Dark Knight

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Originally Posted by Rosalynd

Pseudo tank. Kain was actually the better tank in that game before Cecil became a paladin.

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Kain also had a shield, same as FF3 dragoon, i dont see dragoon in xi or xiv having a shield...just beacuse a class was a certain way in the past doesnt mean it would be in the future

I'm a die-hard FF fan and I'm not that upset over it. Yes it's been a DD in past games, but as long as they use the same skills but in a tank way, I see no problem with it. (Then again, I'm also up to seeing a blue mage to be any party role depending on the skills it learns from monsters, including tank, so I guess I'm just more adaptable)

After all, it's not like there are that many true tanks in the FF jobs, and we do need more tanks!

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Originally Posted by Erepio

Kain also had a shield, same as FF3 dragoon, i dont see dragoon in xi or xiv having a shield...just beacuse a class was a certain way in the past doesnt mean it would be in the future

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So i guess we all agree that past FF games are absolutely useless when it comes to inspiring jobs in XIV? If they could at least admit this i would be ok with it, but they seem pretty determined to draw alot of inspiration from previous titles in other regards.

Hell, at this point Bravely Default is closer to the FF job cliches than XIV is.

The amount of brats full of uninformed, dramatic, entitled whining in here...

We need another tank.
Dark Knight makes sense as a tank.

Butchering classic is a bit ridiculous of an assumption just because it's not copy + pasted out of whatever your speculation has been.
Who's to say it won't have higher damage output, lower survivability?
Or that it might be a very solid job?

You people have way too much free time.

Ok people who are acreaming bloody murder over dark knight being a tank let's relax. Yes traditionaly they are known as dmg dealing hp sacrificing badasses. That however does not mean they have to be I for one am kinda excited I like that SE is willing to change things up it sets the class apart from the other FF versions of dark knight. As for the fact that it don't have a base class in sure there will be some sort of requirement to unlock it and frankly I never understood the classe/job sysytem myself I mean does anyone really use a class after lvl30 for anything other then shits and giggles.i like the direction dark knight is going in and am excited to see what the gun class will bring to the table. Let's give this a chance guys before crying over the fact that your class isn't the way YOU want it.

DRK always used heavy armor and always had lots of hp, its transition to a Tank is not surprising.

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Originally Posted by Rosalynd

So i guess we all agree that past FF games are absolutely useless when it comes to inspiring jobs in XIV? If they could at least admit this i would be ok with it, but they seem pretty determined to draw alot of inspiration from previous titles in other regards.

Hell, at this point Bravely Default is closer to the FF job cliches than XIV is.

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em what... i dont see how making Dark Knight tank instead of dps, makes other FF games "useless when it comes to inspiring jobs in XIV" lol....if it use dark magic, has drain HP attacks, debuffs, uses great swords, wears heavy armor etc for me thats a Dark Knight...being a dps or tank, thats just a role

Lol, I'm the only person so far of 17 pages who gave the OP a like...
No one else likes this being a tank? We do need more tanks, what's the problem?
Can't wait for gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Rosalynd

Pseudo tank. Kain was actually the better tank in that game before Cecil became a paladin.

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True fact remains it was still tank like. So at best it could do both. So its not destroying an iconic class

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Originally Posted by rina_inverse

also curious on the no base class
wonder if SE will tear down the whole class-job concept

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I freaking hope so!

Scrap the weapon = job concept, and let me use other stuff while we're at it!

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Originally Posted by Mugiawara

Lol, I'm the only person so far of 17 pages who gave the OP a like...
No one else likes this being a tank? We do need more tanks, what's the problem?
Can't wait for gameplay.

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Do tell. Queing for Coil 5: Everyone else - five minutes. The last stupid tank - 5 hours. I never tanked before but am still glad we get more tanks. We have like, what, five damage dealer job, three healers and two tanks. Plus the ninjas are comming. so make that six dps jobs-

DRK makes 0 sense has a tank considering FF history.
All their skills are about dealing more damage than enemies do to them by doing HP/DPS trades and inflicting status effects. DRK should be a DPS class, knight sword DPS class as always has been. In fact DRK are Black Magic and stats downgrading skills.

SAM on the other hand, considering FF history, has been always more "tankish" (actually a reaction-tank with support skills) and its tradition as a class goes back to Ogre Tactic`s Swordmaster class, nowhere near a DPS class.

But well, SE can do whatever, but more than a few will be dissapointed if DRK is DPS and SAM is not a tank.

I for one am ecstatic to see DRK confirmed as a tank.

QuQ

TY SE for making my dreams come true. I'll look forward to it.

Honestly, though, i have no idea why anyone is complaining that the DRK's classic ability to sacrifice HP for a huge dps spike is bad for a tank. They'll just work on a sliding scale (much like warriors and paladins already do with sword oath and no-defiance making them squishier but improving dps). We already have a damage mitigation tank, and a self healing tank, why not make dark knight a dps-optional tank? Give a good HP pool that can be sacrificed for dps to deal with trash pulls or finish off bosses. I can imagine this working spectacularly, especially if the damage spikes are high enough to out dps a healer in dps mode. Like any job it will most likely just be about knowing when to use your tools at the appropriate time. ;)

I've been looking forward to DRK myself. It doesn't bother me that its a tank job in the slightest. (My main concern is how people treat new tanks, to be honest.) I'm interested to see how this will work out. I have a feeling it might even end up being a healer's favorite.

Drain has already been mentioned, but there's also Dread Spikes and the Absorb-Stat spells. Combining those with some other "traditional" FF DRK abilities, like sacrificing say, 10%-20% (that's only 100-200 per 1k) of your hp to turn any attack skill into an aoe, I think we're looking at a pretty powerful, self-sustaining tank. I'm imagining Sacrifice + Sanguine Sword/Blood Weapon on a horde of uglies with lots of flashy XIV stuff. Rawr.

Likely they'll also have a DPS mode that they can throw on for OT. Vehemence/Last Resort stance maybe. Something akin to PLD Sword stance, or a WAR not using Defiance.

Anyway, I plan on giving it a try. 'Cause Greatswords. <3

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

DRK makes 0 sense has a tank considering FF history.
All their skills are about dealing more damage than enemies do to them by doing HP/DPS trades and inflicting status effects. DRK should be a DPS class, knight sword DPS class as always has been. In fact DRK are Black Magic and stats downgrading skills.

SAM on the other hand, considering FF history, has been always more "tankish" (actually a reaction-tank with support skills) and its tradition as a class goes back to Ogre Tactic`s Swordmaster class, nowhere near a DPS class.

But well, SE can do whatever, but more than a few will be dissapointed if DRK is DPS and SAM is not a tank.

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We're still going to get more tanks...Just probably not this expansion.
I'm sure the 2 class/jobs we'll get is it for this entire expansion. Rogue/Ninja just hit the before mark,
unless they shoot another DPS in it COULD be Samurai.

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Originally Posted by Lori

No one is saying we don't need more tanks, it just would have been preferred to have DRK as DPS and Samurai (or some other job) as tank.

But whatever Im still excited for it. Almost makes me not even care about Ninja now

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I understand but look how they did Bard lol. I mean they completely killed that one lol.
Just because some jobs where this and that in XI or whatever doesn't mean it can't
change in different Final Fantasies...like they did bard but killed. I say let's wait and see
how DRK is first, could be lots of fun.

I hope samurai and drk are tanks and they introduce more jobs for dmg dealers. I don't mind there being more tank classes than healer classes considering tanks are right now the bottleneck

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Originally Posted by Mugiawara

Lol, I'm the only person so far of 17 pages who gave the OP a like...
No one else likes this being a tank? We do need more tanks, what's the problem?
Can't wait for gameplay.

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No one is saying we don't need more tanks, it just would have been preferred to have DRK as DPS and Samurai (or some other job) as tank.

But whatever Im still excited for it. Almost makes me not even care about Ninja now

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

DRK makes 0 sense has a tank considering FF history.
All their skills are about dealing more damage than enemies do to them by doing HP/DPS trades and inflicting status effects. DRK should be a DPS class, knight sword DPS class as always has been. In fact DRK are Black Magic and stats downgrading skills.

SAM on the other hand, considering FF history, has been always more "tankish" (actually a reaction-tank with support skills) and its tradition as a class goes back to Ogre Tactic`s Swordmaster class, nowhere near a DPS class.

But well, SE can do whatever, but more than a few will be dissapointed if DRK is DPS and SAM is not a tank.

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I see youve never played ff4 n are goin by ff11 knowledge

Hey guys FF14 is a game that is allowed to stand on it's own by doing things. It doesn't need to follow decisions from the previous series.

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Originally Posted by OmniKLD

I see youve never played ff4 n are goin by ff11 knowledge

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I see you didnt either, because DRK was never a tank in FF4

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Originally Posted by Dashuto

All these folks upset that its a tank...

The original Drk in Final Fantasy was a tank.

Many MMO have drain/endrain tanks, Lineage II's best tank was basically a Dark Knight. I'm fully confident they will make drk work just fine.

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So much this... Everyone, again are in their feelings and jumping online to complain.. Again. You can NOT play DRK. This is not FFXI guys. As much as some of you want it to be, it just isn't. For all you so called "FF purists", do your research 1st.

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Originally Posted by OmniKLD

I see youve never played ff4 n are goin by ff11 knowledge

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All the other way arround, i never played FFXI. I played FFIV and if you call something a tank cause it can "tank" during the first hours of game... Well, lol. And kain is better tank than Cecil before he goes Paladin in fact, so LOL.

Now, what is the best entry on the series for what the DRK is: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/D...ight_(Tactics)
0 defense and evasion, pure DPS.

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Originally Posted by Lori

I see you didnt either, because DRK was never a tank in FF4

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It was the 2nd tankiest job in the game. Look at the stats of it and everything else in that game. Only PLD has more HP, Vit, Def etc by comparison to its mean.

Just because it had an HP sacrifice doesn't change it was built as a heavy melee with a shield that took damage better than everything else but Paladin.

Please also review FFtactics and its ridiculously tanky dark knight spamming drains and being nigh unkillable.

Check into FFX2, where there is some debate, but again dark is a super high HP melee, durable, and has drains aside from hp sacrifice.

FFXI is the only instance where Drk was a glass cannon DPS.

some of the QQ in this thread, but really I shouldn't expect anything less. I welcome the new job, especially as a tank roll.

Im stoked that DRK is going to be like EQ's Shadow Knight. Cant wait!!!

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Originally Posted by Dashuto

Please also review FFtactics and its ridiculously tanky dark knight spamming drains and being nigh unkillable.

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hahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahaha.
MNK, 2-hands, DRK dead. ROFL!

DRK just had some resistance cause of armor (0 evasion) and the HP absorb, but its role was to do damage and status effects, it never was good for anything but that, putting a DRK hoping for him to tank anything be it on single or multiplayers was lulz.

There were far too many classes on FFT that were good tanks that the DRK just can`t make it to the top 10. Damn, the Oracle was a better tank xD!

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahaha.
MNK, 2-hands, DRK dead. ROFL!

DRK just had some resistance cause of armor (0 evasion) and the HP absorb, but its role was to do damage and status effects, it never was good for anything but that, putting a DRK hoping for him to tank anything be it on single or multiplayers was lulz.

There were far too many classes on FFT that were good tanks that the DRK just can`t make it to the top 10. Damn, the Oracle was a better tank xD!

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Who cares? It's a different game guy. o.o

Technically the whole concept of 'tank' as we know it is really only a recent thing anyway, given the fact the earlier FF games didn't feature an enmity mechanic in gameplay (well, except for FFT that is, and that wasn't even a true enmity system but more just 'enemy goes for the weakest character in the party'), so a Dark Knight 'tanking' doesn't really count in say FFIV.

Really, DRK being a tank doesn't concern me as more I'm intrigued as to how the Job is going to work in regards to not having a base class - the only way I can think of how it could possibly function in this way is like ROG/NIN, it cannot be chosen as a starting 'Job' for new characters, but can only be unlocked after a certain point, and that upon unlocking you get the Job Crystal as normal, but equipping a great sword will automatically equip the DRK Soul Crystal as well and will not allow you to remove it, because there is no base class.

To be really honest, I'm surprised SE didn't take the easy way out and give it a base class called 'Soldier' in a thinly veiled attempt to rope in FFVII fans. ;) But I digress...

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Originally Posted by whoopeeragon

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Well remember Yoshi-P said MAY require 2 Jobs to unlock Advance Jobs.

If Advance Jobs require 2 Jobs to unlock then those 2 Jobs may require to first reach a certain point in their Job story before the player will be allowed to unlock Dark Knight (which may start out at lvl 1 or higher so players can practice and learn how to play them). I won't be surprised if Dark knight may require player to complete the lvl 50 Paladin Job Quest and lvl 50 Warrior Job Quest as a requirment to unlock the Advance Job.

However, that requirement will also cause a **** storm of complaining and blood lust for SE developers heads as well. (Which I will certainly be looking forward to seeing.)

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

Well remember Yoshi-P said MAY require 2 Jobs to unlock Advance Jobs.

If Advance Jobs require 2 Jobs to unlock then those 2 Jobs may require to first reach a certain point in their Job story before the player will be allowed to unlock Dark Knight (which may start out at lvl 1 or higher so players can practice and learn how to play them). I won't be surprised if Dark knight may require player to complete the lvl 50 Paladin Job Quest and lvl 50 Warrior Job Quest as a requirment to unlock the Advance Job.

However, that requirement will also cause a **** storm of complaining and blood lust for SE developers heads as well. (Which I will certainly be looking forward to seeing.)

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So a little work behind unlocking a class is bad? It will be almost 2 years since the game has been out, if people still only have 1 job to 50 by then.... its your fault.

I think DRK could be a fine tank if it was needed, and this game needs tanks. It makes sense given that they use heavy armor. Sure, they made a good DPS previously, but in other FF games they could always tank a bit. Sure, in FFIV it wasn't "paladin" tanky, but Cecil had some pretty good survivability throughout the entirety of the game. This decision doesn't seem -that- unusual.

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

-snip-

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pretty sure if they did something like that they would have also labeled Dark Knight as an advance job instead of job

seems to me that they are just moving away from the whole class>job system

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Originally Posted by SinisterIsBack

some of the QQ in this thread, but really I shouldn't expect anything less. I welcome the new job, especially as a tank roll.

Im stoked that DRK is going to be like EQ's Shadow Knight. Cant wait!!!

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Honestly if Yoshida would announce that he would give billions of cash to every subscriber, half the forum would be raging that we aren't getting SE stocks instead.

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Originally Posted by Balipu

Honestly if Yoshida would announce that he would give billions of cash to every subscriber, half the forum would be raging that we aren't getting SE stocks instead.

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Free cash is only okay if it is laced in powdered drugs and gold, and also has men in dresses printed on it with a signed quote by yoshida stating "I'm so sorry"

lol@all the people QQing about it being a tank.

The original DRK was Cecil. What was he? The tank of the party.

So stoked for 3.0 now. Bring on the badass powerhouse!

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

The original DRK was Cecil. What was he? The tank of the party.

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The original DRK was Leon. What was he? A monstrous DPS class.

Cecil wasnt a tank till he become Paladin. Kain was more tankish than Cecil LOL.

All this crying over Dark Knight being a tank, and all I can think of is DPS insta ques :D

THIS MEANS SAM CAN BE A DPS!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

Which also goes against FF tradition and thus, is a problem.

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FFT broseph.

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

lol@all the people QQing about it being a tank.

The original DRK was Cecil. What was he? The tank of the party.

So stoked for 3.0 now. Bring on the badass powerhouse!

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You really don't know much about that...Cecil didn't tank until he became a paladin

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Cecil_Harvey

%%Cecil Harvey is the main protagonist of Final Fantasy IV, who also appears in the sequel Final Fantasy IV: The After Years, and the interquel Final Fantasy IV -Interlude- that bridges the gap between the two games. Cecil is one of the few characters in the series to change his job during the game, starting out as a Dark Knight, but after a trial and the battle with the first of the Four Elemental Archfiends, transforms into a Paladin.

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Originally Posted by Parz3val

THIS MEANS SAM CAN BE A DPS!!!!!

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Which also goes against FF tradition and thus, is a problem.

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

The original DRK was Leon. What was he? A monstrous DPS class.

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Who's 2nd highest stat was his Stamina.

You are cherry picking very hard, but its not going to change one key detail.

That Dark Knight is a Tank in FF14, and everyones going to be tanking on it! It is unfortunate, you will just have to learn to adapt to this iteration of Dark Tank. :cool: