Okay. I agree with the original poster *who* voted no.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wynn
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03-12-2011, 06:15 AMZoltan
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03-12-2011, 06:39 AMAbithra
I think I would prefer PvP to be restricted purely to a battle arena. Give it some spectacle then just fighting in the open world.
Plus doing battle arena style they could create a whole tournament system as such and make something out of it with rewards based on different rank fights etc, etc. (not a great explanation I know :3).
Make it different is all im thinking.
EDIT: But really not bothered about jumping at all just rather they didn't force PvP on people is where I stand -
03-12-2011, 06:42 AMJasonMarkle
My opinion on jumping is that it should be a controlled action. Let's just use ffxiii jumping for a recent example. When you came up onto a point that you had to jump it would automatically perform the action for you, and they actually looked really cool being either outrageously high jumps, or outrageously long...kind of like a super hero-esq feeling. I would see that as the most valid use of a jump in XIV since the game mechanics in place currently don't really allow for jump in any kind of tactical use. I think the same could be applied to other areas like swimming under something to reach the next part of a map and such.
SO basically, this would be in your command menu when a valid location to jump or swim is appropriate...much like when you have to use the menu action to open a door. And they should be a bit un-realistic like in XIII...after all it's a game, we play it because it gets away from the true reality of life.
As for PvP, I'm all for it being in a controlled environment. What I would hate to see is the uncontrolled environment of the highest rank players are awarded by being able to just go out and gank whoever is weaker than they are because they're R50 pwning people on lower rank classes or people gathering or crafting at camps. For what XIV is it's just not valuable to us in that manner, and even for those who say they wouldn't do that, there's an equal amount of people who would lie and say they won't do it or they just wouldn't care and do it anyways.
However, if use a controlled environment like the GLD guild arena to do one on one or 4 on 4 or 8 on 8 etc. it could really be a lot of fun. Not only do we get the PvP but they can set up a system of team and individual rankings and other ideas that people can come up with.
That's my two cents on it and I hope to hear what you all think about those points.
First and foremost before we would get either of those, I would love more actual content and polish in the game so I have something to do on my R50 class. -
03-12-2011, 06:44 AMKilta_Firelotus
actually tanaka said their would be rival pvp. the in game guilds rival each other. Like the pirate guild and the musketeer guild rivial each other. And so forth.
jump adds content why wouldn't you want it? with jump they can add so much more to the game. oh wait.... you guys hate jump cuz it looks silly. so where can this large pile of content thanks to jump go? Oh WoW can have it cuz they got jump. :)
jump adds
dynamic battling
dynamic dungeon and open world exploration
ability to find hidden locations
add events that jump is involed in.
Just to same some content. -
03-12-2011, 06:51 AMCairdeas
I definitely do not want to see Jump added if it effects combat. If it is present in combat it should be an ability that Lancer gains, not something bound to your space bar.
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03-12-2011, 06:53 AMKilta_Firelotus
auto jump sucks sorry. anyone who mentions auto jump really needs to go soak their head and reply those games. It is not fun getting stuck in an auto jump loop between platforms It sucks being in an open world we can't fully explore due to limited actions. They should made ffxiv just like ffxiii very linear pathing so there is no point or need to explore.
One of my fav thing to do in large scale open world rpg is to explore. Swim in lakes, climb/jump around different places and building to find hidden things. feel like i'm actually in the world and take on a back seat ride in it.
Not jumping or swimming limits immersion as it limits our interaction with the enviroment. Stop with your pethetic crying over vanity or what other ppl do. its a video game. Even with auto jump ppl gonna go to those places and jump around and your gonna still be annoying.
This games needs conntent, any type of content EVERY type of content to get ppl to play. Tons of ppl quit or didn't play because of jump not in game.
I -
03-12-2011, 06:58 AMKilta_Firelotusplay elder scrolls, it adds a bit of fun to combatQuote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
anyone against jump or swiming is against fun.
Just quit ffxiv then since you want such limited fun. This game will die from lack of fun and the fun haters will be to blame. -
03-12-2011, 06:59 AMLaughlyn
lol jump is hardly this game's problem, and nor was it in the other FF games offline/online either.
The problem is trying to meet the costumers demand.
Obviously it looks like this whole "Forum" intel gathering wasnt such a great idea afterall, why?
Most obvious reason's are us the players...we dont even get along withouth one and another. -
03-12-2011, 07:08 AMSmashington
"Immature" in the thread title,
Giant red text in the OP.
Thread is about jumping and PvP, topics that have their own threads.
I am baffled at the amount of interest in these topics which seem to be of very little importance to the future success of FFXIV. -
03-12-2011, 07:13 AMSmashingtonQuote:
Originally Posted by Kilta_Firelotus
It's funny that when you put it this way I see your point. You are saying that jump/swim = fun?
Boiled down to this basic perspective I would have to agree. -
03-12-2011, 07:17 AMRentahamster
This isn't the right kind of game for open world PvP, just like FF11 wasn't the right type of game for open world, either. Just keep it in a battle arena or something, like that coliseum at the Galdiator guild in Uldah.
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03-12-2011, 07:25 AMNivana
I am not for "Jump" or PvP.
I think jump would be fine if they had originally intended to use it and built the landscape with jumping mechanics in mind, or if it does not cause setbacks to real content, like more areas, quests, etc.
Large scale PvP has the problem mentioned much earlier of being a total nightmare to balance with PvE content, and While I love the idea of killing an obvious bot running in the same path over and over again or getting killed by a friend in a duel or something, I don't want the dev team to spend an enormous amount of time fixing their nerfs. Guess I just don't have enough faith that they'll get it right this time. -
03-12-2011, 07:25 AMTirionCrey
I don't give a ... if they add PvP or not. The only thing that matters to me is that PvP doesn't take as big of a place in the game as it does in WoW, where everything needs to be balanced around PvE AND PvP. If a class is OP in PvP and onehits everything but is completely fine in PvE, I don't want this class to be touched at all and break it for PvE purposes just so it is "okay" for PvP. PvP doesn't matter and it shouldn't matter when it comes to balancing the game.
And about the jump thing...I never needed it in FFXI and I never missed it. I don't see why I would need it in FFXIV or miss it there. WoW is something completely different, the whole world and the coding it has is different. Jumping in the game was there from the beginning ad it was designed with the world map in mind. In FFXIV this doesn't apply, hence the world map would have to be redesigned and recoded for jump to work properly...and I'm sorry...this game needs around 5000 other things a lot more than a stupid jump feature that doesn't change anything in the game. -
03-12-2011, 07:41 AMAlmaMalma
BOING BOING BOING BOING BOING GANK GANK GANK GANK BOING BOING
Wow, I'm sold. Where do I sign? -
03-12-2011, 08:17 AMZezlar
I don't mind jumping but i'm more for simulated jumping similar to Xenosaga / Xenogears / Final Fantasy X / XIII.
Free jumping like in WoW however is just god awful and kills everything. -
03-12-2011, 08:18 AMgifthorse
People are weird, what more can you say?
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03-12-2011, 08:28 AMNeptunelol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Malakhim
@ OP though, thanks I agree with you completely! -
03-12-2011, 08:36 AMOnidemonXenogears had free jumping like wow and the game used it heavily. It is good you mentioned as this game shows how jumping can enhance gameplay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zezlar
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03-12-2011, 08:42 AMOnidemonThey re-designing the maps so if they add jump they can redesign with that in mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nivana
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03-12-2011, 08:58 AMSkidkidd
Jump and PVP would be brilliant
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03-12-2011, 09:31 AMAmsai
This barely deserves a response...... not just no, but NO HELL NO
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03-12-2011, 09:47 AMLaughlyn
lol i hope he DO listen to peoples ideas, without them there would be no such things as games, fantasy worlds etc.
poorly chosen topic title for some personal feelings about PvP & Jump. -
03-12-2011, 10:34 AMRowyne
Yoshi-P has already said no PK, thank the Gods.
I'm definitely a PvE player. I honestly very rarely care for PvP, unless it's to control an area which grants a significant reward (ie opening access to a dungeon). But since this game isn't set up for nation/faction rivalry, that isn't an issue.
IF PvP makes it into this game, it needs to be in a controlled setting. I'm fine with the sports-style matches they've talked about.
But no forced PvP, ever! -
03-12-2011, 10:46 AMunmemaketwinkie
Creating separate servers does not fix the issue of balancing classes. I played WoW as well, PvP is the funnest aspect but also very frustrating when your class gets the nerf bat because they're "too bursty" or whatever. Albeit, some nerfs are warranted, but the frustration and re-rolling remains.
FFXIV doesn't need a jump button. I agree with another poster (somewhere in these forums) who suggested the FFXIII approach; to jump in a designated spot only to surpass certain areas/obstacles. Jumping, swimming, flying are what make a lot of games fun and unique, but this is a traditional RPG with its own flavor. I think that if we tamper too much we'll lose what makes Final Fantasy fun and unique in its own. -
03-12-2011, 10:48 AMOnidemon
PVP will probably be in an Arena form. That's for sure, based on what SE told us for far.
How can they make it fun and popular tho'? I think some how it would be nice to be able to watch the fights. Like have regular tournaments with prizes and be able to build a reputation and fame. There would be 1 vs 1 matches and also team/parties matches.
This would probably cause some lagg issues.... but how nice would it be if you could just come in a coliseum like building where PVP matches take places while other players are watching and cheering. -
03-12-2011, 10:53 AMBayohneIn regards to PvP, from Producer/Director Yoshida
Greetings everyone. FFXIV Producer/Director Yoshida has posted some comments related to PvP and your discussion about it in general. Please take a look at what he has to say and keep his comments in mind!
Quote:
Hi everyone, this is Producer/Director Yoshida.
Thanks so much for the lively discussion about PvP.
Since PvP falls under battle improvement content this is something that won’t be implemented for some time, but I really appreciate your feedback.
We’re not planning to implement a form of PvP where you can get caught off guard and killed by another player, so in that regard, you can rest at ease.
I consider myself to be a PvPer, so I understand a lot about the advanced nature of PvP in general. However, I would be really happy if everyone could continue to discuss your thoughts on PvP and think about what kind of PvP would best fit within the world of FFXIV. (I understand that PvP is a feature that has things that people enjoy and things that people oppose as well.)
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03-12-2011, 10:59 AMCorrderioSo does this mean we can put the final nail in the coffin of this thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
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03-12-2011, 11:01 AMOnidemonAs i posted above, an arena type of PVP with other players being able to watch and cheer would be fun. Also to make sure people don't just forget about it with time it would be nice if it awards some items or armors/weapons.... Makes your character gain some type of reputation or fame.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
Any one else has some cool suggestions? -
03-12-2011, 11:11 AMunmemaketwinkie
I'm so excited to finally express my thoughts on Final Fantasy PvP! There are a number of ways to implement PvP into FFXIV. There's Chocobo Racing! Players could raise their chocobos and race them for notoriety and rewards. Maybe delve into Tetra Master or something similar! Players could sit down and duke it out in a friendly game of cards. My favorite idea would be to create teams (similar to 3v3 arena in WoW) and compete vs. another team in a turn-based battle (think traditional Final Fantasy battles)! Another great idea would be to create a Final Fantasy Tactics PvP scenario; almost like playing chess with your fellow adventurers. Not sure if you can incorporate ideas from other franchises within the same company, though.
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03-12-2011, 12:25 PMArch_Blegan
I would like to see a less punishing version of Darkfall's PvP. For those who have never played the game, it's an open world, unrestricted PvP between warring races and the ability of clans to declare war on clans of allied races. They also have full looting of player's corpses. Killing members of allied races leads to the player being marked as evil and anyone is allowed to PK them (like Runescape, the old days of RS PvP was golden... loved that). Since we don't have warring races, I'm going to skip over that part.
That's the rundown of Darkfall, what I'd like to see from FFXIV is the ability for companies to declare unilateral war on other companies and allow to PK each other without penalties or loss of loot. This I like because companies that use bots like in FFXI will be at war with practically the entire server and we could police ourselves and make open-world HNMs more fun/competitive and less QQ. And if a company has a monopoly then the rest of the server can have a "revolution" against them.
In addition, players should be able to PK other players they aren't at war with but gradually make it so it decreases their "reputation" and if they do too much of it then they are marked as "evil" and players are allowed to PKK them without penalty as well as the ability to fully loot their corpse. Also make it so they are instantly marked as evil to the company that the PK'd player was apart of for the sweet revenge with a one-time PK. That would limit excessive grief'ing because of the consequences. Or maybe instead of marking players as evil and fully lootable, allow PK'd players to place a bounty on their PKer. Something to reward PKKers and punish grief'ing.
As far as balancing goes... this is FFXIV, players can practically use any skill/weapon/armor in the game. If something is great for PvP then any player can obtain and use it. Honestly, the armory system makes PvP balancing very easy since no player is denied an ability, ie no severely overpowered class. Only stubborn people who don't want to put the effort in to advance their character would be denied these abilities.
Darkfall also allows clans to build fortresses/towns (carpenters) and lay siege and destroy each other's hamlets... implementing that in FFXIV would make me /drool. With as much room as we have in Eorzea, this could fill up all that empty space and have us fighting over prime real estate.
A PvP system like this would create villains and heroes on every server (although I'm not opposed to PvE only servers) and would allow us to make our own content/stories.
Sorry for the long post, but PvP is huge to an MMO. . . if we aren't competing against each other then we may as well be playing an offline game. -
03-12-2011, 12:58 PMSoda
Very simple open world PvP:
- Make it toggle-able
- Keep it default off for all new players
- Type /pvp to "toggle" yourself as "on". Put a cooldown on this (5-10mins)
-- A subset of this is that you'll need some sort of indicator that you're open for PKing, so maybe something like a sword icon next to the linkshell shield icon or perhaps changing of someone's name color. The point of this is that YOU and others should be able to easily identify if you're in PvP mode.
Yes, I realize this is a WoW feature, however, all WoW PvE servers had the option to toggle open world PvP for each player if they WANTED to maybe experience some random PvP. Why not make it the user's choice? If you don't like PvP, never turn it on, and if you do, turn it on and enjoy it. As far as I'm concerned, both sides win with this solution.
And just to say, I think something like this should be included WITH something like arena or other PvP games/objectives/scenarios. Why not add the option to PvP anywhere if you want? Could be a relatively simple addition to the game that could add some more excitement and action to the currently rather boring and linear/predictable world. -
03-12-2011, 01:05 PMSkidkiddI agree, I think it would be a nice addition and like stated above, just add a toggle. If you dont wanna scrap with me then dont, but if you care to test your mettle... heheheQuote:
Originally Posted by Soda
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03-12-2011, 01:08 PMJedgarTo me this statement means no Open World PvP. Arena or Ballista type most likely. So can we finally put this to a rest?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
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03-12-2011, 01:20 PMSoda
Well, technically my idea isn't out of the water because you wouldn't actually ever be caught off guard. So in my eyes, that should be a contender that meets the standards Yoshie-P set in his statement, but also pleases the open world PvP crowd.
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03-12-2011, 01:51 PMNephera
I'm against open world pvp because i'm afraid people would target people of other nations and things would get real real ugly.
a specific zone for it would be fine i guess, or ballista or duels.
edit: or all three. -
03-12-2011, 01:54 PMKilta_Firelotus
if they gonna make a game like ballista, NA will not play it. This happen in ffxi. it was used in the first year, by the time i got my ballista license, it was out of style. It was only a jp thing and those are full quick. Barely anyone did brenner and the pankerton was popular for a mnth at best. Na (for the most part) only enjoy fps style open world pvp. It can get nasty quick though. due to tbagging, red=dead mindset, terms like carebear come into play. idm pvp as long as ppl realise it a game and not take it so seriously. I just want game to get more content so a ps3 release is out.
looking at my pc version and a broken pc makes me a sad panda -
03-12-2011, 01:55 PMNephera
Oh man you know what i havent seen since guild wars? competetive pve, two teams trying to complete objectives before the other.
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03-12-2011, 02:16 PMtarquelGets my vote.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nephera
That, and party based PvP (which has probably been said) but two (or more perhaps) partys PvP'ing could be fun :) wrapped around scenarios and/or arenas, could be a laugh :) -
03-12-2011, 02:40 PMZhinse
I would like to see some sort of political system tied to player versus player. Not exactly a war, mind you, but closer to conquest and stuff from FFXI. I think if they model player versus player content to at request duels, gladiatorial arenas, and a linkshell/company political system modeled after the clans in FFTA advance to some degree.
To have Player versus player simply as a side event does not cut it. Even if it is really damn fun, when it comes down to it, if some overal progress isn't being made, then people wont be compelled to do it. Because there isn't any meaningful progress to be made in the game right now, is one of the big reasons why people are not playing it.
I hope that the upcoming battle changes are balanced for PVP, then have the PVE balances built around it, since its way too hard to go the other way around. -
03-12-2011, 02:45 PMKeith_Dragoon
I am only against jump because its not a FF thing. Those closest any FF game came to jump would be in the single player games when your character would ascend a obvious stairwell looking cliffside to reach the top. I'm fine with a jump like this but I believe a jump like any of the more recent MMOs would ruin not the emmersion but the FF feel of the game.
SE's goal is to make this game worthy of it's FF title, jump would be going in the wrong direction. There is nothing immature about this and its how "I" feel on the subject.
As for PVP, XI had it and since then its become a increasing popular thing in most MMOs so I don't see a reason why not to add it. Whether its just a friendly deathmatch type of game or the highly confusing rukesets that XI had asside from ballista and the ghelsba one.