The chance of winning the 3 lines reward of Wondrous Tails is ridiculously low

To me its a waste of time and not worth doing if can't even get one line using shuffle 4 times. If they ever make it worth my time maybe I would think of doing WT again. How it is now do have time to waste on something that might get item need from.

hynaku,they should not orient at you as well.So,save your inappropriate complaints,nobody force you to do that in a first place,same as it should not be easy.

This isn't a single player game where anything that's RNG can be manipulated/save file'd through over and over. This is an MMORPG. RNG is made to be a pain in the arse. This has been in the game since in the 3.X times. This isn't news to anyone but you and a few others it seems. And like others have said, it's the Cactpot all over again. Congrats if you win it, and if you don't you at least got SOMETHING out of it, even if you think that's not enough. It's something optional that you get while doing other things, like sprinkles on cake/ice cream.

Plus this was a way to get other players to go back and do some of the older content that people today might not have an easy time getting a group together to do.

Additionally, hynaku's post is ten months old.

And the post before that is almost two years old.



...forums need to come with some kind of built-in warning when you try to submit a new post to something that's been abandoned for so long.

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Originally Posted by Bacent

This isn't a single player game where anything that's RNG can be manipulated/save file'd through over and over. This is an MMORPG. RNG is made to be a pain in the arse. This has been in the game since in the 3.X times. This isn't news to anyone but you and a few others it seems. And like others have said, it's the Cactpot all over again. Congrats if you win it, and if you don't you at least got SOMETHING out of it, even if you think that's not enough. It's something optional that you get while doing other things, like sprinkles on cake/ice cream.

Plus this was a way to get other players to go back and do some of the older content that people today might not have an easy time getting a group together to do.

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Personally, Wondrous Tails is a waste of my time... complete waste of my time. I honestly tried it a various times since its implementation and the very best combination I could attain was this... (notice how the RNG went wacky when it realized I was about to make a full three lines)?

https://i.imgur.com/vhSTh5m.jpg

I don't like Wondrous Tales RNG, so I don't do it. I think it's that simple really.

If I have any complaint, it's that WT is one of the few easy ways to get Cracked Crystals, as opposed to the 3 billion other ways to get Cracked Clusters. But that's more of a general annoyance than anything wholly WT related.

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Originally Posted by Berteaux_Braumegain

I don't like Wondrous Tales RNG, so I don't do it. I think it's that simple really.

If I have any complaint, it's that WT is one of the few easy ways to get Cracked Crystals, as opposed to the 3 billion other ways to get Cracked Clusters. But that's more of a general annoyance than anything wholly WT related.

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*(Nods)*

Exactly... it's why I don't play it anymore and why I posted that image above as proof that I legitimately put effort into it in the past. In the end I couldn't see any point in participating in it any further.

The RNG on it is pure sacrilege.

I'm just puzzled by the interface. 4x4 grid of challenges, 4x4 grid of stickers.... and zero connection between the placement of the two.

Just give us a list of challenges if the grid layout means nothing.

An overhauled system where the challenge grid arrangement is randomised and you have to fill out your weekly card for tokens you can eventually trade in for 5-slot gear would probably better - and more fair for everyone instead of one lucky person getting the gear.

But that goes for so much of this game, and Yoshida (going by his comments during the BLU reveal panel) seems to genuinely think it's enjoyable when you finally win the RNG thing. Which is bad news for those of us who feel the preceding hours of frustration drain out any happiness over the final result.

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Originally Posted by Laurima

oh look another thread moaning about not getting the best rewards for minimal effort -_-

Yeesh ><

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Oh look another person who thinks absurd rng statistics = effort. Week one WT tails released statistics say someone got 3 lines, did that take a lot of effort for them? No, no it did not.

Effort involves grinding, but I’m sorry wonderous tails is not a grind, it’s a passive activity you do weekly, and if you actually put effort into it, it tends to take 2 weeks anyway to get anywhere close to 3 lines, depending on your LUCK, not effort.

Also the rewards are quickly outdated with the release of artifact/elemental gear. The pentameld crafting gear is just overkill/for flexing, I can craft everything in the game HQ just fine with my overmelded gear that I didn’t spend a single gil making or melding tyvm

I got 3 lines the only time I ever tried.

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Originally Posted by Berteaux_Braumegain

I don't like Wondrous Tales RNG, so I don't do it. I think it's that simple really.

If I have any complaint, it's that WT is one of the few easy ways to get Cracked Crystals, as opposed to the 3 billion other ways to get Cracked Clusters. But that's more of a general annoyance than anything wholly WT related.

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I....disagree. The top 4 items on WT are always dungeons that you'll end up doing in your roulettes anyhow, so WT is basically a freebie if you utilize the second chance points accordingly (and I always seem to have enough). Yes, 0.2% is low for the 3-line bonus (and I've never seen it), but 10.6% for the 2-line has happened a couple times, 58.5% for the one-line has happened more often than not, and the 100% for the 9-seals is basically free repairs for the week (as an omnicrafter it pays for more G7 demimateria than I'll use the entire week).

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Originally Posted by Ramesses

Personally, Wondrous Tails is a waste of my time... complete waste of my time. I honestly tried it a various times since its implementation and the very best combination I could attain was this... (notice how the RNG went wacky when it realized I was about to make a full three lines)?

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Oh no, the computer is against you /sarcasm. Did you see the odds for getting 3 lines that other people have posted? Did you? No? Go back and look. You're just blindly claiming something that you don't seem to grasp how it works. I've gotten anywhere from zero to two lines. Tried to get three, never did. Seen a couple of people I used to play with get it, so good for them.

But don't post 'oh notice how the RNG is against me because I was gonna win'. You do NOT know for a fact if you're gonna win. Hell, if 'you were about to make three lines', then take a better screenshot. You only have 8/9 stamps on your WT book.

Mind you, I wouldn't have an issue with the extremely low chance, if the items were more sustained through a patch. Sorry, but nobody cares about Ornate gear. MGP is fine, hell, even materia is fine if bulk. But I would like more of a reason to bother going for 3 lines at any point in time. Add extremely rare minions, mounts, hairstyles, emotes, not Ornate gear.

personally, I don't do it just because it's somehow implemented in a way that makes me forget i'm even doing it and the books always expire so i just stopped trying completely.

But... the ornate gear from 3-lines is pretty amazing stuff. It definitely should be super rare
You get the best crafting/gathering gear available plus it's got five open slots which means you can use five tier 6 materia in it.
Not only does it save millions in lost overmeld attempts but the final product is much stronger as well

Granted I stopped caring so maybe still not true but they used to update it as well so the rewards remained best in slot as new gear gets released as well.


Most of the real rewards are 2-line which is still a huge pain the butt. The super crafting gear is honestly just superfluous as cool as it is

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Originally Posted by galbsadi

I....disagree. The top 4 items on WT are always dungeons that you'll end up doing in your roulettes anyhow, so WT is basically a freebie if you utilize the second chance points accordingly (and I always seem to have enough). Yes, 0.2% is low for the 3-line bonus (and I've never seen it), but 10.6% for the 2-line has happened a couple times, 58.5% for the one-line has happened more often than not, and the 100% for the 9-seals is basically free repairs for the week (as an omnicrafter it pays for more G7 demimateria than I'll use the entire week).

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That is not what Berteaux is talking about. You are not "disagreeing" with them since what you think is being said, is not what is being said.

What they are saying is, getting the DoW/DoM reward for VI materia, cracked clusters, there is a lot of options to get them, including WT, where DoL/DoH, has very FEW resources for them and a "reasonable" way to get VI materia was just added not to long ago. It is very annoying that in general, they hand out DoW/DoM materia like water, where DoL/DoH is like finding water in the sierra desert.

For the 3 line thing, the reward for the 5 slot materia gear is is very underwhelming for the rarity. For crafting and gathering, because how caps work, the difference between them and normal gear is almost nonexistent and that tiny af difference makes no impact for crafting rotations.

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Originally Posted by Hamada

For the 3 line thing, the reward for the 5 slot materia gear is is very underwhelming for the rarity. For crafting and gathering, because how caps work, the difference between them and normal gear is almost nonexistent and that tiny af difference makes no impact for crafting rotations.

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This is like saying rare crafting mats shouldn't be in Treasure Map chests because DoW/DoM players can't use them.

You're forgetting that these pieces are marketable, and I've never heard a noncrafter complain about scoring three lines because these pieces will sell for eight-figure sums quite regularly.

Edit: If that amount of gil is trivial or unexciting to you, then you're entitled to your opinion, but realize that you're in the minority on that viewpoint. Most players are still excited by high-value items for a reason.

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Originally Posted by Emstidor

This is like saying rare crafting mats shouldn't be in Treasure Map chests because DoW/DoM players can't use them.

You're forgetting that these pieces are marketable, and I've never heard a noncrafter complain about scoring three lines because these pieces will sell for eight-figure sums quite regularly.

Edit: If that amount of gil is trivial or unexciting to you, then you're entitled to your opinion, but realize that you're in the minority on that viewpoint. Most players are still excited by high-value items for a reason.

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You do realize your missing the point? You can make anything artificially rare and sell a lot for the sake of doing so, because it is rare. That has NOTHING to do with my post. All I was saying stat wise (remember SE remarked.. or was it yoshi -p? I do not remember) but back when these where newer, someone complained about the chance of getting 3 lines to yoshi-p saying something like they had to make these rare because they are "powerful" (something to this effect) This is clearly not the case, even more so with DoL/DoH who really do not benefit at all from them, stat wise. It is just a rare trophy that people put an insane value on for the sake of being rare, and again I repeat, has nothing to do with the post you are quoting.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Mind you, I wouldn't have an issue with the extremely low chance, if the items were more sustained through a patch. Sorry, but nobody cares about Ornate gear. MGP is fine, hell, even materia is fine if bulk. But I would like more of a reason to bother going for 3 lines at any point in time. Add extremely rare minions, mounts, hairstyles, emotes, not Ornate gear.

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If they made the rewards too good, the forums would be flooded with more "it's too haaaaard to get 3 lines" whine threads. I like the way they did it now where it's a nice little bonus if you manage to make some lines but not a huge let-down if you don't get the incredibly rare 3.

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Originally Posted by Bacent

Oh no, the computer is against you /sarcasm. Did you see the odds for getting 3 lines that other people have posted? Did you? No? Go back and look. You're just blindly claiming something that you don't seem to grasp how it works. I've gotten anywhere from zero to two lines. Tried to get three, never did. Seen a couple of people I used to play with get it, so good for them.

But don't post 'oh notice how the RNG is against me because I was gonna win'. You do NOT know for a fact if you're gonna win. Hell, if 'you were about to make three lines', then take a better screenshot. You only have 8/9 stamps on your WT book.

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*(Gives a wry smile at the sudden aggression)*

...Have we met?

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Originally Posted by Rymm

If they made the rewards too good, the forums would be flooded with more "it's too haaaaard to get 3 lines" whine threads. I like the way they did it now where it's a nice little bonus if you manage to make some lines but not a huge let-down if you don't get the incredibly rare 3.

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Unfortunately, people would just have to suck it up. I'd personally much rather deal with the disappointment of getting 1, or 2 lines than deal with getting items that are practically worthless after 2 weeks into the relevant patch. If you want the good stuff, it needs to be locked behind something. Again, rather have a horde of decent items locked behind this, than items which lose their value incredibly quickly.

I, like many rarely even do this anymore, simply because the items are, for the most part pretty worthless, or rather.. Not worth going out of my way to try and do.

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Originally Posted by Kaldiin

...Feel free to correct me if the calculation is wrong...

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I have to correct you:
After 7 signs, you have the option to shuffle until you get a pattern leading to three rows on next two signs.
So, the correct chance is the random placement of 2 signs on a pattern where first 7 signs are already placed good:
16 places, 7 used: 9 places left, it means you have 1 possibility over 9 * 8, so it is 1/72, that is about 1,4% of chance.

I'm fine with the 3 line rewards, but I got a 0 line streak 7 times in a row and stopped doing these entirely. The 1 and 2 line rewards very often aren't worth much either. I swim in tomes, the materia market has all but crashed and most of the minions are cheap. They've been using combat materia and tomes as a reward for too many things lately.

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Originally Posted by LalaRu

I have to correct you:
After 7 signs, you have the option to shuffle until you get a pattern leading to three rows on next two signs.
So, the correct chance is the random placement of 2 signs on a pattern where first 7 signs are already placed good:
16 places, 7 used: 9 places left, it means you have 1 possibility over 9 * 8, so it is 1/72, that is about 1,4% of chance.

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But what are your chances of getting the stickers shuffled into a useful configuration in the first place? And with a maximum of four chances (not counting extra chance points acquired later) to get it.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

But what are your chances of getting the stickers shuffled into a useful configuration in the first place?

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Dunno if placement is really random or more lenient, but I didn't got much trouble on shuffling to reach a good setup in about 5-6 tries on the average.

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Originally Posted by Hamada

For the 3 line thing, the reward for the 5 slot materia gear is is very underwhelming for the rarity. For crafting and gathering, because how caps work, the difference between them and normal gear is almost nonexistent and that tiny af difference makes no impact for crafting rotations.

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This is not entirely true. While the numbers are closer together, you have to also consider the amount of effort that having open slots saves. As someone who has pentamelded at least three complete sets of crafting gear, I can tell you that if your RNG luck is abysmal, you can say goodbye to so much materia. With our current gear, we can slot 1-2 T6, overmeld 1 T6, and fill in the rest as needed. In a lot of cases, BiS will take a ton of T6 materia for both DoH and DoL. Overmelding an armor piece with two slots, our odds of overmeld are looking like 17%, 10%, and 7%. In other words, ~1/6, 1/10, and ~1/14. Not accounting for random luck or horrible dry streaks, we're looking at close to 30 or so overmelded materia per piece, with an average expectation of 6 of those being T6. Going by that, we're looking at about 30 T6 materia to just overmeld the first slot for all pieces, and they're not exactly cheap. Then you have to do the same with however many T5s you need. When it comes to T1-3 filler to get those last few points it's not so much, but having open slots so that you don't have to worry about overmelding failing saves you a ton of cash in the long run. It's less valuable for the combat gear, but crafting and gathering gear? I'd jump on getting one of those from a 3-line. So yeah, while the caps don't make a difference, the amount of money you throw away trying to get up to that level is vastly different, which is what makes them so valuable.

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Originally Posted by Ramesses

*(Gives a wry smile at the sudden aggression)*

...Have we met?

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Do you mean at the obvious assumption that you said 'notice how the RNG went wacky when it realized I was about to make a full three lines'? You're coming off as if you knew you were gonna win, when you obviously have no clue about if you will actually win or not. I'm only coming off as aggressive due to you coming off as someone who looks like they either thought they deserved three lines, or that you don't know how RNG/chance happens in MMO games, designed to make you play for a lot longer than a single player game.

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Originally Posted by Zeich

This is not entirely true. While the numbers are closer together, you have to also consider the amount of effort that having open slots saves. As someone who has pentamelded at least three complete sets of crafting gear, I can tell you that if your RNG luck is abysmal, you can say goodbye to so much materia. With our current gear, we can slot 1-2 T6, overmeld 1 T6, and fill in the rest as needed. In a lot of cases, BiS will take a ton of T6 materia for both DoH and DoL. Overmelding an armor piece with two slots, our odds of overmeld are looking like 17%, 10%, and 7%. In other words, ~1/6, 1/10, and ~1/14. Not accounting for random luck or horrible dry streaks, we're looking at close to 30 or so overmelded materia per piece, with an average expectation of 6 of those being T6. Going by that, we're looking at about 30 T6 materia to just overmeld the first slot for all pieces, and they're not exactly cheap. Then you have to do the same with however many T5s you need. When it comes to T1-3 filler to get those last few points it's not so much, but having open slots so that you don't have to worry about overmelding failing saves you a ton of cash in the long run. It's less valuable for the combat gear, but crafting and gathering gear? I'd jump on getting one of those from a 3-line. So yeah, while the caps don't make a difference, the amount of money you throw away trying to get up to that level is vastly different, which is what makes them so valuable.

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Bis overmelding vs 3 line gear? it is wayyyyy cheaper to BiS meld.
Bis melding crafting and gathering gear does not give you much leeway on what to slot because how caps work. At the very most in some gear you can leave the last slot open for cp vs more control or something if you are THAT paranoid but the thing is, SB requirements are way easier then HW you do not even need that much in the first place.

So no you have no room 3 line wt gear saves anything, its all an illusion. None of this gear is that great and does not justify the raritiy, the high prices people sell them for is ONLY for the ohhh shinny rare factor that ends up being moot in 6 months, at most. So I really do not get why people try to argue the importance of this over-rated wt gear when it is outdated so quickly on top of things, and during when it is current, can't even outclass the competition (in regards of DoH/DoL, I have not really memorized what DoW/DoM really makes use out of something). The ONLY thing I can think of that really get value out of these is tanks, healers and brd. BRD it depends what the options are in other gear, all depends on what crit you can get from other options or if the gear itself is capped easy. Then ofc there is healers to penta crazy DH but I am not sure how viable that is to go that far and that amount over crit.

DoH and DoL 3 line gear is more useless then DoW/DoM gear is. well it depends how you approach it but usually with macros you want to cp cap. Lets take the body for an exmaple, since that has the most stat weight and most flexiblity in doing something else (like 5x craft VI but no one really does that since control is more valued) if you cp cap you get only 5 craftsmanship more out of the 3 line WT gear... because that is how the caps work. caps are very strict and does not leave much options for the WT gear to give a real benefit. If you go for absolute control/+cp cap, (the stats that matter most) the WT DoH body has ZERO benefit over the crafted counterpart. You can't really argue a cost melding point for that setup because craft VI is usually the cheapest VI, then your doing a control V, then Cp x (w/e happens to be cheaper, the 5th slot rate doesn't matter and usually buying inflated grade 1's is not smart, spaming grade 2s or 3s tend to be way cheaper for this)

With how predicable this game is, and the fact SB requirements where a lot easier then HW, it is not hard to figure out how to meld without needing to redo it. (like having to meet 3.4 requirements without knowing what they are before hand)

So the DoH/DoL 3 line wt gear are pretty worthless from a stat point of view because how caps work. Selling them off for a high price for being rare is another issue and not something I care about at all. Sure it is quick to do, not bad time investment to get something that high value, but farming over and over and over for second chances is not smart. You make more gil on average just taking what you get for those say 20 mins investing then do something else that is more reliable means of making gil.

So your last line is completely wrong, they are valuable for being rare, nothing more, they do not give a benefit stat wise as far for DoH/DoL (they are even weaker for DoL because not only because of the caps on gear but the hard caps nodes gives to stats, like you can never have more then 95% rate on the hardest nodes for base). That melding argument even with the worst luck you can picture, you are spending 1/10th of the gil in materia, then what you can sell/ buy the gear for.

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Originally Posted by LalaRu

I have to correct you:
After 7 signs, you have the option to shuffle until you get a pattern leading to three rows on next two signs.
So, the correct chance is the random placement of 2 signs on a pattern where first 7 signs are already placed good:
16 places, 7 used: 9 places left, it means you have 1 possibility over 9 * 8, so it is 1/72, that is about 1,4% of chance.

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Need to add, the chance to get at least 1 row is 2/9, ~22%, in the case the startup pattern haven't already one (we have two holes to fill, each one completes at least one row)

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Originally Posted by Laurima

oh look another thread moaning about not getting the best rewards for minimal effort -_-

Yeesh ><

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just because you believe that getting barely anything from getting 0-1 lines is fine for little effort doesn't mean people who moan about it is wrong, so shut up and stop forcing your beliefs onto others

im pissed off about this because i only need 2 stickers to get 3 lines but then i failed just because i couldn't win a 2% chance and pretty much got nothing from this.

what's annoying is that its a weekly pure base on luck crap instead of being fair and equal, i probably never in my life will get 3 lines while selfish people like you probably won 3 lines 3 or more times.

i mean would you get a job in real like where you have 2% chance to get $1000 a week and 98% chance of getting $10? no one would get a crap job like that its not worth it.

i have a better chance of killing satan than getting 3 lines!

Someone in my FC won it last week. You can shuffle into a place where you have 7/9 in a winning position before you start with the final two. Sometimes it can take a while but usually you’ll be able to get into a winning position in a few shuffles.

From there you need luck.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

I'm fine with the 3 line rewards, but I got a 0 line streak 7 times in a row and stopped doing these entirely. The 1 and 2 line rewards very often aren't worth much either. I swim in tomes, the materia market has all but crashed and most of the minions are cheap. They've been using combat materia and tomes as a reward for too many things lately.

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A 0 line should literally never happen. This is why you have the option to reshuffle at 7 tokens. Reshuffle until you have at least one line, with the others on target for all 3.

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Originally Posted by Sirkos

just because you believe that getting barely anything from getting 0-1 lines is fine for little effort doesn't mean people who moan about it is wrong, so shut up and stop forcing your beliefs onto others

im pissed off about this because i only need 2 stickers to get 3 lines but then i failed just because i couldn't win a 2% chance and pretty much got nothing from this.

what's annoying is that its a weekly pure base on luck crap instead of being fair and equal, i probably never in my life will get 3 lines while selfish people like you probably won 3 lines 3 or more times.

i mean would you get a job in real like where you have 2% chance to get $1000 a week and 98% chance of getting $10? no one would get a crap job like that its not worth it.

i have a better chance of killing satan than getting 3 lines!

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Why are you calling out posts from 4 years ago? ... why did you make an account on the forums JUST to callout posts from 4 years ago.

Who doesn't love a good necro'd thread every once in a while.

In any case, I've won 3 lines exactly once, and I wasn't even trying, because by that point I had reached the same conclusion, that it was impossible. I came so close a number of times, only for the game to screw me like it was deliberate.

If you do enough content and shuffle enough times, 3 lines is possible. You need to shuffle until you get two lines and a set up for a third, and then just hope and pray.

Three-lining a WT is still 1000% easier than winning Jumbo Cactpot, which I've never come close to. I've played that almost every week since I started and never got better than 3rd prize, and that only happened once.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

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Why are you calling out posts from 4 years ago? ... why did you make an account on the forums JUST to callout posts from 4 years ago.

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Why are YOU calling out posts from 4 years ago, 4 years ago? huh? huh????? yeah I thought so.