Requesting Information on Jobs: Preparing for 1.21

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

I suppose it's a good point.

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Thanks man, that helped a whole lot.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Aww, missing out on a lot of awesome stuff!

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Normal-sized posts I can deal with so I read anything that doesn't fill the page completely.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Aww, missing out on a lot of awesome stuff!

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Mostly more migraines for other, content related reasons =P

where did they say classes were planned for patches?

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Originally Posted by Albela_Killingifritcom

where did they say classes were planned for patches?

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More importantly, has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

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Originally Posted by Albela_Killingifritcom

where did they say classes were planned for patches?

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Oh good, now I can ignore you.

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Originally Posted by Zeref

More importantly,
Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

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how is this related to anything?

Guys, seriously...

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Guys, seriously...

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Sorry, back on topic. :)

ITT:gender is serious business.

My question....what's stopping SE from taking everything they are doing with jobs and just use them on classes and introduce new classes to represent the jobs that don't natrually transfer/translate/relate to the classes we have...?

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Originally Posted by Allistar

My question....what's stopping SE from taking everything they are doing with jobs and just use them on classes and introduce new classes to represent the jobs that don't natrually transfer/translate/relate to the classes we have...?

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Why do that when they can just release the Job system which comes with it's own skill set and Job Specific armor and accompanying quests? I'm guessing you asked this because you don't want to grind, which is cool, but the job system is more than just to give an identity to things.

The main purpose is for party based content and to give some sense of definition -- just adding it to classes won't lead to definition, because for example a conjurer, while is still a healer can also still nuke within it's control of elements -- a White Mage however will have a higher more specified focus on healing which means being a WHM you'll be more in line with healing than a conjurer is which is in line with nuking and healing, especially for solo but for party play you'll wanna be your WHM rather than CNJ.

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Originally Posted by Zeref

I hardly see any other reason to have two pages of "omg hugzzz" posts after someone says they're a woman.

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It's called friendly banter. There wasn't a single post that called for your outburst, and honestly it made them look more grown-up than you.

Note to self: Never group with Zeref Titania. Seems like his nickers are twisted a bit too tight. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Guys, seriously...

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New rule, yout not allowed to post if your sig takes up 10 X the page area as your post does.........silly donkey knights.

Dunno if it has been asked but, Will artifact armour be meldable? Are we going to have to choose between looking cool or having good stats and materia?

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Originally Posted by Coglin

New rule, yout not allowed to post if your sig takes up 10 X the page area as your post does.........silly donkey knights.

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Silly Coggy coming into my thread and telling me I can't post. Thank you for that amazing contribution.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Silly Coggy coming into my thread and telling me I can't post. Thank you for that amazing contribution.

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Glad I could help. I figured it was about as topic related as 10 of the 14 pages of this thread.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Glad I could help. I figured it was about as topic related as 10 of the 14 pages of this thread.

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Actually, looking back just now about 10/14 of the pages in this thread are actually more or less on topic, with about 4 pages or so off-topic... but I digress. No use in adding to a problem.

Honestly im not too impressed with the "new jobs". All they are is a quest with a fancy class title. No different than what we already have. Kinda boring.

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Originally Posted by Flower

Honestly im not too impressed with the "new jobs". All they are is a quest with a fancy class title. No different than what we already have. Kinda boring.

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how so? Most of them have abilities or spells that are not in the game, how is that not different?

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Originally Posted by Flower

Honestly im not too impressed with the "new jobs". All they are is a quest with a fancy class title. No different than what we already have. Kinda boring.

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Even though I find the little bit we already know about jobs to be quite exciting, to each his own I guess. Let's just not forget we've only been made privy to the tip of the iceberg.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

how so? Most of them have abilities or spells that are not in the game, how is that not different?

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The only class I can see being any different than what we have now is Bard. Sure they add a few new skills, but we will still be stuck with the same classes we started the game with. Aside from structure changes and a few skills here and there I dont see how its going to be much different.

While I understand that just getting 5 new abilities might not look like a massive difference to some, I can not wait to become a White Mage. The jobs are about focus and yes, it is only 5 abilities now but some day there will be a level cap raise that might bring a bunch of new goodies.

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Originally Posted by Yelta_Sumasu

While I agree that just getting 5 new abilities might not look like a massive difference to some, I can not wait to become a White Mage. The jobs are about focus and yes, it is only 5 abilities now but some day there will be a level cap raise that might bring a bunch of new goodies.

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I just wish they would add new weapon classes :( and not "titles". I dont understand the point of "jobs" vs adding new "classes". I do like white mage tho, and bard. At least Bard is going to be fun :).

It is them trying to satisfy both those who wanted class definition and those who want class freedom. With the class/job structure they can do both. I hope they add several new classes and jobs and I would also like them to break away from 1 class = 1 job where it makes sense to do so.

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Originally Posted by Yelta_Sumasu

It is them trying to satisfy both those who wanted class definition and those who want class freedom. With the class/job structure they can do both. I hope they add several new classes and jobs and I would also like them to break away from 1 class = 1 job where it makes sense to do so.

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Glad you brought it up. They mentioned plans for this, however much down the line it may be, back when they first announced details of the job system. The example given was CNJ + THM = RDM.

There's no doubt that the flexibility is there since they'll be requiring more than a single class to be ranked even for the first set of jobs. They can easily make more jobs unlocked via the same main classes with different sub classes. Even jobs that require two or more classes at an equally high level.

Lots of exciting possibilities! Hopefully they take advantage of the potential.

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Originally Posted by Flower

I just wish they would add new weapon classes :( and not "titles". I dont understand the point of "jobs" vs adding new "classes". I do like white mage tho, and bard. At least Bard is going to be fun :).

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The "point" of jobs is, as I see it, being implimented to suit a very very large demand for it by posters. Perhaps because you were not one calling for it, it was not meant for you to understand, at least not so much as those it was implimented for. Jos tend to be a tradition in FF as a whole. So all in all, I guess the point is it had heavy demand and it is tradition.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

New rule, yout not allowed to post if your sig takes up 10 X the page area as your post does.........silly donkey knights.

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I believe they're going to be same as other u/u gear.


There was mention of Job-specific gear outside the AF gear, are Crafters going to be able to make these or will these be quest/npc obtainable?

And can a job use its pre-requisite class weapons without reverting to that class?

These are the things I want to know, because I might not necessarily feel inclined to deck out my Gladiator, Lancer, and Paladin if I'll have to replace all their gear a couple weeks from now.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Glad you brought it up. They mentioned plans for this, however much down the line it may be, back when they first announced details of the job system. The example given was CNJ + THM = RDM.

There's no doubt that the flexibility is there since they'll be requiring more than a single class to be ranked even for the first set of jobs. They can easily make more jobs unlocked via the same main classes with different sub classes. Even jobs that require two or more classes at an equally high level.

Lots of exciting possibilities! Hopefully they take advantage of the potential.

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I just hope that they make different jobs with the classes we have now. I'd like to see a DD gladiator or nuking conjurer job

What you just stated is basically what I'm thinking they should do...if cnj is more akin to whm then make it so even if they can nuke some it's no where near the potency of thm...and if thm is kin to blm then do likewise...with the changes that came with 1.20 they might as well just incorporate everything into one...all the classes do well in party play...dungeons and ifrit and moogle stand as my witnesses...

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Originally Posted by Allistar

What you just stated is basically what I'm thinking they should do...if cnj is more akin to whm then make it so even if they can nuke some it's no where near the potency of thm...and if thm is kin to blm then do likewise...with the changes that came with 1.20 they might as well just incorporate everything into one...all the classes do well in party play...dungeons and ifrit and moogle stand as my witnesses...

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When means Jobs, being more specialized, will do even better for party based content -- confirming what Yoshida wants to do with Jobs versus Classes.

Just seems redundant...weapon specialization=classes, jobs=role specialization...but guess what...we already put classes into role specializations...gla is our default tank, mrd is dd/back up tank, thm is our caster dd, cnj healer/back up caster dd...so if we alrdy do it...what will jobs do that would be any different...all SE needs to do is add those abilities they were going to use for jobs to classes and leave everything else the same and we are set...

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Just seems redundant...weapon specialization=classes, jobs=role specialization...but guess what...we already put classes into role specializations...gla is our default tank, mrd is dd/back up tank, thm is our caster dd, cnj healer/back up caster dd...so if we alrdy do it...what will jobs do that would be any different...all SE needs to do is add those abilities they were going to use for jobs to classes and leave everything else the same and we are set...

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Players put them into the roles, not SE. What SE wanted to do was basically allow for classes to be the flexible ones while jobs were the specialized ones. Weapon = Classes was a mistake to begin with, though. In FFXI for example RDM could use Staff, Dagger, Club, Sword and even Crossbows, likewise a Paladin could use Sword, some Daggers, Staff, Club and Bows.

It basically limits what can be done class/job wise because Gladiator for example can use Daggers which is an iconic weapon of assassin type classes. (Dancer, Thief, Rogue etc.)

It's easiest to think of classes as proficiency with a type of weapon alone. A class is very general and can be shaped into a variety of roles by cross-classing the proper skills.

A job is more of a declaration of what role you will be playing in a party. It is a profession towards which you devote your weapon proficiency. The quests I expect will be quite heavy in lore that will have you learning the secrets of the job you are working towards.

I imagine the way these two systems work so effectively as layers of the armory system will become more apparent with their release and even more so when more jobs branching from the same classes are added.

Its not a perfect system...sure there needs to changes but there is still nothing wrong with the classes being put into roles by us...we know what we need when we need it...

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Its not a perfect system...sure there needs to changes but there is still nothing wrong with the classes being put into roles by us...we know what we need when we need it...

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With classes as they are no matter how many class you level and skills you get there still isn't a very unique feel between them. Felxibility + uniqueness just don't go hand in hand. This two-layered idea gives players the best of both worlds.

I hope it does...I want nothing more than for this game to succeed...

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Players put them into the roles, not SE. What SE wanted to do was basically allow for classes to be the flexible ones while jobs were the specialized ones. Weapon = Classes was a mistake to begin with, though. In FFXI for example RDM could use Staff, Dagger, Club, Sword and even Crossbows, likewise a Paladin could use Sword, some Daggers, Staff, Club and Bows.

It basically limits what can be done class/job wise because Gladiator for example can use Daggers which is an iconic weapon of assassin type classes. (Dancer, Thief, Rogue etc.)

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In my opinion it would make a lot of things simpler if SE made Classes change into Jobs as a class advancement, making each job overwrite the corresponding class, rather than tacking on another system on top of an already cumbersome armory system.

I understand Jobs level through quest, but if a Job was made to be a class advancement you could still level as you would usually, but still get all the other benefits like the gear and skills through quests as you do now.

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Originally Posted by Zeref

In my opinion it would make a lot of things simpler if SE made Classes change into Jobs as a class advancement, making each job overwrite the corresponding class, rather than tacking on another system on top of an already cumbersome armory system.

I understand Jobs level through quest, but if a Job was made to be a class advancement you could still level as you would usually, but still get all the other benefits like the gear and skills through quests as you do now.

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Then you're missing the entire point.

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Originally Posted by Zeref

In my opinion it would make a lot of things simpler if SE made Classes change into Jobs as a class advancement, making each job overwrite the corresponding class, rather than tacking on another system on top of an already cumbersome armory system.

I understand Jobs level through quest, but if a Job was made to be a class advancement you could still level as you would usually, but still get all the other benefits like the gear and skills through quests as you do now.

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As Noctis said, that would undermine the point of adding Jobs, which is to make you good in a party setting at the cost of flexibility.

Basically, because SE is using the "change classes at any time" route on this game like Phantasy Star Universe/Phantasy Star Online 2, they wanted to still have a way to make "defined" roles without forcing you to stay as one class the whole game, as in games like Aion/Tera/etc. So they did this.

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Originally Posted by AlphaDragoon

As Noctis said, that would undermine the point of adding Jobs, which is to make you good in a party setting at the cost of flexibility.

Basically, because SE is using the "change classes at any time" route on this game like Phantasy Star Universe/Phantasy Star Online 2, they wanted to still have a way to make "defined" roles without forcing you to stay as one class the whole game, as in games like Aion/Tera/etc. So they did this.

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re-read what you wrote...we're not forced to stay as one class...we can switch and change any time we want...we can define the classes as we need...