Not Happy With The New Changes

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Originally Posted by Callinon

Forgive me but that sounds a lot like "I invented this freeze mage rotation and no one's going to tell me it's bad!"

You should ask yourself WHY you're leaning so hard on skills with high failure rates when skills that don't have that problem are readily available.

Hasty Touch and Rapid Synth have their uses at very low levels (mostly Hasty, probably less so now though), but they obsolete relatively quickly. By the time you're level 40 or so, you shouldn't even be considering them. Certainly by 80 they should have a thick layer of dust on your hotbars if they're even still there.

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And forgive me, but that sounds awfully elitist of you. "Oh, hey! *I* stopped using that at high level so you should, too." Didn't say my way was the only way, but that was the fun of the system: there wasn't one way to the solution. I chose MY particular way for CP conservation, as well as more chances in the event of failure. And it could reliably get me to hq in the event of good or excellent conditions not popping up--which, as it has been for me, they show up less on high level crafts (might be different for you; if so, kudos). It went:

Inner Quiet
Waste Not II
Steady Hand II
Patient Touch
Patient Touch
Hasty Touch II ~ till end of SHII or Standard Touch if, by that point, I was close to having the bar maxed out.

If the quality was really high--or the RNG really hated me that round--then I had a Master's Mend/Manipulation and could use that to finish up. Then it would be SHII, HTII till I was finished or on the last two of SHII to which I would use Byregot's Blessing to make up for the quality I didn't get--usually coupling with Great Strides. Once quality is done, finish up with Careful Synthesis III.

Sir or Ma'am:

I am unhappy with the recent crafting changes. The crafting mini game used to be fun for me and is no longer fun. As a result, I have decided to cancel my subscription since, as a consumer, that is the most effective way for me to signal my displeasure to the company regarding their product/service. I am very tired of watching MMORPGs that I enjoy go slowly but steadily downhill over time. It's inevitable, I suppose, but tedious all the same. Be well!

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Originally Posted by Isparson

But those two (Hasty Touch and Rapid Snyth) have had their EFFECTIVE success rates lowered, in that you can no longer use Steady Hand to compensate. They've gone from both being 70-80 %, with Steady Hand 1 or 2 buff, to 60% and 50% respectively, with that rate unable to be raised in any way.

Maybe these do disappear from your hotbars later, but Hasty Touch was, at least for me, the workhorse of my rotations from mid-20s until late 40s, (i.e., yesterday). Now, I don't see any point at all to these two abilities ... except maybe as conceptual predecessors to their Focused versions.

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They are good in a pinch. Several times earlier I was like 98% HQ chance, and I had 20/40 durability, and my progress was one synth from being done and I was out of CP.

Might as well Hasty Touch. It worked 2 out of 3 times.

I will say that with such low chances of success, Hasty Touch, Rapid Synthesis, and Patient Touch are effectively useless as far as I am concerned.

I will not use skills with such a huge chance of failure. If SE intends those skills to be the only way to accomplish high end HQ crafting, it will effectively push me out of the crafting scene. With that said, that might not be SE's intention. They may simply expect that proc based skills like Tricks of the Trade, Focused Touch and Focused Synthesis play a bigger role in high end HQ crafting and thus limit how much impact macros can be used for such.

But as they are, 50% or 60% chance skills are dead on arrival in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

Might as well Hasty Touch. It worked 2 out of 3 times.

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That's essentially it's ONLY use case now though. It went from a skill you could use plenty, being the main skill recommended to be used at lower levels, to a skill that is only ever worthwhile when your back is up against a wall.

I'm not saying that having a skill like this is a bad thing, but it used to be plenty more enjoyable, even if it failed multiple times in a row.

Tbh this entire update feels like they gut the system, removed most of the interesting bits, and left what the macros were already using. Heck, my macro for making syrup actually got shorter with the update, and I'm not even well melded!

Give them time, maybe they'll come up with more conditional procs for Hasty Touch and Rapid Synth.

With such a huge overhaul they are probably watching and listening for player feedback. There's always growing pains when it comes to overhauls.

No the system isn't perfect, but after spending all day having fun crafting where I could never find it fun before, I have to say that they got something good here with the spirit of what they're trying to accomplish. Let's try to support them with good ideas rather than grumble about what isn't perfect.

I really wish I could be positive, but I can't see what they've changed, only what we've lost. A few things here and there cost a little more cp, but the rest of this patch was just removing interesting tools. You can't MAMA if you don't have good cp melds,you can't use patient touch before reflect letting you start out with 6 IQ stacks with little risk, and you can't be skillful with comfort zone. (using it as soon as it expires without wasting a turn on your other buffs) Basically, alot of the nuance of crafting was removed without replacing it with anything that feels meaningful.

I don't want to be negative like I was with the dark knight changes, since those ended up rather good, but I was not expecting to keep using the exact same rotation as before. I was ready and willing to re-learn crafting with a re-vamp, but that didn't really turn out as expected.

Keep having fun with the new system, I'm glad you're able to! I just wish I was having fun too.

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Originally Posted by EphPhoen

And forgive me, but that sounds awfully elitist of you. "Oh, hey! *I* stopped using that at high level so you should, too." Didn't say my way was the only way, but that was the fun of the system: there wasn't one way to the solution. I chose MY particular way for CP conservation, as well as more chances in the event of failure. And it could reliably get me to hq in the event of good or excellent conditions not popping up--which, as it has been for me, they show up less on high level crafts (might be different for you; if so, kudos). It went:

Inner Quiet
Waste Not II
Steady Hand II
Patient Touch
Patient Touch
Hasty Touch II ~ till end of SHII or Standard Touch if, by that point, I was close to having the bar maxed out.

If the quality was really high--or the RNG really hated me that round--then I had a Master's Mend/Manipulation and could use that to finish up. Then it would be SHII, HTII till I was finished or on the last two of SHII to which I would use Byregot's Blessing to make up for the quality I didn't get--usually coupling with Great Strides. Once quality is done, finish up with Careful Synthesis III.

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So, let me get this straight. You are complaining that your way is heavy with RNG. Someone posted a macro that does not use said RNG abilities, and you are still complaining.

You are refusing help, and saying it is to hard, and then when someone called you on it, you decided that the appropriate response was to call them an elitist.

As they said before, you are just like the so called "ice" mage refusing to use anything but ice spells.

At this point, being given the information, if you continue to use hasty touch and/or rapid synthesis because "that's how i've always done it" you have no one but yourself to blame for the issues you are having.

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Originally Posted by Niadissa

So, let me get this straight. You are complaining that your way is heavy with RNG. Someone posted a macro that does not use said RNG abilities, and you are still complaining.

You are refusing help, and saying it is to hard, and then when someone called you on it, you decided that the appropriate response was to call them an elitist.

As they said before, you are just like the so called "ice" mage refusing to use anything but ice spells.

At this point, being given the information, if you continue to use hasty touch and/or rapid synthesis because "that's how i've always done it" you have no one but yourself to blame for the issues you are having.

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-looks up at high horse- -sips chai- First off, homey, reading comprehension would help you out immensely. I never said "too hard," I said I agreed with one of the posters I didn't like the direction it was going--specifically in reference to the loss of Steady Hand. I didn't ask for help or to be given a way nor refuse any offered. Go back up and READ and show me where I said that specifically. I'll wait. =P

Secondly, you obviously don't know your skills. While, yes, if you were to use Hasty Touch or Patient Touch without anything, you have a 50-60% chance of success, Steady Hand II bumps that up by 30%. What's that? 80-90%! Oh my, that means only a 10-20% chance of failure! Not so heavy with RNG, now, is it? =P

Thirdly, I never said of any actions I was or wasn't taking, so take putting words in my mouth and shove it, most sincerely. ^_^ Obviously, I'm going to have to figure out something else. If you gonna come at someone rude, at least come correct. kthx bye. =P

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Originally Posted by EphPhoen

Secondly, you obviously don't know your skills. While, yes, if you were to use Hasty Touch or Patient Touch without anything, you have a 50-60% chance of success, Steady Hand II bumps that up by 30%. What's that? 80-90%! Oh my, that means only a 10-20% chance of failure! Not so heavy with RNG, now, is it? =P

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Clearly you've never had a gathering chance at 99% only to fail it five times in a row.

Reported percentages in this game aren't great measures of success rate. I expect anything below 100% to have at least a 10% chance of failure, and that's a lot higher than you're giving it credit for.

But hey, it's your money... waste away.