Alpha Video 6 - Crafting and Gathering~

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Originally Posted by Coyohma

There seems to be a whole lot of people who benefit from 'looting' these trees that SE has laid to waste for our convenience. Are there any drawbacks to such a "system"?

DoL having the option to target what they want is not a big change. You had the option to do so in 1.0. The big change is making it as easy and simple as possible, just click what you want and you're done. What does this mean? It means that more people will gather effectively, lessening any profit from it. Even people who have almost no interest in it can jump in and go at maximum efficiency as there is no system in place. This is bad for people looking to profit from gathering, not good.

If you're gathering to craft, are you crafting to gain EXP or gil? If it's gil, the fact that a higher % of people are gathering more effectively is going to hurt your gains. If it's EXP.. Leves had often become a faster way to do it, and we know quests will be a significant way to level in ARR.

So what are we in favor of exactly? Perhaps speeding up a fragment of DoH EXP, something that is already designed to be very fast.. At the expense of a more complex and robust gathering system and overall economy? I say more complex - that doesn't mean complex, just moreso than the most simple way imaginable to keep gathering in the game at all.

And nevermind the obvious that this kind of loot-gathering requires less sophisticated botting - that'd just be piling on.

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I have to disagree/agree with this because gathering in 1.0 was already easy to get into and not hard to figure out, you just don't have to play the lame mini game anymore. Only thing i agree with is that in 1.0 if you was aiming for ele ore and did not get it you got something else which lead to more money and 2.0 you get nothing if you miss.

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Originally Posted by Coyohma

Gathering in 1.0 wasn't luck, it was probability -just as this video shows its percentages.

What do you think changed in 1.0 when you changed the level (bar) at which you were gathering?

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Probability and luck are, for the purpose of getting a random number generator hit the right number, exactly the same thing.

The less random number generators there are in a game, the better.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Probability and luck are, for the purpose of getting a random number generator hit the right number, exactly the same thing.

The less random number generators there are in a game, the better.

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On the previous page, you said that "profit wouldn't be based on luck (anymore), and that it would remove the element of randomness."

So help me understand. If you have a 76% chance to obtain a specific item as the video showed at one point, no luck is involved. But if it's, say, 40% as you might estimate for a situation in 1.0, then it becomes luck?


Edit - I'll take it the next step. We saw percentages ranging from 72 to 80 in the video. The lower percentages appearing on the higher level tree. It's reasonable to think that the higher the tree level, the more valuable the item, the lower the percentage will be.

Now, explain to me how if you came across a level 50 tree with an item at 40%, how that would differ from a 40% chance of getting an item in 1.0.

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Originally Posted by Coyohma

On the previous page, you said that "profit wouldn't be based on luck (anymore), and that it would remove the element of randomness."

So help me understand. If you have a 76% chance to obtain a specific item as the video showed at one point, no luck is involved. But if it's, say, 40% as you might estimate for a situation in 1.0, then it becomes luck?


Edit - I'll take it the next step. We saw percentages ranging from 72 to 80 in the video. The lower percentages appearing on the higher level tree. It's reasonable to think that the higher the tree level, the more valuable the item, the lower the percentage will be.

Now, explain to me how if you came across a level 50 tree with an item at 40%, how that would differ from a 40% chance of getting an item in 1.0.

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I'm going off what I see on the video. When I'll see low percentages, I'll consider it, but so far the influence of luck seems marginal at best.

Which is good.

Im also glad in gathering you will either get the item you are aiming at or get nothing. Rather not be filling my inventory with stuff I dont want ^^. Good riddense to that.

both 1.0 and ARR involve luck in gathering. As long as the gather success isnt 100%, its luck based. and there is still the HQ rate, which again is luck based.

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Originally Posted by Reika

both 1.0 and ARR involve luck in gathering. As long as the gather success isnt 100%, its luck based. and there is still the HQ rate, which again is luck based.

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Thank you.

Luck is a commentary on what occurs against an expectation. Why Abriael thinks that luck's "influence" changes based on how favorable the probability is, I don't know.

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Originally Posted by Skies

Are you sure you like games, Indira?
I mean, sans the very latest of gaming technology, games have always been about button mashing like that

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i love videogames but people are always making excuses for lame ass shit. even a game like old 80's gauntlet has more to it then FFXIV crafting and thats a button masher.

if i play mario bros. i im pushing button while making sure not to get hit or fall in a pit. im thinking when then i have to push buttons or pushing multiple buttons i have to time a jump making sure i dont miss the moving platform. i play zelda i make sure to look for keys, not get hit, solve puzzle and so on.

even a old nes RPG i had to think about how many step through a menu i had to do an attack or talk to npcs there was some type of feed back to your brain to make you choose. i didnt just sit there mashing a button.

in FFXIV crafting my character sits there i push button(s) and watch a bar grow in about a min. mindless button mashing no form of simple skill not even simple timing you just push a button.
the crafting in FFXIV is horrible one thing i hate about the game i dont care about the success/failure rate the system its self is a pure time sink.

there is NO effort put into that system at all. theres games 10 years old or close to it that have way better systems SWG, fallen earth, eve online just to name a few.

hmm, for real ? Let's talk again when you'll try to do an HQ item, shall we ?

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Originally Posted by indira

in FFXIV crafting my character sits there i push button(s) and watch a bar grow in about a min. mindless button mashing no form of simple skill not even simple timing you just push a button.
the crafting in FFXIV is horrible one thing i hate about the game i dont care about the success/failure rate the system its self is a pure time sink.

there is NO effort put into that system at all. theres games 10 years old or close to it that have way better systems SWG, fallen earth, eve online just to name a few.

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Only if you don't want a HQ item. If you want to make a HQ item, you need to use the right skills to increase your quality bar without the durability bar hit the 0 before the success bar reach 100%.

In other games you just hit a button and then you have the item or not. This I call a mindless crafting system.

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Originally Posted by yukikaze_yanagi

hmm, for real ? Let's talk again when you'll try to do an HQ item, shall we ?

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Originally Posted by Felis

Only if you don't want a HQ item. If you want to make a HQ item, you need to use the right skills to increase your quality bar without the durability bar hit the 0 before the success bar reach 100%.

In other games you just hit a button and then you have the item or not. This I call a mindless crafting system.

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you guys are still making excuses, HQ has never been about anything but luck in FFXIV so far i got tons of HQ randomly just by grinding. i rather hit a button and let it go in auto mode, or hit a button and let something else make it for me while i go do something else.
resident evil on the playstation has a better crafting system then FFXIV.