Blue mage at patch 4.5

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Originally Posted by InkstainedGwyn

I still hope not. We got 2 DPS last time. We need a healer and a tank this time.

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Yep, I'll concede that.

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Originally Posted by kikix12

So you are saying that you prefer to be forced into another class for ALL content, instead of SOME content. That's illogical no matter how I look at it. I prefer to play what I like in some stuff than no stuff. I don't know, maybe I'm just the weird sort that prefers to be half-sated than starving, even though I'd prefer to be sated fully?!

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You're missing the point here what if people want to main and raid as a BLU? People have been wanting that for so long their favorite class, into content that they enjoy whether it be Raiding, PvP, Ultimate, Trials, I could go on but when you forcibly tell people that they have to reroll as another class then people get upset. It's fine if you have friends and can que together then yeah that's awesome, but for a solo class to do things at the end of the game like farm Tomes or maybe the next relic grind which'll be another huge area (in other words match making) and they are gated because they are a BLU and have to play something else it isn't right.

You have to think about the freedom that this game gives you, how you can level, how you can que for a dungeon, do FATEs, and hit mobs that's all you can do where another class like a tank or healer who gets faster ques get in instantly and can move along faster. Unless BLU can actively chain mobs quickly and rack up a lot of EXP then it's going to be a slog, you're also losing 50/60 roulette, leveling roulette, and so on to help you level you'll literally be grinding mobs for hours when you could just do a dungeon.

You have your own opinions and I have mine just the way this games combat, leveling, endgame experiences shouldn't be left to your class or the restrictions it should be the players choice and should play what they like whether it be alone or group.

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Originally Posted by Awful

you'll literally be grinding mobs for hours when you could just do a dungeon.

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But you can do dungeons with a BLU... Just setup a PF "BLU party dungeon exp! We will take turns for who needs to tank/heal!" and that's it.
That's literally all you have to do. (Except for the 15 first levels, of course.)

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Originally Posted by Fyce

you need to already have a Lv50 battle job, and finished 2.0. Sure, they are not heavy requirements, but it means that you can't choose BLU as a starting job like you suggested. You just got told to get your facts straight, but you still missed something...

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Read my edited post I corrected myself as they posted it since I was re watching the fanfest you know read the edited part?

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Also, you use the argument of players not being able to go into endgame content because they'd have leveled up through open world content... but that's ignoring the fact that you can very much to dungeons with other people (just not in random grouping through DF). Besides, what do you mean "end game content" when the job is capped at 50?

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The issue is the game doesn't tell you to use PF it tells you to use DF to find groups for dungeons and tells you about the rewards for queing with adventurer in need, and there is no open world content unless it's FATEs, the same boring content we've had since 2.0? What thrilling open world building content. They said they will continue to increase the cap what I'm saying is because you can't access it (being level 50) you can't do any endgame or roulettes so please read.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

You are also very much assuming that BLU won't be introduced to players as a very special job, with its own specific content and mechanics. Like that job will be shown as any other just to trick new players into thinking that this is how the game is played. Why are you assuming that? The game already has a sh*tload of tutorials and information bubbles dedicated into explaining side-content to players. There's no reason to think that BLU won't be disclosed as such.

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It might or it might not be, it could just be "this is BLU, here is quest guy, it is a limited job meaning it takes part in solo play" we don't know yet so you can't really say what's gonna happen here till it happens for now they basically said they could have balanced it around the core game but they didn't. I'm also not assuming anything at all I'm just saying what has been said you are gated since you cannot partake in any kind of endgame or even the xpac at launch and the leveling experience is flawed since it's nothing innovative. The way BLU is advertised is a side content job and I'm gonna stick by that since it is a limited job and can't take part in any of the later stuff unless they tweak it down the road.

I think what Awful is trying to say is. Say you pick Thamaturge / Black Mage to start the game with. You get to lvl 15 and you're introduced to the Duty Finder and your first dungeon. Now it's been a while since I've started the game but I don't believe you're ever "introduced" to the Party Finder. That person then uses the Duty Finder every time they get a new dungeon all the way up to lvl 50. They probably even spammed dungeons to level as well. I did... Anyway they get to 50 and now there is a quest that opens up allowing them to play the Blue Mage. They do the quest, get to level 15, go to try to use the Duty Finder to grind dungeons to level but can't do it. Now they have to ask around or go on the internet, provided the game didn't tell them when they unlocked the job, to find out that they can't queue into the Duty Finder. They either grind regular mobs and probably fates. Or they figure out how to use Party Finder and either sit in it waiting for a generous tank / healer / other dps (probably another Blu) to help with the dungeon, which would probably take hours considering there is nothing in it for tanks and healers to do low level dungeons since you only get tomes and such from the Duty Finder, or shout in the hub areas for a party like people do in Eureka.

Now lets say they stick with it and get to lvl 50. Assuming that this is their 2nd job they have leveled just after getting their first job to level 50, they are not told they can't go into Heavensward and level to 60. They can only do anything level 50. which is Binding Coils and some Extreme Primals that most people only do unsynced for WT. So even if you do the primals you are still going to be a lvl 50 with a bunch of level 70s killing the thing probably faster than you need to see the move you are trying to learn.

In conclusion Blu is not being designed as a job that's intended to be played the way everything else is be playing. It's a job that's there for players who have already been through the content on another job and just need something to do in their downtime. Which is bad design when people want to take Blu "through" the content when the content is relevant. Not A patch or SEVERAL patches later.

FFXIV is basically a game of parties fighting a boss so a solo job is a real head scratchier. True it was fun to people in a solo Final Fantasy game going around learning enemy skills to use against the final boss but... you used Blue Mage in the final boss fight. We don't have a ton of open world solo content. I just don't get it. Sadly this looks like another Lord of Vermillion content fluke; good idea but poor delivery.

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Originally Posted by Awful

You're missing the point here what if people want to main and raid as a BLU?

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I want to have a class that consists of casting the limit breaks for free, with a godmode on.

Seriously. "What if the people want (...)" is an irksome argument at this point. It was said from the VERY BEGINNING that this class CANNOT come into FFXIV without limitations to it. There was a choice of making a different class and slapping the name "Blue Mage" on it, or making a Blue Mage and limiting it. They chose the second option. The better option, actually, because going forward they CAN make this class work in more things. Doing the reverse would be a lot harder. Once it would have lost its identity but still be accepted, you'd have an army of people against it regaining that identity because they'd like the fake Blue Mage. And rightfully so.

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Originally Posted by Awful

You have to think about the freedom that this game gives you (...)

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Ironic coming from someone with your arguments, because you argue AGAINST that freedom. The part of that freedom is switching classes on the fly. You are against using that. You don't want freedom. You want to go along a single, definite line. Part of "freedom" is the necessity to deal with the consequences on your own. In this case...it means that some classes may not be available for everything. In a normal MMO without the freedom to change classes this would be unacceptable, but it IS acceptable here BECAUSE you have the freedom.

Also, you can level in the same way. Again. Only PvP and Deep Dungeon are unavailable. And there is no faster queue than instant queue. You get instant queue when having pre-made party, while dungeons are on of the fastest leveling methods in the game. Not deep dungeon. Palace of the Dead at low to mid levels SUCKS. It's just easier to enter as a DPS, though not even that is true anymore.

Not to mention, PvP is separate on other classes already so it's rather likely they WILL allow Blue Mage in PvP somewhere down the line no matter how it's PvE side will continue.

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Originally Posted by Awful

You have your own opinions and I have mine just the way this games combat, leveling, endgame experiences shouldn't be left to your class or the restrictions it should be the players choice and should play what they like whether it be alone or group.

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Yes, opinions. And I have no intention of trying to change opinions by force nor call them wrong. However you are not using opinions alone. "Not being able to level like other classes" is not an opinion. It's a statement of a fact. But it is mostly wrong. Plain and simple. I am only discussing those matters where you do NOT bring up opinions. Don't like it?! That's your choice. Try to make it to be something else than it really is?! I'm going to point at it and call you wrong in that, because you are at the points I am discussing with you.

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Originally Posted by Awful

Read my edited post I corrected myself as they posted it since I was re watching the fanfest you know read the edited part?

The issue is the game doesn't tell you to use PF it tells you to use DF to find groups for dungeons and tells you about the rewards for queing with adventurer in need, and there is no open world content unless it's FATEs, the same boring content we've had since 2.0? What thrilling open world building content. They said they will continue to increase the cap what I'm saying is because you can't access it (being level 50) you can't do any endgame or roulettes so please read.

It might or it might not be, it could just be "this is BLU, here is quest guy, it is a limited job meaning it takes part in solo play" we don't know yet so you can't really say what's gonna happen here till it happens for now they basically said they could have balanced it around the core game but they didn't. I'm also not assuming anything at all I'm just saying what has been said you are gated since you cannot partake in any kind of endgame or even the xpac at launch and the leveling experience is flawed since it's nothing innovative. The way BLU is advertised is a side content job and I'm gonna stick by that since it is a limited job and can't take part in any of the later stuff unless they tweak it down the road.

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Your only argument is only about very new players being unable to read tutorials and understand what the PF is, even after finishing 2.0 and leveled a job to 50.
That's an extremely niche concern to have, especially if you have to assume that the game won't disclose how BLU works and why it's different to new players.
You also completly ignore tools like the Novice network where new players can ask questions about things they don't understand.

That's litteraly the weakest argument against how BLU will be in FFXIV in this entire thread.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

Anyway they get to 50 and now there is a quest that opens up allowing them to play the Blue Mage. They do the quest, get to level 15, go to try to use the Duty Finder to grind dungeons to level but can't do it. Now they have to ask around or go on the internet, provided the game didn't tell them when they unlocked the job, to find out that they can't queue into the Duty Finder.

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That quest can simply start by "Blue Mage is a limited job. Limited jobs are submitted to restrictions regular jobs don't have, and have special content as well as gameplay attached to them. Please, read this tutorial about Blue Mages. [Tutorial opens]".
Problem solved.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

In conclusion Blu is not being designed as a job that's intended to be played the way everything else is be playing. It's a job that's there for players who have already been through the content on another job and just need something to do in their downtime. [...]

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Exactly. It's simply side content.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

[...]Which is bad design when people want to take Blu "through" the content when the content is relevant. Not A patch or SEVERAL patches later.

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That, on the other hand, is only your own opinion. You can't do "relevant content" with your Squadron. It didn't prevent this side content to exists and be enjoyed by some people.
You say "people want to take BLU in relevant content". Who are you to say what everyone wants? I, for instance, couldn't care less about not being able to raid with a BLU, and I appreciate the system they came up with to make it feel like a true and iconic Blue Mage. So, speak for yourself and yourself only, please.
Besides, we already knew since 4 years ago how BLU was going to be. Or, more to the point, not to be.

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Originally Posted by kikix12

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You really have to look at the big picture here you're saying that my arguments go against freedom? It really doesn't there are people who want to level through PvP and there are still people here today that do it's pretty effective and breaks up the tediousness of leveling, guess what BLU can't do? Same with PotD so many people rushed Rdm and Sam because the ques were bad and was optimal to level by doing 50-60 floors so they could continue on with SB MSQ so they wouldn't be left behind, guess what level BLU is stuck at? 50.

To me you're saying that I am removing freedom when in reality it's SE where they limit you because it's a "limited" job (see what I did there) BLU is limited to what it can be apart of, limited to how it can level, limited to how it gets abilities, limited to how you can level it. Don't point fingers at me when SE is the one who chose to how you can level this class and how it interacts with how the core game is which guess what, the endgame is indeed Tome grinding and roulettes as well as whatever optional content that needs matchmaking which is an issue if people don't have premades and wanna play solo.

I'm not using facts, I am using what's given to me and how the state of the game is currently and how going forward with this experiment isn't going to create a desirable experience for a lot of people who are displeased with myself being one of them I'm just voicing how with all these things I said are issues that SE have made for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Awful

The issue is the game doesn't tell you to use PF it tells you to use DF to find groups for dungeons and tells you about the rewards for queing with adventurer in need, and there is no open world content unless it's FATEs, the same boring content we've had since 2.0? What thrilling open world building content. They said they will continue to increase the cap what I'm saying is because you can't access it (being level 50) you can't do any endgame or roulettes so please read.

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We could potentially see Party Finder used more with Blue Mages wanting to hook up. Potentially it could be where it get more love. But I've generally found it's use for gathering people for endgame stuff. I think in a better case scenario, the restiction would essentially be you can do any piece of content as long as you don't use the duty finder, whilst inconvenient, it would not be horrible (plus, if you can roulette as a pre-made with a BLU, I think that would help a lot too). You may well end up with some parties of only Blue Mages this way hanging out on the Party Finder, it could be non-Blue Mages pick up on that and join said party finder groups. But I guess SE is being cautious as it is a departure from normal jobs and could cause too many problems if not in check.

Whilst I get that the game doesn't do much to push the party finder, I think if you wanted to level Blue Mage, you'd become more acutely aware of its benefit. Plus it does get used for content and there is a message every so often in your chat window telling you how many party finder parties match your criteria at the moment, so whilst not pushed, I expect awareness to come quickly and a reminder of its existence to be common.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Your only argument is only about very new players being unable to read tutorials and understand what the PF is, even after finishing 2.0 and leveled a job to 50.
That's an extremely niche concern to have, especially if you have to assume that the game won't disclose how BLU works and why it's different to new players.
You also completly ignore tools like the Novice network where new players can ask questions about things they don't understand.

That's litteraly the weakest argument against how BLU will be in FFXIV in this entire thread.

That quest can simply start by "Blue Mage is a limited job. Limited jobs are submitted to restrictions regular jobs don't have, and have special content as well as gameplay attached to them. Please, read this tutorial about Blue Mages. [Tutorial opens]".
Problem solved.
Exactly. It's simply side content.
That, on the other hand, is only your own opinion. You can't do "relevant content" with your Squadron. It didn't prevent this side content to exists and be enjoyed by some people.
You say "people want to take BLU in relevant content". Who are you to say what everyone wants? I, for instance, couldn't care less about not being able to raid with a BLU, and I appreciate the system they came up with to make it feel like a true and iconic Blue Mage. So, speak for yourself and yourself only, please.
Besides, we already knew since 4 years ago how BLU was going to be. Or, more to the point, not to be.

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Squadron and a Job are two VERY different things. A job should never be meant as just side content since a Class/Job is something you have to be to do 80% of the content in the game. Having said that I guess Crafters are side content as well, but they are not battle classes. And I didn't say everyone I said People. Some People want to take Blue through relevant content and other don't. Again I didn't say everyone just people which means SOME of them.

Also, I think with the "freedom" argument, they're not limiting freedom, they're adding to it by saying "you guys can now have Blue Mage, and it'll be a proper Blue Mage" and avoid some of the disappointment people felt with something like Summoner when they couldn't play a summoner true to the FF titles (I still love SMN, but it's not SMN). So this is a new option to the game, whilst by comparison to other jobs there are restrictions, but if you want to avoid those restrictions you still have the choice of another job that works in the more conventional FFXIV way - BLU could have been one of these, but it'd have to sacrifice parts of its identity to pull it off. In fact, where there are restrictions in some areas for Blue Mage, there is freedom in how it is played and configured that is not given to other jobs. I cannot choose my spell list as a SMN or a SCH, now can I do a tank or DPS or healer build for any of my jobs, I cannot change the role my jobs plays nor have anything like the kind versatility or choice that comes with being able to customise your job or how you play it.

What they've done is added a new type of job to work in a more traditional Final Fantasy way, thus adding more choice in getting what people enjoy. But for it to work, to be fair and for balance, it can't have the same parameters. I just hope that SE do right by it and get the balance right, so the restrictions aren't too hefty.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

Squadron and a Job are two VERY different things. A job should never be meant as just side content since a Class/Job is something you have to be to do 80% of the content in the game. Having said that I guess Crafters are side content as well, but they are not battle classes. And I didn't say everyone I said People. Some People want to take Blue through relevant content and other don't. Again I didn't say everyone just people which means SOME of them.

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And who are you to say that battle classes should never be created to be side content? Especially one with such a very specific gameplay? It's like saying that Pyros shouldn't exists because there are battle actions specifically designed for that side content, and that you can't use them elsewhere.
Next time you'll say that fishers shouldn't exist because they aren't playing like the other gathering classes and have very specific and dedicated content/gameplay? For me, BLU is to battle classes what fisher is to gathering classes.
You are not the one deciding if something can or cannot be created as side content. Period.
However, you are free to voice your own opinion on the matter, saying if you like it or not. But that's different from stating "A job should never be meant as just side content" like you had any authority in the matter.

Oh and, "people want" is not the same as "some people want". Words have a meaning. Saying "people want" imply that the majority wants something. "Some people want", on the other hand, only speaks about a specific group of people, which might even be a tiny minority. But you didn't say "some people want", because it'd have less impact than a big generality like "people want". It might sound pedantic, but it's simply me catching you using a false/weak argument to put more weight on your end than you actually have.
Why is that important? Because when you have a debate with someone, and you use something vague like "some people wanted BLU to be that way!", a very simple counter-argument saying the opposite is exactly as valid as yours: "but other people didn't wanted BLU to be what you described." And boom. There goes your argument.

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Originally Posted by Saefinn

...so the restrictions aren't too hefty.

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I would consider only allowing you into instanced content - you know, where the majority of the game takes place - by way of a fully premade group as too hefty.

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig.
You can put a blue mask on a minigame, but it's still a minigame.

I haven't been this disappointed in a company's decision for an mmo in a very long time.

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Originally Posted by JBee

You can put a blue mask on a minigame, but it's still a minigame.

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By that token, you can put a blue mask on a regular caster with a set spell selection, but it's still not a Blue Mage.

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Originally Posted by JBee

I would consider only allowing you into instanced content - you know, where the majority of the game takes place - by way of a fully premade group as too hefty.

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig.
You can put a blue mask on a minigame, but it's still a minigame.

I haven't been this disappointed in a company's decision for an mmo in a very long time.

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Perhaps I come too much from the stand point of running content with my FC & friends and when I've done endgame content, it has been through party finder. 24 man raids I can see being impacted badly, but that was not really in the forefront of my mind thinking about this as I've hated and avoided Return to Ivalice (despite loving FFXII). I still have my reservations about it, I am hoping for the better case scenario. Maybe the effect of all this is that people end up using the Party Finder more, which some regions do.

Whilst I am still in two minds, I am not seeing it as the doom and gloom it is painted as. We'll have to see how this actually works out in practice, because that is where my scepticism lies, because history has shown that SE don't always get it right in practice, as one who though Eureka was a great idea, but hate how it was implemented whereby they became glorified fate trians.

But if I can do content as a premade group and can still do it via party finder and get a job that I enjoy and love playing and feels like a true blue mage, then I may (whilst begrudgingly) take the hit that I can't use duty finder for it. Of course, the job will have to be worth it in the end.

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Originally Posted by LastFireAce

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

Level 5 death would work against EVERY end-game boss because every endgame boss is level 50, 60 or 70.

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Or they could easily be immune. Just like MAJORITY of FF bosses who legit imuned to death such as fate boss

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Which defeats the purpose of having it. Dead skill. May as well not even have it.

My point, in response to the previous poster was that "L5 Death" only worked because the players and the monsters/bosses were level 50/60/70 at end, and it would be unusable for all the leveling content between those. So why would you equip a skill that you works only on trash mobs on the 50/60/70 end game content. You wouldn't if you had something else that could steamroll over them.

My favorite "cheat" in FF6 was the vanish/x-zone(Warp/Banish) which I was not aware was an actual bug, but because it worked on everything. That was because Vanish was not supposed to be cast on monsters. Whoops. Once that cat was let out of the bag, that was de-facto strategy. In FFV, a similar strategy worked by raising the level of the monster using a certain skill and then L5 Death. Whoops that was probably not the intended effect, casing a buff on the monster first.

The problem with BLU, as we currently *think* it will work, is naively assuming players won't find a way to use BLU in a way that developers had not intended, and it becomes de-facto strategy.

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Originally Posted by Listrella

Blue mage was never going to work as a main job, not without fundamentally betraying what that job is about, which is learning abilities from monsters.

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Red Mage was never going to work as a main job, not without fundamentally betraying what that job is about, which is using damage magic, healing magic, and melee combat in equal measure.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

By that token, you can put a blue mask on a regular caster with a set spell selection, but it's still not a Blue Mage.

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Completely agree with this comment.

There's no reason why a happy medium couldn't have been found, instead of doubling down and limiting a job that so many people have been looking forward to.

- Make certain abilities not work in dungeons
- Make certain abilities not work in raids
- Make certain abilities unable to be used on Bosses
- Give the job some skills as they level up, with either the skills enhanced/changed or added to via monster encounters
- Limit the potency of certain abilities in roulettes

I don't mind something new; frankly if they wanted to add a solo job like this they would have been better off adding the Beastmaster instead.

I feel bad for all of you people who were super excited to main switch to blu.

But on the other hand, that isn't me. I did not care about blu at all before the reveal. Everything they announced seems pretty exciting to me and have elevated a job that I would have leveled to cap and ignored to something that I can see putting a lot of time into. This is all pending implementation hangups (learned abilities being rare come the hell on), but otherwise I am stoked. And honestly, more excited for this than anything put into this game since heavensward, and I am saying that as someone that plays as sam and rdm 90% of the time.

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Originally Posted by JBee

Completely agree with this comment.

There's no reason why a happy medium couldn't have been found, instead of doubling down and limiting a job that so many people have been looking forward to.

- Make certain abilities not work in dungeons
- Make certain abilities not work in raids
- Make certain abilities unable to be used on Bosses
- Give the job some skills as they level up, with either the skills enhanced/changed or added to via monster encounters
- Limit the potency of certain abilities in roulettes

I don't mind something new; frankly if they wanted to add a solo job like this they would have been better off adding the Beastmaster instead.

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The only one I'm iffy on is the "Give the job some skills as they level up, with either the skills enhanced/changed or added to via monster encounters" I think the acquisition for skills is spot on. And I'd add to the first 3 "now work or high potency" because any of the skills what would be "problematic" in XIV should have a high GCD anyway or boss immune to it (ie their lvl 5 death >.> it would either hit hard but not fully -- like in some other ff games-- or boss immune to it.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

Which means you get those abilities in duties, instead of randomly gobbling on mobs in the open world.

That is a good choice, really. Imagine the crowd looking for specific mobs. Pure chaos.

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It will be both open world mobs and duties/trials etc. Gonna be a lot more fighting in the world.

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Originally Posted by Beckett

Red Mage was never going to work as a main job, not without fundamentally betraying what that job is about, which is using damage magic, healing magic, and melee combat in equal measure.

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To add to this, this is something I actually said before Red Mage came out! And I had to eat crow super hard! It may not have been 100% in the spirit of the original job, but it's close enough, and Red Mage is one of my favorite jobs to play in FFXIV. I can respect the opinion of people who are looking forward to a new type of gameplay that comes with a a solo-based BLU, but the idea that Blue Mage could never, under any circumstances work as a regular job in FFXIV is asinine.

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Originally Posted by TheJarvisMan

Everything I've read leads me to believe this class is going to be isolated to its own content. If that's the case, then they just ruined the one class I've been waiting for above all in this game. Time will tell...

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Jesus, I called my shot here. Wish I was able to take some kind of joy in it. :(

I am incline to at least give them credit for trying to add BLU in a form actually like a BLU as it is something a lot of people wanted.

However in reality I think it would have been better for them just not to bother. FF 14's gameplay systems aren't really structured in such a way that BLU would work and as such there was never any way for them to be true to what a BLU was and still have it work in the FF 14's role based structure. In the end you come of with something that isn't really what people wanted.

TL:DR They were never going to be able to pull off a true BLU because of how FF 14 works so they probably shouldn't have tried.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

The Carnivale system is not in the game already, not sure where you think you're seeing it.

Sucks you're not getting to play a "Blue Mage" that's really just a regular caster with spells named after beast spells in your precious raids. Truly, we are living in the darkest timeline.

Stop being so narrow minded about how a class can be added to the game. Less stressful that way.

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And here we have this famous hate for raiders again. Do you really think its cool that a class gets implemented that people can't play in the actual game aka. the parts of the game that people really enjoy?

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

How is it 'not content' just because all YOU want to do is raid?
Raiding is about 10% of the game, people are always clamouring for 'good side content', thats why Diadem and Eureka were disappointing, because peoole want side content, and indeed many still do play Eureka.

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You can't do anything through Duty Finder with it.

You can do FATEs and Leves with BLU.

Systems that have been completely abandoned for years now.

BLU is travel the overworld, collect skills, so that you can travel the overworld. The catch is that the overworld must be interesting, and anybody that has played this game in the past 8 years would know that the XIV overworld is one of the least engaging in MMO history.

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Originally Posted by TheJarvisMan

Jesus, I called my shot here. Wish I was able to take some kind of joy in it. :(

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How can anybody take joy in it?

BLU has been one of the most hyped jobs since xiv legacy's reveal. It was revealed at fanfest. They called it a job. They even showed it in combat.

And it's not a job. It's a joke, like Lords of Verminion.

But at least Lords of Verminion has depth.

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

Everything they announced seems pretty exciting to me and have elevated a job that I would have leveled to cap and ignored to something that I can see putting a lot of time into.

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I agree with this. I think the concept of Blue Mage is very interesting and different; it's like a game on its own! I initially wasn't really interested, but now I am.
Besides, we'll get some other jobs for raiding at 5.0, so people at endgame content won't be empty handed.

Edit: Not sure if I misread, but wasn't Blue Mage allowed to do raids so long as they're in a premade party?

I just dont understand why they couldnt do both systems?

Give them core skills through quests that can be used in dungeons and raids and then on top of that let them collect more skills for solo content that will be locked out if you are doing recent group content.

@Clover_Blake: They could do raids with a premade party but only those lvl50 ones since the job is locked at that level for some time and is only raised through 5.x patches. Thus it cant do recent content.

I am looking forward to it. I do understand some people being a bit unsure. I think in time they may be able to let you go in duty etc,as a person who enjoys solo/duo play or something to work on this is perfect for me. I will look forward to collecting my spells and using different combos. It will be also great if they introduce Beastmaster and Puppetmaster in the future. The world is dead everything is tele here and nobody is around. I think it will make the world feel more alive if people are out collecting spells.

The truth is that there is a middle-ground here.

Give Blue Mage this exciting, new, solo-leveling and skill acquisition experience. Allow for a massive amount of skills to be learned and used on your own in any way you see fit. And then tweak some of these skills to be balanced for party play while maintaining the spirit of the job, as they have done for literally every other job in the game.

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Originally Posted by Awful

You really have to look at the big picture here you're saying that my arguments go against freedom?

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Um...To look at "bigger picture" you need to look from various perspectives. I assure you, that's exactly what I do and what you seem to be adamantly against.

Think about it this way. There are two alternatives. They add Blue Mage this way or not at all. These are the only options because THEY are the ones that make this game and THEY decided that. They didn't want to cripple the Blue Mage and make an entirely new job, then slap the title on it.

If they added Blue Mage, they added to what you can do. Now you can do stuff as Blue Mage. Stuff that have not really been accessible before, even, unique to Blue Mage. You cannot do certain things (but content-wise it only applies to new stuff, Deep Dungeons and PvP).
If they did not add Blue Mage, you wouldn't be able to do anything with it (duh!). You'd never get more to do, nor anything unique to do. You could do LESS than you can do, thus they wouldn't give you more freedom.
If they did add Blue Mage and then removed it...yep. That would take away some of your freedom.

No matter how you look at it, if your point of view is from what IS, and not what COULD BE (which is a horrible way to review anything), then this is a positive addition to freedom, not a negative. You never get the freedom that is later limited. Basically, you just GET less freedom than you'd want, but why would they endanger the whole game just to give some players that extra freedom, and do that on the spot? Because you keep ignoring the fact that it is all an experiment that is likely to evolve.

dead on arrival.

This is a waste of development time pure and simple. They made more compromises with SMN, BRD, and RDM than they would have had to with BLU.

They literally could have implemented it the same way, tweaked how abilities worked for balance and to have some sort of rotation, and the abilities make it if in a specific role. Make it so that depending on your level you have to have a certain number of skills slotted to queue for content.

Would it have been harder to balance...sure. But it would have also been the first job with some actual depth in the game doing it that way. Instead we get a half measure that will be nothing but disappointment.

The saddest thing is that since this content is coming out in 4.5 people will be really bored for 6 months and play the content... which will cause them to see it as a success and replicate it for another job the community wants just to disappoint all over again.

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Originally Posted by Viridiana_Sovari

This is a waste of development time pure and simple.

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Have you played it? Don't think so. Personally I will wait till I actually try it before making a judgement. Also 4.5 will bring the mistery Gold Saucer attraction and a new incentive to farm doge mounts. So if you aren't having fun with broken pimp, you can do other stuff.

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Originally Posted by Viridiana_Sovari

This is a waste of development time pure and simple. .

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I guarantee you that exponentially more people will do this than ultimates. Even if you expand the concept of doing ultimates to include the couple thousand people that watch ultimate progression on twitch.

It's a good thing that they're trying new things. However, I personally am a bit disappointed with BLU along with others. I was hoping for it to be like other classes but with the monster learning mechanic and some form of gate keeping, skill limitations (banning certain skills/having a nerfed version for grouped content) or perhaps preset skills for balancing while introducing skill choices. I originally thought this would be the case, and that BLU won't ever be perfectly balanced in the sense that it is not as powerful as others but still somehow viable and not overpowered/broken. As someone who enjoys most of PVP I was also hoping for it to be at least playable in PVP with a set of monster skills but unfortunately it isn't.

Though unlikely, I still hope that its limited job status gets removed in the future.

Having slept on it, I'm going to try to wait and see how BLU and the Masked Carnival play out before going one way or the other.
I will say that I am a bit disappointed that you can't play relevant/current content with it.
I'm also interested on how they are going to make the Masked Carnival relevant and what rewards we will get from it.

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Originally Posted by Viridiana_Sovari

They made more compromises with SMN, BRD, and RDM than they would have had to with BLU.

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Could they have made a BLU fit into the mainstream content and current job mould by removing some of its iconic aspects that are unfit for regular party play? Yes.
Did they want to do it? No.

It's fine to break the mould from time to time and make new things.

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Originally Posted by Viridiana_Sovari

This is a waste of development time pure and simple. .

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This is what really gets me. I don't even want to know how much time and resources was put into BLU and making content specifically for it, only for people to lose interest at level cap because it's not good enough to put actual time into it.