Weapon versatility for all jobs <Yes, Please>

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Originally Posted by Otaku

You say this but mage's use 1 or 2 handed weapons. While I do agree that we shouldn't go as far as XI, I would like to see more variety, a PLD with a 1h hammer/mace or a WAR with a great sword. As long as it doesn't effect skills (PLD MUST use a shield so no 2h or duel wield) I don't see an issue with it.

RDM would use a Foil, Saber or Epee btw unless they make them a full on mage class in which they would get stuck with wands/staffs

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Thats not what OP suggested though..
The whole Warriors using Great Swords and Axes type thing is fine imo.
Warriors using bow's though? No.

Also, on archers, maybe they can add some type of small dagger for them to strike with in close range as opposed to punching the monster ;x
Nothing fancy. Just small knives with minimal decoration, made of different alloys. A skinning knife, if you will.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

If you actually played FFXI you would know why it's used as an example. A Warrior could use all weapons but it's main weapon was Great Axe.

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And the only time that was remotely useful was abyssea, where WAR laughed as it urinated on the concept of including more jobs to the group because WAR could cover close to all red procs. The rest of the time you were a gimp if you used anything other than a great axe post the 2H update.

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You mentioned 3rd Expansion, Treasures of Aht Urghan, where Colibris that were weak to piercing caused SAMs to use Polearms over Great Katanas due to piercing bonus which lead to more damage output ontop of SAMs innate boosts, i.e Self-Skillchain..did you even play the game?

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Lolibri parties had their own issues and are not what can be considered real content. Sure, penta-spam SAMs were considered fun and made leveling on that job a breeze, but no half-serious SAM would actually bring a spear to events.

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Very few jobs even had A+ rating in a weapon therefore you're stating people didn't use anything but their main weapon all of the time, which is incorrect because this varied by situation heavily.

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You're nit-picking. Admittedly, DNO should have said "highest skill rating weapon", which was indeed the case. What made the weapon so meaningful was the bonuses to ACC and Attack Power, which you obviously received more from higher skill rating in a weapon, which then would be used to counteract level correction when the moron--I mean, players in the group were hunting IT++++ mobs for exp.

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For example Zilart and CoP era Paladins used -pdt staff for kiting

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This is the sort of abomination I want to avoid.

armory does not need a overhaul SE need to be creative on how they use it.

they can add more than one TYPE of weapon, pld/gla has a a few types of swords theres other types they can use for other classes like con & thm have single & 2h weapons. as long as they keep types of weapons to a class it will make sense.

examples:
pld can get maces, whm can get hammers. warrior can get a basic great sword, pld can get a balmung type great sword.
mnk can get a bo staff, thm & con have there own types of staff. brd can get a harp, horn, bow, crossbow.

SE needs new weapon skills for each type of weapon too.

each weapon type can be made to use attack types more than the others, say pld mace piercings & blut damage when a whm hammer will only do blunt.

No thanks. Coming from XI, you were pretty much pidgeonholed into one or two weapon types due to a job's particular affinity with certain weapons, For example, Ninjas could use guns, but your skill with them was abyssmal compared to your throwing ability, ergo, if a nin used ranged weapons, they were shuriken/chakram.

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Originally Posted by Mudd

Thats not what OP suggested though..
The whole Warriors using Great Swords and Axes type thing is fine imo.
Warriors using bow's though? No.

Also, on archers, maybe they can add some type of small dagger for them to strike with in close range as opposed to punching the monster ;x
Nothing fancy. Just small knives with minimal decoration, made of different alloys. A skinning knife, if you will.

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Not gonna happen I'm afraid. I did suggest something like a dagger or hunting knife during the debate about Archers having auto attack. If I remember the response from the admins right, it went something along the line of having to maintain a damage balance, (i.e. if they gave us the dagger, they'd have to nerf bow dmg further.) which no archer would have agreed to, see as how they had just gotten a damage nerf at the time.

Whatever...

I think i saw someone mention this on like page 3 or 4, but being creative with combinations i think is better.

I'd love to see some of the crafting/gathering classes implemented into battle as well. Arhcer+alc = chemist, can use crossbows/guns and have an ability to use potions on other party members with a reduced CD (essentially act as another healer/buffer class). give them an ability that doesnt' consume the potion to alleviate the gil sink.

MRD+botony=geomancer, one handed axes. battle mage that can exploit weaknesses.

GLD+CRP=puppet master.

FSH+CNJ=beast master.

CNJ+WVR=Orator/scholar

tons and tons of possibilities that can fit within the current armory system and accomplish versatility.

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Originally Posted by indira

armory does not need a overhaul SE need to be creative on how they use it.

they can add more than one TYPE of weapon, pld/gla has a a few types of swords theres other types they can use for other classes like con & thm have single & 2h weapons. as long as they keep types of weapons to a class it will make sense.

examples:
pld can get maces, whm can get hammers. warrior can get a basic great sword, pld can get a balmung type great sword.
mnk can get a bo staff, thm & con have there own types of staff. brd can get a harp, horn, bow, crossbow.

SE needs new weapon skills for each type of weapon too.

each weapon type can be made to use attack types more than the others, say pld mace piercings & blut damage when a whm hammer will only do blunt.

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The thing is if you're going to add new weapons for a class and say they need new WS, then just make a new class rather then adding these weapons to said class.

If you want classes to have a variation in weapons then they need to work in a different way rather then just giving them "new" abilities. You can easily do this by giving them access to abilities they normally wouldn't have access to.

Such as a GLA/PLD with a Hammer/Club could have access to certain unique PUG/CON abilities but they lose access to some of their GLA WS. Or a GLA/PLD could have a great sword and while they gain some unique MRD/LNC abilities they lose access to their shield skills as well as some WS on GLA. Or you could give a GLA a Scythe which gives them access to abilities unique to THM/LNC but of course you lose access to some of your unique GLA abilities.

It all comes down to balance. It's easy enough to say well add more weapons and just add in new WS but then how do you define these abilities so that they don't make other classes useless or keep it balanced so that one weapon type will have the same use as another weapon type on another class.

I doubt we'll ever see a concept in which we equip different weapon types to make "new" skills available, we may however see a concept in which equipping a different class arm may allow us access to unique class skills from other classes since remember they are on the action/trait list when choosing abilities. We just don't have any class/jobs which are able to use abilities that are unique to said class yet.

If anything I imagine that if they do expand the weapon types a class can use it may be a quest like the jobs but just work differently. You obtain lv 30 and go to a weapon traininer. He teaches you x weapon through a quest/challenge and you unlock Rank I which allows you to use unique abilities up to Rank 10, then this happens up to Rank 5 in which you obtain Rank V but let's say you can only use unique abilities up to lv 35, so when it comes to rank IV and V those would be use to Rank IV (Allows use of all GLA abilities) Rank V (unique WS for said weapon).

Basically say you want a club/hammer for your GLA. With the following arm equipped you would have the following
-Ability to use PUG/CON/MRD/LNC abilities
-Restriction to THM/ARC
When on PLD it would be
-Ability to use MRD and unique CON abitiles
-Restriction to everything else

The ranks would work as followed:
Rank I (Ability to use all CON/PUG abilities up to Rank 10, Restricts access to GLA abilities 10+, Restriction to GLA WS 35+)
Rank II((Ability to use all CON/PUG abilities up to Rank 20, Restricts access to GLA abilities 20+, Restriction to GLA WS 35+)
Rank III((Ability to use all CON/PUG abilities up to Rank 30, Restricts access to GLA abilities 30+, Restriction to GLA WS 35+)
Rank IV((Ability to use all CON/PUG abilities up to Rank 35, Access to Pummel Combo line, Restriction to GLA WS 35+)
Rank V(Unlock Club/Hammer WS and Resitrction to GLA WS 40+)

The basic layout is you would have to use the abilities accesible from your new arm to overcome challenges which is why you would be limited to being unable to use your GLA abilities up to a certain point. However the overall goal would be to unlock new class variation when it comes to using said class to give each class more variety overall.

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Originally Posted by IStolzI

I don't think that because someone didn't have an ls were drks zerged with kclubs that means they didn't play XI... I don't recall pld ever being good with a Gsword. Sam only used Plarm when fighting birds. War dual axes had a period of popularity but Gaxe was better before WoG, ppl just <3 dual wield more than their dps. All melee jobs had A+ with their main 2h weapons, single handed weapon jobs didn't because A+ for single handed didn't exist. It was A- max for 1h IIRC.

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They didn't before SE actually boosted the ratings down the line and adjusted the formulas of the weapons, this is why people <3 dual-wield more because it was next to useless to wield a 2hand weapon on WAR and DRK had an innate acc issue with Scythe and GSD (thus why they dual'd Axes.)