Response to Congestion (as of Dec. 15)

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Originally Posted by Maeka

So, here's a couple ideas I've had on what could be done to alleviate congestion:

1). The playerbase: IMO, anybody who finished MSQ should take a week or two off, to let others who have yet to finish MSQ log on and get that done. But no, thousands of players are logging on and staying logged on and doing stuff like grinding tomestones and other stuff while a bunch of people who can't get on for trying who wanna do the MSQ making things worse for everybody. Have some consideration for your fellow player. Endgame dungeons and gil farming can wait.

2). To SE: One thing I think should be done, is sort the queue by /played time this week and time both. For example, if there's 5,000 people in the queue, you'd sort that queue by /played time this week (you'd have to keep track of this obviously). Those who have less /played time should be placed at the front of the queue, for example if I enter the queue and I have 2 hours of /played on a Friday, I jump ahead of someone who was already in the queue who has 20 hours of /played time this week even though they entered the queue an hour before I did (but yet if there's someone else who entered the queue 15 minutes ago who also has 2 hours /played, they get on before I do). They already had 20 hours this week, they can wait. Let somebody else on who hasn't been able to play yet.

EDIT: 3). Actually, SE could enforce #1; place all characters who have finished Shadowbringers MSQ but not Endwalker MSQ ahead of those who have finished Endwalker MSQ. That way, players who have yet to get caught up get a better chance of doing so.

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I could see this going over like a lead balloon. SE isn't going to favor one group of paying subscribers over another, nor should they. We ALL pay subscription costs to access the game. You think the company wants to start another rant session on these forums? Because if they did just what you suggest it would only exacerbate the current situation. Common sense dictates that much.

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Originally Posted by Nothv13

What you want though is not voluntary, it is forced. If people decide to not play because they don't need to and allow others in then so be it. the moment you want to force it however, is the moment you get push back and you yourself look selfish.

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The only reason I suggested forcing it is because people won't willingly be considerate.

/shrug

If people would be considerate of their own volition, then it wouldn't be needed.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

... that people like me are paying for and not getting, while I get to see others who did get on and do all their stuff hogging the queues and refusing to get off and let others through.

It's frustrating and I'm tired of it.

And yes, yes, I know, they handed out free time, but you know what? The people who got the MSQ done who are hogging the queues also got the free time even though they're no-lifing it and being on all day long. So that doesn't change anything.

Now, if Yoshi-P were to hand out an additional week, 2 weeks, etc to the people who don't have EW MSQ done (who have ShB done), then that would be different. But no, he gave it to everybody which still doesn't give us any compensation beyond what he gave to everybody. It's still unfair that people like me still can't get on while we watch everybody else having fun at max level and we can't get on enough to even get TO there.

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I'm sorry you are frustrated, but it is still no excuse to penalize OTHER players. If someone wants to be considerate to others and log out so someone else can take their turn, like I have been doing, that is up to them. In no way should that be forced. That is draconian.

Emotions run high when frustration is abound during all of this, I and I think everyone else gets that. But this isn't the first time I've seen this suggestion about capping play times, assigning play times, using some artificial gate as a means to decide who gets to play or not. I'm sorry but it isn't right. I will never change my opinion on that, and I would never FORCE someone else to log out under any such conditions. If SE goes that route, all they do is trade one group's frustration for another, and possibly alienate even MORE of their customer base with such a bad practice.

SE are taking steps. It is slowly improving. All they and anyone else can ask for is patience while they further attempt to make the situation better. Already they have given out 21 free days of playtime which is astonishing in of itself. They've admitted fault on the 2002 errors. Give it another week or two now that sales have ceased, and the queues will start to decrease.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

The only reason I suggested forcing it is because people won't willingly be considerate.

/shrug

If people would be considerate of their own volition, then it wouldn't be needed.

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In a perfect world, sure, but we don't live in that so you really shouldn't force people to do anything.
You just have to be patient really and the only advice I can give is try to get bits of play time before you work in the morning if you can.
Also try to wake up early in the mornings on weekends since the queue starts to get going at noon.

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Originally Posted by ArkenaeuxBelmont

I'm sorry you are frustrated, but it is still no excuse to penalize OTHER players. If someone wants to be considerate to others and log out so someone else can take their turn, like I have been doing, that is up to them. In no way should that be forced. That is draconian.

Emotions run high when frustration is abound during all of this, I and I think everyone else gets that. But this isn't the first time I've seen this suggestion about capping play times, assigning play times, using some artificial gate as a means to decide who gets to play or not. I'm sorry but it isn't right. I will never change my opinion on that, and I would never FORCE someone else to log out under any such conditions. If SE goes that route, all they do is trade one group's frustration for another, and possibly alienate even MORE of their customer base with such a bad practice.

SE are taking steps. It is slowly improving. All they and anyone else can ask for is patience while they further attempt to make the situation better. Already they have given out 21 free days of playtime which is astonishing in of itself. They've admitted fault on the 2002 errors. Give it another week or two now that sales have ceased, and the queues will start to decrease.

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Yeah, that's easy for you to say.

You're at the end, you're max level, you don't have to worry about spoilers, you don't have to avoid the XIV community and its content creators like the plague, and you get to work on your endgame gear.

It's easy for you to look down at the people who can't get much of any progress in MSQ and say "It'll be okay it'll get better in the coming weeks".

Easy for you to say.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

It'd be better than what we got now, at least for the people who can't even get through MSQ because they got jobs and they can't log on wee morning hours.

I mean, let's face it... short of making new servers (They already said why they can't do that), there's nothing you can do to alleviate the issue. You can only do a round robin type system to let some people play and then let other people play. Since people can't be asked to be considerate, then perhaps you gotta force it.

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When I was a kid there was a gas shortage in the US. My state went to if you license plate number was even you could buy gas on these days of the week if it was odd the other days of the week. The thing failed miserably. Your idea will work no better.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

Yeah, that's easy for you to say.

You're at the end, you're max level, you don't have to worry about spoilers, you don't have to avoid the XIV community and its content creators like the plague, and you get to work on your endgame gear.

It's easy for you to look down at the people who can't get much of any progress in MSQ and say "It'll be okay it'll get better in the coming weeks".

Easy for you to say.

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So again, because I planned ahead with my real life affairs, took my time off accordingly to be able to deal with the anticipated high traffic and log in server issues, people like me should be punished because other's didn't?

All any of us can tell you is sorry. That we know the situation sucks. Some of us ARE being considerate in logging out of our own choice.

It doesn't change the fact that to cap one player because they've finished some kind of milestone while not capping another is wrong. It is not the game's fault that someone can't play during peak times.

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You just have to be patient really and the only advice I can give is try to get bits of play time before you work in the morning if you can.
Also try to wake up early in the mornings on weekends since the queue starts to get going at noon.

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Let's see here, three times a week I have to get up in the morning: on one week, I have to get up 4AM on Saturday, 3AM on Weds, and 6:30AM on Thurs. The other week, it's Sunday instead of Saturday (the Sunday and Saturday are back to back) for work. On Thursdays, I am so dead tired that I end up crashing and it's fricken hard to get out of bed early-morning, and same goes for the Monday after the Saturday-Sunday weekend. So that leaves me with what, 1-2 days a week I can possibly get on the game?

Also, this game loves to crash randomly on my PC. It is the 1-and-only out of 30+ games in my Steam library that I have played within the last year that does. Sometimes I can log on and it crashes to desktop with no errors after 5 minutes, though last week I got lucky and did a 6.5 hour session and no crashes at all. This means that waiting in a queue is absolutely useless, because God-Only-Knows how long I can actually play until I get a BS crash. And since unlike WoW, XIV does not save your place online, once I crash, that's that. I'm done because I sure as frick don't have 5+ hours to wait on a queue (and probably get 2002'd anyhow).

It's extremely frustrating. I actually care about the story of the game, and I can't hardly interact with any of my FC, I can't really talk to my friends much, because several of them have finished MSQ, and here I am just entered Garlemald, feeling quite alone and wishing I could just get on and get caught up.

And of course I get Lv90s who have finished MSQ talking down to me going "it'll be okay it'll be okay you're just being selfish" ... yeah, that's easy for them to say.

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Originally Posted by ArkenaeuxBelmont

So again, because I planned ahead with my real life affairs, took my time off accordingly to be able to deal with the anticipated high traffic and log in server issues, people like me should be punished because other's didn't?

All any of us can tell you is sorry. That we know the situation sucks. Some of us ARE being considerate in logging out of our own choice.

It doesn't change the fact that to cap one player because they've finished some kind of milestone while not capping another is wrong. It is not the game's fault that someone can't play during peak times.

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You keep using that word... "punished".

It's more that you're being asked to "pass your turn" and if you specifically only log on to the mornings than none of this even applies to you so I dunno WTF you're arguing about.

And to be honest, anybody who takes off work or school for a fricken video game is just ridiculous. I'm sorry, but no video game is important enough for that.

You know what? I am done with being cordial. I am happy to take up a spot. Proud of it really. I have 4 level 90 combat jobs and counting, working on Reaper next! Then maybe in a couple days I will work on sage while thousands are sitting in queue. It's a good time. I might even try my hand at doing extremes again?

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Originally Posted by Maeka

And to be honest, anybody who takes off work or school for a fricken video game is just ridiculous. I'm sorry, but no video game is important enough for that.

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I had vacation, it had to be used before the end of the year or I lost it.

Bummer you had none or couldn't but don't fall victim to your own claim of bias.

However now I'm done with the story and playing the other content in the expansion.. .you on the other hand are suggesting randoms on the internet be rationed so that you can play the game.

Who here is managing their own time to maximize their enjoyment.. and who is asking others to sacrifice so that they get to play a "fricken" video game?

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Originally Posted by Maeka

You keep using that word... "punished".

It's more that you're being asked to "pass your turn" and if you specifically only log on to the mornings than none of this even applies to you so I dunno WTF you're arguing about.

And to be honest, anybody who takes off work or school for a fricken video game is just ridiculous. I'm sorry, but no video game is important enough for that.

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Yes, if you force it, then it is punishing a person.

People who took time off to play were willing to do what is needed in order to play when they wanted to play. If video games are not so important, then no reason to force people that have gotten to play to the end of the line.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

Let's see here, three times a week I have to get up in the morning: on one week, I have to get up 4AM on Saturday, 3AM on Weds, and 6:30AM on Thurs. The other week, it's Sunday instead of Saturday (the Sunday and Saturday are back to back) for work. On Thursdays, I am so dead tired that I end up crashing and it's fricken hard to get out of bed early-morning, and same goes for the Monday after the Saturday-Sunday weekend. So that leaves me with what, 1-2 days a week I can possibly get on the game?

Also, this game loves to crash randomly on my PC. It is the 1-and-only out of 30+ games in my Steam library that I have played within the last year that does. Sometimes I can log on and it crashes to desktop with no errors after 5 minutes, though last week I got lucky and did a 6.5 hour session and no crashes at all. This means that waiting in a queue is absolutely useless, because God-Only-Knows how long I can actually play until I get a BS crash. And since unlike WoW, XIV does not save your place online, once I crash, that's that. I'm done because I sure as frick don't have 5+ hours to wait on a queue (and probably get 2002'd anyhow).

It's extremely frustrating. I actually care about the story of the game, and I can't hardly interact with any of my FC, I can't really talk to my friends much, because several of them have finished MSQ, and here I am just entered Garlemald, feeling quite alone and wishing I could just get on and get caught up.

And of course I get Lv90s who have finished MSQ talking down to me going "it'll be okay it'll be okay you're just being selfish" ... yeah, that's easy for them to say.

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Alright, first off...

No one is talking down to you because they disagree with your opinion. To assume that is childish, and it's playing a victimized card. I in no way have insulted you, and have been giving clearly opposite yet disagreeing opinions.

You don't want people to apologize? You don't want people to have empathy? People can be empathetic towards you and still disagree with you. That isn't "talking down" to you.

I start to lost empathy when people try to help each other and get hostile over it.
It's not my fault any of this happened, it's not anyones fault.
They're implementing a fix Tuesday for the 2002 disconnects.

I don't want to be mean or rude, but you guys really need to relax.
At the end of the day, it's just a video game.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

And to be honest, anybody who takes off work or school for a fricken video game is just ridiculous. I'm sorry, but no video game is important enough for that.

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Neither is getting worked up like this over a game either.
Just try to be patient, it'll work out.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

You keep using that word... "punished".

It's more that you're being asked to "pass your turn" and if you specifically only log on to the mornings than none of this even applies to you so I dunno WTF you're arguing about.

And to be honest, anybody who takes off work or school for a fricken video game is just ridiculous. I'm sorry, but no video game is important enough for that.

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Oh that is it, someone is sorry for your frustration, and has a different opinion you're going to try the tactic of insulting them and spending an exhausting amount of effort in this thread trying to be right? We get you, loud and clear. However your idea is not the popular opinion and won't be no matter how right you think you are. That energy could be better spent IMO.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

You keep using that word... "punished".

It's more that you're being asked to "pass your turn" and if you specifically only log on to the mornings than none of this even applies to you so I dunno WTF you're arguing about.

And to be honest, anybody who takes off work or school for a fricken video game is just ridiculous. I'm sorry, but no video game is important enough for that.

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How I choose to use my PTO from work isn't really any of your business? How, and it what world, do you have any right to tell anyone else what is and isn't important enough to them personally to use their given time off for?

I'm arguing the side and viewpoint that it isn't right to punish a group of players in-game with an arbitrary cap just because they've completed MSQ. Even if I only play a few hours in the morning now to do my dailies and then log out, and it wouldn't effect me at all, to me it is something I disagree with and am opposed to. Are you saying people aren't allowed to have an opinion now too?

All I'm going to say is around this time it would normally take me 2-3 hours to log in. Today 15 min. It's amazing how things change once you don't have a bunch of free to play folks dragging down the servers just standing around in the major cities.

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Originally Posted by thereal_aliceanders

All I'm going to say is around this time it would normally take me 2-3 hours to log in. Today 15 min. It's amazing how things change once you don't have a bunch of free to play folks dragging down the servers just standing around in the major cities.

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And just like that things are getting better.

My FC mates said as much tonight too, regarding the queue times. I don't think any of us really realized HOW many free users were taking up the queue spaces.

Without a surge in Christmas buyers as well, the queues should continue to slowly decrease.

Free users have been locked out now?

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Originally Posted by Jybril

Free users have been locked out now?

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Yes they have.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...57f7b5b78b9bb3

"Free Trial players are unable to log in outside of late night and early morning hours, and so we will also temporarily suspend new registrations for the Free Trial."

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Originally Posted by Jybril

Free users have been locked out now?

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No new free trials can be registered and Sub users have queue priority over Free Users.

See the post on the Lodestone for full details.

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Originally Posted by thereal_aliceanders

All I'm going to say is around this time it would normally take me 2-3 hours to log in. Today 15 min. It's amazing how things change once you don't have a bunch of free to play folks dragging down the servers just standing around in the major cities.

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...Free trial users have already been at the back of the line since launch. They're also not completely locked out from these changes, they simply said new free trials would be postponed. Players currently already registered with the free trial are still allowed to play (assuming there is no queue of subscribed players ahead of them).

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

...Free trial users have already been at the back of the line since launch. They're also not completely locked out from these changes, they simply said new free trials would be postponed. Players currently already registered with the free trial are still allowed to play (assuming there is no queue of subscribed players ahead of them).

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However it was specifically mentioned in the Lodestone article about new registrations and possible authentication fraud abuse. It's a good chance that these things might have been related. RMT companies could have been bot spamming new accounts under the free trial to distribute their shady wares in game, and thus bloated the queue more than anyone thought they were.

Honestly there could be any number of reasons, but the queues are lower today on a vast majority of servers. So let's count our blessings at least.

...quite a few people don't seem to understand how the free trial works.

1. Free trial players couldn't queue well before this. They never could.
2. Free trial players can't trade nor engage in many other interactions - RMT uses paid accounts.

The congestion really isn't related to the free trial. Though I think suspending it is good in any case, as this way new players don't get a negative impression from signing up for something that tells them "sorry, you can't play."

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

...quite a few people don't seem to understand how the free trial works.

1. Free trial players couldn't queue well before this. They never could.
2. Free trial players can't trade nor engage in many other interactions - RMT uses paid accounts.

The congestion really isn't related to the free trial. Though I think suspending it is good in any case, as this way new players don't get a negative impression from signing up for something that tells them "sorry, you can't play."

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Fair point. It's been so long that I forgot about the no trade restriction.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

...quite a few people don't seem to understand how the free trial works.

1. Free trial players couldn't queue well before this. They never could.
2. Free trial players can't trade nor engage in many other interactions - RMT uses paid accounts.

The congestion really isn't related to the free trial. Though I think suspending it is good in any case, as this way new players don't get a negative impression from signing up for something that tells them "sorry, you can't play."

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Yeah I don't know where you are getting this information but it's false. The were able to log in. Granted there is a laundry list of things that they can't do like buy things, but they for sure could log in during peak hours (until now).

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

...quite a few people don't seem to understand how the free trial works.

1. Free trial players couldn't queue well before this. They never could.
2. Free trial players can't trade nor engage in many other interactions - RMT uses paid accounts.

The congestion really isn't related to the free trial. Though I think suspending it is good in any case, as this way new players don't get a negative impression from signing up for something that tells them "sorry, you can't play."

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Not true, they could log in. My sister plays with a friend in the evening who is on free trial. They could log before during prime hours just lower priority for getting thru the que. Now they cannot log in during prime time hours.

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Originally Posted by thereal_aliceanders

Yeah I don't know where you are getting this information but it's false. The were able to log in. Granted there is a laundry list of things that they can't do like buy things, but they for sure could log in during peak hours (until now).

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They are STILL able to log in, they have 0 queue priority though. A sub user will jump them in the line. Effectively making them unable to get through the queue.

If they log in during off peak hours with no queue, they can still get in however.

TBH if they are implementing a priority que system.....they might as well make it Legacy player's > Normal player's > Free trial.

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Originally Posted by EtherRose

TBH if they are implementing a priority que system.....they might as well make it Legacy player's > Normal player's > Free trial.

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Except that Legacy and Non-Legacy are both paying the same sub. Hence the distinction break down the devs made between paying customer and non-paying customer.

Breaking it down any further in my opinion wouldn't be a valid idea and just be a trigger for resentment, even if it wouldn't honestly change much. There aren't THAT many legacy players that it would make a gigantic impact.

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Originally Posted by ArkenaeuxBelmont

Except that Legacy and Non-Legacy are both paying the same sub. Hence the distinction break down the devs made between paying customer and non-paying customer.

Breaking it down any further in my opinion wouldn't be a valid idea and just be a trigger for resentment, even if it wouldn't honestly change much. There aren't THAT many legacy players that it would make a gigantic impact.

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Right, they are paying the same sub. While Legacy is 5$ cheaper they are the ones who kept supporting FFXIV 1.0 while it was garbage. Everyone else left then came back later in 2.0+. If anything, Legacy player's "should" have a priority queue. It won't happen though.

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Originally Posted by Taebok

"Error 2002 While Waiting in Login Queues
In regards to Error 2002 that occurs during login queues, outside of causes related to unstable connections, we have confirmed a bug.
This bug was part of a login-related program created back in FFXIV version 1.0"

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A clap for the people who found the bug, because hot damn imagine trying to read back through years old spaghet code and figure out wth they did lol.

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Originally Posted by EtherRose

TBH if they are implementing a priority que system.....they might as well make it Legacy player's > Normal player's > Free trial.

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As a legacy player, I find such a thing as unnecessary. If I wanted to flaunt entitlement, it wouldn't be any of the in game vanity or some petty jump in the queue. It'd be the fact I pay only 2/3 the sub fee for the rest of the games life that others pay in full for.

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Originally Posted by EtherRose

Right, they are paying the same sub. While Legacy is 5$ cheaper they are the ones who kept supporting FFXIV 1.0 while it was garbage. Everyone else left then came back later in 2.0+. If anything, Legacy player's "should" have a priority queue. It won't happen though.

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Legacy players have received more than they "deserve". You deserve to pay less and also get queue priority? Please. You aren't special. Get over yourself. Woopdee-doo, you kept paying money for a bad game. What a hero.

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Originally Posted by Viirin

Legacy players have received more than they "deserve". You deserve to pay less and also get queue priority? Please. You aren't special. Get over yourself. Woopdee-doo, you kept paying money for a bad game. What a hero.

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Am a legacy from 1.0. I do not want a priority queue for myself, it would only make me a pariah when ppl can't get in. I only advocate for a smooth entry queue that doesn't boot me anywhere from 0-12 times in my 4 hour journey to enter. If i know I don't have to keep an eye on it, I can easily do other things while I wait.

Also legacy from 1.0, do not need a priority queue. But I'm glad that for the moment the free trial players are cut off. Turns out some of them may have been the afk botters on certain servers, and the queues are now a lot nicer in a few places.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

If people would be considerate of their own volition, then it wouldn't be needed.

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How do you know people aren't doing this of their own volition? A data center can handle 17,000 to 21,000 concurrent players in the login queue. Cactuar alone has an active population of 13,343 as of Dec 3, 2021. https://dotesports.com/mmo/news/all-...er-populations Cactuar's on the Aether data center which houses 13 different worlds. For simplicity's sake, let's say all of those have an active population of 13,000 players. That's a total of 169,000 active players on the Aether data center.

Let's say 25% of all active players have completed the MSQ and 100% of those players choose to stop playing so other people can have a chance. 169,000 x 0.75 = 126,750 active players who haven't completed the MSQ and are trying to get in. That's six times (600%) the login server's hypothetical max capacity of 21,000 or 9.94 times (994%) of the 17,000 max capacity.

Even if a full 50% of players on the Aether data center have finished the MSQ and stopped playing, there are still 300-500% more players than the login server can handle trying to get into the game.


Until a great majority of players on each *data center*, not just server, decide to take a break from playing, queues are going to continue being significant even if SE did the unthinkable and completely stopped people who finished the MSQ from even being able to log in.


I know quite a few, possibly up to 50%, of the people in my FC have finished the MSQ and have taken a break or are logging in much less frequently. We're a worldwide FC so I don't know how many people are playing while I'm asleep or at work, but many have commented on how participation has pretty much reduced to "the regulars" again. I also know that me, myself, and I have reduced my play time after marathon sessions to finish the MSQ. People ARE cutting back on play time. There are just far too many people still trying to get into the game for there to be a practical effect on queues on high population data centers.

Alright so what I've gathered from the last 15 threads + this one is that clearly REAL problems here are:

Free trial users SNEAKING in at midnight
Normal subscriptions being allowed in before the royal legacy players without at least kissing their feet first
People in their houses, if you are in your house for any reason then you need to get out RIGHT now or else you're getting reported
People afking for any reason whatsoever, you should log out if you have a sneeze because the buildup takes too long and someone else could be playing in that time that you are making that stupid about to sneeze face
People who took off work who are HOGGING playtime, they should be at work all the time ever and its their fault that you didnt think to or couldnt do the same
And then of course the dev team, because they can't do anything right and anyone here could have easily fixed the 2002 problem in their sleep + bought servers + made the whole game

Did I get everything. Probably not, we have like another week until the fix patch, so I'm sure by then the demands and blame will rise to a new absurd level.
Just a little reminder that if you log on anytime between 11pm-8am PST (on a weekday anyway) there is literally no queue. None. 0. At most there's like 20. Which is none-you zip right in. So just a little reminder there.

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Originally Posted by EtherRose

Right, they are paying the same sub. While Legacy is 5$ cheaper they are the ones who kept supporting FFXIV 1.0 while it was garbage.

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Supporting a game when it's garbage isn't a good thing. It's the players who didn't support 1.0 because it was garbage who forced SE to completely remake the game and create a success.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Supporting a game when it's garbage isn't a good thing. It's the players who didn't support 1.0 because it was garbage who forced SE to completely remake the game and create a success.

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Well really it's the FFXI subscribers that should get priority because they saved S-E after the Spirits Within financial disaster and then bank-rolled 1.0/ARR.

Actually maybe S-E should give free access to FFXI whilst you're queuing and swap you over when you can log in.

/s