Play other games :)

I'm just dropping back in here to cackle at the victimology of "Venat criticism", which I recall pretty much always accompanied hero worship of the Ancients and declarations that we'd live in a perfect utopia if only we'd murder dissidents as soon as we detected them, like that's a *hinged* way to view the world, and doesn't completely miss the solid narrative message Endwalker at least tried to get across.

I've got my criticisms of Endwalker's storytelling, but "Venat criticism" has never not struck me as the seething of people so enamored with utopia they'd be willing to ignore...all of literary history's commentary on how idiotic utopianism is.

Dont you guys get tired of the same ol song and dance amongst yourselves?

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Originally Posted by TowaIsBestGirl

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Yeah, it's less about wanting to take a break, and more about having to take a break, because there is nothing left to do. That is the whole issue.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

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I mean, I don't really blame people for being fed up. I myself took a break from the forums, just to take a break from the forums (not for being inactive in ffxiv), probably will do so again. It's now gotten to the point that it's not really fun to post anymore, and the whole place is a hostile environment, outside of the "show your.." threads.

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Originally Posted by Semirhage

I'm just dropping back in here to cackle at the victimology of "Venat criticism", which I recall pretty much always accompanied hero worship of the Ancients and declarations that we'd live in a perfect utopia if only we'd murder dissidents as soon as we detected them, like that's a *hinged* way to view the world, and doesn't completely miss the solid narrative message Endwalker at least tried to get across.

I've got my criticisms of Endwalker's storytelling, but "Venat criticism" has never not struck me as the seething of people so enamored with utopia they'd be willing to ignore...all of literary history's commentary on how idiotic utopianism is.

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Believe it or not, one can simultaneously believe that a society is not perfect and that it doesn’t deserve to be annihilated in a way Venat annihilated the ancients. We get the point EW narrative is trying to make, we just think its nonsense.

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Originally Posted by Semirhage

I'm just dropping back in here to cackle at the victimology of "Venat criticism", which I recall pretty much always accompanied hero worship of the Ancients and declarations that we'd live in a perfect utopia if only we'd murder dissidents as soon as we detected them, like that's a *hinged* way to view the world, and doesn't completely miss the solid narrative message Endwalker at least tried to get across.

I've got my criticisms of Endwalker's storytelling, but "Venat criticism" has never not struck me as the seething of people so enamored with utopia they'd be willing to ignore...all of literary history's commentary on how idiotic utopianism is.

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"solid narrative" - that gave me a chuckle

Don't know where you get that all of Venat criticism is somehow supportive of slaughter. Weird take when Venat is the one killing a bunch of people. And your point is that of the Endsinger? Do you agree with her? Since you seem to claim that the Ancients world deserves to be destroyed?

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Originally Posted by Semirhage

I'm just dropping back in here to cackle at the victimology of "Venat criticism", which I recall pretty much always accompanied hero worship of the Ancients and declarations that we'd live in a perfect utopia if only we'd murder dissidents as soon as we detected them, like that's a *hinged* way to view the world, and doesn't completely miss the solid narrative message Endwalker at least tried to get across.

I've got my criticisms of Endwalker's storytelling, but "Venat criticism" has never not struck me as the seething of people so enamored with utopia they'd be willing to ignore...all of literary history's commentary on how idiotic utopianism is.

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I don't think you actually read what people critical of Venat were even posting, then. The Sundered exist at the expense of the Ancients and so the latter are under no obligation to just allow themselves to be wiped out because some narc masquerading as a 'supreme deity' decides to genocide her own people rather than sit down and have a conversation about her actual concerns. We know from their own admission that the Scions would never allow such a fate to be inflicted upon their own people, thus there's no reason for anybody else to let it happen to them either.

That aside, you realise it's fiction...right? People criticising 'mommy' is not at all equal to people being sent threats or viciously insulted for criticising her.

It's a bad faith attempt to deflect from the fact that many people critical of Venat simply wanted the story to be consistent and not suddenly approve of genocide and consider it to be an 'unfortunate necessity' just because it happened to benefit the 'good guys'.

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Originally Posted by Thenightvortex

Believe it or not, one can simultaneously believe that a society is not perfect and that it doesn’t deserve to be annihilated in a way Venat annihilated the ancients. We get the point EW narrative is trying to make, we just think its nonsense.

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To be fair even Venat fans can dislike how they handle the Shattering. The whole debate was not really as black or white as some would make it out as. I am perhaps one of Venats biggest fans, but I really would have liked more emphasis on the weight her choice had. Does not help that lots of what we know of that time is said in metaphor. One of the reasons why I would love SE to expand its FFXIV storytelling to things like novels etc. Lots of good stuff to be mined that the game unfortunately cannot explore.

Thats the interesting thing about storytelling I find, no one is really right or wrong when it comes to enjoying a story/lore or not. We all form our own opinions.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

No one is gatekeeping anything. Disagreement is not akin to allowing or disallowing. Heck, if anything it seems more like positivity is the thing that is discouraged the most on here. Sure there will be trolls pushing the bar, but if we judged everything by their standards then we are doomed.

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Everyone and their father is a victim, I suppose. Personally, I despise the very idea of being a victim so I reject it outright. My own approach is instead of whinging and attempting to invite pity, if I feel like I'm not being heard I'm gonna keep talking and putting my views out there. Maybe I'm just beating my head bloody and raw against the walls of an Imperial Castrum, but I'm stubborn and very spiteful, to me the victim mindset is the true attempt at throwing the white flag up. If nothing else, I try my best to remain polite and refrain from attacking the person instead of the argument. Would that some present here could follow that fairly common example of upstanding citizenry. We teach our children these things, come on people.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

I agree criticism is a needed aspect of any media, but to be fair though, the ‘posters that roll up to trash you’ thing often happens if you speak positively of the game too. People have even used the same excuse you say to justify being disrespectful of negative posts, that they are ‘just tired of it.’ You are right that such debates can fall into ‘mockery and various accusations.’ but it is in no way unique to one side either. It would be great if every topic could be well-written and throughout examinations of the game, but in this environment thats near on impossible to carry on past a few pages. Plus when it comes to subjective aspects like story, we are all pushed by our own bias viewpoints.

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I find it odd and conspicuous how the convenience of both-sides-ism only ever surfaces as a defense for one side being assailed. Strangely when both sides are actively engaged in zealotry the -ism is startlingly absent. Curious, that.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

To be fair even Venat fans can dislike how they handle the Shattering. The whole debate was not really as black or white as some would make it out as. I am perhaps one of Venats biggest fans, but I really would have liked more emphasis on the weight her choice had. Does not help that lots of what we know of that time is said in metaphor. One of the reasons why I would love SE to expand its FFXIV storytelling to things like novels etc. Lots of good stuff to be mined that the game unfortunately cannot explore.

Thats the interesting thing about storytelling I find, no one is really right or wrong when it comes to enjoying a story/lore or not. We all form our own opinions.

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I don’t think one can be right/wrong about enjoying a story. People can be right and wrong about lore facts however, and it is a far too common occurrence when people deny or ignore those facts when trying to defend Venat. There are many ways it could’ve been done better, I agree, but it doesn’t seem like they are going to elaborate on this story arc beyond Panda/Myths at all, so it is what it is.

Speaking of playing other games. One I recommend is UnEpic. It's a side scroller RPG that I come back to every now and then because I like toying with different builds.

Want to be the heavy armor Fire Mage? Do it.

Want to be a DnD Cleric with a mace? You can do that.

Want to be an archer who also uses alchemy? It's doable.

Want to be the backstabbing rogue who on occasion whips out a giant two handed hammer? Why not?

Plus I like the fact difficulty actively rewards and punishes you. Easy gets you constant health regen, enemies have limited field of view, and you have hit invulnerability, but only get 5 skill points on level up.

Hard+ mode gets rid of health regen, enemies will see you clear as day as long as they have LoS on you, and there is no hit invulnerability so you can be juggled to death if pincer attacked, but you get 7 skill points on level up...which means more options.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Dont you guys get tired of the same ol song and dance amongst yourselves?

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Yes, that's why I tend to just read some threads and rarely post in them. Then get an essay written in response to something I said. Especially when I point out how tiresome said song and dance is. Also now I gotta use another phrase cause some people don't like it when you just use the most familiar phrases or examples and will dismiss your argument.

Also yay for necromancy of a topic that poor skeleton of a horse. Gotta be looking pretty grizzly. Oh and one side totally didn't bring it up this time or any of the few other times.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Speaking of playing other games. One I recommend is UnEpic. It's a side scroller RPG that I come back to every now and then because I like toying with different builds.

Want to be the heavy armor Fire Mage? Do it.

Want to be a DnD Cleric with a mace? You can do that.

Want to be an archer who also uses alchemy? It's doable.

Want to be the backstabbing rogue who on occasion whips out a giant two handed hammer? Why not?

Plus I like the fact difficulty actively rewards and punishes you. Easy gets you constant health regen, enemies have limited field of view, and you have hit invulnerability, but only get 5 skill points on level up.

Hard+ mode gets rid of health regen, enemies will see you clear as day as long as they have LoS on you, and there is no hit invulnerability so you can be juggled to death if pincer attacked, but you get 7 skill points on level up...which means more options.

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Speaking of old/niche games, most of what Artix Entertainment develops is pretty swell even if the company itself is full of those of questionable ethics. I feel as though you can't swing a dead cat in the corporate sphere these days without hitting a Kotick, or a Metzen, or a Hazzikostas. Regardless, AQ Classic and DragonFable are pretty rad imho. Worlds and 3D are gutter trash, though.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Yes, that's why I tend to just read some threads and rarely post in them. Then get an essay written in response to something I said. Especially when I point out how tiresome said song and dance is. Also now I gotta use another phrase cause some people don't like it when you just use the most familiar phrases or examples and will dismiss your argument.

Also yay for necromancy of a topic that poor skeleton of a horse. Gotta be looking pretty grizzly. Oh and one side totally didn't bring it up this time or any of the few other times.

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It might be tiresome, but that’s what happens when a game destroys its own lore for a cheap FFIV ripoff. There’s just nothing interest to discuss about current lore, so far it’s been incredibly bland with character such as Zero and monster of the week fiends who all died within minutes of getting introduced. Also doesn’t help that every other storyline in this patch cycle is a continuation of HvZ arc and therefore adding more fuel to the song and dance. I’m sure after the end of Pandaemonium it will become relevant once again.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Dont you guys get tired of the same ol song and dance amongst yourselves?

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Yes. That's why I dance to a different tune now. Ignore feature is great and I never gave it the chance it deserved.

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Originally Posted by Thenightvortex

It might be tiresome, but that’s what happens when a game destroys its own lore for a cheap FFIV ripoff. There’s just nothing interest to discuss about current lore, so far it’s been incredibly bland with character such as Zero and monster of the week fiends who all died within minutes of getting introduced. Also doesn’t help that every other storyline in this patch cycle is a continuation of HvZ arc and therefore adding more fuel to the song and dance. I’m sure after the end of Pandaemonium it will become relevant once again.

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I wasn't even talking about that topic really. But more so to arguments. It's just one huge loop. I'm surprised no one has done a thesis on how arguments develop on this form.

Anyway as to try and not derail the thread some more as I'm shocked a certain troll hasn't put their topic police hat back on. I like what little we have been shown with TotK. It feels like the devs saw all of the zany stuff people did in BotW and chose to embrace those things. In building systems where you can build even more crazy looking stuff. It's rare for Nintendo to not balk at certain feedback.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

I wasn't even talking about that topic really. But more so to arguments. It's just one huge loop. I'm surprised no one has done a thesis on how arguments develop on this form.

Anyway as to try and not derail the thread some more as I'm shocked a certain troll hasn't put their topic police hat back on. I like what little we have been shown with TotK. It feels like the devs saw all of the zany stuff people did in BotW and chose to embrace those things. In building systems where you can build even more crazy looking stuff. It's rare for Nintendo to not balk at certain feedback.

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Nintendo may not have shown us much, but the leakers sure have. ( ͡ಠ ʖ̯ ͡ಠ)

If neither Agent Bryan Mills nor John Wick can stop these vile villains, who can?

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Originally Posted by TowaIsBestGirl

Nintendo may not have shown us much, but the leakers sure have. ( ͡ಠ ʖ̯ ͡ಠ)

If neither Agent Bryan Mills nor John Wick can stop these vile villains, who can?

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Nintendo will retain Reggie's services as a PMC contractor and deploy him against the leakers. Their bodies will never be found.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Yes. That's why I dance to a different tune now. Ignore feature is great and I never gave it the chance it deserved.

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Wait, I just realized something...

You blocked a bunch of people right after being exposed for planning targeted harassment on the forums...

You're not 'dancing to a different tune', you're hiding! And here I was, actually giving you a bit of respect for what I thought was genuine character growth...

I lose more and more faith in the forums every day.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Yes. That's why I dance to a different tune now. Ignore feature is great and I never gave it the chance it deserved.

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Lately some threads are just a sea of blocked posts, but it's worth it. :)

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Originally Posted by SassyAssassin

Check check? D:

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*waves* I don't know if you ever agree with me or not, but that doesn't matter. I like your posts. They entertain me.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Lately some threads are just a sea of blocked posts, but it's worth it. :)

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Check check? D:

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Originally Posted by TowaIsBestGirl

Everyone and their father is a victim, I suppose. Personally, I despise the very idea of being a victim so I reject it outright. My own approach is instead of whinging and attempting to invite pity, if I feel like I'm not being heard I'm gonna keep talking and putting my views out there. Maybe I'm just beating my head bloody and raw against the walls of an Imperial Castrum, but I'm stubborn and very spiteful, to me the victim mindset is the true attempt at throwing the white flag up. If nothing else, I try my best to remain polite and refrain from attacking the person instead of the argument. Would that some present here could follow that fairly common example of upstanding citizenry. We teach our children these things, come on people.



I find it odd and conspicuous how the convenience of both-sides-ism only ever surfaces as a defense for one side being assailed. Strangely when both sides are actively engaged in zealotry the -ism is startlingly absent. Curious, that.

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To be fair, this is a forum where most of the topics are about pixels on a screen. Being on the minority opinion/position is not enough for one to be a victim, and I apologise if my words seem to echo so. Again, this is just a video game, not Parliament or the UN. I agree with your comments about being civil, but even the most well moderated and open forums struggle with that. Plus these threads have at times, due to trolling or not, gone into areas of personal insults and real world topics. In those cases, I can understand why people decide not to be tolerant of intolerance.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Yes. That's why I dance to a different tune now. Ignore feature is great and I never gave it the chance it deserved.

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I get too much comedy out of it to use the ignore feature. Can't be bothered to reply to the same arguments all the time, but the verbal dancing is kinda fun sometimes.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Yes. That's why I dance to a different tune now. Ignore feature is great and I never gave it the chance it deserved.

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I have to agree. It was a feature I never even dared to use before, but certain non-game related/troll topics made it a necessity for ones sanity haha.

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Originally Posted by TowaIsBestGirl

if I feel like I'm not being heard I'm gonna keep talking and putting my views out there. Maybe I'm just beating my head bloody and raw against the walls of an Imperial Castrum, but I'm stubborn

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This is how I use the forums. I have my opinions and I'm going to post them if I so choose. People can screech and whine about that if they want, but angry rants from Vel, raids from Renalt and his posse, or trolling from Titanman isn't going to convince me to do otherwise. Ironically, the best way to convince me to change my opinions is the one that no one seems willing to do. Actual genuine discussion about a topic.

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Originally Posted by TowaIsBestGirl

If nothing else, I try my best to remain polite and refrain from attacking the person instead of the argument.

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Once you have been here long enough, you will learn that some people are just not worthy of respect. You can be as polite as you possibly can be, and they'll still treat you with utter malice.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

I get too much comedy out of it to use the ignore feature. Can't be bothered to reply to the same arguments all the time, but the verbal dancing is kinda fun sometimes.

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I am of the same opinion. I have only a very select number of people on my ignore list, and those spots are reserved only for those who manage to not only be annoying, but also unfunny while doing it.

https://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/acc...cf8d4b97e2.png

Dont worry OP Chrono odyssey is coming

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Originally Posted by MonteCristo

Dont worry OP Chrono odyssey is coming

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Blue protocol at some point as well. Diablo too, this year is looking good for gamers.

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Originally Posted by SassyAssassin

Blue protocol at some point as well. Diablo too, this year is looking good for gamers.

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Can't wait for Diablo 4 and Baldur's Gate 3 myself! My wish list this year was so long I had to cut half of it as realistically they'd just sit in my backlog. (Sorry RE4 remake!)

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

D4 for sure, and I think I might try out FFXVI as well, despite Clive being about as generic as you can get. I can't help it, it's a final fantasy game.

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I actually had to cut FF16 (and Street Fighter 6....) I'm just simply overwhelmed at how many games are all coming at once that I want to play.

I am very interested in how a mainline FF game will be with an M rating - but the gameplay as a nearly elderly FF4 and 6 player seemed a bit too flashy for me. Maybe someday though since the accessibility options look strong!

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

Same. I was very glad when they announced BG3 for PS5, and D4 is my most anticipated game of the year. Its the main reason why my most played game at the moment is D2R haha.

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I loved every Diablo game since Diablo 1 (aside form Immortal....even I have limits haha). I also loved D2R - it actually felt really fresh after a decade long break from it to come back to it so clean and updated!

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Originally Posted by SassyAssassin

Blue protocol at some point as well. Diablo too, this year is looking good for gamers.

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Very good!! They wont have to worry about people criticizing for much longer ;) its about to get real quiet soon esp when diablo 4 drops.

D4 for sure, and I think I might try out FFXVI as well, despite Clive being about as generic as you can get. I can't help it, it's a final fantasy game.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Can't wait for Diablo 4 and Baldur's Gate 3 myself! My wish list this year was so long I had to cut half of it as realistically they'd just sit in my backlog. (Sorry RE4 remake!)

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Omg I almost forgot about Baldur’s! Sucks we still have quite a bit of waiting to do but I believe this time it will be worth it :3

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Can't wait for Diablo 4 and Baldur's Gate 3 myself! My wish list this year was so long I had to cut half of it as realistically they'd just sit in my backlog. (Sorry RE4 remake!)

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Same. I was very glad when they announced BG3 for PS5, and D4 is my most anticipated game of the year. Its the main reason why my most played game at the moment is D2R haha.

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Originally Posted by MonteCristo

Very good!! They wont have to worry about people criticizing for much longer ;) its about to get real quiet soon esp when diablo 4 drops.

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I loved loved loved the demo! It was buggy as hell on console, ran into a bunch of invisible walls lol but still had a lot of fun.

I don’t get all these crazy threads just popping up.

Take a break. Then come back. I still have so much to do!

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I loved every Diablo game since Diablo 1 (aside form Immortal....even I have limits haha). I also loved D2R - it actually felt really fresh after a decade long break from it to come back to it so clean and updated!

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Yeah its one of my favourite game worlds. Partly because I love its addictive gameplay loop, and partly because I adore its lore and horror atmosphere. I feel that side of it is sadly ignored.

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Originally Posted by AngelCheese77

Take a break.

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https://media4.giphy.com/media/qnOBmH70CGSVa/giphy.gif

Hey, you should 'unsubscribe' and 'take a break'. 'Play other games'.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

Hey, you should 'unsubscribe' and 'take a break'. 'Play other games'.

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They said the thing, congratulations on being yet another of the bunch of clueless people that dont understand what it means to like a game for some things but not for the others

Wooooo !

https://media4.giphy.com/media/qnOBmH70CGSVa/giphy.gif

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

They said the thing, congratulations on being yet another of the bunch of clueless people that dont understand what it means to like a game for some things but not for the others

Wooooo !

https://media4.giphy.com/media/qnOBmH70CGSVa/giphy.gif

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Actually, we do understand what that means. That's why we play other games in addition to this one.

The ones who don't understand that are the ones who think that a single game should provide all the entertainment they need.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Actually, we do understand what that means. That's why we play other games in addition to this one.

The ones who don't understand that are the ones who think that a single game should provide all the entertainment they need.

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Congratulations on saying the "other games" thing, wooooo!

https://media4.giphy.com/media/qnOBmH70CGSVa/giphy.gif

So GW2 was a bust. Thankfully it's F2P so nothing lost. Apparently there is an issue with the installer in which it will download fine...until it doesn't. I did some looking and it's an issue that is going on for three years and no answer on why or how to fix it.

So now I'm just reinstalling some old Steam games I got. I was debating on Far Cry 5 or Evil WIthin 2. I went with Evil Within 2. I might stream it to my Discord group and if the quality is good...I looked up how to stream Google pages and what is on your screen and might start movie nights...which means if they are masochists than I can torture them with some of my terrible movie choices. Tubi is great for those.