Best Gear in Coil needs to end

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ayiana_Arch

Just my two cents on this: You do not need BiS gear for anything other than Coil.

---

Technically you don't need i110 for coil either. i110 drops as a reward /from/ coil so it can be cleared with significantly less.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nel_Celestine

Technically you don't need i110 for coil either. i110 drops as a reward /from/ coil so it can be cleared with significantly less.

---

Like I said, BG was able to clear it with i90 gear. But it makes sense that Coil drops the best gear, which is as it should be. The Weathered gear does not need to be un-weathered if you aren't doing Coil is all I'm saying :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FraenirVolsung

This is absolutely 110% true. My only issue with the way things have been designed is that you create two unique sets of i110 gear but you gate them both behind 1 individual piece of content. Put the i110 high allagan gear in coil, but give us something else that is equally as challenging for unidentified allagan, sands, and oils.

---

This is the issue: there are two different gear sets for same item level but they're both gated behind one content. What is the point in this?

I don't think anyone is asking same level of gear to be obtained in an easier manner, but they're asking for alternative difficult content for same item level. The issue is Coil 2 is the only content worth doing right now. And maybe Leviathan ex and upgrading an animus or a few.

I honestly don't see any issue with having the best weapons in the game drop from the toughest content in the game.

Here's a thing for oh-so-bored contentburners out there:
OFFER TO DO TRAINING RUNS (no, not for gil)
...problem solved, end of story.

No, seriously, I'm sick and tired of every single PF looking for "i9k+ and kill exp only otherwise we hunt down your family and burn down your house", but nobody ever offering to teach anything, anywhere. And then of course those same people getting mad as hell if they can't get a party together for whatever they wanna do and ragequit if they try DF and find one or two newbies in there. Like, what do you expect?? Nobody's forcing you to complete everything in shorter-than-should-be-possible time - if that's what's fun for you, sure, go ahead. But please don't expect everybody else to be like that as well, and don't expect SE to cater to those specific needs of yours either.

BreathlessTao.. you're using logic. The very thing that trolls despise.

Honestly though that's how I see people like that, trolls.

Of course people should run and are rerunning older content with and for others in learning purposes. I know I am running Coil 1 and extreme learning runs regularly. That doesn't change the issue that only worthwile progression content is Coil 2. There's a lot of stuff to do in the game: I could do animus for all my jobs, run dailies to max my fame for all beastmen tribes, get max rank in PvP etc. etc. The issue is, that content isn't interesting to me. And I'm not alone in this. I have many FC members who are very much into progression but are losing interest because in addition to Coil 2 all the game is offering them is "forced" (yeah yeah blah blah you don't have you do it if you don't want to blah blah) soldiery farming and animus upgrade.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Taika

I could do animus for all my jobs

---

http://i.minus.com/iuly4qIYq1H3.gif

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BreathlessTao

Here's a thing for oh-so-bored contentburners out there:
OFFER TO DO TRAINING RUNS (no, not for gil)
...problem solved, end of story.

No, seriously, I'm sick and tired of every single PF looking for "i9k+ and kill exp only otherwise we hunt down your family and burn down your house", but nobody ever offering to teach anything, anywhere. And then of course those same people getting mad as hell if they can't get a party together for whatever they wanna do and ragequit if they try DF and find one or two newbies in there. Like, what do you expect?? Nobody's forcing you to complete everything in shorter-than-should-be-possible time - if that's what's fun for you, sure, go ahead. But please don't expect everybody else to be like that as well, and don't expect SE to cater to those specific needs of yours either.

---

So they should be relegated to teaching most of the playerbase? When they've likely taught many people already? There comes a point when you just get tired of teaching people CONSTANTLY, and just want a win. This isn't unreasonable in the slightest.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ispano

So they should be relegated to teaching most of the playerbase? When they've likely taught many people already? There comes a point when you just get tired of teaching people CONSTANTLY, and just want a win. This isn't unreasonable in the slightest.

---

No, we are doomed to wipe for eternity, lest we be bad people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BreathlessTao

Here's a thing for oh-so-bored contentburners out there:
OFFER TO DO TRAINING RUNS (no, not for gil)
...problem solved, end of story.

No, seriously, I'm sick and tired of every single PF looking for "i9k+ and kill exp only otherwise we hunt down your family and burn down your house", but nobody ever offering to teach anything, anywhere. And then of course those same people getting mad as hell if they can't get a party together for whatever they wanna do and ragequit if they try DF and find one or two newbies in there. Like, what do you expect?? Nobody's forcing you to complete everything in shorter-than-should-be-possible time - if that's what's fun for you, sure, go ahead. But please don't expect everybody else to be like that as well, and don't expect SE to cater to those specific needs of yours either.

---

You can look at a 7 minute youtube guide and know a lot about a fight. You will still most likely die, but you will KNOW what you died from and how to correct it instead of going "WTF WAS THAT" after dying from a mechanic you had no idea about (and will die to again because of this reason). A lot of PF groups are like that because some people want to farm content for a piece of gear they want without spending the first 15-30 mins wiping while teaching someone. You may think this is unreasonable, but after having it happen to you 10 times, you'd rather just cut through that phase and get 7 like-minded players together (learning groups exist for this reason).

On a sidenote, a lot of players don't get mad when they group up with new people, they get mad when they group up with new people at endgame who do not even know their class. I'm sorry, but you cannot properly learn a fight if you still cannot properly DPS, or heal, or keep enmity and rotate between defensive cooldowns. There are resources outside the game that teach you this, and if you're a DPS, then training dummies exist for this purpose.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zaft

I would just prefer new and fun achievements. That's what gives hardcore raiders something to do on WoW at the moment.

---

Don't know about WoW. But Rift had that (don't know which did first, dont care:P ). Also certain Raid bosses had triggers you could activate for the Hard Mode of the fight. eg: First fight in Endless Eclipse had 4 bosses before main boss, you killed them one at a time, but, if you killed them in a certain order it activated the hard version of the fight. Another one had a Boss frozen behind the normal boss, edge around and free that one and itactivated Hard mode with different mechanics and two instead of just the one boss to fight.

Off the top of my head, one they could add is Twintania, break her collar and she becames stronger with more mechanics. Leave her collar and its as normal. Drops a mini Twintania minion.

SWTOR had a good (in theory) system for raiding with having 3 levels of difficulty. Story mode, which was the easiest. NOrmal mode, which was, well the normal difficulty, and finally nightmare mode being the most difficult. (Albeit for a few months, hardest thing about SWTOR raids was the RNG of whether the bugs would derp you over or not:P )

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BreathlessTao

Here's a thing for oh-so-bored contentburners out there:
OFFER TO DO TRAINING RUNS (no, not for gil)
...problem solved, end of story.

No, seriously, I'm sick and tired of every single PF looking for "i9k+ and kill exp only otherwise we hunt down your family and burn down your house", but nobody ever offering to teach anything, anywhere.

---

You do realise that many, many of those are made by players who, between the lines, are saying "I want experienced people to join to carry me through the fight".

You do know you can make your own PF parties stating the requirements you want, instead of just trying to find someone else who did that for you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sapphic

You do realise that many, many of those are made by players who, between the lines, are saying "I want experienced people to join to carry me through the fight".

---

Not just that but that's also all I'm reading out of his post. I have no trouble finding experienced people to do content with so it looks like he is projecting his own frustrations. A training run is inexperienced people getting together to learn content, experienced people taking an inexperienced person is called a carry.

yeah yeah u beat T9 now ur bored go do something else on the game do levi ex or mog ex or help people. people need stop saying there bored there's enough content in the game good lord u dont have to do coil.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atkinsj7

yeah yeah u beat T9 now ur bored go do something else on the game do levi ex or mog ex or help people.

---

Cause that's not what some people pay to play this game for, to walk people through content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ispano

So they should be relegated to teaching most of the playerbase? When they've likely taught many people already? There comes a point when you just get tired of teaching people CONSTANTLY, and just want a win. This isn't unreasonable in the slightest.

---

"You are allowed to play however you want, as long as it is in the way I want." - the "anti-elitist" creed.

Rawr, meow, nya!

[QUOTE=Kiara;2072124] snip

All of that you mentioned in XI was implemented over a number of years and this game isn't even a year old yet. Give them some time, they are pumping out a lot more content then XI did in a year so imagine how much this game will have a number of years from now. However this is ladder progression game not horizontal like IX, so I don't expect to see a lot of that type of progression

Oh my gosh, hardcore casuals? lawl

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dreamer

There's a veritable plethora of content in the game currently, and it's well-paced to boot. Don't depend on a single game to be your sole source of entertainment.

---

Right now, the progression past i90 is "do Coil, do Coil or do Coil"

They've kneecapped the game by putting all three "different methods of progression" into Coil, behind Coil's lockout mechanics and RNG. If you want to get to the top of the gear ladder, you do Coil. No choice. Do Coil. Want to do something else? Well we've got Hard Mode dungeons that you need to finish the main quest to access, which means doing a mandatory Full Party instance. We've got Primals, which are all Full Party instances. We've got FATEs that you can't do solo. It's that or Coil.

Why should easy solo content grant access to high/top end gear?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raenryong

Why should easy solo content grant access to high/top end gear?

---

you know that they can make solo content hard? just saying...
for a lot of people if is not raid is easy. i know some game where you can get solo/duo/group content extremely hard and demanding. why add this sort of thing? because not everybody want to log in the game for simply go into a raid every day. a change of pace that still hard and demanding can be really good.
Raid is nice, but seriously, had more content different can be nice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silentwindfr

you know that they can make solo content hard? just saying...
for a lot of people if is not raid is easy. i know some game where you can get solo/duo/group content extremely hard and demanding. why add this sort of thing? because not everybody want to log in the game for simply go into a raid every day. a change of pace that still hard and demanding can be really good.
Raid is nice, but seriously, had more content different can be nice.

---

I'm not sure if you were around for beta, but some of the class quests were quite challenging (thinking specifically of the level 15 BLM one). There was a lot of uproar over this(and others), and it seemed right around then they changed the mentality to make things a lot easier.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silentwindfr

you know that they can make solo content hard? just saying...
for a lot of people if is not raid is easy. i know some game where you can get solo/duo/group content extremely hard and demanding. why add this sort of thing? because not everybody want to log in the game for simply go into a raid every day. a change of pace that still hard and demanding can be really good.
Raid is nice, but seriously, had more content different can be nice.

---

I agree with you. As long as the content is comparable in difficulty to raids, it can have similar rewards (though I still feel raiding should award the very highest tier of drops since it does require the most teamwork/group co-ordination and is effectively the pinnacle of PvE). What I do not agree with is having high tier things drop from easy stuff like beastmen dailies/hard mode dungeons/fates/etc.

*sighs* i know, like the quest level 15 at the end of the city quest, with the antidote...
a lot of change was made in the beta that wasn't very...smart. but well, i'm just saying is possible and maybe is a good idea to bring back some hard content that are not raid for add more diversity to the game!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raenryong

I agree with you. As long as the content is comparable in difficulty to raids, it can have similar rewards (though I still feel raiding should award the very highest tier of drops since it does require the most teamwork/group co-ordination and is effectively the pinnacle of PvE). What I do not agree with is having high tier things drop from easy stuff like beastmen dailies/hard mode dungeons/fates/etc.

---

true, but stuff like beastmen dailies are extremely long..... freaking long, easy... but really long.
but i want to see more content, i'm sick of this way of thinking, saying only raid can provide challenge. we can get soo much more than this! we are in 2014 and we have acces to much more technology, more stuff was create over the years and you can't say me they can't bring some nice challenge into the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silentwindfr

sighs i know, like the quest level 15 at the end of the city quest, with the antidote...
a lot of change was made in the beta that wasn't very...smart. but well, i'm just saying is possible and maybe is a good idea to bring back some hard content that are not raid for add more diversity to the game!



true, but stuff like beastmen dailies are extremely long..... freaking long, easy... but really long.
but i want to see more content, i'm sick of this way of thinking, saying only raid can provide challenge. we can get soo much more than this! we are in 2014 and we have acces to much more technology, more stuff was create over the years and you can't say me they can't bring some nice challenge into the game.

---

I agree with you that they could bring in a lot more challenging solo content. However...it's an MMO. Playing with others is kind of the idea, ya know?

Like I said I agree and would like to see it too, but don't get your hopes up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raenryong

Why should easy solo content grant access to high/top end gear?

---

Because we have to grind longer for it. Which were willing to do.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Xaruu

Sounds like OP may just need a break. Also.. he has yet to beat T9 but he is right in that there is nothing to do aside from coil for the best gear. Kinda sad... some nice side grades that arent coil related would be nice

---

Thornmarch EX drops a neck piece and Levi EX drops weapons and shields.

Unless you're wanting things like Brayflox HM to drop i100 gear I'm not sure what you want.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sylent09

Because we have to grind longer for it. Which were willing to do.

---

Tell that one of the hundreds of people whining and complaining about the Atma quest line.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sylent09

Because we have to grind longer for it. Which were willing to do.

---

Why should the best gear be awarded on the basis of time spent and not skill demonstrated?

The best gear should always come from the end. Most MMOs operate on a gear treadmill. Gear from X, helps you down Y which gears you up for Z.

I 'think' what the op is trying to say, is that people don't have time to run Coil efficiently to keep up with the gear. I honestly believe there should be some middle-ground in the end-game content. Crystal Tower is too easy, hence why it drops i80. But Coil is pretty demanding and tough, but the rewards are there. Both ends of the scale really.

Hate to use Warcraft as an example, but their use of Heroic content was ideal. It allowed the 'casuals' to see the content in Normal and the 'hardcore' to show off their ego in Heroic gear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silentwindfr

you know that they can make solo content hard? just saying...

---

why add solo content to a mmorpg? ö_Ö story is solo enough...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raenryong

Why should the best gear be awarded on the basis of time spent and not skill demonstrated?

---

becoz judged by QQ threads patience is a high enough challenge to justify top tier gear

if you have already gotten all 12 atmas and 13500 myth tomes then........ you probably play the game too much

I hope the game gets even more difficult so people have more things to complain about.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

Oils. And I think Scholar needs 7 oils.

---

For scholar you need the complete left side except the pants of daystar set (left side needs sand) and the ring on right side (1x oil).

As of missing alternatives, I would equip a whitemage the opposite way. Left side high allagan stuff except pants (1xsand) and on rigth side the daystar accessoires as the high allagan ones are missing piety.

Actually there are only 2 rings for healers, so both need all of them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raenryong

Why should the best gear be awarded on the basis of time spent and not skill demonstrated?

---

You could get ilvl 90 from wp before. No issues or complaints about that. It's about the fact that we should have options. Obviously you do coil and enjoy it. Believe it or not many people aren't you. We enjoy to just grind and not do coil where people are complete jerks, kick you for learning, blacklist you for needing an item, want you too have team speak, yell at you for a simple mistake. Casual players should still be able to get some gear to. Would you be happy if coil dropped ilvl 100 gear while people who grind extreme dungeons get ilvl 110 gear? That's how we feel.

I think it would be better if coil dropped *some* of the best stuff, but not all of it.

Say i110 main gear (head, chest, gloves, legs, feet) only dropped in coil. And only t9 dropped the i115 weapon.

But the rest of the i110 gear should be somewhere else in the world (sld tokens, primal fights, long quests or whatever).

Right now you've got ALL of the i110 stuff (right & left sides of the inventory) and all of the i110 upgrade tokens for SLD gear (including weapon) and the i115 weapons are ONLY available on the 4 bosses in coil2. Content that both favors playing with a static and is behind a weekly lockout. Basically it's too much crammed onto too few bosses. So it's not only bad for the raiders (too much loot crammed into too few loot tables makes it extremely RNG dependent to get your gear), but it's also bad for the players who can't play at specific set times (for a static) since all of the i110+ pieces are not in content that is available to them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raenryong

Why should the best gear be awarded on the basis of time spent and not skill demonstrated?

---

Because alternatives are better. While I've never had an issue putting in hours of attempts in raiding before. What I don't tolerate is all the whining, elitism, and overall negativity that comes with it.

So why should the best gear be awarded on the basis that people tolerate that kind of environment and not to those that are civil?

I just don't really get why these people want this gear, other than because they're simply jealous people beating turns in Second Coil have a higher illv than them. There is no other content in the game which requires you to be in i110-115 gear. In all honesty you don't even need i100 gear to beat the new EX Primals, but that's still available. Other than that what is there you could possible need to be that overgeared for?

In Theory, best gear, or lets say "better gear" is a form of progress where you trade playtime for higher success rate on bossfights. That way you give weaker players a chance when they spend more time in collecting "Sets". The problem we have here is that SE cuts progress because gear you will need to beat content you are getting after beating that said content... So yeah, a MMO never ends but it is ridiculous to implement gear for content that "may" comes in a year or such...

That aside, we have some nice cutscenes and MANY open questions! SE should really start answering some questions, we are hanging around with lose ends of strings knowing nothing... with ascians SE already opened new strings and we know less than before! Sorry, but delivering service is not "answering" questions... not even lore from 1.x is answered, so we cant say its a new chapter...