MNK 4.0 Changes . . . I'm not a fan tbh

The changes just feel bad. I'm already considering changing to another melee DPS class. Monks already lose a lot of their GL stacks due to invulnerability phases of bosses that you simply cannot change. Refreshing it to maximum with another skill to try to change it just doesn't feel like it addresses the problem, especially if the new fists of fire just increases cast time for that damage. I would have preferred a level 70 skill where upon opening all the chakras, instead of using Forbidden Chakra, they can activate a skill like FF11's Hundred Fists, where they can basically attack faster and let them build up those stacks of GL faster after a boss's re-entry into the battlefield. I think the chakras still share a global cooldown with everything else as well, which is another problem. If they did not, then it might be a lot more useful.

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Originally Posted by DarkLiriel

Reading this and other threads and laughing at how idiotic these OPs and responses are.. No one's even played any of the jobs at 70, we don't know how the new skills need to be worked in, we don't know what the boss fights are going to be like... Chill out people, my god. The devs likely know exactly what they're doing. So monks ate a damage nerf? They are likely changing the job up some so that some skills are going to be used more often. Get use to it, change your job, or gtfo of the game. Simple as that.

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We're expressing our disappointment and frustration at lackluster and counterintuitive class design, not "monks eating a damage nerf." No, we don't know what the content is going to be like. No, we don't know precisely what SE has in mind when it comes to boss/raid design.

We do however know that the impending changes to monk as a job do not have many benefits for us either in terms of numbers (because people have done the math) or in terms of our position in the raid meta (since samurai is booting us out of the low-utility-high-numbers dps role).

Then again, it's kind of unrealistic to expect someone to understand the significance of SE basically throwing a gigantic monkey wrench in the works of a class they apparently neither main nor perform well at.

I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but when you have no idea what you're talking about, it kind of makes you look both pompous and ignorant to tell people that they're overreacting to something that you aren't actually all that well-versed in.

Tl;dr Honestly, you just kind of look like a smug douche. Get used to it, learn to play the class you're dismissing the detrimental changes to, or gtfo the thread.

All they would have to do to make me happy is add touch of death back in and give demolish its old duration. I'm fine with a pile of useless skills since it's what monk has always had. The only thing interesting about playing it was managing touch, demo and fracture to maximize damage. Monk always felt like the easiest melee to play even with those 3 dots. Come stormblood it's going to be a downright snoozefest.

Even if they buff up some of monk's numbers I'll probably switch to dragoon for the next tier anyways since they removed the rng on wheel/fang. I just want to play jobs where procs / rng are not part of the rotation.

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Originally Posted by DarkLiriel

Reading this and other threads and laughing at how idiotic these OPs and responses are.. No one's even played any of the jobs at 70, we don't know how the new skills need to be worked in, we don't know what the boss fights are going to be like... Chill out people, my god. The devs likely know exactly what they're doing. So monks ate a damage nerf? They are likely changing the job up some so that some skills are going to be used more often. Get use to it, change your job, or gtfo of the game. Simple as that.

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As long as those developers know what they doing 10 times better than World of Warcraft, World of Tanks, Armored Warfare, War Thunder, Guild Wars 2 and many other developers, i'm going to be HAPPPYYYY with this game.
Bought it 2 days ago and LOVE IT. :)

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Originally Posted by DarkLiriel

Reading this and other threads and laughing at how idiotic these OPs and responses are.. No one's even played any of the jobs at 70, .

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Not sure in what sort of cave you live in, but we know every single new skill as well as their potency and cooldown that's gonna be released. There are even very legit rotations from people who have been theorycrafting for those jobs that changed a bit (obviously not MNK's case because the rotation is the same).
Elemental shoulder tackles, a buff that decreases SS but buffs damage, an AOE raid party buff, a skill that refreshes your stacks and decreases your damage if you receive some (why are these 2 things even mixed up in the same skill?), an unchanged tornado kick (this has to be a bad joke...) and the freaking exact same rotation without touch of death.
Sorry I'm not all that impressed with MNK, which is why I won't even touch it in SB. Hats off to those who are loyal enough to MNK to go through this garbage xD.

SE please, make changes before SB!
PD: Remove the Minuet hide in the new buff

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Originally Posted by DarkLiriel

Reading this and other threads and laughing at how idiotic these OPs and responses are.. No one's even played any of the jobs at 70, we don't know how the new skills need to be worked in, we don't know what the boss fights are going to be like... Chill out people, my god. The devs likely know exactly what they're doing. So monks ate a damage nerf? They are likely changing the job up some so that some skills are going to be used more often. Get use to it, change your job, or gtfo of the game. Simple as that.

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they can try to throw anything to us, what we point out is not a trouble of dps, but lackluster and lazy add of skill and trait to the monk tools.
the point here is, if they did scraps more of half of the new thing get in sb of the monk it will make no difference.

since you seems to not know what you talk about let's resume the situation:

- tackles mastery, a trait that modify shoulder tackle in function of the fist you use.

Fire tackle get a +30 potency, it means shoulder tackle get to 130 potency what is... meh since shoulder tackle is a skill used every 30 second... not even a core mechanic of our jobs.

Earth tackle get a knockback of 10 yalms... the goal of a monk is to get close for attack since we don't have any real long range attack... what was asked since day 1 of ARR and what was being expected since the boss of job quest 60 have a ranged attack

wind tackle have a potency of 70-80 but can be used 2 times. ...ermm when we are at melee why we will need another charge?

more important this mastery recquire us to play into other fist element....what we don't do... fist of wind is a garbage that was expected to be taken out, instead we did loose death touch... *sighs*

- deep meditation: a trait that give your critical weaponskill a chance to give you chakra, one of the few add that is...decent... more a way to make up for the whole HW debacle where this skill was barely usable. by the way, no new addition to the chakra system we still have the attack and the tp generation, what any good monk will say is barely usefull, since we still have motivation, worst with the add of goad as role skill and the song... means you will only use the attack. great... a trait for one skill...

- Riddle of fire: skill of 90 sec of cd that increase the damage of 30% and reduce the attack speed of 15%, just a reminder all the damage of the monk are low mainly because we are a jobs based on speed. and there we have a buff that strips us of our speed for increase damage. more important only the monk have skill that have downside inside it... that are that violent.

- Riddle of earth: skill of 90 sec of cd that increase our resistance to damage, only after take one attack. and refresh Greese lightning duration. 2 trouble with this skill: one we are freaking dps, we are not means to take damage. second what is the point of tornado kick now? since we will have a skill that will allows us to save our greese lightning stack that have a duration of 16 sec now. without forget, this force us into fist of earth stance, reducing more our damage...

- finally brotherhood: a 2 minute CD that will buff the member of the team AROUND the monk only, if they move to far the buff is lost. the number we have is 5% of damage buff for melee character. and the monk is not included, indeed it allows us to get more chakra, but if your group only one melee dps, it means only 2 person will affect you. without forget this skill is interesting only if the other dps have high attack speed. if they are dragoon.... well let's say you will not get a lot of chakra. this skill work well when you have 2 monk together... worst if the damage buff stay like this, a ninja is far more interesting with his +10% the target take every minute!

and that the reason why monk are unhappy, all we have get are buff... no new mechanic, no new attack, we will still use the same cycle since the release of FF14 arr... worst we do loose 1-2 attack. what the monk point out, is the "synergy" offered is far not enough for justify the presence of the monk, worst the change will force the monk that play since ARR or worst like me since the v1 to wait 2 years for expect a change of the jobs? seriously?

ps: i will take you are a summoner, since said by your account, with HW you did get the transe mechanic and now you will get demi bahamut, all in all you have get new mechanic that have change your gameplay, evolving the summoner. the monk haven't evolved really since ARR... the add of HW was barely decent... and the one of SB are simply bad.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

but we know every single new skill as well as their potency and cooldown that's gonna be released.

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That would be incorrect...
What we know is the April build that prioritized stability over balance for the sake of having a playable environment for the media to enjoy.
This may imply to be a build from even before April.

Not gonna tell you to stop being unhappy about what you've seen so far, since it is a form of feedback for the devs (if they are actually reading all of this), but I don't believe you should take the potencies and CD timers as definitive yet.

If the monk job is gonna stay as it is shown in the videos, the gameplay is gonna be as boring as before, tops. I will bring nothing new to the discussion since I don't have the Maths to prove anything. However, I did sign in to bump this and add a reply to get my disappointment across.

I agree with everyone saying that the number themselves are not the (main) problem, since they can be tweaked and adjusted, which will probably happen anyways (remember the bard job at the beginning of HW?). The main problem is that they f'ed the gameplay by including solutions to problems we didn't really have. The new mechanic gives us nothing new during combat, only as a small opener maybe, and besides that all the issues will remain.

I'm not worried about DPS. I'm sad that the poster class of this expansion is possibly the most underwhelming one yet.

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Originally Posted by Rheumasalbe

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This is indeed the main problem many main monks have with the job right now. The rotation is the same, in fact worse, same but simplified. And just like you said, the new actions are situational and mostly useless.

A better buff to monks would've been a balance that we ALWAYS have on. Cause I'm sorry.. when you're the TOP DPS in any dungeon and the astro gives the BALANCE to someone ELSE.. fuck that shit. Take away both earth and wind and give fire the balance buff that's always on. Give us more damage and give us back our speed. The raid things we got feel like a joke cause really? Brotherhood looks like it'll ONLY be useful if you have the correct party members for it. What if you're the ONLY melee? Well brohood isn't going to work for you now. And really? I love shoulder tackle.. it's my spin dash. But WHY did it have to have effects that make me turn OFF fist of fire?

Kill the other fist, buff fire and put the shoulder tackle buff with fire also. And that one move is still there? One llm punch? WHY? Tornardo kick could've been awesome if you just oh I dunno... took the taking my GL stacks away and buffed it's damage. Make us WANT to use the skill more. Not LESS. SE it's not hard to give monk some love... but nevermind.. gotta baby Samurai. T.T
- Yes I'm salty. - But at least I'm trying to give SE some feedback on how to not mess up such an easy job to fix.

MNK was my main from the very beginning. I personally don't mind getting any new skills, fine, it can be like FFXI where monk gets very little to no love, i'm use to it. But they actually had to go back and make the skills that we already had...bad....

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Originally Posted by DarkLiriel

Reading this and other threads and laughing at how idiotic these OPs and responses are.. No one's even played any of the jobs at 70, we don't know how the new skills need to be worked in, we don't know what the boss fights are going to be like... Chill out people, my god. The devs likely know exactly what they're doing. So monks ate a damage nerf? They are likely changing the job up some so that some skills are going to be used more often. Get use to it, change your job, or gtfo of the game. Simple as that.

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Can we stop with these assumptions the devs are completely infallible? While I don't disagree, we'll need to see the final results to judge with 100% certainty. The odds they make fundamental changes from the media tour toolkit is extremely unlikely. At least, this close to release. Furthermore, the devs do not exactly have a great track record if we look at Heavensward and the time it took to either fix things or just flat out ignore them.

Diadem weapon isn't BIS, there is no real rotation, there was no problems with machinist or astrologian on release, Gordias was unjustified complaining are all things that they've talked about off the top of my head that has proved they're human and aren't gods that can't have made mistakes.

Well in about 19 hours we'll see if there's anything new to look forward to. The problem is... monks just aren't getting anything new or exciting this expansion. More damage will make us viable, sure, but it won't make us interesting.

In fact, we're losing the only depth our job had with the removal of ToD and Fracture. Being able to read ahead in the fight to maximize their use was a useful skill that gave great monks an edge over good monks. It's not on the level of like, Bards maximizing oGCDs and Empyreal Arrow with Feint, but hey it is something. Or, was something.

As a MNK main I'm disappointed with the new skills. I sincerely hope things are changed before the full release because no one will bother taking MNKs into high end content otherwise. I'll be picking up a different class if our viability drops even further in Stormblood.

My two cents: a "solution" for the whole Monk problem would be to give Riddle of Wind (RoW) an additional buff, for example a speed-only buff (like 10-15%) that expires when Greased Lightning 3 (GL3) is stacked (or has a 20-30 sec duration in general). Or give the Wind Aura a +5% speed boost and RoW 5-10%. That way
(1) we would have another skill similar to Perfect Balance in the sense that we get to GL3 a lot faster than standard rotation from scratch, albeit not as useful, and
(2) it would also sort of solve the problem with long down times.
(3) Another bonus would be that RoW would not be useless, and the amount of change involved for SE would be minimal,
AND (4) it would bring a new mechanic to monk gameplay with at three types of stances: speed, damage and defensive.

Here's how I imagine it after down time:

Start off in Wind Aura + Coeurl Stance -> tackle -> snap punch (-> GL1) -> tackle again (i.e. RoW -> get speed buff) -> [do combos to get into GL3]

To counterbalance the insane dps boost you'd get if it was able to be activated during combat one could include a 10% damage reduction until GL3 is reached. Or keep both speed boost and damage reduction 20-30 seconds and make RoW a counter-balance to RoF, which is damage boost and speed reduction. Then we would have a defensive stance and riddle (Riddle of Earth), a speed stance and riddle (Wind) and a damage stance and riddle (Fire).

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Originally Posted by Powercow

Well in about 19 hours we'll see if there's anything new to look forward to. The problem is... monks just aren't getting anything new or exciting this expansion. More damage will make us viable, sure, but it won't make us interesting.

In fact, we're losing the only depth our job had with the removal of ToD and Fracture. Being able to read ahead in the fight to maximize their use was a useful skill that gave great monks an edge over good monks. It's not on the level of like, Bards maximizing oGCDs and Empyreal Arrow with Feint, but hey it is something. Or, was something.

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This. Why would anyone pick us over a SAM? Sure we get that buff to RNG give us Chakra okey, then what? Lower our GCD for extra damage?
Yoshi - Give us more, something!

We're the only DPS that has less attacks going into 4.0, aren't we?

It's... so weird how the 3.0 skills all made so much sense and only served to make the class smoother and all around stronger, and here we are now, with a raid buff that'll likely affect only around half the party and more Shoulder Tackle options.

Man, SE done ****ed up.

I think all the melee classes have the same amount of attacks/abilities. I could be wrong tho. It looked like they had roughly the same amount of weaponskills and abilities.

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Originally Posted by Blacktestament7

I think all the melee classes have the same amount of attacks/abilities. I could be wrong tho. It looked like they had roughly the same amount of weaponskills and abilities.

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Unless I'm forgetting something, NIN is breaking even, losing Dancing Edge and Mutilate and gaining Hellfrog and Bhavacakra, Monk is -1 with losing Touch of Death, and Dragoon is...complicated, but technically breaking even.

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Originally Posted by Blacktestament7

I think all the melee classes have the same amount of attacks/abilities. I could be wrong tho. It looked like they had roughly the same amount of weaponskills and abilities.

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Monk is down Touch of Death and Fracture (yes, we did use Fracture) and we didn't gain any new GCDs or damage dealing OGCDs. The changes to One Ilm Punch haven't made it something we'll use in our rotation ever so we've actually backslid significantly since 2.1 :/.

Are you guys only counting moves that were native to the class and not borrowed weaponskills?

technically in gcd attack we use only 7 actively...
Arm of destroyer, one ilm punch and rockbreaker are situational and often not worth the use.

in ogcd skill we do have 5 attack giving us 12 skill for our cycle.

i don't count buff or stance mechanic since they are virtual passive.

dragoon have 10 attack gcd and 4 ogcd attack skill (don't counting the SB one yet) giving them 14 active skill (i don't count the aoe like for the monk since they are situational skill)
ninja have 7 gcd attack and 4 ogcd, plus 3 ninjutsu mostly used. giving them too 14 skill active.

i don't count SB because we haven't the exact skill list, for the dragoon in the skill trailer we see penta thrust and it was not shown in the media tour.

anyway, we are already short of 2 skill and we will not get more and get less... since we loose death touch. (i havent counted futur role skill or cross skill actual too)

SB is dumbing down badly the monk, when it must be the jobs with the most active skill, since we are technically the fatest job (with the ninja true, but we get more skill speed on our gear)

Single target, NIN will have 5 GCDs in SB, 3 of which are finishers that branch out of the first 2. Will have less options for GCD than PLD. Talk about brain dead :v
At least they have 9 offensive oGCDs.

Given that the ToD was removed to save Tp usage and general gcd losing about 10% dmg and lower TP cost, it would make sense if SE snuck in GL4 (+ additional 10% dmg and 5% attack speed) to justify the extra TP and balance out the lost of 10% dmg lost. Also would balance out the Riddle of Fire 15% slow. Didnt Yoshi P hinted that during rotation you have the option of not spending chakra to gain more dps. Maybe that's the whole concept of Riddle...

even if it's the concept... don't that make the gameplay still bland? i can understand that they want to reduce the number of action, but i don't want to arrive to the point that the jobs can't evolve because they risk to become to complicate to be played...

up

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

even if it's the concept... don't that make the gameplay still bland? i can understand that they want to reduce the number of action, but i don't want to arrive to the point that the jobs can't evolve because they risk to become to complicate to be played...

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However, if the requirement for the average player is too high, then you risk not bringing in New players. You would have a low income of players but a high exit of players as they outgrow the game. It wouldn't be good for the games stability, in my opinion.

i will be blunt, not every jobs must be as simple to play... plus, if people expect to be good in less of 1-2 day of training what the point. it take time to understand a jobs and learn to play it. like it take time to master a fight in raid.
people must stop to expect to get everything handled for them

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

i will be blunt, not every jobs must be as simple to play... plus, if people expect to be good in less of 1-2 day of training what the point. it take time to understand a jobs and learn to play it. like it take time to master a fight in raid.
people must stop to expect to get everything handled for them

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You say that, but if some jobs were outright easier to play but yielded similar results, the imbalance in jobs become more apparent. SE wants all the classes to be more accessible to the general audience. Don't get be wrong, I don't think any of the rotations are inherently very difficult, but some people are gated to roles or jobs based on the "lack of ease" some people experience.

honestly....even dragoon is far harder than monk... then this reason don't hold.

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Originally Posted by SpeckledBurd

Monk is down Touch of Death and Fracture (yes, we did use Fracture) and we didn't gain any new GCDs or damage dealing OGCDs. The changes to One Ilm Punch haven't made it something we'll use in our rotation ever so we've actually backslid significantly since 2.1 :/.

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I'm not saying we haven't lost alot. I'm still holding hope that SE doesn't follow through with some of the removed moves like ToD (Phlebotomize/Mutiliate) personally but I'm sure we're just gonna have to eat that. And my count on moves weren't viability or necessary, just a pure how many buttons to push count. And even then I'm pretty sure I'm still wrong in thinking the mdps have the same skill/ability count. I'm thinking NIN and SAM have 2-3 more buttons than MNK and DRG.

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Originally Posted by Leonus

Are you guys only counting moves that were native to the class and not borrowed weaponskills?

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I was yes. I was only counting moves that were that class specific. So no cross-class like Fracture, Bloodbath, Mercy Stroke, e.t.c.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

technically in gcd attack we use only 7 actively...
Arm of destroyer, one ilm punch and rockbreaker are situational and often not worth the use.

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I'm really not seeing the issue with Rockbreaker. Don't get me wrong, AotD is garbage and no one will ever repeatedly use OTP even with the SB change. But Rockbreaker isn't "situational". It's the only feasible AOE the monk has that's not locked to a cooldown of 30s or 60s.

it's extremely situational since it need to do 2 skill before use it... you can go and toss a arm of destroyer and behind a twin snake (since we have no aoe in raptor form).... means at best the rockbreaker have a 6 sec of cd... for the damage it deal and the cost of the tp.... do it worth it? clearly no...
honestly i don't think it worth to keep an aoe combo if it's not rework a bit... we need a raptor form aoe if they want to make it worth the usage... but honestly with the cost of tp... it's.... well messed up to use it. generally i think it's safer to deal as much damage to one target for reduce the number of enemy as fast as possible. reducing the pressure on the tank and healer.

instead to try to deal pea shooter damage, yes on the paper our dps is good, but if you look at the hp of the monster it's only a dent into them life... you deal more damage overall, but in terms of battle efficiency i still think it's safer to deal more damage to one target and reduce them number.

not we had this debate a long time ago about what was the better, do aoe or focus on one target at the time.

Rockbreaker is really usefull during big pulls. You can also do an Aoe burst with perfect balance which is extremely efficient on big pulls.

The burst thus far has only been useful in a2s *shudder*
after that ti was a potencial lost cause on boss you'd be stuck without PB for the opener

Raiding is not the only content in this game...

And Rockbreaker is a useful skill whenever you need to aoe, why would you remove that ?

because in it form it's not worth the use. you have many number but on the long run it's not easily usable nor worth the cost in tp. like i have said it's situational and you prove it.
plus like prove it by the new info about sb, they don't want us to do big pull, they make every aoe get a nerf for we play differently.

like said the Rockbreaker is lacking another skill for be good, a raptor form aoe. what we don't have, either they add one, or strip it... in this form, it's a ssituational skill barely used.

plus i have told you, i think in a pull even a big pull, it's safer to focus for reduce the number of enemy and reduce the pressure on the tank and healer. because a large part of our dps...come from auto attack that are buffed to extrem by all the self buff we do have...
they focus on the skill for expect to get a maximum of dps is not the best way. yes, for short instant you get insane dps, but the monster will not die faster in the long run.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

because in it form it's not worth the use. you have many number but on the long run it's not easily usable nor worth the cost in tp. like i have said it's situational and you prove it.
plus like prove it by the new info about sb, they don't want us to do big pull, they make every aoe get a nerf for we play differently.

like said the Rockbreaker is lacking another skill for be good, a raptor form aoe. what we don't have, either they add one, or strip it... in this form, it's a ssituational skill barely used.

plus i have told you, i think in a pull even a big pull, it's safer to focus for reduce the number of enemy and reduce the pressure on the tank and healer. because a large part of our dps...come from auto attack that are buffed to extrem by all the self buff we do have...they focus on the skill for expect to get a maximum of dps is not the best way. yes, for short instant you get insane dps, but the monster will not die faster in the long run.

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You aren't supposed to spam it on every rotation due to the tp cost, no. It is, however, our primary source of aoe dps that is not on a 30- or 60sec cd (although AotD is a dps gain on 6 or more mobs). One Ilm Punch's buff stripping is too situational to warrant wide use. Rockbreaker's aoe is not.

In a situation when you're dealing with a trash pack or an add phase, focusing on one mob is absolutely not safer and I have no idea where you got that from. Burning one down at a time leaves the rest alive and hitting everyone for longer, thus placing significantly more strain on both your tank and healer and the rest of the party's tp/mp. It's actively detrimental not to use aoe with 3+ mobs, because a dps gain is a dps gain.

tl;dr - You are entirely misinformed.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

because in it form it's not worth the use. you have many number but on the long run it's not easily usable nor worth the cost in tp. like i have said it's situational and you prove it.
plus like prove it by the new info about sb, they don't want us to do big pull, they make every aoe get a nerf for we play differently.

like said the Rockbreaker is lacking another skill for be good, a raptor form aoe. what we don't have, either they add one, or strip it... in this form, it's a ssituational skill barely used.

plus i have told you, i think in a pull even a big pull, it's safer to focus for reduce the number of enemy and reduce the pressure on the tank and healer. because a large part of our dps...come from auto attack that are buffed to extrem by all the self buff we do have...
they focus on the skill for expect to get a maximum of dps is not the best way. yes, for short instant you get insane dps, but the monster will not die faster in the long run.

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I understand that Rockbreaker is limited but it's not weak in the least. Again, it's exceptionally strong for an AoE weaponskill and where it's placed does two things, when you AoE you retain GL3 and you aren't consistently dropping TP to do AoE damage like literally every other physical dps class. It's 130 base pot + MNK buffs so there needs to be some level of balance. I've never lacked AoE damage since 3.0 launched and unlike some I've never PBed Rockbreaker or ever wasted TP doing AotD. Adding a raptor form AoE will literally just force the monk into dropping all it's TP into AoEs. I mean, even then I wouldn't unless the raptor form had Rock's damage or something. Because if it's as weak as AotD it's not gonna be used.

I'm confused as MNK (or any physical dps for that matter) AoE also doesn't have damage drop off. I didn't have a problem doing AoE damage prior to HW and Elixir Field just pushed me higher to a point where my damage was comparable to a BLM if the adds were set up right and I still didn't need to ever use PB or AotD. The only reason AotD is unviable is the 50 pot vs 120 TP. It'd need to do double that base pot to match Boot or DK on an AoE of 3 enemies or higher. For that cost, 6 or more is a requirement for the TP cost. And that ignores Bootshine's auto crit on positional. Rockbreaker doesn't have that problem, it's again true strike but on multiple targets. Not using it is non-efficient and just as much of a waste as repeatedly using Bootshine.

I mean, seriously. Rockbreaker's range isn't even that bad so I don't see how you're seeing it as worthless. And if I'm not mistaken, not a single AoE for MNK was nerfed in those translated tooltips. I think those were the only abilities that werent nerfed actually. I'm feeling less like there's a problem with Rockbreaker and more you're discounting it because it's combo based but honestly, it's almost comparable to Geirskogul if you take the MNK buffs into consideration, probably about 10 pot off and less range.

Sry, if this feels like a rant but I've had people tell me how MNKs AoE's been weak since I started playing this game and yet, I've literally never had a problem doing AoE damage as long as I ignored AotD and used Howling Fist smartly. Elixir field only made things better. Hell if you really want to burst damage in AoE you can throw IR and B4B (I know not anymore but before) and overtake most AoE's in the game with one Rock, EF, HF rotation. The amount of outgoing damage is Deathflare level.

EDIT: If Geirskogul is 220 pot and Rock is GL3 it's 57 potency off if my math is right.

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Originally Posted by Deithwen

Raiding is not the only content in this game...

And Rockbreaker is a useful skill whenever you need to aoe, why would you remove that ?

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It's not the only content in the game, but it is the only content that matters with regards to Job balance. Nothing else really requires the full suite of abilities in Job's kit to be used to clear it frankly.

That said, Rockbreaker is a great AOE skill, even if it's third in a combo it's still fantastic. It's functionally a 190 potency skill after all buffs are accounted for with no damage drop off. Compare Fire II, which does less damage per cast. Sure it isn't spammable, but that doesn't make it any less amazing for sustaining your AOE over an entire dungeon.