, I don't like it, so I'm going to be rude to you". False reference would be like "I want to leave this party, but don't want to get yelled at too much, so I'll say everyone's DPS sucks" and someone else would assume they're running a parser. I don't think there will be more rude players with parsers, just how you get that information will be /better/ with parsers, you'll at least know if they're full of fake kupo nuts or not. Players will be able to see if they're doing poorly and improve, that'll be the biggest change imo - rude players will still be rude regardless. I mean evidence of this issue is the whole meta Paladin / White Mage treatment, even though we don't have a parser the information from parser is already available and will not change if SE trys to ban them harder, the damage from parsers is already done, lets get the bonuses from them already. It's annoying to me to see them delayed/not added because we already suffer their consequence of more informed meta choices, and people using them in the shadows, so all we're doing now is losing out in the benefits (like better discussions on balance on the offical forms, reliable self improvement, better tips to others, knowing when a rude player is just talking crap and doesn't know their own job).

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

Bah, I've seen much worse =p Just put away that great Katana and keep going forward =p

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HAI!!! We will wade into the battlefield together and I will prove my honor! "TASTEAH MAI BLADEE!" .. oh wait, wrong game.. W.e! :D

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

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Think most the outrage is not that there is a cash shop and they putting stuff in it, it the price they are charging for the items on top of paying a monthly sub. Lot of people seem to be unhappy about a emote costing $7, now if they lowered that price to say $3 for the emote would there still be people that unhappy? Yes but I think a lot less would complain about it and be more ok with. Least that what I feel is going on, that cash shop for what it selling it ok it just priced too high for be a sub game.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Things come at a price I see your comment above its simply a choice I wanted the hw griffin mount but I wasnt willing to pay for the extra special edition price for that mount. Im not willing to preorder storm blood when I can just buy it on june 20th when its cheaper, the game isnt forcing you to do anything. Unless you buy all the special edition stuff, then some things are just out of ur reach in general. Why is this a problem, you dont have to have everything in the game , nobody said this when you signed up for your sub I know it didnt say that on mine.

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I'm not concerned about CE game/expansion, plushie, OST items. These are marketing/promotional items, and that's a different beast all together. Perhaps I should have clarified further on post #274, because as I mentioned, it always gets nitpicked.

The exclusive items I have an issue with are the ones that go directly to the cash shop. The new emotes, Far Eastern Garb, the mounts, Scion outfits, etc.

Times do change, and cash shops do seem to be creeping in everywhere. I obviously don't think they belong on a sub game, but I'd personally be OK with it in XIV if they would do the following:

1) Have only account items (fantasias, server transfer, name change) and items that have been obtainable in game at least once
2) Have a system to convert gil to Crysta
3) Lower the damn prices. @.@ I play Archeage as well, which is arguably one of the largest money-grabs at the moment, and SE's prices rival that of AA.