Please remove gear advantages in PVP

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Originally Posted by Tenku

He could be on his alt man.

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It's his main.

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Originally Posted by x037x

I looked you up on the lodestone (Drain Bead) and words can describe the sadness I feel for you, keep grinding, you'll get there someday, in the meantime I guess you can keep sympathizing with people the likes of MRMR as you QQ about getting facerolled in the wolves den. And seriously at least get a full DL or PVP set before you gimp the team you're random queueing for. LVL 40 stuff, cmon man grind WP for a sec before you attempt to PVP.

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Why? Don't you have different gear sets? Like "spiritbonding" "pvp" "Warrior" "MRD" "Armorer" etc? Again, the ignorance is strong in you. Why do you assume so much?

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Originally Posted by Imapooonu

Why? Don't you have different gear sets? Like "spiritbonding" "pvp" "Warrior" "MRD" "Armorer" etc? Again, the ignorance is strong in you. Why do you assume so much?

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It's ok *hugs*

Idk... i'd be working on spirit bonding i70 stuff so after 40ish wins i'd have something to put on my i70 gear but that's just me.


edited*

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Originally Posted by x037x

It's ok *hugs*

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What's okay? It's okay that I have several gear sets? It's okay that you're ignorant and insulting? It's okay you can't spell okay?...and don't touch me.

Who's sexually harassing? My stone II in cleric stance will touch you in all sorts of uncomfortable ways, I don't know whats in your dirty mind that's correlating PVP with sex but I don't want any part of it. Maybe you're brain dead... OH wait that's your toons name a play on words right? (Drain Bead) HAHA, Honestly you're not even worth anymore of my posts, it was nice to tango with you though.

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Originally Posted by x037x

So you would like PVP tweaked into an environment that tailors to your personal wants and needs in order for you to win? Would you like fries with that? Do you receive welfare and EBT as well? Do you live in section 8 housing? Do you usually ask for handouts and complain about your socioeconomic disadvantage in RL as well and then protest that other people have better jobs and get paid more than you? Is it unfair? Is the MAN keeping you down from success?

Are you a communist?

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What the fuck?

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Originally Posted by docbon

What the ****?

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Yep (includes 10 characters)

@x037x

Soooo your spell is going to touch me, NOT you? Whew. Not sure how I misinterpreted that. Coulda been the fact you said you were going to, but who am I to split hairs?

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Originally Posted by docbon

What the fuck?

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Hey I got a like for that comment.

But anyway, I was elaborating and eluding to the attitude that people who are not good enough in a certain area, demand the standards be lowered. Further more people who cannot fend for themselves in an MMO PVP, or in real life situations demand that the standards be lowered, normalized and gimped across the board so it suits their needs. Yay! everyone gets a trophy! everybody wins! Me too!! Furthermore they require assistance and handouts when they can't make it on their own, and worst of all they demand them. "If I can't win, gimp everyone so I'm better" "If I can't win normalize the standards, make it equal across the board" force everyone into an equal situation ? Humans in a competitive environment are NOT EQUAL, there are bad, good, better, and best, to force everyone into equality regardless of their skill, potential or talent is communism. Hence my example and use of the word in my earlier post you WTF'd.

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Originally Posted by x037x

D: And yes senior sports teams do get awarded more points, in essence they earn the privilege to play in playoffs, and then awarded the chance to play in finals.. OH wait you'd probably want to eliminate playoffs and championships as well?

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While probably not at all the intention of this post, and why I only will comment on this part.
It makes a great argument for tiered competition. All of those things (other sports) have entry level (non-varsity, amateur, minor league, etc.) arenas/tiers, for the less geared, skilled, experienced, casual, etc.

Why does that not exist here, sorry I don't PvP 12 hours a day 7 days a week, but being kept out of PvP because I simply can't gear up, or play as often, seems ludicrous.

And to later posts ... Wow, you seem to take a game either way too serious, or you are just super angry at the world.

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Originally Posted by docbon

What the fuck?

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Its funny and sad because of how little he knows what he is talking about.
The people requesting a freer environment without artificial barriers to the competitive scene or 'market' are labeled as communists. Not only does he not know what what communism is, he is using the term he doesn't understand as a way to poison a well and he is the one advocating for an environment where people are more likely to succeed on something other than their own merits.

Logic & knowledge fail wrapped in a pretty hypocrisy bow. All you can do with people like this is ignore and pity them.

It really sucks that people are so used to every MMO having a gear grind in PVP that they can't see past that and think that's the ONLY way MMO PVP can be.

It also sucks being the minority, but what can you do. The majority is wrong pretty much in every situation in life, but since they outnumber you their outcries are heard over your compelling arguments, your facts, and anything you can come up with to dispute their false claims.

Idiocracy is a great movie and I suggest everyone watches it, because it's what I see the world becoming more and more everyday.

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

It really sucks that people are so used to every MMO having a gear grind in PVP that they can't see past that and think that's the ONLY way MMO PVP can be.

It also sucks being the minority, but what can you do. The majority is wrong pretty much in every situation in life, but since they outnumber you their outcries are heard over your compelling arguments, your facts, and anything you can come up with to dispute their false claims.

Idiocracy is a great movie and I suggest everyone watches it, because it's what I see the world becoming more and more everyday.

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You're idealistic, and that's great, but you're forgetting practical implications. The voice of many (unfortunately) overcomes idealism. MMO's are no exception to this rule. It is what it is. Either you like it or you don't. No one is forcing anyone to play this game. The PvP here is limited. Accept it as it is or continue having delusions of a 'grander' innovation that will most likely never come.

I love how PvP never fails to bring out the arrogance in people. "I'm better than you. Everything you do is wrong if it isn't the same as me. No one should be able to disagree with me. I want everything my way because it's obviously the best way since it is my way.".

My favorite is: "What's your rank in WoW?" or some other games that mean nothing to the current game.

We aren't so used to PvP gear progression that we can't see anything else. What we're used to is seeing MMORPG's do PvP without gear progression and watching them fail terribly. The reason I stopped playing GW2was because I hit level 80 and there was no reason for me to stay. I know for a fact that the majority of my FC would no longer PvP in this game if the progression was gone.

Stop thinking you're smarter than everyone else. You're no better than the rest of the stupid human beings on this planet and you just sound pathetic when you attack everyone who tries to debate with you. The fact that we still exist is proof that the majority isn't always wrong. If the minority were always right nothing would go well because the minority get no say in what happens.

Understand the MMORPG audience. Think about why the majority of them play MMORPG's. Think about why they pay monthly to continue playing these games after they reach the max level. Think about why level caps are raised and why they keep adding higher gear. Progression is going to be the answer the majority of the time. Taking progression away from an audience who wants it is a stupid move.

Giving the audience both forms of PvP would be a great move, though. Why shouldn't the people who want fair PvP be allowed to do it? They should, as long as it doesn't take away from the majority of the game who want what they pay for. I'll happily sign petitions and whatever else to add a mode that syncs all gear and stats to level 50 as long as it's adding alongside. They could even give you the same rewards you get from winning normal PvP matches, but half it that way people who want to jump into normal PvP can collect some gear.

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Originally Posted by LongNu

You're idealistic, and that's great, but you're forgetting practical implications. The voice of many (unfortunately) overcomes idealism. MMO's are no exception to this rule. It is what it is. Either you like it or you don't. No one is forcing anyone to play this game. The PvP here is limited. Accept it as it is or continue having delusions of a 'grander' innovation that will most likely never come.

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Originally Posted by Seripha_Starbane

Both in GW2 and SWTOR where gear is close to vanity only, the competative pvp element has failed horribly. People want to progress. Thats why they play mmos.

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Originally Posted by LongNu

Please do not go off trying to make this game's PvP what it's not. This isn't any MLG PvP. It's an MMORPG, which means progression. Either accept it as it is or find PvP elsewhere. GW2's reward system was its downfall. Do not expect other game companies to make the same mistake. (Hopefully)

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Huh? The most successful MMO(World of warcraft) is normalizing gear and giving everyone preset gear to pick from for arenas(the only pvp we have in this is literally arenas). When this was announced at Blizzcon the crowd went wild, everyone was so excited and PVPers have been fighting for this for a decade.

If I don't like it quit you say? That worked so well for FF14 1.0 - where did that game go? Oh right..

It's fine, just tell everyone who doesn't like how this game works to leave and quit, until no one is left and they have to make a realm reborn v2. SE didn't say they're taking player feedback more seriously now or anything. You don't want this game to be successful, and that's fine, a lot of us do.

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

It really sucks that people are so used to every MMO having a gear grind in PVP that they can't see past that and think that's the ONLY way MMO PVP can be.

It also sucks being the minority, but what can you do. The majority is wrong pretty much in every situation in life, but since they outnumber you their outcries are heard over your compelling arguments, your facts, and anything you can come up with to dispute their false claims.

Idiocracy is a great movie and I suggest everyone watches it, because it's what I see the world becoming more and more everyday.

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You're being just as closed-minded as the people you're complaining about. You've gone on and on pushing your opinion as irrefutible fact and you ignore any reasonable argument to the contrary, it's like talking to a wall.

This made my day. LOL

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

It's fine, just tell everyone who doesn't like how this game works to leave and quit, until no one is left and they have to make a realm reborn v2. SE didn't say they're taking player feedback more seriously now or anything. You don't want this game to be successful, and that's fine, a lot of us do.

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I'm not telling you to quit. I'm telling you to be realistic about the game you're playing. WoW's potential capabilities are far greater than this game.

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Originally Posted by lordbones

The self-entitled generation... those who don't pvp much should be as good as those who spent time on getting their gear...If I wanted PvP with everyone on equal footing I would pick up some 10 dollar game off of steam that doesn't provide any equipment.

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Boy am I glad you don't design shit in this game, but it seems they already have like minded people at the helm.

I actually went to blizzcon. People cheer at everything there. The only thing that had dead silence was when they were yapping about the movie which they never should have made a panel of since they've got nothing so far. And no, the crowd went a lot more wilder over other stuff rather than the pvp changes. Heck I am pretty sure Blink 182 got more cheers than the pvp gear.

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Originally Posted by Mihael_Longclaw

Boy am I glad you don't design shit in this game, but it seems they already have like minded people at the helm.

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If you're going to make such a useless comment, please explain your thoughts. Your feelings mean shit to me.

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You all are playing an MMO, not an RTS...Not GW2 style gameplay, not WoW. If you don't play for progression what are you playing for? Why do people want all these new dungeons/ new PvP style matches...ie CTF/ KOTH...just for fun? No. People want new gear. They want to look better, be more powerful, and enjoy new content. Who the hell wants to play PvP for PvE/RP rewards? Sure, I'm not going to say new minions and mounts are a bad thing, but serious PvPers don't give a shit about those when they spend more time in the arena than they do anywhere else.

How boring would this PvP be if all people had to look forward to in terms of progression was more skill points? YES, the current Arena only system sucks. But how many people do you seriously expect to sprint to r30 for only vanity items? meh

I love when Shiyo acts like she cares about this game, when before 2.1 she threatened to quit literally every other
post she made. She did nothing but trash this game into the ground constantly. I think she actually DID quit for 2
or 3 weeks before 2.1 was released. What happens first day? Complaints.

I don't know why anyone takes Shiyo serious about anything, ever. Just another crybaby who will keep un-subbing
until she gets her way. Nothing to see here.

Look people, the current PVP system is nowhere near a balanced state, hell, it took blizzard 10 years to smooth it out and they are still trying to balance out PVP, it's a difficult task and even when updates happen, unexpected, unpredicted things happen which lead to nerfs and even more never ending changes, followed by more QQ. A week into this games PVP scene and so many people are just up in arms about losing. That's the thing, they are essentially crying about losing, they're not crying about being outgeard, they are not crying about being outskilled they are simply crying about losing, they don't want a really want a "fair" playing environment, they want to win, but they don't want to do what the game demands for them to do to win under the prescribed conditions. They want wins handed to them.

I disagree with the OP. I feel like gear grind in an MMO is part of the reason I play them, both pve and pvp gear grinds. I like the idea of going hard and grinding out rank 30 before anyone else does equipping all the i90 and just farming people that have less time then me for a month or so. :cool:

Is this right? no, prolly not. But I'm also the kinda of person that gets a kick out of camping corpses, and ganking lowbies.. its fun to feel powerful in a game. I'm not ashamed to say it. I played gw2, it was fun, but it died out very quickly other then WvW the structured game was a flash in the pan imo, alot of the was because there wasn't a ton to look forward to. While successful pvp-centric mmo's have thrived with a geared based system. If you want to play skill based pvp play a moba or something imo, mmo pvp has always been about grinding gear and farming, which I personally and people i know are ok with.

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Originally Posted by mirth12

I disagree with the OP. I feel like gear grind in an MMO is part of the reason I play them, both pve and pvp gear grinds. I like the idea of going hard and grinding out rank 30 before anyone else does equipping all the i90 and just farming people that have less time then me for a month or so. :cool:

Is this right? no, prolly not. But I'm also the kinda of person that gets a kick out of camping corpses, and ganking lowbies.. its fun to feel powerful in a game. I'm not ashamed to say it. I played gw2, it was fun, but it died out very quickly other then WvW the structured game was a flash in the pan imo, alot of the was because there wasn't a ton to look forward to. While successful pvp-centric mmo's have thrived with a geared based system. If you want to play skill based pvp play a moba or something imo, mmo pvp has always been about grinding gear and farming, which I personally and people i know are ok with.

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I admire your honestly, prepare to be flamed.

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

Please remove gear advantages in PVP. Losing a match due to someone having better gear than my team is not fun in the slightest. Having to be much better than my opponent because they're 30% stronger than me is not healthy for a competitive PVP environment.

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Sometimes people see a problem and they come up incorrect solutions to that problem based on a poor evaluation of it. You problem isn't that people are over geared from you. The problem is your loosing a lot of your matches and you don't think that you should be paired with the opponents your getting. Adding in elo calculations to match making would solve this and give you opponents closer to your own skill (and gear) level and thus more exciting matches for everyone.

Beaten plenty of relic teams in PVP. Not worried about this.

EDIT: using my level 41 market board-geared bard.

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Originally Posted by Jadi

Sometimes people see a problem and they come up incorrect solutions to that problem based on a poor evaluation of it. You problem isn't that people are over geared from you. The problem is your loosing a lot of your matches and you don't think that you should be paired with the opponents your getting. Adding in elo calculations to match making would solve this and give you opponents closer to your own skill (and gear) level and thus more exciting matches for everyone.

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Add to it that later on would come the "incorporate win/loss percentages and match people based on their win/loss records." It will never end. Give them a cookie today, they'll sue you for the cookie store tomorrow.

If someone points out an objective imbalance, why is that observation always labeled as "QQ"....I don't get that.:confused:

Hey guise lets give everyone 1 HP and restrict all abilities so PvP becomes a game of who can right click on their opponents fastest. Then it would be fair. Right guise?

At least remove the Warfront wins and loses from the menu I don't want to see how many games I've been in and how many games I've won or lost, it's in your face. I hate that.

Is everyone missing the very basic point that: Every single person playing this game has the exact same game mechanic ability to earn the very same gear that some people in this thread are demanding give an unfair advantage to others? I do not see the argument as “please remove gear advantages”, I see it as "please remove skill, and/or hard work/effort”. After all, if we ALL have the exact same game mechanic ability to earn the same gear, isn’t that what we really are talking about?
Whether the excuse is, I do not have enough time to run pvp, I do not have the best class, I cannot afford the crafted gear, I cannot find others to run with so I need to pug against 3 man premades and lose a lot, I cannot push my keys fast enough…. it all comes down to a ‘personal issue’ not an unfair game mechanic issue preventing you from gear. (continued)

(continued from above)
My win/loss record is not pretty right now. I crafted my own lvl 55 pvp set the first day of pvp, I purchased pieces I could not craft and I have only one piece of 70 pvp gear so far. However, I am damn proud of that one piece (close to my second) as I earned it doing 100% pug groups where winning in a complete pug is not easy against teams of 3 that are communicating and strategizing. However, I do NOT want handouts where those that formed successful 3 man teams and/or those with more skill or time on their hands to earn gear faster than me are punished so that 'I' am given an unfair advantage as I have the exact same options everyone else in this game has, even if I personally am not able to run as many matches or find others to group with.