Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

To all you lore people:
Next time you have two (or more) WHMs in a raid, stop everything and initiate vote kicks until only one remains. Otherwise your raid isn't lore abiding.

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Originally Posted by Acesfool

He said their plan was to introduce rothgar as male only

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No it wasn't. Their plan was to introduce Hrothgars in general, but there was a big demand for Vieras since 2.0. But since they had resources and time only for one race, they were have to decide between female Viera and female Hrothgar, because they wanted to implement male Hrothgars no matter what.

lol ok "bud"

I think the writers at Square Enix are very capable to continue the lore regarding male Vieras. They write amazing stories for RPG's, so there's definitely room for creativity with the current lore behind male Viera.

For example, the game writers can portray male Vieras as a marginalized group, and that several elements of the "Green Code" was actually designed to discriminate against them. Thus, being the very reasons male Vieras are reclusive and kept from holding positions of political power. The lore can go from there, becoming a story about a struggle for equality and universal rights.

The writers probably won't follow this plot, but it's just one example of a multitude of possibilities to make male Vieras and female Hrothgars playable characters according to lore, and it can be very... very good. ^_^

https://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/acc...50b34b3bf6.jpg i want cute male vieras^^

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

(...)Or just start ignoring those that say "But Lore!" since they're certainly not reading the thread anyway. :D

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They are here just to try to start a fight with us. They know about male miqo'tes, etc. But they come here just to say "but the lore..."
Just ignore them, it's the best option. They will never read your answer, unless if you start to make mad (that is the real objective of them).

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Originally Posted by Halivel

No it wasn't. Their plan was to introduce Hrothgars in general, but there was a big demand for Vieras since 2.0. But since they had resources and time only for one race, they were have to decide between female Viera and female Hrothgar, because they wanted to implement male Hrothgars no matter what.

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That was Yoshi-P's initial statement, but after reading his interview with Mr. Happy I'm more or less confused about the order of development of both races.

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Mr. Happy: As a follow up, is the team considering adding the other gender for these two races in future expansions?

Yoshida: Short answer is we haven’t made a decision on that. The reason why we can’t say for sure. We need to optimize our work flow with the existing races and the new ones. After that, perhaps we do the other gender. But we don’t know right now.

We did consider Male Viera instead of adding an extra race, but we tried to take player feedback on adding a more beast like race as well as the strong desire to receive Viera. We did expect strong feedback on the gender lock. It was a tough decision, but we decided to do our best to meet both the player feedback and our development team’s vision. It will be very costly to add a new race or genders. So I won’t say no, but I would not like to set expectations high.

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This is a later interview and gives me the impression that they added Hrothgar as a limited race in the place of the male Viera, and the whole "Hrothgar came first, fem Viera was added in later due to demand" was a PR tactic to spin the story to divert backlash from the lock. (I kinda believe this because the Hroth got finished right before Tokyo fanfest, and their videos and the whole reveal seemed a little more rushed compared to the Viera one.)
But at this point Yoshi P has been caught saying "the Hroth came first" -> then "the Viera came first", it's starting to become a "which came first? the egg or the hen" kind of story.

Although I support the cause, the amount of art posted without crediting the artist is a little worrisome.

I know most people are interested in feminine/petite male Viera, but what about body types like Yarne from Fire Emblem Awakening? Bunny Boy without looking too weird. (Excuse me if already suggested, but this thread is simply too long.)

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20160713044718

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

Although I support the cause, the amount of art posted without crediting the artist is a little worrisome.

I know most people are interested in feminine/petite male Viera, but what about body types like Yarne from Fire Emblem Awakening? Bunny Boy without looking too weird. (Excuse me if already suggested, but this thread is simply too long.)

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20160713044718

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Body wise he looks really good actually, but imo the face and hairline scares me off a bit, I suppose it's because I'm kinda in favor of a bishounen face for the Viera males so they'll fit with the females. (my own bias lmao)
Amusing enough, Yarne has a sort of Au Ra male look to him, don't he? I think its the face and the spiky hair.

I like his body type though, I'd believe this guy jumps around stealthily in the jungle and isn't in the gym drinking protein shakes 24/7.

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

I know most people are interested in feminine/petite male Viera

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It's not the most popular request, it just happens to be the loudest. Most players are either not all that shook up about the lack of Viera men or they want something that is conventionally attractive. The artwork you posted is an excellent example of what most would be content with and have been pushing for.

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

I know most people who spam the thread are interested in feminine/petite male Viera

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Fixed that for you.

I don't understand why people is pushing for a playable male Viera so much. It's not the first time Square-Enix done a gender locked races look at Mithra and Galka in Final Fantasy XI.

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Originally Posted by Nalfein

Fixed that for you.

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Not untrue, but a one sided observation nonetheless.
There are people who spam the thread who are interested in buff viera.

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Originally Posted by SoothingPaws

I don't understand why people is pushing for a playable male Viera so much. It's not the first time Square-Enix done a gender locked races look at Mithra and Galka in Final Fantasy XI.

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Well, this is 2019 and everyone wants everything and wants it right now.
And of course, if they don´t get it right away, that is a personal insult against them...

That said, most posts here are reasonable and supporting something in a calm way is a good thing.

There are just some ppl that completely ignore that we are getting 2 new races, 1 for each gender. It often sounds like SE took something away from them, and thats not the case.

what ever design they stick with ill just be happy they are in.

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Originally Posted by Senn

Not untrue, but a one sided observation nonetheless.
There are people who spam the thread who are interested in buff viera.

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Unecessary fight, why not request male Viera and let the devs do the trick, I'm sure they'll do their best.

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Originally Posted by Nalfein

Unecessary fight, why not request male Viera and let the devs do the trick, I'm sure they'll do their best.

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This isn't a fight, though. Just a disagreement.
As for your last part, I do agree with that. I've already said I would like male viera the way Yoshi P envisions them. Although I do have my preferences, at the end of the day I'll take whatever it is the devs cook up. That being said, there's nothing wrong with people discussing what type of male viera they would like to see, buff or slim.

edit:
I wanted to add that we should all respect Yoshi P/the devs design even if male viera isn't up to your preferences. I'll be happy if we even get them.

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Originally Posted by SoothingPaws

I don't understand why people is pushing for a playable male Viera so much. It's not the first time Square-Enix done a gender locked races look at Mithra and Galka in Final Fantasy XI.

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Basically, a lot of people who grew up with SE games have seen male Viera as a mystery since 2006, and a lot of us hoped for an exclusive FFXIV take on it that would be playable.
Yoshi P said back when ARR just came out that the gender locks in 1.0 was bad design, and that they moved away from that principle altogether, which they have followed until now.
They used the Viera as an example when doing a poll over which races players would like back when deciding the races for ARR, it had the highest percentage, clearly showing the demand for the race.
They showed concepts back in 2.0 showing they had considered Viera for a time before moving to Au Ra. (males included in design)
They implemented Male Viera lore into the game during the ivalice raid series.
Yoshi P showed up with a bugs bunny shirt. bugs is male (it's a bit of a stretch but I'm adding it here anyway.)
After the reveal of the female Viera when they were asked about the males they pointed to the in-game lore - and then hinted at Tokyo FanFest right before pre orders launched.

Then come Tokyo FanFest 2019 they show Hrothgar when almost everyone expected male Viera.
Now thanks to people requesting it, they've announced that they're open for feedback. So Male Viera and Female Hrothgar posts will probably become a constant request on the forums until they happen or we get a concrete no from SE.

As a sidenote:
The claims of sexism by a loud minority etc. mostly stem from this which I find ridiculous but I'm just gonna amass as much scources into this for future readers.
Do correct me if I'm wrong and I'll edit the message accordingly.

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Originally Posted by Emmanellain

So Male Viera and Female Hrothgar posts will probably become a constant request on the forums until they happen or we get a concrete no from SE.

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On the forums, in Q&As, on PLLs, in conventions, in interviews...
If they thought people were annoying about unlocking the bunny outfit, WOO BOY.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

On the forums, in Q&As, on PLLs, in conventions, in interviews...
If they thought people were annoying about unlocking the bunny outfit, WOO BOY.

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To be completely honest, their marketing team should've probably poked Yoshi on the shoulder and whispered "you know, this might create a new demand for female Hrothgar, and people will just want male Viera more"
If genderlocking gearsets was a hotbutton issue, locking genders will create even more outrage.
Especially when the "we don't have previously existing reference" won't cut it when they've already created concepts people have raved about since 2.0, and the original Viera creator even gave them his blessing.
Heck the "Hrothgar came first" explanation has been shot down as well, as Yoshi is saying they came first, then indirectly saying they were intended to replace male Viera after making the female Viera.

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"We did consider Male Viera instead of adding an extra race, but we tried to take player feedback on adding a more beast like race as well as the strong desire to receive Viera. We did expect strong feedback on the gender lock. It was a tough decision, but we decided to do our best to meet both the player feedback and our development team’s vision. It will be very costly to add a new race or genders. So I won’t say no, but I would not like to set expectations high." - Yoshi P

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You'd think as a company SE would take advantage of the mystery surrounding male Viera, as old players who played alongside Fran in 2006 and other Viera games onward might want to see what the males are like and pick up an MMO for the first time. That and, well, handsome/cute races have the highest play rate in this MMO.

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Originally Posted by Senn

This isn't a fight, though. Just a disagreement.
As for your last part, I do agree with that. I've already said I would like male viera the way Yoshi P envisions them. Although I do have my preferences, at the end of the day I'll take whatever it is the devs cook up. That being said, there's nothing wrong with people discussing what type of male viera they would like to see, buff or slim.

edit:
I wanted to add that we should all respect Yoshi P/the devs design even if male viera isn't up to your preferences. I'll be happy if we even get them.

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Yeah my bad, I didn't word that well. I mostly agree with what you said and the part you edited is great.

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Originally Posted by Nalfein

Yeah my bad, I didn't word that well. I mostly agree with what you said and the part you edited is great.

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Nothing to worry about.

Now I wonder when we'll get an announcement... Not that I'm expecting anything soon. I've seen a few people who just want to hear confirmation on male viera - they don't mind how long it takes. However, I think asking for confirmation puts Yoshi P in a hard place. There's never any guarantees so I don't think he would outright say anything. Even more so if they haven't even worked on the model.

It's best to just be patient with these things. We may very well be waiting until 6.0, after all. I want to see them added at some point, but not at the cost of other aspects of the game's planned content.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It's best to just be patient with these things. We may very well be waiting until 6.0, after all. I want to see them added at some point, but not at the cost of other aspects of the game's planned content.

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Well, assuming we get them at all, I'm going to guess maybe 2 years? Could be longer.

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Originally Posted by Senn

Well, assuming we get them at all, I'm going to guess maybe 2 years? Could be longer.

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I think we should be a bit more optimistic :p

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Originally Posted by zeylos

I think we should be a bit more optimistic :p

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I think that is naive.
SE wont pull out a new race (gender) before the next expansion.
So 6.0 is the earliest and never is the latest possibility.

It is certainly a possibility. They have pulled jobs and jobs take the same if not more amount of work than genders for already existing races

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Originally Posted by zeylos

It is certainly a possibility. They have pulled jobs and jobs take the same if not more amount of work than genders for already existing races

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To be fair, Blue mage probably had one dude working on it and Ninja was released back when ARR had basically no content, I doubt they take as much effort as modeling and animating a new racial gender.

I have to say, I love how this thread is already 263 pages long. That being said, I imagine the FFXIV dev team would definitely want to include the male Viera and female Hrothgar somewhere further down the line. But I can also imagine they may need to adjust their workflow and optimize the system for making armor fit bodies more so that adding the two genders won't create too much of a bottleneck on time. I believe Yoshi-P has mentioned as much in an interview with MrHappy recently after the Tokyo fanfest.

I have faith Yoshi-P will manage to figure something out and gives us the missing genders. Heck, seeing how big the demand is I bet they're actually eager to figure out how to effectively do this without bottlenecking themselves in the future.

Edit: apparently I made it reach 264 pages, lol. xD

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Originally Posted by Halivel

No it wasn't. Their plan was to introduce Hrothgars in general, but there was a big demand for Vieras since 2.0. But since they had resources and time only for one race, they were have to decide between female Viera and female Hrothgar, because they wanted to implement male Hrothgars no matter what.

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LOL, that's pretty much what I said. The point being hrothgar were their first thought. So you're lucky to get viera at all, male or female.

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Originally Posted by Acesfool

LOL, that's pretty much what I said. The point being hrothgar were their first thought. So you're lucky to get viera at all, male or female.

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uhm...
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Originally Posted by Acesfool

He said their plan was to introduce rothgar as male only

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and

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Originally Posted by Halivel

Their plan was to introduce Hrothgars in general, ... they were have to decide between female Viera and female Hrothgar

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How is it the same? :D

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Originally Posted by Valenth

I have faith Yoshi-P will manage to figure something out and gives us the missing genders. Heck, seeing how big the demand is I bet they're actually eager to figure out how to effectively do this without bottlenecking themselves in the future.

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This is my exact belief too. At first I was super disappointed about the whole situation, now though it's just hope. I'm reluctant to get my hopes up, but I'm still hopeful that Yoshi P and the dev team are actually for removing the gender lock and they're actively trying to figure out how they can do it without overloading themselves or removing dev time from other aspects they're working on. Although I hope it doesn't take them until next expansion, I'm sure it's just a matter of time and that makes me happy <3

I also think they won't take until next expansion. I'd expect to see then 5.x

wishful thinking it will be anytime in ShB life
maybe next expansion or maybe even after

be a bit odd that a gender is locked by a expansion now i think about it

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

Although I support the cause, the amount of art posted without crediting the artist is a little worrisome.

I know most people are interested in feminine/petite male Viera, but what about body types like Yarne from Fire Emblem Awakening?

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Not "most".

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Originally Posted by MrKimper

And they've also been described by yoshida as being slim, handsome, elegant, and elezen like. Matsuno when asked said he thought they'd just be highlander with rabbit ears. At the end of the day the only thing we have to go on is concept art, nobody's hijacking anything because we have no way of knowing concretely what they'll look like if they're added at all.

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Yes but it does give a pretty good indication of the range they're considering which, if they want to stay quite close to the females, just bigger, will be between elezen and highlanders/au ra. I'd be quite surprised if they drastically deviate from the concept art. I think a wide slider is a good compromise, and one they might opt for, to avoid deviating too much from the above-mentioned body types.

https://i.imgur.com/bJDMr2E.jpg?1

https://twitter.com/k0u_b0nb0n/statu...09057599598592

Also some appreciation for ♀ Viera

https://i.imgur.com/4PlDZmo.jpg?1
https://twoucan.com/profile/lyco1019

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Originally Posted by Valenth

I have to say, I love how this thread is already 263 pages long.

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Not if you use the "more threads per page" option!

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Originally Posted by zeylos

I also think they won't take until next expansion. I'd expect to see then 5.x

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Considering they stated multiple times these would be the LAST races to be added, I would assume it will take way past 5.x for them to get the time and resource together if they choose to do it.

1575 likes amaizing, keep going, have my support for a 6.0 male viera (and female ronso) good ppl.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Yes but it does give a pretty good indication of the range they're considering which, if they want to stay quite close to the females, just bigger, will be between elezen and highlanders/au ra. I'd be quite surprised if they drastically deviate from the concept art. I think a wide slider is a good compromise, and one they might opt for, to avoid deviating too much from the above-mentioned body types.

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How about we worry about them being added and what they look/are shaped like after, my point is if someone likes x viera let them like x viera. As long as nobody's asking to be a 14 year old, I don't see the reason to say they're misrepresenting something we have no idea what direction the dev team intends on going.

As I said I'd rather they be as you described, au ra men but more toned and with less odd proportions, but that doesn't mean if I see people posting fanart of something opposed to that I'm going to say they're "hijacking" viera. It's a moot point, all I care about is if a response is made or not.

I'm not saying they will for sure look like x or y but there's no need to put up imaginary sides and so adamantly tell someone no(Unless they're posting literal children) when you should all in theory want the same thing. Do you get what I'm saying?

It's fine for people to request whatever they like, but let's not pretend the developers are working from a total blank slate. Already you have both Yoshi and Matsuno setting out some ideas as to how they'd expect them to look, and it's not exactly a great deviation from the concept art they've shown. They've not put all their cards on the table yet, because it's too soon and the whole thing is already quite a delicate matter.

In any case, the sides are already there given that they cannot make everything work, so it is understandable that people are posting what they'd like to see most and putting out arguments against the contrary. That goes for those posting buff Viera and those posting their opposite, and so it is natural that you will see arguments about shoehorning arising, especially when the absence of slim male bodies is exaggerated for the purposes of making this argument.

I'm quite willing at this stage to wait for SE to make their move and show us what they have in mind but it could take a while. ;)