Bunny outfits for men, not a cryptid!

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Originally Posted by Lilseph

You know, putting a biiiit of effort into it. Alternatively, yeah, the Chippendale's looks generic, if we use the pics posted as a comparison. You can even replicate it. But what about create an outfit for males using THAT outfit as a concept? Then add all the accesories and ornaments you want to make it look more Final Fantasy-ish.

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Well thank you for the clarification...the reason I didn't understand was no one who posted images of chippendales explained anything like that; including your post with the image.

Everyone who posted those images basically said "I wanted it like this" or "I expected this or something like this", but that is so vague...no one clarified something like: "I want something designed using this concept as a base and expanded upon to make it more FFXIV style and unique"

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Originally Posted by Nestama

If they did end up making a male-exclusive Chippendales outfit and it doesn't look that much different to what I've created (which I'm pretty sure is unisex), then I'd be more disappointed about that than I would be with the copy-paste.

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This is all hypothetical. While there are sort of similar items (ribbon especially isn't very close, griffin leather cuffs), they're still not a collar with a bow tie and dress shirt cuffs. The pants could be cut a little lower like goatskin breeches and maybe add a bit of a modest bulge. Want a different bare chest? Add some Gold Saucer-themed arm tattoos or something. I think it's possible to make a Chippendales-esque outfit with some nice and unique items.

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Originally Posted by Miste

Well thank you for the clarification...thereason I didn't understand was no one who posted images of chippendales explained anything like that; including your post with the image.

Everyone who posted those images basically said "I wanted it like this" or "I expected this or something like this", but that is so vague...no one clarified something like: "I want something designed using this concept as a base and expanded upon to make it more FFXIV style and unique"

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welcome to online communications, every one skips out on little details like that expecting people to get the implied meaning, but then end up chewing each others heads off when they do not get it, such as:

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Except this isn't putting words in people's mouth, as it has actually happened already, in theodrics post, which you quoted.

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Lets read again shall we? I will even bold stuff for you

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Originally Posted by Theodric

In other words, you don't really have a stake in the fight or any knowledge of the long string of disappointments where male glamour options are concerned yet you can't help but rush at the chance to make a snide comment. It's very telling that the vast majority of the posters belittling the concerns raised about male glamour options don't even seem to play a male character themselves...at least not as their main character. Interestingly enough, many of those same individuals also post as Au Ra and Miqo'te women - which just so happen to be the two of the more popular and 'fan service' options available where glamour options are concerned.

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So few things here, first off they where stating how a vast majority act, not just yourself, second the fact you feel this was directed at you, you are basically admitting yes you where belittling people that are concerned about male glamor. 3rd, they where not assuming anything as they noted "at least not as their main character" I do not think you have a right to state "I don't usually play miqo actually, I'm normally a hyur." When you are posting on a Miqo'te as far as I remember.

Now I do not think it can be debated that "Au Ra and Miqo'te women - which just so happen to be the two of the more popular and 'fan service' options available where glamour options are concerned." holds true. People just want more options for what they like, males is lacking, and more unique male outfits would be appreciated, not this landslide of female only, or male and female gear, or such as this, male getting copy/pasted female gear. The double standard as you call it, is what people are upset about.

It really just gets old seeing you over and over again posting "can't please everyone" to legitimate concerns.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

People are so unreasonable sometimes...

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You had no reason to post this other then trying to fight with people

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Originally Posted by Lilseph

Answering to you both, a male equivalent would be a remodel using the base design to create something that is appealing for men, not just transfering the whole outfit and stamp them on their bodies.

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No. A male equivalent is what a male equivalent is. It's not what you want the male equivalent to be. If someone would tell me they want an orange, me giving them a tangerine would make them question my intellect. It looks like orange (though smaller), its acidic, it's fruit as well and related to boot...but it's a tangerine.

A male equivalent to a bunny hostess suit is either based on its look (aka. that suit, but wearable by men) or on its function. And yeah...this is how a male equivalent of a hostess looks like.

What you are talking about is a MASCULINE equivalent. Masculine =/= male. Those are two different words with two different meanings. And ironically...a masculine equivalent could be female-only.


So I go back to my earlier post. Did people actually ask for WHAT they want? No. Because they said something that is simply wrong, hoping that the other side will deduce what they want from context. Yeah...no. Sorry, but how they are expected to deduce anything from context if they do NOT have context? This is translated, then is briefed and passes multiple hands. Unless you make CLEAR what you want, aka. a masculine bunny suit for men, you cannot complain about it being different than what you want.

The fault is on those that did not define what they want. It's as simple as that. No amount of shifting blame on Square for not understanding you is going to change the reality that YOU (not you specifically, but those that wanted a "male bunny suit") are the ones that misused the English language in requesting the suit.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

3rd, they where not assuming anything as they noted "at least not as their main character" I do not think you have a right to state "I don't usually play miqo actually, I'm normally a hyur." When you are posting on a Miqo'te as far as I remember.

Now I do not think it can be debated that "Au Ra and Miqo'te women - which just so happen to be the two of the more popular and 'fan service' options available where glamour options are concerned." holds true. People just want more options for what they like, males is lacking, and more unique male outfits would be appreciated, not this landslide of female only, or male and female gear, or such as this, male getting copy/pasted female gear. The double standard as you call it, is what people are upset about.

It really just gets old seeing you over and over again posting "can't please everyone" to legitimate concerns.

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If we go by that logic, how can you have an opinion on Eureka if you only post with a level 60 character? Clearly you haven't done it before, as far as we know!

I was a hyur for years. Just because you have only seen me posting in the last month does not negate those years. In fact, most people who know me are surprised I'm still a Miqo'te, as I have fantasia'd to one many times in the past, and it rarely lasts more than a day before I'm back to hyur.

Can't please everyone is a legitimate thing to say, as no one will ever be happy with everything. You can please some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can never please all of the people all of the time. This is a legit quote and its true.

There is no "landslide" of female only gear. There are actually less than 5 or so sets that are female specific where males do not have an equivalent. There are several sets that are unisex instead of male only, and I agree this is unfair. You are judging based on the topic of males asked for a bunny suit and got one, vs males asked for male specific or less male unisex female only gear. I have NEVER said males should not have equivalent amounts of gender locked gear.

The topic at hand is separate from other topics on the matter. In this case, there were many people asking for the bunny outfit to be available to males as well. They did so, and now other people are unhappy about it, saying they expected something else. I'm pretty sure the dev communication was always "we are working on the male bunny suit" and not "we are working on a new unique male bunny suit."

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Missed the point yet again, why am i not surprised.
red herring (or legitimately did not understand) no idea.

I need to ask though, how? HOW after all those details I gave?

Edit: maybe be a good idea to have your post typed out in full before posting, regardless I am not wasting any more post quota trying to take back what I said to your new edits and posting again.

I guess I can say this though, you may be correct but that line is still out of place, as you keep doing that to subjects no matter what it is asked for, and gets old. Just let people talk what they want changed, we do not need "spam" I guess you can call it, pointing out "can't please everyone" as that does NOTHING to help the topic in general. It is a another bandaid, quick and lazy fix, for once I would like them to show a change with effort behind it, that is all I ask for.

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Your points are very hard to understand. You stated i did not have the right to say i was a hyur. I have every right to state I was a hyur, I have screenshots to prove it.

People literally asked for the male bunny outfit. How is it lazy to give people what they asked for?

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

I do not care, it is off track and off the point, I am not going to ask for such a thing when it does not matter, you taking that statement that literal just shows how much you misunderstood Theodric.

You do not understand because you take things too literally.

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What does this even mean? You say I don't have the right, then you say it doesn't matter to the topic. WHY DID YOU BRING IT UP THEN?!

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

If we go by that logic, how can you have an opinion on Eureka if you only post with a level 60 character? Clearly you haven't done it before, as far as we know!

I was a hyur for years. Just because you have only seen me posting in the last month does not negate those years. In fact, most people who know me are surprised I'm still a Miqo'te, as I have fantasia'd to one many times in the past, and it rarely lasts more than a day before I'm back to hyur.

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Missed the point yet again, why am i not surprised.
red herring (or legitimately did not understand) no idea.

I need to ask though, how? HOW after all those details I gave?

Edit: maybe be a good idea to have your post typed out in full before posting, regardless I am not wasting any more post quota trying to take back what I said to your new edits and posting again.

I guess I can say this though, you may be correct but that line is still out of place (goes back to my reply to Miste ) as you keep doing that to subjects no matter what it is asked for, and gets old. Just let people talk what they want changed, we do not need "spam" I guess you can call it, pointing out "can't please everyone" as that does NOTHING to help the topic in general. (the point that ended up missed why I replied to your first post in the manner I did so) It is a another bandaid, quick and lazy fix, for once I would like them to show a change with effort behind it, that is all I ask for.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Your points are very hard to understand. You stated i did not have the right to say i was a hyur. I have every right to state I was a hyur, I have screenshots to prove it.

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I do not care, it is off track and off the point, I am not going to ask for such a thing when it does not matter, you taking that statement that literal just shows how much you misunderstood Theodric.

You do not understand because you take things too literally.
https://youtu.be/Nui8k152yak

I dont care about the outfit..... I'm just happy I can finally wear bunny ears

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Originally Posted by kikix12

On a different note...Please, people...Stop bringing Chippendales into this...

They have nothing in common with the bunny outfits.

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Actually, not true. Chippendales tried to trademark their custom, but the US Patent office would not give it to them. This went to court and they ruled that the Patent Office did the right thing, because a witness testified Chippendales outfit is based off the Playboy bunny costume, which means the outfit wasn't distinctive to be able to get a trademark. So yes, Chipperndales outfit is the male version of the Bunny Playboy costume.

Maybe I think it's the reason why they took too long make this male version of the bunny suit. Cause they know ppl are going to complain anyway when they ask for it and it comes out what they ask for. What were they expecting, a much more revealing gear set? Is that what the community that complain asking for? I mean at least they got it I guess.

Thank God. Now, everyone can stop asking about them incessantly and move on with their lives.

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Originally Posted by Lilseph

As it is now, it looks like a comedic relief more than anything.

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Because that's how males crossdressing is viewed in japan, as comedy relief or something foolish to not be indulged in for very long (though this is a common trope for many cultures).

Obviously they struggled to make something for men based off the bunny suit and instead went for hey let's just make it a big joke cause they didn't know how to conceptualize a masculine version of the purely feminine outfit. I don't have a dog in this fight so I don't care too much, aside from not looking forward to Ul'dah in the coming months, but it's plain to see they as a team had no clue on how to approach this project. And we can't use previous outfits that show off the male figure as proof of ability since those were based off pre-existing styles.

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Originally Posted by SilverObi

Because that's how males crossdressing is viewed in japan, as comedy relief or something foolish to not be indulged in for very long (though this is a common trope for many cultures).

Obviously they struggled to make something for men based off the bunny suit and instead went for hey let's just make it a big joke cause they didn't know how to conceptualize a masculine version of the purely feminine outfit. I don't have a dog in this fight so I don't care too much, aside from not looking forward to Ul'dah in the coming months, but it's plain to see they as a team had no clue on how to approach this project. And we can't use previous outfits that show off the male figure as proof of ability since those were based off pre-existing styles.

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I don't think they had any intention to make this. Just more of seeing if this would stop a part of the community from asking that question/s.

What is the source on this I don't see it on the lodestone or dev blog.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

What is the source on this I don't see it on the lodestone or dev blog.

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It came from the dev panel at PAX east.

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Originally Posted by Osmond

I don't think they had any intention to make this. Just more of seeing if this would stop a part of the community from asking that question/s.

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Yeah that's the most likely answer to be fair

Cool, can we get better caster glamours for men, now?

https://i.imgur.com/PLTZJRh.gif
I wasn't sure if SE was just going to give us guys a more conservative, generic-looking suit with bunny ears or go for something "chippendale-esque", but I certainly wasn't expecting them to copy/paste the existing outfit.
I don't know, after all these years I thought they were were just stuck on designs and perpetually leaving it on the backburner. Part of me wonders if after a while they said 'screw it' and went with what's already there just to shut everyone up? Especially with their interest in reusing armor this expansion, it wouldn't surprise me.
But you know what? For once I couldn't be happier that they reused assets. I love it! I can't wait to get it and use it for glamour. This is precisely the kind of thing my character would wear for laughs, and honestly I hope SE gives us more stuff to cross dress with.

Hm.... I might wear the tights...

2 years of hard work

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Originally Posted by Fourbestintoner

2 years of hard work

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I mean.... it took them about the same amount of time for egi glamours.... aka carbuncles which were already in the game.

While the outfits being identical to the female versions (other than dem bulges) does bring up the question of "Why did this take so long to implement?", at the end of the day I'm glad they look the same. There's nothing I hate more than trying to set up a glamour and finding out the male version looks completely different from the female version.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the bunny outfit the girls have is WHAT people were requesting?

Unless someone specifically said something else to Yoshi-P?

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Originally Posted by dejiko_san

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the bunny outfit the girls have is WHAT people were requesting?

Unless someone specifically said something else to Yoshi-P?

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It was a 50/50 thing. Half wanted an exact copy and the other half wanted a male equivalent.

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Originally Posted by dejiko_san

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the bunny outfit the girls have is WHAT people were requesting?

Unless someone specifically said something else to Yoshi-P?

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That's what I was thinking, too! :O What do people exactly want here? :<

It almost like they could have made a poll and people could vote about what they want.

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Originally Posted by Soge01

That's what I was thinking, too! :O What do people exactly want here? :<

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Some people are happy with the 1:1 copy.

Most of us are disappointed because we hoped we'd get a unique outfit tailored to highlight masculine sex appeal. Especially with the time it took them to implement it.

We're just getting the girl's leftovers since it's really funny for guys to crossdress like this to many people; actually sexy guys are icky and gross bro. I don't find this sexy like I do on the women, so I am pretty bummed. There will be work-arounds but I care about the principle of the matter.

This will be the best thing of 4.3 The New Age of Stripes

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Originally Posted by Hestzhyen

Some people are happy with the 1:1 copy.

Most of us are disappointed because we hoped we'd get a unique outfit tailored to highlight masculine sex appeal. Especially with the time it took them to implement it.

We're just getting the girl's leftovers since it's really funny for guys to crossdress like this to many people; actually sexy guys are icky and gross bro. I don't find this sexy like I do on the women, so I am pretty bummed. There will be work-arounds but I care about the principle of the matter.

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Ahhh, I see what you mean now! Yeah, it would've been nice to see male exclusive bunny outfit made for them. Like, an open best with Speedos or short shorts with a simple bowtie or short the around the neck. I'd play a male if there was an outfit like that! :D

On these forums at least, I don't remember seeing a single person requesting a more masculine version. Every single time they either specified wanting the same exact one females had or they only said "bunny suit" which is 100% open to interpretation and any reasonable person would rightfully assume they're requesting the female one.

Sorry if this has already been brought up, but I'm not reading all 15 pages of "I like it," "I hate it" or "It's not what I envisioned" to see if it was mentioned yet:

Game watch interview with Yoshi-P bunny suit bit (in conversation about Edda's dress):

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A. ...At the moment we are working to get rid of the gender lock for bunny suits for men.

Q. So men and women are going to be able to equip it?

A. Yes. The NA community had an especially high demand so we thought we should do it. Our female staff is putting hard work into creating it.

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Aside from this, I don't recall any other official word on what was going on with the male bunny suits, but it was never stated here that the male version would be something original and different from the females. Removing a "gender lock" sounds more akin to keeping the original style.

But what I do take from that interview was apparently a big contributing factor for the length of time it took was they delegated it to only their female staff instead of the whole team to work on.

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Originally Posted by Cidel

Sorry if this has already been brought up, but I'm not reading all 15 pages of "I like it," "I hate it" or "It's not what I envisioned" to see if it was mentioned yet:

Game watch interview with Yoshi-P bunny suit bit (in conversation about Edda's dress):

Aside from this, I don't recall any other official word on what was going on with the male bunny suits, but it was never stated here that the male version would be something original and different from the females. Removing a "gender lock" sounds more akin to keeping the original style.

But what I do take from that interview was apparently a big contributing factor for the length of time it took was they delegated it to only their female staff instead of the whole team to work on.

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Yeah, nothing official was ever really stated as to the how, but the way they worded it at points could have been interpreted as it potentially resulting in something different than the original design. That and it took a pretty long time for what was essentially a matter of putting the exact same thing on the opposite gender...I can see how it rubbed some people the wrong way.

Tbh, I never really had an interest or care about this to begin with. I'm just glad it's over and done with so now we don't have to hear about it during panels where more important things should be brought up (seriously, whenever I heard someone bring that up last time I died a little inside. Yoshi P also didn't seem to be in the mood to address that either)...but I can see both sides of this, as I've said earlier in this thread.

I'm pretty sure that Yoshi and the devs wanted to get it out of the way so people would stop asking, and people DID ask for some gender equality in gear. Can't ask for much more than a copy/paste solution I suppose.

I was thinking... For a now masculine look, equip the bunny ears, wear no shirt, wear those male swimsuit shorts, moogle knecktie? And you can look like a male stripper. my point is, that there's allot of options for glamour in this game to make your own sexy male stripper. Aside from that, is genderlocked which I think it's really cool for people to express their male character in a genderfuild way or expression.

Meh. I personally don't have a problem with it. My Roe is ready to rock some fishnets.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DIN8k0QUEAEimpp.jpg

I don’t mind either.
.....so.... when are we getting it?

Well grats to those who were asking for it but... what I was hoping for was a Chippendale type outfit, rather than this, which I consider lazy and indicative of their overall stance to more masculine glamours. It could still be achieved through customisation, I guess. I suppose for the guys who wanted some girly options for guys though it works.

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Originally Posted by Cidel

Sorry if this has already been brought up, but I'm not reading all 15 pages of "I like it," "I hate it" or "It's not what I envisioned" to see if it was mentioned yet:

Game watch interview with Yoshi-P bunny suit bit (in conversation about Edda's dress):

Aside from this, I don't recall any other official word on what was going on with the male bunny suits, but it was never stated here that the male version would be something original and different from the females. Removing a "gender lock" sounds more akin to keeping the original style.

But what I do take from that interview was apparently a big contributing factor for the length of time it took was they delegated it to only their female staff instead of the whole team to work on.

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That's pretty bizarre. Why leave it just to their female staff?

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Originally Posted by Jkap_Goat

I was thinking... For a now masculine look, equip the bunny ears, wear no shirt, wear those male swimsuit shorts, moogle knecktie? And you can look like a male stripper. my point is, that there's allot of options for glamour in this game to make your own sexy male stripper. Aside from that, is genderlocked which I think it's really cool for people to express their male character in a genderfuild way or expression.

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Crossdressing*

I've revised my stance on gender locks, though. It'd be better if the outfits simply had a masculine/feminine option, and you get to pick how it displays on your char, but this would be a lot more work for the devs. On the other hand, the game has a relatively high sub fee, has a cash shop and charges full price for the game itself, so the excuses for dev laziness are beginning to wear increasingly thin on a number of fronts, compounded by the amount of money poured into dead ends, like Diadem or the very broken Rival Wings, or the rather bare bones Eureka. They're also following the same formula as they did in HW, for SB, so it's not like they're bringing in huge innovations, so where is all this money going? Cross-subsidising other brands? Not a good thing. The game also isn't as hard to design outfits for as, say, WoW, which suffers from more outdated tech and therefore requires more granular manipulation.

Also this "there's options" thing is getting a bit trite. Yes, there are, but why should it be a case of having to mix and match - sometimes imperfectly - for masculine glams, whereas well coordinated feminine ones are often delivered in one piece? And by "feminine" I mean exclusive female gender-locked ones, which are only sometimes unlocked - as they are - for males.

I find their overall stance lazy and I am growing rather bored of it.

I am not sure how I feel about this. Like, just having the exact same models but wearable by males was pretty much my bare minimum acceptable solution, so this really isn't ideal, but on the other hand, given SE's track record with male glams I was honestly expecting to get generic recycled pant model #4875, so I'm somehow both disappointed and relieved at the same time.

It does beg the question of how they can bear to release an item like this, with fishnets under a thong, for males when they couldn't manage to reign in their disgust enough to allow males to wear a relatively modest pair of jean shorts, though. Is that the next fight? Campaigning for more variety in pants options and some decent shorts that aren't class-locked?

I have a lot of other thoughts about how misleading the information we were given about the development of the male version was, and how long it took to make slightly less than half a set when they managed to churn out 2-3 female-exclusive sets in the same time, but I think most of them have been covered a few times in this thread so I'm gonna let it go for now.

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Originally Posted by Lukha

It does beg the question of how they can bear to release an item like this, with fishnets under a thong, for males when they couldn't manage to reign in their disgust enough to allow males to wear a relatively modest pair of jean shorts, though. Is that the next fight? Campaigning for more variety in pants options and some decent shorts that aren't class-locked?

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Maybe they're hoping it'll be so obviously awful that people will never ask for it again lol

Things like this irritates me about this community. I just don't get it...

You preach and demanded for bunny suits for two years and when you finally get it, you complain that it's not different enough? I mean, isn't this what you guys wanted?

If they made a Thav Dress and Wedding Dress for males are you going to complain it's not different enough as well?

Seriously, this is a victory in the right direction. This proves that the devs heard your call. But complaining like this is going to make the devs feel like you guys are ungrateful and why bother with other requests. Sorry, but coding doesn't work like (check box male availability and it'll magically snap on). They have to make outfits from scratch to fit the different sizes of the genders. The suit for female Au Ra won't just magically scale to male Au Ra.

Arguments about lazy designs and having to wait are irrelevant when this is EXACTLY what was requested. It probably took so long so that they could enable the option for players who already own the female version can fantasia to male and not have to repurchase a separate version of it, along with the fact that they had better things to do than to work on a glamour that a small minority of the community even want's to wear. Which is why it was on a low priority list to begin with.

You guys should be happy that you finally got something you fought two years for. To me, this just proves that those complaining just wanted to be snow flakes all along and didn't truly want equality.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Maybe they're hoping it'll be so obviously awful that people will never ask for it again lol

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Well, the issue now is that they've proven in the past to be rather selective about feedback. Some people will cheer this on and request more similar items in the future. Those of us who request things like additional facial hair options, meanwhile, will likely continue to be without a meaningful voice.