Please help me understand why i should continue to play a repeat of 2.0?

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

*nods*

Interesting that you list Castlevania as an RPG though. Tell me which titles of Castlevania have you played and enjoyed?

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He might mean the igavanias (SOTN, OOE, Harmony of Despair, etc.)

Even they had some measure of vertical progress. True horizontal progress would end up affecting the need to explore and find more powerful items. It was far more interesting facing a boss with new stuff instead of playing richer mode and "Hydro Storm!" Ing everything to death.

Or to take a page from Harmony. Floating Soma with Valmanways. You practically won the game the instant you had this overpowered monstrosity of a build. Takes a lot of the teeth right out of a fight, and the game, for other players once you had two or three soma with em.

And no matter what additions there were, unless it was a Valmanways +1 soma players wouldn't touch it. Seems like a waste, right? And it poisoned everything those blades touched.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

He might mean the igavanias (SOTN, OOE, Harmony of Despair, etc.)

Even they had some measure of vertical progress. True horizontal progress would end up affecting the need to explore and find more powerful items.

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Thank, you, but I'd rather he speak for himself. We are, after all, trying to address his desires in this thread, and how some measure of them or general enjoyment can be gleaned from the game as it is now. I'd rather not tip my hand as to how, until I've reached my conversational point. It's better that he reaches it with me, than just to lay it all out in front of him -as in forums, it tends to come out as badgering.

Played FFXI for a long time and thoroughly enjoyed it but it had its issues, which folks here can feel free to go on at length about. Been playing FFXIV since 2.0 beta and thoroughly enjoy it, though it too is not without its flaws. For starters, XIV could use a couple of coil-esque quality challenging 24-man raids that Free Companies could instance and do together as a group. Besides that and a few other minor tweaks the game could use, this is still a very solid MMO.

If you're not finding yourself enjoying it in its current state, this might not be the game for you. It will never be a FFXI-clone and no amount of expansions are going to get it there or even close, no matter how much former XI players long for it to be.

Hyrist: almost all versions of castlevania from nes to xbox/ps3 versions to the 3ds ones. Its an adventure game for me and not a rpg so i still don't understand why people yet again intentionally pick on minor things such eeemergad he thinks castlevania is an a rpgs (almost sounds that far fetched). Anyways enough of that negativity. I've made my point we are not going anywhere with this discussion it will come to do Yoshi P fanboys vs FFXI dreamers.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Its an adventure game for me and not a rpg so i still don't understand why people yet again intentionally pick on minor things such eeemergad he thinks castlevania is an a rpgs (almost sounds that far fetched).

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...Hyrist asked you what games you played, then you yourself listed Castlevania as an RPG. Not exactly hard for people to get confused by what you mean when you keep contradicting yourself in your posts o_O

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Hyrist: almost all versions of castlevania from nes to xbox/ps3 versions to the 3ds ones. Its an adventure game for me and not a rpg so i still don't understand why people yet again intentionally pick on minor things such eeemergad he thinks castlevania is an a rpgs (almost sounds that far fetched). Anyways enough of that negativity. I've made my point we are not going anywhere with this discussion it will come to do Yoshi P fanboys vs FFXI dreamers.

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I meant no offense. Castlevania stretches a wide breath of genres, but always seems to prefer to refer to itself as an action adventure - and not an RPG. So I was courious as to the games and elements that lead you to add it into the RPG genre. I was not judging you. I'm glad for the clarifcation.

This said, I focused on Castlevania not for the fact that it was different from the Genre you were talking about, but rather because it holds elements I wanted to talk to you about. Specificly the fact that many of the Castlevania games are actually quite similar in nature. In fact, several of the Classic Castlevania games, (I, III, IV, Bloodlines, Dracula X (and Chronicles) etc.) are actually very close permutations of one another. Yet, you list them as some of the games you remember fondly, yes?

This is because there is no contrast of expectation, you expected more of the same from these games. But, when they did change, you still played them and enjoyed them.

Heavensward is much the same as its predecessor, because it seeks to refine on its successes, rather than make a radical deviation from its previous iteration. It seeks refinement, rather than revolution.

As far as your concern in difficulty, remember that in some of the Castlevania games, there were 'Hardmode' versions of those games? The loot pool between it and the others were identical. I ask you, honestly, did you feel your achievement in beating the games on Hard Mode feel cheapened by those who acquired items in Normal?

What I would ask of you, for your own enjoyment, is to approach the game as an Action-Adventure game, like Castlevania. Yes, it has Roleplay Elements, yes, it has multiplayer elements. Technically it is an MMORPG, but it plays very much like an action-adventure game with RPG elements.

I feel we place too much expectation on 'Genre's' these days that we forget ourselves and the elements that are similar in other genre's that we find fun. FFXI and other MMOs, they are their own games. I don't try to compare them. That's with FFXI being my first and most played MMORPG. That's as a Legacy member.

Skizzle, I do hope you find enjoyment in the game again. My best advice is to approach it with a clean slate, devoid of expectation, with the same awaited joy you would a Castlevania title. Don't worry about the achievements of others - they're not a part of your game, any different than someone who plays a console title on their own elsewhere. Focus on your own achievements, at your own pace, and the time you get to spend with those you care about and who's company you enjoy in the game.

And always remember, you can beat the game on Hardmode while others are struggling with normal. That's where you can feel accomplished.

Anyways, hope you stick with it. Don't get discouraged, this is just a game, like any other. There's no need to treat it any more special then the library of single-player games behind you.

As opposed to what MMO? This is what every modern MMO has devolved into.

Skizzle isn't asking for the game to be overhauled, he's commenting on the fact that the types of battle content (both current and planned) is an identical pattern to 2.0, rather than mixing it up and adding a new battle system or two. And rightly so. Is it too much to ask for a new type of PvE in an expansion?

Personally, I'm most disappointed they've rehashed the hunt system, because it was awful in 2.0 and it's awful now.

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Originally Posted by Delily

Because it's successful. If you do any research on the topic, the model used by FFXIV has been consistently the most successful model of gameplay.

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It's succesful for making money. But not for providing a quality game.

Wow was a much better game before it came to be the great moneymaking machine it is for blizzard today.


Making a game accessible for the average joe brings in a lot of subscriptions. And via those a lot of money.

But the average joe is not a gamer. They dont invest much time or effort into the game. (why would they, when they can go out instead? Its just a game!) Nor do they care much about the quality of the game (since its just to pass a few hours, much like a cheap movie).

However, while this makes the game economical succesful... because of the reduction in quality (the time and effort the game requires from a player) the game itself suffers.



Yes the model is succesful..for SE. But for us, the players that care about playing a good game? Can we really say its a good model?


I have seen the effects this model had in wow over the past years: The game became increasingly dull and uninteresting to play. Because everything that took a little bit of time or investment was deemed ''too hard to get into for the average joe''.

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Originally Posted by Tadacho

Skizzle isn't asking for the game to be overhauled, he's commenting on the fact that the types of battle content (both current and planned) is an identical pattern to 2.0, rather than mixing it up and adding some new battle systems as most expansion packs for most MMOs usually do. And rightly so. Is it too much to ask for a new type of PvE in an expansion?

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I've only played a few MMOs, but every one of them died shortly after changing their end game to something new, usually while also making drastic changes to classes. We don't put so many hours into this game because we want a different game. They don't have an unlimited budget. If they start making alternatives to raids and dungeons, development resources will get pulled from other areas.

If you want a different game, try different games. This game is clearly doing something right as it's extremely successful.

The proression that he doesn't like is exactly what makes this game what it is.

The OP still has yet to claim he likes anything about this game. Again, for the 10th time, you are doing it wrong if you need to ask why you should play a game. The answer to that question will always be: You shouldn't continue playing the game. You should find a game that you like. You can then come back to this game after a break and see if it's fun again. If it isn't, oh well. It's a video game.

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Originally Posted by Cirgellon

I've only played a few MMOs, but every one of them died shortly after changing their end game to something new, usually while also making drastic changes to classes. We don't put so many hours into this game because we want a different game.

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I also don't want a different game, and I never said anything about endgame content... It could be something as silly as bringing back chocobo escorts! It's just something different.

Also, to use FFXI as an example, this is a game that changed its endgame every single expansion (dynamis, sea, sky, abyssea, on and on) and is still going (just about). So much variation in the types of PvE battle content available, whilst very much keeping the game itself the same game.

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Originally Posted by Tadacho

Skizzle isn't asking for the game to be overhauled, he's commenting on the fact that the types of battle content (both current and planned) is an identical pattern to 2.0, rather than mixing it up and adding a new battle system or two. And rightly so. Is it too much to ask for a new type of PvE in an expansion?

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Academically? There's only so many mechanics you can add before everything becomes derivative. And we reached that saturation point back before Final Coil. Classes got revamped with differing combat systems than each class personally identified with, and additionally we haven't seen the full of Alexander's Mechanic's yet.

So... yes. Yes it is too much to ask for, in my opinion- when you consider all that we've gotten with this expansion already, within a year and a half of the original full on remake. We can stand to be more patient, and more grateful for what we have. We got an entire single-player's worth of content for the expansion, and there's still more to come.

Instead of griping we can be brainstorming on what sort of systems we would like to see - give them ideas. Reminisce on mechanics from other games and theorize on how they could fit here, rather than demand that they do. There is an entire level of conversational tone that we seem to forget having once we log into these forums, and I feel that correcting such should be a higher priority than airing our frustrations raw.


On a side note. FFXI did not change its endgame wit every single expansion, it added to it. People were still farming for Dynamis drops when Salvage Came out, and Einjherjar was not all that different from Dynamis. It was a very Horizontal game that cannot be accurately compared to a vertical progression MMO.

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Originally Posted by Tadacho

I also don't want a different game, and I never said anything about endgame content... It could be something as silly as bringing back chocobo escorts! It's just something different.

Also, to use FFXI as an example, this is a game that changed its endgame every single expansion (dynamis, sea, sky, abyssea, on and on) and is still going (just about). So much variation in the types of PvE battle content available, whilst very much keeping the game itself the same game.

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I'm all for some new stuff, which this game does add btw. That said, only if the new stuff is minor enough that it doesnt tKe resources from the stuff many of us like. Maybe they can make the people working on hunts do something else.

I'mnot under the impression that minor things like this will satisfy the OP though. He is complaining about the current system of progression.

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

Instead of griping we can be brainstorming on what sort of systems we would like to see - give them ideas. Reminisce on mechanics from other games and theorize on how they could fit here, rather than demand that they do. There is an entire level of conversational tone that we seem to forget having once we log into these forums, and I feel that correcting such should be a higher priority than airing our frustrations raw.

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I agree, but I didn't derail this thread into the argument it's become.

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

On a side note. FFXI did not change its endgame wit every single expansion, it added to it. People were still farming for Dynamis drops when Salvage Came out, and Einjherjar was not all that different from Dynamis. It was a very Horizontal game that cannot be accurately compared to a vertical progression MMO.

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Changed. Added to. No need to be fastidious. The point I'm making is that they brought in new battle systems with each expansion and even outside of expansions to great success.

Personally I'd love to see a face-lifted Hamlet Defence brought back and perhaps some new open world content. I remember Yoshi P mentioning time trials of dungeons, and of course there's still the primal summoning system up in the air. And here's hoping the airship system of exploring new islands and challenging NMs has some real depth to it. Even something like BCNMs would be great, collect some kind of token, trade them in to some kind of aetheryte and enter a battlefield! Lots of opportunities for different types of PvE, but instead they chose to just reuse hunts, treasure maps and dungeons, which is perhaps what personally disappoints me the most (The Hunt, that is) and makes 3.0 feel like 2.0 rehashed.

Though admittedly you are correct - it's early in 3.0 and something new could very well be in the works. The Hunt and Treasure Maps weren't added until later in the 2.0 series also. Here's hoping!

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Originally Posted by Tadacho

I agree, but I didn't derail this thread into the argument it's become.



Changed. Added to. No need to be fastidious. The point I'm making is that they brought in new battle systems with each expansion and even outside of expansions to great success.

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Not in the revolutionist terms that are being insinuated. Dynamis was not introduced until later in Zilart's plot. And even Divine Might was not out at the start. Level caps were incrementally added until the 75 cap and each system revealed became more and more derivative as the game went on.

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Personally I'd love to see a face-lifted Hamlet Defense brought back and perhaps some new open world content. I remember Yoshi P mentioning time trials of dungeons, and of course there's still the primal summoning system up in the air. And here's hoping the airship system of exploring new islands and challenging NMs has some real depth to it. Even something like BCNMs would be great, collect some kind of token, trade them in to some kind of aetheryte and enter a battlefield! Lots of opportunities for different types of PvE, but instead they chose to just reuse hunts, treasure maps and dungeons, which is perhaps what personally disappoints me the most (The Hunt, that is) and makes 3.0 feel like 2.0 rehashed.

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The Primal System is on the back burner, I don't expect to see that this expansion at all due to the way it was described in the interview concerning it. I'm with you on the idea of bringing back Hamlet Defense, though it would likely have to be instanced much in the way Guildhests are in order to be successful, which I'm fine with. But, as a daydream, I would definatly be even more ok with the idea of having zones that are changing depending on performance of said events. This would take a lot of work though and again, isn't on my expectation list.

I'm not going to complain about Hunts and Treasure maps. IMO they are much improved from their iterations and much better integrated into the progression system. I have a desire to do them and a means that is both peaceful and entertaining (Yey flying!) So in this respect I am ok with the fact that they spent the initial release of Heavensward refining what they had. After all Hunts was not a system they indended to create, but rather one as a result of our feedback. There still needs to be work done on A and S level hunts, IMO due to crowding on populated servers, but the dailies and weeklies are fun.

I also like the improvement on Leves. Through smaller changes and more dynamic monsters, Leves feel fun, if not rewarding as I would like them to be nearing 60. The Large Scale leves in particular I do enjoy.


I would like to see them expand upon the Airship trips soon, as they said they would. Ideally our Airships will be able to find instanced encounters similar to how the Hydra and Chimera use existing areas, that we can bring our FC mates in to challenge for loot and fun.

Again, I'm not dissatisfied with the content I have. Do I want more, absolutely, I always do. But right now, they've done a lot to make 'more of the same' appealing again. I'm content to chew on it a while.

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Though admittedly you are correct - it's early in 3.0 and something new could very well be in the works. The Hunt and Treasure Maps weren't added until later in the 2.0 series also. Here's hoping!

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Indeed.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Hello fellow adventurers!
Some might share these thoughts so please help me understand if I'm wrong in my way of thinking.

why should I continue a repeat of 2.0?
The new gears you get from LAW is pretty much how we grinded the tomes in 2.0 for DL gears.

New gears presented and the weekly restrictions in my view only shows that its a repeat of everything else we have experienced before IMO?

Barely anyone doing fates in the new areas since everyone seems to be spamming northern thanalan for the xp.
Was I wrong for rushing and doing that too since the new areas didnt offer any enjoyment in fategrinding?

You can't go levling all your jobs to 60 just because I need something to do. I should be able to enjoy and improve my job and gaming experience without this weekly cap and feel the need to level more jobs just because i need to do.

These are my thoughts.
Kind Regards
Skizzle

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Don't it's that simple, the game isn't gonna have some mega change to it's foundation just because it's "3.0" new areas (actually old areas re-released), new race, new jobs, and new fluff is all we get just like every other MMORPG has done starting back in Ultima Online days.... Oh and don't give me any of those "WoW made huge changes in the X-pacs" type of replies cause that's BS the core of the game has and always will be that same. #playordon'tplay

Tyzeon I dont know anything from WoW but i know FFXI didn't have alot of this recycled stuff until wings of the goddess come out when some areas got re-used since you travelled back tot he past.

Like someone else here said Duty Finder will be the death of this game and you are not kidding. Here we go again with Yoshi P played too much everything else but FFXI. This closed I must be in a instance envoirment its so boring and it gives you an easy suffocated envoirment. Last time I remember I could enter a castle in FFXI and a group could randomly run buy and assist me. No such here exist. Instead we are giving bigger maps and people will use the arguement its exact the same thing wich it is not.
They didn't listen to the players they just added bigger maps not more content within the maps.

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

On a side note. FFXI did not change its endgame wit every single expansion, it added to it. People were still farming for Dynamis drops when Salvage Came out, and Einjherjar was not all that different from Dynamis. It was a very Horizontal game that cannot be accurately compared to a vertical progression MMO.

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This is the biggest problem with XIV right now IMO. They have not increased the amount of relevant raid content since the 1st coil. We are still stuck with 4 relevant events at a time. I'm not saying go horizontal.. I know that isn't happening. But they could at least stop making group gear surpass raid gear so damn quickly. If group gear was 100 at the end of 2.0 cycle people could have still been raiding/progressing through 6-9. Instead they turn it into a loot pinyata and basically delete it from the roster due to group gear being superior.

Get immersed in the story and explore the game world. I recently played FFXI for a couple of months before HW launch and I have to say, it was extremely refreshing to play the entire story and all expansions to really get immersed in the story and explore the world. That's one reason why I'm not rushing my goals in HW, because I'm enjoying the journey every single step.

Many things about FFXI where nice especially gameplaywise. You are not bound by one single weapon compared to Yoshi Ps WoWs vision. Either he thinks player are too stupid to handle multiple weapons or he himself couldnt play like that because his choice of MMORPGs didnt offer that variety of overwhelming gameplay when it came to weapons and spells? The freedom of FFXI is by far much better than this. SE learned nothing. I'm guessing the Yoshi P fanboys will now say FFXI servers are still active go there..
Thats the point I shouldnt go there I should enjoy this game and it should be rewarded and challenging to many aspects aswell as not beeing recycled over and over again. Not all players are from WoW that plays we appreciate the variety and freedom of gears gameplay and this non dutyfinder envoirment.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

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way to talk about something u know nothing about..in WoW classes have weapon pools similar to FFXI


also the illusion of choice is worse than no choice...in the end of the day ppl will just calculate whats the best weapon/gear etc for the class to be the best and you either do that or just get left out of pretty much everything


side: good job on basically calling any1 who doesn't agree with you a "YoshiP fanboy", that will for sure help your cause

Erepio thats how the discussion turned out sadly it became a Yoshi P Fanboy vs FFXI Fanboys because people turned it into that.
Last time I played WoW my only weapon of joins for Rogue was daggers. Last time I played FFXI my weapon of choice for thf and ninja was pretty much everything.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

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it turn like that because you keep calling any1 that doesn't agree with you a YoshiP fanboy, i guess they much cuse the possibility of actually liking it this way is too far fetch huh?

also all you have done is just ask for FFXI stuff in FFXIV even tho you said u dont want this to be FFXI 2.0..how about u actually come up with ideas on how the features can be implemented in FFXIV


at the end of the day its come down to "i like this game, i dont like it", if you dont like it the i dont know, go play something else?

ps: i disagree with you, i hope we never see most of the FFXI stuff here cuse what FFXI is just a big "wait" for basicly anything it offer zero real challenge, so i must clearly be a YoshiP fanboy, oh wait i also love FFXI, my 1st MMO, and i consider myself a FFXI fanboy and still play that too when i want that type of gameplay

pps: no idea what u talking about, rouge can also use fist, swords, maces etc

idk. If u dont enjoy the game then u dont need to force yourself to play it . I dont mean that negatively towards you OP.

I can only say ur the only one who can tell to yourself why you should play FFXIV or not ^^

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Many things about FFXI where nice especially gameplaywise. You are not bound by one single weapon compared to Yoshi Ps WoWs vision. Either he thinks player are too stupid to handle multiple weapons or he himself couldnt play like that because his choice of MMORPGs didnt offer that variety of overwhelming gameplay when it came to weapons and spells? The freedom of FFXI is by far much better than this. SE learned nothing. I'm guessing the Yoshi P fanboys will now say FFXI servers are still active go there..
Thats the point I shouldnt go there I should enjoy this game and it should be rewarded and challenging to many aspects aswell as not beeing recycled over and over again. Not all players are from WoW that plays we appreciate the variety and freedom of gears gameplay and this non dutyfinder envoirment.

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Sizzle, the bound to a single weapon concept was Tanaka's vision, as evident by the Armory system that was inherent in 1.0 - before Yoshida was ever placed on the project. Please don't spread misinformation.

While there is a lot of hostility sent your way, there's no point in simply lingering onto it. Please read over my previous post directed towards you, that you seem to have overlooked for my advice on your gameplay habits.

Again, as a FFXI veteran, and as a FFXIV Legacy member, I rather enjoy the systems we have. That does not mean I do not want more, but it means I'm patient. And I'm far from the only one, with IGN netting Heavensward an 8.6 in spite of criticisms about new content, gated expansion, and endless sidequests.

As far as the comment of "You should enjoy this game." The thing is... you don't have to. If it simply does not appeal to you, let it go. Don't hang onto something that makes you bitter, if that's the case. If you do enjoy parts of it, focus on that. You're in ultimate control of that.

Anyways, either at this point you're being purposefully inflaming or... you honestly were fed a lot of misinformation about the things you are upset about.

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Originally Posted by Zarzak

This is the biggest problem with XIV right now IMO. They have not increased the amount of relevant raid content since the 1st coil. We are still stuck with 4 relevant events at a time. I'm not saying go horizontal.. I know that isn't happening. But they could at least stop making group gear surpass raid gear so damn quickly. If group gear was 100 at the end of 2.0 cycle people could have still been raiding/progressing through 6-9. Instead they turn it into a loot pinyata and basically delete it from the roster due to group gear being superior.

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Keep in mind, any additional 'routes' they make upon the progression path will be expected to be maintained as the game progresses upwards. The thing that made FFXI so much easier to develop is the fact that they could develop a system and leave it - and due to the lack of vertical progression the content would still be relevant. Here, not only do they have to figure a means to making old content relevant or capable for others to complete in smaller numbers, but any system they create as a means of progression will add to their development schedule for any piece of content.

8 man raiding, 24 man raiding, Large Scale PvP, Hunts, Treasure Hunts, 'Primal' Fights and Dungeons all have to go through continual updates. Anything they add would add to that pile. So workflow will become a continual concern. Whatever they do, they have to do it in a method they can manage to upkeep for the next 9 years or so.

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Originally Posted by Erepio

pps: no idea what u talking about, rouge can also use fist, swords, maces etc

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2 Specs cant be played without a dagger equiped. And for the third spec all weapon types have essentially the same effect. (they used to give different effects...years ago)

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

You are not bound by one single weapon compared to Yoshi Ps WoWs vision.

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Eh, I question this. Setting aside the fact that Yoshi P did NOT come up with the Armoury system (as others have mentioned), even though different jobs could wield a variety of weapons in FFXI there was rarely a good reason to do so. In all but a few cases, for each class there was ONE weapon that was better than the others. This weapon sometimes changed over time, such as the way WAR dual-wielding Axes made way for single-wielding Great Axes when two-handed weapons got their buff - but at any given time, if you were wielding a weapon other than the optimal weapon, you were regarded as a fool. BLM could wield a scythe - but if you joined a party with one equipped, you'd be laughed off the server.

This only changed when activites started cropping up that required specific weaponskills - and THAT only happened after Abyssea had landed and turned the game on its head anyway. And even THEN, a player would equip the alternate weapon only long enough to use the weaponskill, after which they'd switch back to their primary.

LineageRazor again stuff that was awesome in FFXI but where not good you could use them here and improve them. I think alot of people wouldnt mind different weapons from time to time. It gives you more freedom when playing. Right now it is still a very locked in envoirment. I doubt that will change the same goes with the gears. What is wrong with gears have -10% damage taken or other specifics? That makes the stuff more enjoyable right now all we get is these 4 different stats on each gear piece unless we overmeld stuff into a 5th or 6th stat.

Pretty Much 2.0 now with flying and a bit bigger maps!

Big maps that are pretty much really empty cause even when you do get flying mount you just get the unlock the map acheivement.
Fates in no areas wow so cool... not no one does that because they take forever and no one is there to even play with you since everyone is spamming northern thanalan.
OMG DRK gets a panther...? Really that panther is just the couerl mount just black.
Its going to be really hard to get to 60 Yoshi P said in old interviews. I have 4 jobs at 60 now so how is that hard? and ive been playing 2-3h a day.
Check up old live letters Yoshi P has said himself he was gonna remove the ilvl cause this wasnt the way to go. 2 years later 3.0 still iLvL.
Also the whole the expansion just got released wait for updates? What am I supposed to wait for? Updates on the world map that can give me more xp? Shouldnt that have been thought of right from the start and you could have made content a bit harder so people can catch up with the new stuff and not feel like they have done everything they need to do for their character atm and now they just afk at the foundation waiting for this amazing new patch... wich is what? Savage Alexander? You mean 2 years of trying to create an expansion and this is the only thing they can offer?

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Reinha when Zilart and cop came out:
1. I didnt even have one 75 job was still working on that.
2. Was fun doing dungeons because it was challenge and rewarding.
3. Storyline was 10/10
4. Questing in FFXI you where not someones fetchboy as it is in FFXIV.
5. Where many jobs in FFXI you couldnt have had all of them maxed out was almost impossible and difficult.
6. Its an MMORPG stuff shouldnt be soloed the point is finding people that are willing to help you. I understand nothing like FFXI where 6 players must do stuff but atleast 2 or 3 people OUTSIDE of duty finder!
7. I laugh at your silly 5 new skills for each job when FFXI overwhelmed you with skills and jobs im used to a BLM having 40+ spells not 20.

Beleive me I can go on.

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1. Whatever
2. Yeah sitting in one spot pulling the same mob for hours on end, awesome fun.......
3. Thats purely opinion based, Some was good, some not so good. 3.0, IMO, blows everything away from FFXI.
4. It was either ridiculous amounts of drops, or insanely rare drops to hand in.
5. Because many jobs weren't even welcomed in XP parties, you were FOTM job/sub or GTFO. Also XP didn't scale, you were getting the same XP at 70 as you where at 20. XP parties consisted of stacking the FOTM DD job.
6. But it shouldn't be mandatory either, why many where stuck in Jueno waiting from hours to days, depending on which job they wanted to level trying to get an XP party or people to join. Seeing as you could lose hours of XPiing in seconds, players played it safe
7. Thunder, most of the "new skills" where unused and/or useless. You pretty much used the same WS/spells for all content. BLM, thunder. Also due to resists and elemental wheel, certain jobs where excluded from certain content.

Your role was pretty much dictated by the majority, SMN? heal due to them having the largest MP pool. RDM? Better keep that refresh up.

Believe me, I also can go on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Many things about FFXI where nice especially gameplaywise. You are not bound by one single weapon compared to Yoshi Ps WoWs vision.

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Correction:
The decision to give every class only 1 weapon type was made by Tanaka, not Yoshida. And I doubt the old team knew much about WoW. Or about MMORPG in generall, seeing how even the simplest standards (like a search system for the market wards) were missed in 1.0 at launch and how exp was earned.

Learn your XIV history facts first

Sapphic: No edit im dead serious I didnt have my 75 at that time it took me about 7 months i think to get one job to 75. Again like I've said for the 10th time. No one wants a new FFXI but we want something challenging and rewarding like FFXI. Learn from what actually was good in FFXI and take it with you here. Alot of things where really good about that game use thoese and don't ignore them all the way since FFXI was the start of SE FF MMORPG franchise.

If it ain't broke, why fix it?

The formula has worked in other games and it has worked here since launch.

They've made some changes in how crafting/gathering works.... then there's BRD.

So by having a 2.0 reskinned as 3.0 with everything exactly the way it was isnt broken?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

So by having a 2.0 reskinned as 3.0 with everything exactly the way it was isnt broken?

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Was it broken in the first place in 2.0? Because it didn't seem to be for me.

Why does the game have to change drastically with each expansion?

Edit: And please don't exaggerate by saying "everything". We have had some changes which were asked for, including drops from primals and raids.

Sure there are things that can be improved, including hunts, but claiming that everything is the same isn't helping you win your argument.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Sapphic: No edit im dead serious I didnt have my 75 at that time it took me about 7 months i think to get one job to 75. Again like I've said for the 10th time. No one wants a new FFXI but we want something challenging and rewarding like FFXI. Learn from what actually was good in FFXI and take it with you here. Alot of things where really good about that game use thoese and don't ignore them all the way since FFXI was the start of SE FF MMORPG franchise.

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Personally I want to see it going its own direction, unique to FFXIV. Not similar to XI.

SecretCrowds: Ofcourse not everything is wrong. Anyone playing Heavensward knows Yoshi P recycled more than captain planet on this expansion. Still the same type of weekly tomes This "Law" is pretty much the first tomes we had for darklight gear. Levling is still way too easy and fast. By that fast levling you barely get to enjoy your levels or the gear that you get. I got to enjoy my level 52 gears for about 3h then i was 54 and had to upgrade well that was worth it?
All this for this vertical progression that will leave 80% of everyones servers doing nothing more than AFK in foundation like we did in mordhona a few months back because you run out of things to do due to how fast and easy it is to level. Again stop with the level more jobs. I don't want to level more jobs i main 5 different jobs and thats enough but i shouldnt have 3 of these jobs at i180 already. This isnt because of me spending alot of time on the game its because the game itself is too easy.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

By that fast levling you barely get to enjoy your levels or the gear that you get. I got to enjoy my level 52 gears for about 3h then i was 54 and had to upgrade well that was worth it?

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Then you had the wrong gear on.
I enjoyed my lv 50 gear until lv 54.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Reinha when Zilart and cop came out:
1. I didnt even have one 75 job was still working on that.
2. Was fun doing dungeons because it was challenge and rewarding.
3. Storyline was 10/10
4. Questing in FFXI you where not someones fetchboy as it is in FFXIV.
5. Where many jobs in FFXI you couldnt have had all of them maxed out was almost impossible and difficult.
6. Its an MMORPG stuff shouldnt be soloed the point is finding people that are willing to help you. I understand nothing like FFXI where 6 players must do stuff but atleast 2 or 3 people OUTSIDE of duty finder!
7. I laugh at your silly 5 new skills for each job when FFXI overwhelmed you with skills and jobs im used to a BLM having 40+ spells not 20.

Beleive me I can go on.

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FFXIV is borrowing from the philosophy Blizzard adopted with questing, which was to make quests "jobs" that were short and sweet. The characters issuing the jobs weren't really important and the quests were meant to compliment the faster paced combat as well as emphasize the nature of the world the player was in. The issue is that FFXIV is as much about their characters as the world building, so they really need fewer quests and more effort put into those implemented and the characters issuing them. For example, if someone is going to give us a quest, they should look unique, have good dialog, well composed cutscenes, and maybe a voice acted part or two so we get a feel for them. Haucherfant was a good example of a character that wasn't all that impressive at the start of 2.0, but they made him so much more by giving him a voice and putting him in a well crafted quest chain.

A lot of the current quests are okay as local jobs, but they aren't really "quests" as much as doing some shmoes laundry. Personally, I think they should take a page from the Witcher 3 and have all the quests start at a job board at each settlement, then have the player go talk to the npc involved. At the very least then it feels like what it should be. Heck, they should be doing this with the existing battlecraft leves so they don't seem like they are job posting popping out of the nether.