Whether it's the right time to charge or not...
Eventually they had to reach a point of "charge or shut down". They've probably reached that.
And assuming TOR is a resounding success... how successful is it likely to be in Japan? or China?
Not the time to charge, cya in 2013...
Printable View
-
10-15-2011, 08:00 AMLerris
-
10-15-2011, 08:12 AMAlexNiculaieAnd that feedback would be nigh useless. Consultants are expected to know what they are talking about. No-one wants the opinion of a clueless nutjob who's pulling statements out of his ass. If you think SE or any company would care what your opinion is if you haven't even tried the content in question, you are delusional.Quote:
you got me on a technicality but I believe my point still stands. I can still log on and provide feedback without experienceing highlevel content. I should have specified in my earlier post that I was talking about high level and specific content.
-
10-15-2011, 08:14 AMExniInb4 ninja edit.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
See DEV's!! Forum violation!! OP just gave you an excuse!
Btw... we are sticking around. Or have you not noticed that even on day 1 the initial 'shock and awe' reaction on all the polls shows the majority will be sticking around. You are in the dwindling minority.. -
10-15-2011, 09:25 AMAamesxDavidNo, it doesn't. I don't care if you were talking about high-level content in that specific quote or not - you were saying that you don't need to experience content to know what it's like and whether it's worth playing. Your opinion of content is based on what other people who have actually played it say about it. That's not a technicality, it destroys your entire point.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
You may be able to provide feedback on the miniscule amount of content that you actually bother to experience. I mean, what are you calling "high-level content" anyway? Anything above level 15? You can get that on your first day.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
You call this a beta, but you're not willing to beta-test content, even when it's free. So now that they're charging, you make a big fuss?
But you know what? I understand your position on experiencing content. You want to wait until everything has been polished and the game plays the way it was meant to. That's totally understandable. Problem is, you gotta wait then. Like it or not, the more content you play, the better idea you have of how each piece of the game fits into the whole. I could review a book having only read the first page, but no one would care to hear what I have to say about it - and rightfully so. If you want to wait until everything is fixed before you play, then wait. It's not as if the little bit of content you'd be able to give feedback on won't be covered by the thousands of other players who have experienced more of the game than you have. And making a thread saying "I'm not paying, bye" does nothing to change that. -
10-15-2011, 10:13 AMChainYes, we need to flood this forum with this to get the message across.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaida
-
10-15-2011, 11:41 AMAlexNiculaieWhat message, that a minority of players on these forums are whiners, and/or dissatisfied with the condition of the game?Quote:
Yes, we need to flood this forum with this to get the message across.
-
10-15-2011, 11:43 AMIsaaruI like to call it the "loud minority"Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNiculaie
-
10-15-2011, 11:53 AMLavani
Hey guys, I know the game is still in alpha, but we should definitely pay them for it. How else will they develop better games?
-
10-15-2011, 12:16 PMDragonlord
I have been supporting this game since beta, and still do, but charging for a game that is 50% complete makes no sesne. CEO of SE admiited the game was released a huge disaster.
If u havent read yet, here is the link.
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/09/28/sq...damaged-brand/ -
10-15-2011, 12:34 PMMrLion
lol no one cares about you OP...feel free to leave and never come back. And yes even if you come here to see posts no one would care because you're not posting on the forums...
-
10-15-2011, 12:53 PMGaoWell no one is forcing you to pay for it... i mean if you dont want to pay why don't you just not play the game? I really don't think telling people about for example - "I hope you guy's read this and that I make you change your minds to not pay to play this incomplete game" Should effect people's decision. Doesn't people have the right to choose to pay or not without anyone else telling others what they should do?Quote:
Originally Posted by December
-
10-15-2011, 01:31 PMFocant
I have a feeling most people have already made up their minds about what they're going to do. Those who want to stay will stay and those who want to leave will leave. It's fine to share your displeasure about the game going pay to play but it won't change anyone's decision to be honest. It's also hardly a "bad idea" for SE to be doing this. What's the worst that will happen? They lose a chunk of the non-paying playerbase? Even one person staying behind will net them more money than this game has in the past year, and with the re-release in 2013 they don't really need to worry about high player populations between now and then. With v2.0 they have an opportunity to bring in new and old players with an almost entirely new game, and I doubt many of them will know of or care that SE started charging for the game at the end of 2011.
Having players leave sucks. It's never fun to have a game you care about take a hit to population or be divided so heavily. That being said though, I don't think it will ultimately do anything harmful considering the huge reboot that will take place a little over a year from now. I'll be sticking with XIV until then, and I hope all of you that do leave will come back and give the game a shot again once 2.0 launches. -
10-15-2011, 01:38 PMXxOstiaxXHave you sat down and think about the precedent that this sets ? If they are successful(Wish imo they wont be) with this, it will set a new standard of "Here are a few concept arts of what will be our game, now here is the beta, pay a monthly fee and we will hope to give you the game in the pictures by this # time frame"Quote:
Originally Posted by Gao
-
10-15-2011, 01:57 PMDecemberi don't mind waiting. I've been waiting since 2010. And yes, I log into the game but i don't really do much except run around. I look at shop prices, I check the market wards, I see how bad the server - client lag is. I check to see how the combat has changed (even if it is level 15). It still gives a really good idea about how the general basics work in FFXIV (which are their -main- problems). I don't need to level and see how the monster strongholds work, or how much EXP the leve's give. I do want to save my experiences in FFXIV for when it's actually good. I do not want to level up just to be higher than everyone else once 2.0 hits.Quote:
But you know what? I understand your position on experiencing content. You want to wait until everything has been polished and the game plays the way it was meant to. That's totally understandable. Problem is, you gotta wait then. Like it or not, the more content you play, the better idea you have of how each piece of the game fits into the whole. I could review a book having only read the first page, but no one would care to hear what I have to say about it - and rightfully so. If you want to wait until everything is fixed before you play, then wait. It's not as if the little bit of content you'd be able to give feedback on won't be covered by the thousands of other players who have experienced more of the game than you have. And making a thread saying "I'm not paying, bye" does nothing to change that.
Bottom line still stands. You guys are just 'fanboy' enough to pay SE to test their content for them. They are counting on you to make sure their relaunch goes better than their first launch. This MMORPG now depends on this relaunch more than anything. It doesn't matter how much money they make each month in this coming year... if the relaunch does not deliver (and in a timely manner) FFXIV is going to flat out flop. Why are you paying them? They messed up. You should not have to pay for that. Charge us when the relaunch happens SE. Do not charge us to help pave the way for your relaunch. -
10-15-2011, 02:01 PMBearforceto the op, why do you care if they pay from thier own wallet? pretty sure investors will be coming to invest on a game based on whiteknights/fanboys pay subs because they are the largest player base in the [SIZE="7"]world[/SIZE]Quote:
Originally Posted by December
-
10-15-2011, 02:04 PMDecemberI'm not sure where you are getting the larget player base in world stuff from... but anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearforce
If we allow SE to charge us to play a beta (there is no arguing that we are still in BETA phase of FFXIV) then we are rewarding failure. SE deserves to fail. They deserve to eat revenue in order to fix their mistakes. Charge us for the finished game. Do not charge us to play-test for you. -
10-15-2011, 02:07 PMhideaki
dont ven come back 2013, ffxiv doent need player like u
just quit -
10-15-2011, 02:09 PMDecemberRead the entire forum before you arrogantly bring this hateful bullshit in here.Quote:
Originally Posted by hideaki
-
10-15-2011, 02:52 PMGao
I understand what you mean, and to me I think you put up a valid statement and I can't think of anything to counter argue what you said because I can't come up with my own valid argument^^ but... I also thought when I saw 2.0 was "Why the heck didn't we get this when XIV came out? Why did I spend money on a game that clearly isn't playable... Heck I'm one of those people whose going to not play this game because the game is not worth the fee to me.
What I was trying to get with my post is that there are people that think "It's no use trying to get people to follow what you tell them to do, because you're just one person and no one really cares what you think. I'll do what I want" Sure you might get people but that doesn't mean that a whole lot of other people will follow. All that you're doing is making another post about the SAME topic that has already been discussed plenty of times and people already gave their answers... Some will leave till 2.0 comes out (Me included) and some will actually pay.
P.S. I know i'm being hypocritical with me saying it's useless to tell people what to do...so why am i doing the same thing? I'm not trying to tell you guys "Hey stop doing this or that" I'm just saying what my opinion of the matter is. Which is exactly why I wont argue back... it's your guys' opinion and not mine your free on what you want to say. -
10-15-2011, 02:56 PMDecemberIt was only really announced what, today, yesterday? These debates are just now starting bigtime because the announcement was just made. i will continue to be vocal about this for a while because I feel I can get the attention of the higher ups. If anything, i can educate people just enough to make them -not- pay for this game every month. Shame on SE for dangling content in our faces and saying, "hey, the game will be done in 2012/2013, time to pay!"...Quote:
Originally Posted by Gao
-
10-15-2011, 03:13 PMAmyRaeIt's a fair sentiment, but it's not going to change anyone's mind, I'm afraid. The people who really like the game will continue to pay for it, and those who don't won't. It would seem SE needs the money more than your gratuitous participation for now. But it really comes down to the PS3 release no matter what.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
-
10-15-2011, 03:13 PMFestAkos
Because we know what 1.20 entails(you know, the patch that will coincide with the monthly fee).
-
10-15-2011, 03:31 PMMackizar
I only partially read through the entire thread, but I get the jist.
My take on it is this; Yeah yeah, in a market where it's flooded with freemium games poppin' up like weeds, it's easy for people to feel entitled and In all honesty, there's a TINY shred, a slight glimmer of truth behind the OP's post, albeit he worded it poorly. However the truth is in that there is a large percentage of players who feel this way, and it's up to SE to give them a reason to stay.
On the flip side, I'm not only going to be paying for a service that I enjoy with my friends, but I'm going to pay them to be a part of MMO history. I have every ounce of confidence in this reboot, and not only has Yoshi P and the team gone through grueling lengths to fix what was already in place and add new stuff, but it's the level of transparency, and the open communication with the player base that excites me.
When they announce a change, they ask our opinions and for feedback. If something can or wont work, they provide us with detailed, often technical engine limiting explanations as to why. This level of openness and trust in an audience is unparalleled in this market.
ANOTHER fact to consider is that while Wow, Rift, and other 'AAA' games are western, and ported over to Asia, this is the reverse side of that. It is doing, and will do amazing in japan, and all of Asia, and with all 2.0's changes it will be the most western (accessible/polished/casual-X-hardcore blended) game of the genre out of an Asian studio, which means they will have more US players than any other Asian MMO most likely.
In closing, I'm paying because I have fun, I'm paying because my voice is heard, I'm paying because I like the relationship Yoshi's team has worked hard to develop with me, and I'm paying to be a part of something amazing.
Cheers! -
10-15-2011, 03:37 PMKailea_Nagisayou still sound like a crying baby....sorry but you do, The game got off to a bad start, but it is under new management now and is improving with each patch, and this new "rise to 2.0" is very promising, my others and I as well, are willing to take this gamble, and see what Yoshi can really do. If you don't want to that is fine, but don't come in here and call us names or saying that our choice is stupid, just so you can "get SE less money"Quote:
Originally Posted by December
This is not about money anymore, it is about helping resurrect a dying game. I have played FF games since my NES days, and even though I don't like everything that FFXIV is, I don't want to see it die a shameless death.
shame on SE? no shame on you for being so childish and low, really.... "fanboy" like I have not heard that 50k+ times in my gaming life, what does that word even mean anymore..... nothing really, it is used way to much for the stupidest of reasons.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
Many of us disagree with your "opinion" so we are fanboys, what ever word you want to use, it does not change the fact that all you are trying to do (and failing hard) is to hurt an already wounded game. -
10-15-2011, 03:44 PMAmyRaeI don't think if you don't want to pay a subscription that you're an "ungrateful a-hole." For some people, they don't think it's a good value for their money, and that's perfectly acceptable.Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang
Now griping that the game should be kept free because they feel entitled to even more free months is probably going too far. -
10-15-2011, 03:55 PMBearforce
Quote Originally Posted by December View Post
it may have come off as childish. I just think that a fail-game deserves to fail. If they want to try and make it up to us as players, and make the game better, I am all for it. I just won't be paying them to fix mistakes.
failed to read what you quote do you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kailea_Nagisa
-
10-15-2011, 03:55 PMkaiyouske
It's simple really. People that don't think the service is good enough will not pay and people that are enjoying themselves of course, will pay. If you like it, pay. If not, then don't.
Personally I would not have started charging until version 2.0 came out.
I understand that Squeenix wanted to let the players know what the pipeline is down the road, but by announcing it and the start of the monthly fees together the pipeline sort of got lost in translation. You are basically saying 'we're only half done with our game but you have to pay for it anyways' whereas if you just announce the fees first and patches as they come out, people would be more like 'oh look cool the game is getting better!'.
Me? I'll be waiting for the 2.0 free trial and decide from there. Hopefully I won't be too busy with The Old Republic and Diablo 3 by then. -
10-15-2011, 04:09 PMFromZanarkand
Great post. Totally agree.
Here's what it comes down to. Sure I want to see this game succeed. I purchased the Collector's Edition day 1 and have since kept up with the game's progress. People hate and hate on the game but I remain loyal and even defend SE. But going pay to play right now is the WORST decision SE could possibly make.
SE is putting in the money and effort they should be putting in regardless. If SE would have done it right and waited two years on a release we wouldnt even be playing right now - Theyd still be putting in the SAME money without subscription fees. But they didn't wait. They messed up and we are currently playing a version of the game that, as of today, was announced to soon be obsolete. So basically we are to be paying a fee for THEIR mistake of releasing too early? Not to mention that a lot of the common sense features that make up the most basic of MMOs are being saved till 2.0. Oh and The Old Republic comes out the same time this game becomes pay to play. (And I've played the Old Republic beta and it's awesome! It's everything FFXIV was meant to be: The ultimate story driven rpg/MMO hybrid)
So basically SE is telling me that, come Nov/Dec, I have to choose between paying for a FFXIV version that is unfinished and ultimately doomed or a finished brand spankin new MMO like the Old Republic. See ya in a year FFXIV. -
10-15-2011, 10:14 PMKuraiOk well first off, technically its not a beta (even if we all treat it like one)Quote:
Originally Posted by December
And second, "they" being SE own the servers and all the server side software, they have every right to charge if they wish.
i am sick of all the trolls on this site!! -
10-15-2011, 10:17 PMJackDanielsCalling people trolls is an act of trolling. I'm sick of all the trolls crying 'troll'!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurai
-
10-15-2011, 10:39 PMKailea_Nagisa
People need to put blame where blame is due, it is not really SE's fault as a whole, nor is it Yoshida and the new team, you can place all your blame sqaure on Tanaka's head.
-
10-15-2011, 10:43 PMDecember
People please don't come in here suggesting I just want a free game because I feel entitled. You obviously haven't read what I said.
Also, I have already placed the definition of troll here. Someone who disagrees with you is not a troll.
I'll repeat the bottom line once again so people don't stray from the topic with their "byebye-qq" crap.
FFXIV in it's current state is not a finished product. it is their fault the game sucks. They should have never released it. 2.0 is their new finished product. We know this, because it's a relaunch of the game. We all knew that PS3 was going to be their relaunch. Everything depends on their relaunch. If you want to stay and be beta testers that's fine. a lot of us are smart enough that we know we are doing FFXIV Developers a favor by staying here and playing. I won't pay to beta test. I will be back, and happily paying, for the finished relaunch of the game.
If I follow your logic _"MMORPGs are always changing, always releasing patches, this is no different"_ Then we should have been paying since beginning, right? -
10-15-2011, 10:44 PMYellow
Oh hey It's you :D You're the guy posting 90% of these 'Final Fantasy XIV not doing this/too expensive/not going anywhere/doom and gloom/this game sucks/boring' posts.
:D Didn't you say you were leaving a while ago? -
10-15-2011, 10:51 PMSeirra_LanzceBut you sounded like one.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
-
10-15-2011, 11:05 PMDecemberNope I never said I was leaving. Please quote me where I said I was outta here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow
-
10-15-2011, 11:29 PMExniYES! NOW YOU GET IT!! SE did us, and themselves, a favor by allowing us to continue to play for free. If SE had continued to charge from launch that would have been their right. Obviously, SE feels that a year of free play for the disappointing launch was enough..Quote:
Originally Posted by December
YOU think the game sucks, YOU think they never should have released it, and YOU think you are playing a beta. As you can clearly see a lot of players completely disagree with you. Yeah, your entitled to your own opinion, and trust that we all got it, you don't think it's worth paying for atm, you think the rest of us are stupid for doing so.. K. Your title addresses the community with a 'CYA in 2013'.. It's still 2011 and according to you the game still sucks so why are you still here? The actual bottom line is "SE doesn't want you to stick around now if you aren't ready to P2P, so yeah, CYA." -
10-15-2011, 11:31 PMMortikhan1) The game was a finished product at launch. Simply put, it was not what we all expected or wanted. The fact that it does not include other features from other games does not make it incomplete...it just means they were not included. They acknowledged that some of those features will be included later but were never part of the original design.Quote:
Originally Posted by December
2) The game sucking at any point is an opinion and not a fact. I have liked several of the past features better than I like the current ones. I have made the adjustment to those features and have continued to have a good time in the game. If/when you come back later I hope you learn to adapt a bit better. I doubt it but if I can hope for SE to improve on this game then I guess I can spare some hope for you.
3) You can go if you want. I am sure you will hear the stories about what content you will miss out on from the world "changes" and how they came about. You will not be part of that transition but bother someone who did stick around long enough they and might tell you about them :).
4) If you think that 13 months for free is not enough then feel free to head out to another game that will give you the same after release...regardless of condition. This game has been truly FTP for that time. Not some FTP with "donations" that give players with bigger wallets an advantage. Btw, 13x$15 is still $190 per person that they have not collected on. If 20k people are currently playing they have missed out on 3.8 mil per month in money they could have used up till now to improve the game and pay their people (49.4 million overall). They have more than paid for their sins. If this game was released with its current content as of today they could easily charge for it without a doubt. Many other games have done far less and charged for their content. You are judging on the short strides they have taken after each patch rather than on the giant leap they have taken from release. All of which you have received for free.
5) You may be more intelligent or see this as another beta but you have very little respect or appreciation for what they have done to correct the issue at no expense to you up until this point. Calling people stupid because you claim to know the future is not intelligence...it's arrogance.
6) @ your last point. By your logic...if people don't like content then they should receive it for free? If that is the case then I hereby announce my permanent hatred of all games past, present and future. -
10-15-2011, 11:40 PMTheVedisCalling people trolls who call people trolls is an act of trolling. I'm sick of all the trolls crying "troll" at trolls!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by JackDaniels
-
10-15-2011, 11:43 PMJackDanielscalling people trolls who call people trolls who call people trolls who call people trolls is an act of trolling :'( gtfoQuote:
Originally Posted by TheVedis
-
10-15-2011, 11:47 PMScherwizYo Dawg...Quote:
Originally Posted by JackDaniels