you guys went overboard with this new relic

My sub ends today and I hoped the new relic quest could hold me in the game. But this awful grind for a weapon I won't even use: NO THANKS, I'm out for now! (I main Dragoon)

After not raiding for about 4 months, I really wanted to get the relic and head into Savage again. Thought it would have taken about a few days to a week at most. Even grinding Alexander Normal for about 10 hours ( about 6- 11 minutes a run, disregarding queue time). That's an INSANE amount of time.. By the time I get the weapon 3.2 will be right around the corner... It'll be useful for a few days at this rate.

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Originally Posted by Dorander

Someone has completely forgotten how they did the level 50 relic. They will nerf it in subsequent patches so those who can't dedicate that much time will be able to get it quicker.

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I remember them doing that, and it didn't motivate me to go back and do it at all. Because by the time they HAD nerfed it, my interest in the relic had already been lost.

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Originally Posted by zosia

You guys just want everything too fast. Also, I am sure by mixing up the way you grind that the weapon can still be obtained faster than some of you are making it out to be. Either way, this is the choice you guys made, you want to grind relics rather than face down a4s for your 210 weapons. Enjoy the grind.

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You say too fast, I say they are at least 6 months late. They could've released them at 200, then came out with subsequent quests to bump 205 or 210, instead of just slamming this all on us at once. And honestly savage weapons should've probably been 215, like they did with all the other raid weapons.

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Originally Posted by Vencarii

My sub ends today and I hoped the new relic quest could hold me in the game. But this awful grind for a weapon I won't even use: NO THANKS, I'm out for now! (I main Dragoon)

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My sub renewed yesterday...wasted money because I'm done as well. Maybe I'll come back later; haven't decided yet.

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

You say too fast, I say they are at least 6 months late. They could've released them at 200

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^ This. Especially with how little amount of new things these three quests needed to be added to the game (read: none whatsoever).

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

You say too fast, I say they are at least 6 months late. They could've released them at 200, then came out with subsequent quests to bump 205 or 210, instead of just slamming this all on us at once. And honestly savage weapons should've probably been 215, like they did with all the other raid weapons.

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they already did that in a practical sense. We have had ilvl200 eso weapons for about five months now.

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Originally Posted by BreathlessTao

^ This. Especially with how little amount of new things these three quests needed to be added to the game (read: none whatsoever).

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and how ds you know its dev time and not a4s/thordan clear rates that were the limiting factor? They could have postponed the relic to keep thordan and savage relevant for a longer period of time.

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Originally Posted by Vencarii

My sub ends today and I hoped the new relic quest could hold me in the game. But this awful grind for a weapon I won't even use: NO THANKS, I'm out for now! (I main Dragoon)

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Lmao

/10char

The grind is a bit OP, but I only agree with the fact that it isn't casual or mid core friendly. People who can't put in the hours in this game are going to be shut out on yet another piece of content. You guys have to understand that these quests aren't suppose to be completed in days. I'm guessing this is all an experiment to see who will consider going into savage again.

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Originally Posted by zosia

They could have postponed the relic to keep thordan and savage relevant for a longer period of time.

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They could've kept them relevant just the same, wouldn't have to release the new ilvl relic at the same time as new content. We could have at least had the 170/180/190 version at expansion, 200 for savage, 205 for Thordan and 210 for the last leg before next raid patch. Even if it's the same item level they still have different secondary stats people can itemize with so there's not much harm in having multiple, same-ilvl weapons. We had them before after all, nearly every 5 item levels.

But this a moot point in arguing since we can't go back in the past.

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Originally Posted by Cluebilly

I remember them doing that, and it didn't motivate me to go back and do it at all. Because by the time they HAD nerfed it, my interest in the relic had already been lost.

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That's on you then. As it stands, and probably will always stand: Relics are just alternate ways for people to get a half step down weapon from the hardcore raiders until the last patch before the next expansion. Then it's BiS just like it was before Heavensward. So, aim for your tomestone weapon, or primal weapon if you can't be bothered to do the work a relic or raiding requires.

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Originally Posted by Dorander

That's on you then. As it stands, and probably will always stand: Relics are just alternate ways for people to get a half step down weapon from the hardcore raiders until the last patch before the next expansion. Then it's BiS just like it was before Heavensward. So, aim for your tomestone weapon, or primal weapon if you can't be bothered to do the work a relic or raiding requires.

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True. I'm just going to at least try. But it's gonna be a heck of slog since I know it's gonna be pretty boring.

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Originally Posted by zosia

You guys just want everything too fast. Also, I am sure by mixing up the way you grind that the weapon can still be obtained faster than some of you are making it out to be. Either way, this is the choice you guys made, you want to grind relics rather than face down a4s for your 210 weapons. Enjoy the grind.

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Or I can wait for 3.2, do my Eso weekly cap in a day, three weeks in a row, and be able to spend my rest of the week free for things I like to do instead.
Like, enjoying the game and such. :(

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Originally Posted by Alcide

http://imageshack.com/a/img905/1131/tKE4K0.jpg

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Hey they do like 3/4.

They always manage to surprise us with how horrible they can make the relic quest.
They don't forget their roots by recycling all the 2.x relic for 3.x.
And they remember the fans but they don't care and just throw shit at us.

Saw the last step on Reddit. That, essentially, disengages me from starting Anima and just puts me in the "wait for Gobdip in Void Ark" camp.

Lol everyone thought they were going to walk up and with their zeta and get a free weapon, now they like
http://replygif.net/i/1065.gif

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Originally Posted by Whocareswhatmynameis

Lol everyone thought they were going to walk up and with their zeta and get a free weapon, now they like
http://replygif.net/i/1065.gif

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I tried to warn people that started the zeta grind last month thinking they were gonna be well off.

They just wasted all that time grinding lol.... most people in my FC already have done the fate grind.... 5 to 8 hours thats all it took. How long does it take to get zeta from scratch right now? lol

I personally can't condone this. It's too much too little for so little for too little too late. It would be fine if 3.1 and 3.0 were actually good, but they aren't and so it isn't.

Remember the first relic where it had unique bosses, challenging fights, and wasn't a soul draining device used waste people time until the next content patch? Good times those were.

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Originally Posted by HorrorStory

Saw the last step on Reddit. That, essentially, disengages me from starting Anima and just puts me in the "wait for Gobdip in Void Ark" camp.

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Unless you raid savage, them 10 item levels on the weapon are irrelevant anyway, b/c you do not do harshly tuned content.
If you raid savage you will get your 210 weapon from there.
I understand that they want you to work for a 210 item level weapon and I agree.
I just wonder what sort of player is the target demographic here.

-casuals: can't finish THAT kind of insanity within the entirety of Heavensward, so they are out.
-savage raiders: likely don't care because to them it would merely be another visual (grind is way overboard for a projection item)
-midcore players: most likely the ones to attempt this, but they won't finish the weapon in a timeframe that allows the item to be useful, since the next patch is due in 3 months already.

No matter from what angle you look at this: the grind is out of sync with the reward for all target groups.

When we were speculating on what the anima quests could be, the most cynical person's worst-case scenario turned out to be the reality. A monster grind of currency/tokens with the numbers set unreasonably high. I think people would have really really appreciated if there was some original content. The old relic weapons had chimera and hydra, two original battles that weren't available outside of the relic quest. I think people would want at least one original battle that must be conquered for their special weapon, even if it means one less new battle available outside of the weapon quest. I haven't polled everyone but from all the comments it looks like the community would support development time being spent on a weapon quest series that is more original and less tiresome than what anima turned out to be.

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

Some people and myself personally enjoy working towards a goal, whether it becomes pointless or not. We're not "white knighting" anything. People want everything handed to them and to put as little effort in as possible. I am pleased this isn't handed to us on a silver plate.

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Wow, you really don't see the big picture here, do you? This won't be handed to you on a plate....YET. It will be marginalized eventually, and all your hard work will be crapped on. This isn't something SE implemented so you can feel accomplished. This is something SE implemented because they know that patch 3.1 was an abysmal flop and they're trying to keep people from abandoning ship until 3.2. For some reason they believe that making the relic quests even more torturous than before will keep people in. The masochists, perhaps.

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Originally Posted by Aarik

Wow, you really don't see the big picture here, do you? This won't be handed to you on a plate....YET. It will be marginalized eventually, and all your hard work will be crapped on. This isn't something SE implemented so you can feel accomplished. This is something SE implemented because they know that patch 3.1 was an abysmal flop and they're trying to keep people from abandoning ship until 3.2. For some reason they believe that making the relic quests even more torturous than before will keep people in. The masochists, perhaps.

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That like the entire game in general and been that way since launch. If a person unhappy with it why they still sticking around, some things could be changed yes but I don't see some radical change to game in the way they do stuff.

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Originally Posted by Granyala

Unless you raid savage, them 10 item levels on the weapon are irrelevant anyway, b/c you do not do harshly tuned content.
If you raid savage you will get your 210 weapon from there.
I understand that they want you to work for a 210 item level weapon and I agree.
I just wonder what sort of player is the target demographic here.

-casuals: can't finish THAT kind of insanity within the entirety of Heavensward, so they are out.
-savage raiders: likely don't care because to them it would merely be another visual (grind is way overboard for a projection item)
-midcore players: most likely the ones to attempt this, but they won't finish the weapon in a timeframe that allows the item to be useful, since the next patch is due in 3 months already.

No matter from what angle you look at this: the grind is out of sync with the reward for all target groups.

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To have a time-based reward is always a mistake. Give casual players casual challenges, give midcore players midcore challenges, give hardcore players midcore challenges. Trading skill x time is the mistake here. In this day and age, NO ONE, has time to do this. Its fun how yoshi-p itself once said "players don`t have time to play mmo`s like old anymore". I haven`t seen this level of mindnubbing grind since ragnarok online, and at least, in RO, the endless mob killing was fun if you pushed yourself to do trains of 40 instead of 30 mobs...

Casual Challenge - Hydra/Quimera level trials. ---> Relic i200 (Entry level raid alternative)
Midcore Challenge - Primal EX trials. ---> Relic i210 (alternative to past-patch BiS)
Hardcore Challenge - Savage difficulty raid/trials. ---> Relic i220 (BiS for the content patch)

All the same skin, just diferent ilvl and stats, maybe a diferent name or coloring, even aura to diferentiate them. Make a series of long challenges. Skill based. Beat X boss with certain conditions. In X ammount of time. Not using X method. Put each level of players to the test. Have them investing their time into planning how to beat the challenge instead of doing mindnumbbing content.

Idea. Ramuh EX -Anima Trial-.

Beat Ramuh EX with both healer under the permanent effect of the tether.
Beat Ramuh EX under 3 minutes.
Beat Ramuh EX without a single KO.
Beat Ramuh EX without the use of a LB.
Beat Ramuh EX ... You get the idea.

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Originally Posted by Aarik

Wow, you really don't see the big picture here, do you? This won't be handed to you on a plate....YET. It will be marginalized eventually, and all your hard work will be crapped on. This isn't something SE implemented so you can feel accomplished. This is something SE implemented because they know that patch 3.1 was an abysmal flop and they're trying to keep people from abandoning ship until 3.2. For some reason they believe that making the relic quests even more torturous than before will keep people in. The masochists, perhaps.

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The sheer amount of people in PF doing fates means they were right. These are not as torturous as before though. The drop rates from these fates is not nearly as bad as atma when they first came out.

Alright seeing as I have no Beast Tribes at all done ever and I will not be doing anything regarding them, I need some answers here.

What are the steps from begining to end. What do I personally have to do to get this relic. Please note that I will NOT be doing any beast tribe content as it is totally outdated content.

After thinking about it at work today and putting the numbers together on how long this would take to complete casually, I can definitely see where the problem is. At the very least, this entire relic quest screams that it should have been included in 3.0 and expanded over time. By the time anyone has one of these, Gobdips would be added to Void Ark and that is a free 210 weapon with minimal effort required on the players part.

On to the actual "content" of the quest, there are a lot of things they could have done to ease up the repetitiveness of the quest. Your choices either come down to:

Run Alexander until you're sick of metal for the rest of your life, and people are already tired of Alex due to Savage.
Grind an absurd amount of Law and Poetics.
Do a limited amount of beast tribe quests. And if you aren't rank 3 with any of them, forget about this step. Which leaves you with less options.
Grind...even more hunts and/or pray you get lucky with treasure maps.

Is this all they could have done with. They have tons of other content that are dead that could use reviving. How about a weekly CT and Coil quest that rewards 5-10 unidentified items of your choice? How about developing new content to mix things up? The last time we received trials unique to relic was back in 2.0.

I really want Yoshi to respond to these complaints on the live letter on the 23rd. If he doesn't, I'm going to be really disappointed.

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Originally Posted by Lexia

That like the entire game in general and been that way since launch. If a person unhappy with it why they still sticking around, some things could be changed yes but I don't see some radical change to game in the way they do stuff.

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Yes it's been that way since launch, and relic quests have always been grindy....but this is beyond grindy. This is to the point where if people work at this NON-STOP, they most likely still won't have it by the time the next big patch comes in; their work will be marginalized before they even have the finished product!

I am fine with this and how it is set up - I don't mind it, it doesn't bug me and gives me something to do. I don't understand how people can complain when it's been out less than one day - and chances are once people are done they will be complaining that they have nothing to do and the game's boring again. This always happens, and it looks like that hasn't changed.

Yes I don't mind something being easy - but please SE don't make the whole game a insta-get. Even if its just annoying/hard in the sense that it's so time consuming - at least it isn't 'oh yeah you talked to a npc, here have all the things'. Personally it's nice to have something annoying now and then to take up some time in this game.

They forgot to bring the fun.

Like literally just forgot it. This really feels like "Please stay subbed for three more months" the weapon, and not "this is fun and engaging content that you can do at your own pace without committing ages of time". Did they hire the EQ/XI legendary quest designers for this step or something?

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Originally Posted by Rath

The sheer amount of people in PF doing fates means they were right. These are not as torturous as before though. The drop rates from these fates is not nearly as bad as atma when they first came out.

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Rath....that's the FIRST part of THREE parts for this first relic stage. The second part? Easy but annoying. The third part? It's beyond nightmarish. To put it into perspective, you would need 54,480 poetics for the third part.

Sorry, my bad. You would also need 16 HQ high-tier crafted items as well. Hope you're a max-geared omnicrafter!

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Originally Posted by Aarik

Rath....that's the FIRST part of THREE parts for this first relic stage. The second part? Easy but annoying. The third part? It's beyond nightmarish. To put it into perspective, you would need 54,480 poetics for the third part.

Sorry, my bad. You would also need 16 HQ high-tier crafted items as well. Hope you're a max-geared omnicrafter!

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omnicrafting wont help. They are specialist recipes.

The first to steps are alright. The last is a nightmare if your intending to sprint it. Taking it like a marathon however probably wont be as bad since the stuff you need comes from so many sources.

This will be all of us when we get that i210 Relic D: !!! #Damnit

http://static1.squarespace.com/stati...-old-gamer.jpg

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Originally Posted by Belhi

omnicrafting wont help. They are specialist recipes.

The first to steps are alright. The last is a nightmare if your intending to sprint it. Taking it like a marathon however probably wont be as bad since the stuff you need comes from so many sources.

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By which time 3.2 will have come out, alongside gobdip from Void Ark or via some other method (hunts, anyone?). Thereby nullifying all your efforts before you've even obtained your reward from them. This is merely a POORLY disguised attempt on SE's part to get us to remain subbed for 3 more months of dead content.

Can someone please explain the relic quest from start to finish.

I have no beast tribes and will not be doing outdated 2.x content.

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Originally Posted by Madjames

Can someone please explain the relic quest from start to finish.

I have no beast tribes and will not be doing outdated 2.x content.

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I could, but it would be quicker if you just saw the horror for yourself : https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme..._weapon_guide/

There you go. Enjoy. Or not.

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Originally Posted by Aarik

I could, but it would be quicker if you just saw the horror for yourself : https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme..._weapon_guide/

There you go. Enjoy. Or not.

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Ok so I need to do fates, grind alex for pieces, I need law which I have but what about Poetics?? Wth is it requiring those outdated things for?

The last part wants HQ items that are from where?

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Originally Posted by Madjames

The last part wants HQ items that are from where?

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Crafters. You can imagine how much they will cost now, given everyone wants their hands on them.

The grind is just too much, you really did take this too far SE. I love the game but I'm just not sure if I can play it anymore if this is what is in store for the future.

It's honestly not that bad. One thing that would make it better is if we could trade in manifestos for items though. like a page = 30->50 items. It gives people an incentive to actually do savage too.